Hello All,

For the past 2 years I have been in a long distance relationship with a lovely lady whom I adored. At times our relationship was really tough despite all the wonderful moments that we had had togther. (It was tough because obviously we didn't get to see each other as much as we would have liked and picking up where you left off takes time every time you meet).

Anyway, just before xmas when I was visiting her I received the "I need time and space" and "i'm confused" lines which to be honest I felt were coming because she had become somewhat distant. Like a gent I duly obliged and backed off even though she would not give me a reason for her request. Frequency of contact subsided but once in a while I received the odd "missing you" or "thinking of you" text which I acknowledged in the positve.

After xmas she called and said that she wanted to resume the relationship but in a more relaxed fashion taking things slowly. Again I duly obliged. There followed a period of renewed contact culminating in an agreement to meet. ( I do think that during this time I propably pushed things slightly too hard but not badly) A few days before we were due to meet she cancelled saying that she wasn't ready to meet me. Although disappointed I agreed once again.

Contact died over the next few weeks and then out of the blue (yes you guessed it) I receive a call from her and this time she was purring down the phone saying that she misses my voice and me etc. It was during this conversation that she asked me if I minded her calling. I told her that I did find it tough because it felt like she was using me whenever she got insecure. It also seemed that every time I showed a little interest in her she would back off again.

Eventually after a week of "I miss you but i hope you have a great life" messages from her I eventually sent an email asking her not to contact me again as it was really effecting me emotionally. I said that I was either in the relationship or out, there can be no in-between now. Several days later after no dialogue she sent a reply saying that she accepted my request. That was a week ago now.

Anyway, since then I have been reading up on relationship advice to help me better understand what went wrong. Firstly I lost my job and I'm still out of work, secondly her ex found a new girlfriend and lastly I unitentionally became a wuss. Yes I miss her very much and yes I want her back but I'm not a begging sort of bloke. I'd rather she came back to me because she genuinely wanted to give things a go. I also know now that if she comes back I need to be much more of a challenge to her. I appreciate it is difficult to judge the situation based on a few words but can someone assure me that my "don't call me anymore" email was the right thing to do. And if so why? Many thanks.

YES the e-mail was the right thing to do. She did not contact you right away because woman need to 'reflet'. You needed to end it. YOU NEED TO EVICT THE WUSS IN YOU!!

DON'T CONTACT her for at least 3 months - she may contact you back. NO CONTACT - no WUSS!! You need to make her miss you - which you DID NOT before - and that's hard to do in a Long Distance Relationship.

I awsume you e-mailed, called, texted - every day?? -

See - people want what they can't have - she keeps leading you on.

This end thing may just work.

But, YOU have to stop putting her on a pedestal... do your own things - get a job - job is priority #1 - forget about her. Hang with your friends. Workout. Family. Anythimg but her.

Were you always being all nice to her? Woman hate nice! Hate nice! It's OK to be kind to her.

Woman want a leader, confident (calling all the time, e-mailing texting is NOT confident) - you need a life - woman are never your life - they do not come first - they are part of your life.

We're you too needy/clingys? Yes.

Were you too agreeable - never starting an argument? NOT putting her in place if she criticzed you?

See, woman have tests and you had have failed many of them.

The tactic here is No Contact. Stick with it - call someone else.

You were just too available for her - everyone needs a hit of doubt.

To be honest there were definetley times when I was a wuss but it wasn't full on "i'll do anything for you cos I love you". It was more "you know I love you and i'm here for you".

I was left guessing so many times and because of that I got anxcious. I just wanted her to level with me and tell me where we were at. When we did talk it was sometimes very vague and that is frustrating. My wussness came out of not knowing I guess, but I never went communication crazy.

She told me she had many issues in her life and has been seeking therapy to help her deal with them. I have no idea what the issues are but my feeling is that the real issue is that she hasn't really let go of her ex.

I've always been a bit of blokes bloke so looking back it makes me cringe knowing how intense I got at times. You sort of get drawn into it. You are right about the pedestal thing but that won't be happening again. I see my error.

It has been a tough lesson and sitting here now I feel I blew it. Too bad eh!

What if she calls?

I feel for you brohter. Woman just can't stand Wuss's. You think your doing something nice for them and they think you're a door mat and they can walk all over you.

They do love their ex's - I had a gal who divorced her husband and 4 years latter she was still in love with him. Woman use that crap therapy all the time - 90% of the people in therapy are woman - did you know this?

Anyway... you needed to NOT contact her every day - maybe twice a week MAX - let her call you.

You are the prize. ALWAYS. Woman don't want to be the prize.

1. You needed to be less available - don't call all the time, no e-mails, you set the dates, etc. No clingy-needy - EVER - get a hobby, work out, work on getting that job, friends, family,

2. NEVER go into girl friend mode - she probably told you all about her problems - THAT's for her girl friends. NEVER be on the phone for endless hours - you WILL bore her and go into girl friend mode.

3. NEVER be agreeable - disagree - stand up for you self - if she criticizes you, STAND UP for yourself. DO NOT be a kiss .

4. Don't buy her things all the time.

5. Don't give up your power - be a leader - be CONFIDENT - make the decisions - don't pass the decisions on to her because you THINK your being nice. Put yourfoot down and say your coming to see her. Get a hotel room and see what happens - she will come see you.

6. Don't be nice - don't be a 'nice' guy. Too charming. Woman WANT drama. TEASE THEM!! Bust her chops.

7. You need to learn about woman's tests - be prepared for every test - you fail one and you may lose.

8. NEVER, NEVER fro ma guys stand point ASK for clarification in a relationship - NEVER. That's the woman's job - she will drop you like a rock.

9. NEVER tell her how you feel. NEVER. Not for a long, long time - and let her do it first... she might say - I love you - and you say - "I know"

10. Don't EVER try and make a woman like you - be yourslef (some what) - BE FUNNY, no tough questions.

This has happened to me - I was a guys - guy - never a Wuss - woman will do this to you - AND it's is completely stoppable.

"i'll do anything for you cos I love you". -STOP THAT!! Never NO! Don't do some things for her, OR give her a hard time about it.

" just wanted her to level with me and tell me where we were at. When we did talk it was sometimes very vague and that is frustrating. My wussness came out of not knowing I guess, but I never went communication crazy." - Welcome to woman - DON'T let this stuff bother you - ever. AND STOP asking for clarification - your GUT will tell you where you stand with her. You DROPED her interest level like a rock.

NEVER ask for clarification!

Keep things cool my man - don't sweat the small stuff - QUIT worrying.

I advise going out on a bunch of dates. And maybe calling this girl in 2 months and ask her for coffee - go visit.

It sounds like you put WAY too much pressure on her. Woman HATE pressure. No more tough questions OK? ESPECIALLY if you talk with her. AND IF she calls - return her call in a couple days.

You haven't blown it yet. DON'T be a Wuss and call her. Go on a date. Let her MISS YOU. Woman play games - if you had a close relationship, she may be back.

You need to love her 100% if you want her back. See girls feel - they DO NOT think in logic like men at ALL. They feel. We think: "she loves tulips" - I'll buy her tulips every week - No, No, No - woman don't think that way - they get creeped out and mad - they think you buying their effection.

Go to this website NOW! www.relationships.blog-city.com - great info!!

Many thanks for clarifying things, it has been very helpful. I have been naïve but at least I know what it is all about now. Thanks again.

I agree with WildKat21... people want what they can't have or what they're not getting. The more someone ignores you, the more upset you get and want to talk to them.

Hi,
In short, take a break, and don't bother her.
Let her decide if she wants to call you, talk with you, email with you, etc.
Leave her alone... she will decide if she wants any kind of relationship with you.
Best of luck,
fredg

Folks, thanks again for all your support and guidance. Much appreciated. One last question - Who is going to win the US Masters this weekend??

Sorry for the long post and tough love - but it's so easy to manage this stuff if you know the rules.

Follow that to the end. OK? I know from experience.

You just need to be a little more aloof and concentrate on other things and let her pursue you.

Also - follow the rules and you won't have problem with any woman and they will love you for it. Love you.

Make sure not to be too available - work comes first always - get that job.

WILDCAT!! Dude u rock!. where in the world did u get so much of text ? It was really good ;)

Unfortunately - it's the rules dude. It's what woman want.

I know from experience and study. I've been through a lot to tag some beautiful, great woman. I have some great guru's.

Woman live in the bizzaro world, seriously. They may tell you something else. They may tell you they want a nice guy, romance tick, a guy who does and pays for everything - But, it's BS.

Woman want drama - lots of drama - they won't tell you this... but they do. They will argue they don't.

They want a CONFIDENT, KIND (NOT nice guy), Mysterious, FUNNY, well groomed guy - with some jerk-like tendencies. Be allof, DON'T share your emotions, be some what unavailable (hang with friends, workout, work etc.)


OH YES!! MAKE SURE TO LISTEN!! WOMAN need to talk 70% or more of the time - THEY DO NOT want to hear about your whole life story immediately - DO NOT share EVERYTHING!! They want a mysterious man.

NEVER always tease them and bust their chops occasionally - they love and need this to feel.

REMEMBER - woman communicate differently. YOU HAVE to ask questions.

ALSO - I forgot the worst thing - looking for her approval... NEVER do this - worry about yourself. Don't doing things for ALL the time.

And WATCH the compliments... compliments are great in SMALL doses.

Watch the I love you's... do not tell her how you feel for a long time. She says - "I love you too soon - like a couple months - say "I know"

Mate I think you should right a book, you could make some serious coin! My damn head is spinning so much from your good advice I won't be able to speak! Thx again Wildcat for some great input, my head is getting straight.

I knowthere is a lot more to tell you. Guys aren't born with this stuff. I went for ever not knowing this stuff.

We think we should always be 'nice' to woman - they HATE that!

My current gal loves Tulips - I would go and buy her a field of Tulips - but she would HATE that - she would think I was trying to BUY her affection - you have to give woman favors/kindness in small doses - especially in the beginning.

See - nice guys are approval seakers - WOMAN HATE THAT! You have to do your own thing - treat her 80% of the time like woman of your friends/younger step sister. Watch the freaking compliments.

Don't always aim to please.

Its true man.. I hv learnt all that in past too :p these freakin girls... they donno what they want !

Dude I didn't get what exactly did you mean by " ALSO - I forgot the worst thing - looking for her approval....NEVER do this - worry about your self. Don't doing things for ALL the time. "

Ash - what I meant there, and I have seen this in 90% of all men, being an -kisser - always being agreeable, not putting her in her place when she criticizes you. Being all smilely all the time - worrying that you might upset her about something and always trying to please her. Woman want to be upset sometimes - they feel - they have emotions. They also want to be treated like you treat your friends - no pedestal. Most guys think that if a woman actually likes them they need to treat them like gods - most woman run after a while, they enjoy it initially.

Loooolz.. yeah they think they r being real good... but u stupid guys... learn to offend them !


Someone'z LAW : Opposites Attract Each Other !


Sorry I dnno who the hell wrote that law... it sounds stupid but its true !

Hey wild.. are you swingcat or hv you read his book ? :p

I've read them all. I like Doc Love a lot - no nonse. David DeAngelo is my Quam - DD got me to totally change several years ago and I have had phenominal success. I've spoken with him - he is great guy and just wants to help guys. All woman do is study this stuff and talk about it - guys don't.

I know a guy who on purpose tries to get a woman he first meets and he likes to disagree with him. It builds up this tension in woman and they go bizerk - they love it! Woman want to feel and this creates it.

I hvnt heard about doc love.. but I hv read most of them too ! Some of them were so damn boring but I think david deangelo and ross jefferies books were good :p... there was one more.. I forgot the name of it... it was for boosting self confidence... that one brought the real change in me ! It was something like say this and that any idea which one is it ?

Yeah - it's like a light turns on! It's so easy to do.

The key is (sorry ladies) - NEVER put a woman a head of you. NEVER - don't do it.

Guy's. A few weeks into this now and I'm finding things tough. I guess the hardest thing is not knowing how she is and just basically missing her. Any words of wisdom out there that can help me through this? By the way I haven't called her and don't intend to, I just need help focusing...

Whoah! He's alive! :)

Really now... you're doing a good job... it gets kind of tough, but the result of being patient can only be good. You're just learning to live without her. It's tough, just as it's tough to, all of a sudden, work on things you've never done in your life. Just imagine someone picking you up on the street saying: "Yo dude, gotta come work with us on some rocket science project" with a gun pointed to your head :) It would be tough, you wouldn't know what is what - but you would keep trying.

Just do the same here... acknowledge it's hard, but just keep doing it!

Squonk - what happened when you met that one weekend?

The key is to keep busy - I went to the gym for 2 hours every day and work real hard when I went throug hsomething like this. Spent a lot of my time with my friends - also drank a lot (which I don't necessarily recommend). Also went on some dates - that helps a lot. I did get her back and it was great for a while.

You might want to call after 3 weeks or a month.

I assume she plans to marry?

Nice comment CroCivic91. I guess I need to grin and bare it, you are right, thanks. You know, the worst thing is that I keep thinking back to my last signing off email which basically said thanks for agreeing to not contact me etc. I went on to say that I felt used (because she had stated that she was not so good at relationships so early after previous relationships), which in hindsight was not a fair thing to say and I also said that all I ever wanted was to be together with her. I feel such a prat for saying this now. That is way too much pressure for her even after two years of dating. Looking back I can see that she was confused and the last thing she needed was heavy crap like that from me.

Hi Wildcat 21, the last weekend we met was before xmas. I knew she was reluctant to meet and the first 3 hours were bad. She hardly said a word until I said that we needed to sort things out. I asked what she wanted to do and she said she needed time and space. I said no problem. Once we had cleared the air she switched back to the girl I knew and loved - caring, relaxed, friendly, loving etc. The rest of the weekend was really nice. She said maybe we could meet for New Year but backed out of that a few weeks later. Then after New Year it was into the occasional "I miss you, I care for you, I wanted to hear your voice" calls. If I responded in the positive she backed off again.. weird stuff. I don't think making contact with her is my call any more. I mean she has agreed to let me go so I guess I should go. She definitely wants to marry but I think she is confused and scared about commitment. Reading between the lines I think there were aspects of me that she liked and aspects of her ex that she liked and she ended up beating herself up trying to figure out what to do. I gave her the "get out of jail free" card I think! Don't worry guy's I won't call...

I think it was just the way you approached this woman. You were just plain too available to her - big turnoff - you need other things in your life. You can't surrender to one woman - even when you are married you need to little bit of mystery and doubt going.

You can't be a 'nice guy'.

You have to be careful what you say - less is more!! Always with woman - less communicatin, less words, less time spent together.

Never contact a woman every day - never - unless you live with them - make them contact you.

" and I also said that all I ever wanted was to be together with her." Learn from - never say that again until your wedding DAY!

Hey Dude - Also - those akward moments need to be wiped out by humor. You needed to make her laugh - She HAS to equate you to FUN! FUN! FUN! And only fun. You should have grabed her hand and taken her somewhere - where ever you were was not the right seetting either.

And if there is a problem - you needed to talk about - ask what was wrong - I am sure something was bothering her - woman Won't come out and say what's wrong - you need to ask open-ended questions. Probe her out and get done to the bottom of what is bothering her - just letting her talk would have helped out a ton - as you LISTENED!! DON'T EVER try to solve her problems UNLESS she specifically asks.

It has been 5 months since I last saw her and 5 weeks since I last spoke to her directly. A week ago I sent her a letter.

I'm sorry guy's this may seem like a weak thing to do but I just wanted to set things straight regarding some stuff that I said in my last email to her 5 weeks previously when we finally agreed to split. Basically in that email I accused her of using me and came on a bit heavy. That response has been weighing heavily on my mind and as I have got stronger I felt ashamed of the comments, so the letter was an apology for those comments. I felt so much better because I was looking after my own needs.

Anyway, she sent me a text saying thanks and that she sort of expected something would come from me. I replied saying no worries. I didn't ask how she was or anything like that at all. It was just a pleasant short text. Two days later (and I wasn't expecting this) another text arrived saying that she was thinking about me and my letter that I was on her mind and that she would write back soon. I didn't respond.

So folks is this entering a new phase? How do I proceed. Personally I feel much stronger and more confident. I miss her but know I can live without her. I can naturally be myself now i.e. cool, strong and pleasant but aloof. I still think she needs to take time out to recover from her ex which is something that she has not done properly. Who knows she could be back with him. Of course it could be that she is sensing that she has lost control and is trying to re-establish her power. I need to be careful. If there is any chance for us in the future it has to be based on unconditional love when we are both ready, I have too many friends already!

Wildcat I need some advice! (or anyone else)

I received a load of texts from her last week saying that she misses me and thinks of me and asked if we would ever see each other again etc. It culminated in us talking by telephone for the first time in weeks. During this conversation she started to tell me why things happened the way they did. It seems that she needed to give herself time to get over her ex and that also there were pressures in our relationship that she could not cope with. i.e. me moving there etc. The therapy thing is still going on but it does sound at though she really has been very low i.e. depression. Anyway she said that she wanted to see me and we agreed two weeks time. She didn't want to hang up but eventually we did. During the conversation she asked if I was seeing anyone and whether I had dated anyone. I said that I had but it hadn't been serious. She really did sound very mixed up with her thoughts and I just tried to be calm and friendly and understanding.

We spoke the next day briefly and then I backed off because in the back of my mind I felt that this could be just another mood swing. Sure enough, after three days of no real contact I called her sensing that there was another shift in her thoughts. She told me she was scared of meeting in case things didn't work out well. I said I understand and I expect nothing. She said that I was the only one that she wanted to meet but wanted to feel totally right before meeting. I'm cool with this. I haven't spoken to her for two days now but I'm wondering if I should wait for her to contact me or try and encourage her and gently show her that we are starting over and that I need it slow too. etc. Any advice

It's great she contacted you if she is the woman for you.

BUT, it sounds like she is playing games.

I wouldn't contact her again - she may just be teasing you to see if she has you hooked still. Woman do this for sport. Wait for her to come to you.

ALSO - WHY are you so freaking serious with this woman - keep it light!!

You keep putting freaking pressure on her when you have zero barginning power. Understand?

WOMAN HATE to be presured. Make this woman laugh - but her chops for not calling or blowing her off - be funny and play hard to get.

You got to learn to keep it light - all you do isbe serious with this woman.

And don't ask for clarification from a woman - you probably keep taking steps backwards.

Here is your mission:

1. MAKE HER LAUGH!!
2. Talk about ANYTHING but the past
3. Tell her how great your life is going - NO NEGITIVES!!
4. Ask to get together
5. STOP asking for clarification in your relationship. STOP. Just let what happens happen!!
6. Quit putting pressure on her - keep things light and funny
7. DON'T SAY you care - show it!!
8. AND PLEASE for the love of GOD wait for her to contact you!! Even if it's a month!! Make her miss you. Make her feel that there is doubt I nyour relationship.
9. STOP showing her ALL your cards - OK? Be some what mysterious

To be honest I didn't get heavy talking about the past. It was her that wanted to do that. She told me that she wanted to because it was important to her. I was fun and positive and yes I teased her but it was her that wanted to tidy up the past. It was like she wanted to give me answers. I was cool with it and appreciated her honesty. It sounds like she has been very low and is still very confused about life etc. I was just listening most of the time.

I think I have all the bargaining power! If she thinks that I'm the one for her then she knows where to find me. It is her that has chosen to break up. If she has doubts then she has to address that. All I can do is continue to live my life. She wants to MSN and all that but I don't. I think that stuff is very confusing sometimes.

I agree - all that text messaging can put you in 'girlfriend' mode. I found out the very hard way putting a lot of stuff in writing to a woman who might not understand you completely can be terrible.

Maybe you just say - lets stop talking about the past. FRESH START! 2nd chance. Sounds like you both need that - it can work. They would most likely do wonders for her.

You both probably need to sit down and just talk. Why don't you just plan a weekend and just go see her - no expectations. Surprise - a lot of woman love suprises. But be prepared to stay somewhere else. Always try and keep it light.

I think you are spot on there. She really is a very deep thinker (like most people I guess) She asked me if us getting together again would be to continue what we had or start again and I said start again.

It is a strange process. There are periods of no contact then contact and then no contact again. Being confused about things means that she needs time to think about what we say to each other. It is never childish stuff, always very adult conversation but I can hear her brain ticking every time we talk.

If I could give one tip to anyone in this situation it is above all else behave in a calm, dignified way despite what the emotions are saying to you. By remaining calm and dignified you bring a maturity and wisdom to the thing that conveys strength in the face of something very traumatic. This will be interpretted in a positive way (eventually) by the dumpers!

ALWAYS stay positive. Listen to her. Sounds like you are learning and improving - remember - woman want to be led - make decisions - tell her you are coming next time she calls - you have to see her. Don't make her the prize - but I doubt you do because of what she has put you through.

*******

To tell you the truth, I may be going through some of the same things. I had been seeing a wonderful woman up until the end of February. She needed time/space - I gave it to her period end of story. Had not heard from her for 8 in weeks. All of a sudden she has been in contact the last 3 days. I was in love with this woman. We saw each other for 6 months. She is not like your woman - but asking a lot of questions and bringing up the past. Gorgeous woman - very intellegent, independent

I just don't know if I could go back. I think it's a real mind f--- for them to come back - don't you? It seems like she is trying to bring up old feelings that I burned away. She wants to get together - start fresh.

And I am seeing some one else. I have been seeing this gal for over a month. Is it fair to 'settle' for this gal, when I was in love with another gal?

I think that there is a common but complex theme running through the majority of the issues on forums like this. To be honest I will never be able to put my finger on it but what does come over loud and clear is that there appears to be an underlying fear from the dumper that they are losing control of their independence and freedom and they are not ready to surrender that independence until they are absolutely sure they have experienced all that there is on offer (even when, despite daily issues, their last relationship probably provided the best match they may ever have).

It is a human trait to want to believe that the grass is always greener and that "I deserve better!". Unfortunately 9 times out of 10 the grass isn't greener and guess what - they don't deserve better. The coming back thing several weeks/months later is I believe inquisativeness (based primarily on doubt and insecurity), which is designed to satisfy their curiosity and either confirm to themselves that their decision was right or to realise that they made a bad decision. Its like they are double checking that they did the right thing. If we as dumpee's all stand around waiting like idiots they are most likely going go "yep I did the right thing"!

That's why the no contact phase is so important for the dumpee. It is a time when they can re-discover themselves, get stronger, become more appealing and then most importantly rationalise the situation properly! We were dumped, rejected, discarded, thrown away, whatever, and that really really hurts. When that happens you can only do one thing. Close that chapter in that relationship there and then, take yourself off, lick your wounds and heal. There maybe a second chapter coming your way weeks, months, years ahead but if you go into that as the same person not having learnt fom your experiences then you will not succeed.

Wildcat, all the things you say to me about having to understand where I am in this cycle, why I am there and what I need to do to move on applies to all of us. You have moved on because you have met someone else and you think she is lovely. What you can't do now is use her as a pawn. Respect her, be honest with her, tell her. As I said before more than ever you need to keep your dignity here as that will be the strongest thing you have. Tell your ex that although you understand her actions she really hurt you. Tell her that you still love her but the trust that was there has for the moment gone and right now is not a good time to start rebuilding that trust. The chapter is closed, start a new one but do it with dignity with all who are involved.

Thanks. It is so f---ed up that she has called. Messed with my mind.

"independance and freedom and they are not ready to surrender that independence" - that is exactly what happened. Good catch - that's why we have to be LESS available - mysterious - 'People want what they can't have'. For some reason these gals realize they haven't heard from us and our lives are going on nicely without them.

See - I have had to learn from this stuff - I don't want this type of stuff to happen to anyone else. Heartache is avoidable if you manage the relationship right. With my ex-gal who just called I made a lot of mistakes because I thought it was different - most guys make this mistake. I think I was way too 'nice' to this one - I am normally not.

The other girl I am seeing I do need to tell her what is going on. I have some feelings stired that I did not think I had.

Square one - start over is the way to go - but I really need to decide. I sort cool with it when she told she need space/time and said OK. And now she wants to get back together - it was a good relationship for me. We will see - I am really taking it slow and I may go out of town just to try and figure it out.

Yes and you HAVE TO learn AND change. That's key. Build up barriers.

Keep things light going forward.

An after thought -

I think you are really on to something there with that "independence and freedom" - I think you need to keep that feeling going in them for the first few months or even 6. I think that goes with being less available to them all the time - not returning messages right away - not answering calls - being busy - not always making plans. NOT sharing your feelings - acting just happy hanging out with them.

These are not games - it's to build up attraction AND dependence.

I have a feeling we both may have surrender early. That may have gotten scared - coming on too strong. I usually don't do this at all - but then you find a woman you really like and things change. You want to be real nice to them - and that's bad for business.

I think it all has to do with putting pressure on them - THIS IS MY THEORY GOING FORWARD - if you want something in a relationship - try and make it look like there idea. I've used open ended questions to accomplish this.

I am still freaked out - she called last night while I was out with the other gal. I still haven't told the other gal.

Hey Wildcat,

Long time no chat. How are things going with your situation? I would love to know how things moved on...

After the last round of chat and making plans to meet my ex she has backed out once again and I haven't heard from her in four weeks. She really is screwed up and doesn't know what she wants. Her therapy is taking her to places that she doesn't want to go to and that is apparently tough for her. I just can't help thinking that she will meet someone else and drift off altogether.

I am keeping up NC and trying to move on but man it is so tough. Recovery is going to be a long slow process. She has left me well and truly damaged. I try to keep busy. The work situation is improving. I now have a couple of cool opportunities which I am waiting on. If one of those comes off then I can get cracking on my career again.

I would love to know how to forget things completely though and move on.

Any tips anyone?

Hey Squonk,

I am actually sitting on my laptop at her parents cabin in Michigan. It was really hard, but we did get back together - I am a hell of a lot more guarded - big barriers - changed guy. But, the last month and 1/2 have been great - we both said something's we needed to say - and she really opened up. Taking a day off today and headed back to Chicago early tomorrow. Beautiful weather today.

They only way to get over a woman is TIME and find someone else. There are probably a 10 million other woman out here - AND ones that are probably 10 times better woman than this one. NO CONTACT with her - none. Write her a letter and don't send it. I also strongly advise a tough workout schedule.

Your deal is a lot like situations I've been through - we want something we can't have - remember that. I have a feeling if you had gotten together with this gal - you would take her for granted and not respect her. Probably eventually repulsed by her eventually.

For me, I hate losing - hate it.

It sounds like she is just playing with you - it's nice knowing someone is out there wanting you. Do NOT contact her - do not return Text, calls, e-mail. With this lady you will have to do this for many months - IF you really want her back it will take a lot of time AND you need to cut the contact right way. Show her you have a life, moving on etc. - she may come flying back. But, always being there won't work right now.

Personally - I would move on - I usually don't say that, but if she has all these issues - she may give you heartache the rest of your life. And she is playing games. Don't return any calls.

Maybe in 3 or 4 months send her an e-mail - VERY short and say - "hey, how's it going?"

See with woman like this - guys like us want to rescue them - we think we can help and we really can't. They need therapy.

Wildcat, that's great to hear that you got your woman. Well done. Its good to know that the hours of torment and thought have landed you the right deal.

Your words are very appropriate, thanks again for reminding me of the way ahead. It is so tough to remain focused and confident in what I am doing. I really have got mixed up with a bad one here and allowed her to manipulate me into a state of utter confusion. I'm like some dumb puppy who thinks the whole world loves me if I love them. I guess all puppies get kicked at some point.

Time is indeed the answer. Im not up for dating at the moment but in time I know that will come. NC is the only way for me to heal and I'm pleased that all contact in the past 6 months has been from her. I just wish I had been stronger in defending my integrity.

I think she is playing games with me but only as a result of her deep confusion about what she wants in life. Im convinced she has some very deep personal issues from when she was a lot younger which has resulted in this confusion that she is going through at the moment.

One question, I seem to remember that somewhere you said that you were not bothered if your ex had been with someone else. Is that really the case. Did it really not bug you that she could have been with someone else?

Good to hear from you Wildcat.

Squonk

No, I would never be happy if she saw another guy - I don't want to know - I don't think she did while we were apart - her work takes up a lot of time and she probably would mention it. This only applies if I would want her back. If I didn't want her back I couldcare less.

There is a STRONG reason you are not together - you WILL find out soon enough when you meet her and that perwon won't have the baggage this other lady has. I just have a strong feeling this gal is totally wrong for you - not sure why you are pinning away for her?

You have to be a man here and forget this lady. Move on. Ifyou hear from her agan - and I wouldn't responsed for 2 months - You lay the law - she won't walk all over you like she may have been used to,

I did get her back, but it was difficult. Over 4 months. I wouldn't recommend what I did to everyone - but this is one great lady.

Step one - nothing else - get your career going. Woman will be attracte to you then.

My advice to you is find a job and stay with it save up some money do what ever you can to improve yourself and slowly you will become a happy man

I wasn't able to look through all the threads of these postings but I wanted to address Wildcat21 responses so I apologize in advance if I misquote anything you said. One thing that struck me is when you said that women don't want "nice guys" and they need to be put in there place once in aawhile. I took a class recently in church called "Wild at Heart" and what the author talked about is this very thing. I was sure how much I bought into it because I think I became somewhat of a wuss w/o realizing it. One thing he did say is women don't want ot be with a "nice guy". They want someone courageous, daring adventurous and willing to take risks. Most of all someone who will fight for their woman (family, friend, what have you). I wanted to confirm what you have been saying is solid. Don't get me wrong, guys should be nice meaning polite and compassionate when needed, but society has made us to be wimps and pushovers and I think it has been showing up in this forum. We need to stop being needy and start being men! As much as I don't always agree with Mike145k's responses he sometimes hits that point also.

Jduke - very well said.

'Nice Guy' is ugly - it's NOT being kind - kind is good. DON'T be a push over - SAY NO to woman. Make them pay for things once in a while - make them do things.

'Nice Guys' have NO spine - always agreeable - never confrontational. DON'T put woman up o na pedestal.

Also DON'T EVER be abusivem rude, cruel to woman.

Confidence is key - do your own things - hang with your friends.


Did you study the book - Iron John? - great book about weeding out the feminism in us.

YES - STOP being needy and clingy. Don't SHOW IT OR say if you feel that way.

Woman are REPULSED by Nice Guys - REPULSED.

To lear MORE about 'Nice Guys' go to this amazing site: www.relationships.blog-city.com

SO MANY men in society today are 'Nice Guys' and they don't even know it. I am trying to help retrain a few. The will SOOOOO much more happy - believe me.

We need real men with a scare down their cheek and say I demand respect see

True - woman NEVER respect Nice Guys - ever!

Wildcat, is this by the same author John Eldredge? Unfortunately, I am not a book reader but the books I do read are usually nonfiction. I will look for it and maybe add it to my collectionof unread books for when I do decide to start reading books. You have a well balanced approach about this. Most people might think that we mean to totally dominate women and that is not the case. Men and women are different and nothing is going to change that not even the feminists ( I am not going to apologize for that comment). The decent well balanced women will know what we are talking about and agree. My wife totally agrees with this book and line of thinking. Anyway, I don't want to get way off track or too long.

[ Unfortunately, I am not a book reader] I wonder if an expert would say that

I can't remember his name, but it's about bringing back the - kind, independent, CONFIDENT, non -kisser, LEADER etc. the guy who does not put a woman ahead of himself (not being conceited - but she is at most an equal).

Not these guys who put woman up on a pedestal guy. Who are always agreeable, -kissers, worrying about NOT upsetting woman, ALWAYS doing NICE things, ALWAYS buying them gifts, ALWAYS calling them WAY to often.

Woman DON'T want to be the prize - NEVER! Never!

De-pussyfying of man - de-femenising of man. No - pussys plaease.

I real life woman do noy want to be princesses - THIS IS NOT HOLLYWOOD.

I know a guy that was in a rship with someone like that and it turns out that the person was with someone else and whenever she got lonely she would text or call... I hate to say it but it sounds like she is using you and only comes around when its good for her or when she is not with someone else.. id wait and see what happens but don't contact her.. sounds like she has someone else

Wildcat, is this by the same author John Eldredge? Unfortunately, I am not a book reader but the books I do read are usually nonfiction. I will look for it and maybe add it to my collectionof unread books for when I do decide to start reading books. You have a well balanced approach about this. Most people might think that we mean to totally dominate women and that is not the case. Men and women are different and nothing is going to change that not even the feminists ( I am not going to apologize for that comment). The decent well balanced women will know what we are talking about and agree. My wife totally agrees with this book and line of thinking. Anyways, i don't want to get way off track or too long.
Listen to the first few lines he states I am not a book reader could an expert say that

listen to the first few lines he states i am not a book reader could an expert say that
I can say that. If you were to read books, you'd notice that there are dots at the end of sentence.

Folks,

Another 8 weeks has gone by and then last week I get two more texts enquiring how I am and wanting to say hi!

I replied politely and she came back with "thats good - hug"

I didn't respond again but ever since then I have been struggling. What did she want and why has she done this again.

I know she has been in therapy and doesn't want a relationship at all but what does this mean?

I'm hurting but I haven't contacted her. Should I call or continue no contact?

Message deleted

Battle - he's met her. They've been together a lot.

Squonk - I wouldn't have responded. She just seeing if she still has you - OR, I would have responded days later.

I do honetsly now think you are hurting not because of her - but the feeling of not having a relationship, not having a gal - you might go see her and even be repulsed.

I'd just move on and focus on yourself. No contact. And that REALLY mean not returning her messages - which you really should NOT have done.

Hello Mr Battle!

You really are some kind of prick aren't you. If you can't help yourself from sounding off at least do your homework first. Do me a favour and keep off this forum if that is the best you can do - tosser!

Wildcat, good to hear from you and thanks for your comments. How are things working out for you?

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Ok - Battle - that's enough - these are people you don't KNOW!

Your being judgmental and have ZERO facts. This is advice.

What's you problem? Just because you're misserable doesn't mean you take it on others.

If these people knew about you - they would rip into you way more. So quit it.

AND - you post here to HELP people - not hurt them. It's advice.

Quit judging people and making up stuff you know nothing about.

You have more problems than any of them combined - so don't throw rocks when you live in a glass house.

Just because you feel bad doesn't mean you take it out on others.

Message deleted

I feel like such a coward because I want to take the cowards way out.

I think you need professional help...

Seriously, are you working with anyone besides just being on meds? A lot of us have been there; it takes work to bring yourself back and it's usually not something you can do totally alone.

She is reall a nice gal - just been through more than any of us could imagine. She knows what's going on. She actually has a nice stable life right now that she should be enjoying.

I guess that's the end of this thread then!
:eek:

That's nice of you to say packer115.

Im definitely no Wuss.

I have been intrigued by why I have been hung up on this girl but throughout this year I have learnt many things about her and her condition. From what I believe she has a personality dissorder as a result of some bad stuff that went on when she was younger. The net effect is that she can't handle "love". She craves it but can't handle it and apperently that is why she rejects it. The push/pull approach is a form of manipulation that is instinctive - in other words she can't help it and what's worse I didn't see it.
It is very complex stuff but she has been working on it and is trying to help herself.

My issue is with myself for not undertanding my own feelings. Of course I should walk but as a fixer I want it to work and I think the common name for that is "Wuss" ! I come on here for help not abuse.

You never try and be a fixer with a woman - she will RUN. The best you can do is listen and use listening skills - let HER work through her problems.

"She craves it but can't handle it and apperently that is why
she rejects it." - I know what you mean - I've been there before - a woman I deeply loved - couldn't love back because of issues as a child and young adult.

I heardthe only real way for her to 'fix' it is through therapy.

You could wait this one out and wait for her to come to you, BUT it could take months and months of 'space' OR even years.

I seriously think you should read every article at www.lovetactics.com - there is good advice there is you wish to pursue this, but again, it may take a long time.

In the mean time - fix yourself, date other woman etc.

Thx Wildcat

I guess at the end of the day it is all about "me". I think much of the difficulty is in trying to second guess what she is thinking or wanting because of her manipulation. To be left hanging there is not on. On the other hand maybe I have a control problem of my own I can't handle not knowing!

Onwards and upwards!

Also - follow the rules and you wont have problem with any woman and they will love you for it. Love you.

Make sure not to be too available - work comes first always - get that job.



What's the rules? Hehe:D