Hello:

What do you think about the big bonus legislators gave themselves in the Farm Bill & what they say about food stamps?

Republican Fincher, TN has received over $3 MILLION since 1999 in farm subsidize. Last year he received $70K plus. He will get more next year. On food stamps? "If you don't work you don't eat" "This is other people's money" Yeah his...

The second biggest recipient was Representative Doug LaMalfa, a California Republican and agriculture panel member who, along with his wife, Jill, is part owner of a farm that received direct payments of $62,857. On food stamps? The poor, disabled, children, veterans, and the elderly don't need them.. They should get private help or go to a church.

Here's what the American Conservative website (http://www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/the-monty-burns-republicans-food-stamps/)said.

Christians need to seriously reconsider uncritical support for a political party that prioritizes lavishing subsidies on the agribusiness rich while telling the poor to sit quietly and wait for scraps.

Is the right wing beyond embarrassment?

Excon

That's only 1 reason I am all for everyone being 3rd party. I refuse to support crooks, liars and hypocrites that get away with murder bit throw the book at us if we were to steal an apple to keep from starving.

Hello again,

Right wing CATO Institute says, (http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/gop-hypocrisy-farm-bill)

Whenever Republicans cut social welfare spending, Democrats claim that Republicans dislike poor people. By passing the farm bill this week — after stripping out spending for the food stamp program — House Republicans showed that the stereotype is largely true.Anybody?? (crickets chirping)

Excon

CATO is Libertarian, but conservatives have been calling out both sides for their irresponsibility in both of these areas and still are.

GOP to Taxpayers: We're Against Subsidies, Except If They're For Rich Farmers (http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/353433/gop-taxpayers-were-against-subsidies-except-if-theyre-rich-farmers-veronique-de-rugy)

We agree ,the farm bill is a scam on many fronts including bogus credits to non-working farms ,destructive ethanol credits ,sugar beet subsidies ,and the food stamp program.

Are you telling uus something about your agricultural policies we don't know? You adopted the same socialised approach you complain about in Europe. Isn't it interesting the rest of us manage to compete with you without the handouts

Yes I am ;our farm policies are a failure and have been since Roosevelt.

I wonder how much was thrown in for rabbit disaster planning.


Watch him pull a USDA-mandated rabbit disaster plan out of his hat - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/watch-him-pull-a-usda-mandated-rabbit-disaster-plan-out-of-his-hat/2013/07/16/816f2f66-ed66-11e2-8163-2c7021381a75_story.html)

In OZARK, Mo. — This summer, Marty the Magician got a letter from the U.S. government. It began with six ominous words: “Dear Members of Our Regulated Community . . .”

Marty Hahne, 54, does magic shows for kids in southern Missouri. For his big finale, he pulls a rabbit out of a hat. Or out of a picnic basket. Or out of a tiny library, if he’s doing his routine about reading being magical.

To do that, Hahne has an official U.S. government license. Not for the magic. For the rabbit.

The Agriculture Department requires it, citing a decades-old law that was intended to regulate zoos and circuses. Today, the USDA also uses it to regulate much smaller “animal exhibitors,” even the humble one-bunny magician.

That was what the letter was about. The government had a new rule. To keep his rabbit license, Hahne needed to write a rabbit disaster plan.

“Fire. Flood. Tornado. Air conditioning going out. Ice storm. Power failures,” Hahne said, listing a few of the calamities for which he needed a plan to save the rabbit...

Full disclosure, this was not an Obama admin reg, it was borne out of the post-Katrina response. If only they'd had an animal disaster plan perhaps so many animals wouldn't have been abandoned. Fortunately, the USDA magic-rabbit licensing enforcement division may be scaled back.


... Or maybe not. Late Tuesday, after a Washington Post article on Hahne was posted online, the Agriculture Department announced that the disaster-plan rule would be reexamined.

“Secretary [Tom] Vilsack asked that this be reviewed immediately and common sense be applied,” department spokeswoman Courtney Rowe said in an e-mail message.

You can't make this stuff up.

Apparently it is possible over there

Awesome, the benefits that are supposed to be going to hungry Americans are being shipped to Jamaica in 55 gallon barrels.

NY food stamp recipients are shipping welfare-funded groceries to relatives in Jamaica, Dominican Republic and Haiti - m.NYPOST.com (http://m.nypost.com/p/news/national/it_on_y22owkLpsldSAjDVC9isjM)

It takes lot of caloriesand time for welare queens to be popping out one kid after another every 9 months. They don't have time to get a real job.

You can't make this stuff up or is it just another stuff up

People that can afford Iphones and cell phone data plans for everyone in the home.. can afford food too.

So you are saying you can swap food stamps for iphones, is that a successful marketing campaign

so you are saying you can swap food stamps for iphones, is that a successful marketing campaign

They swap food stamps for booze and drugs... Casino gambling... sex from crack ho's...

Everything but food. Showing there really isn't a need for it at all.

And for pennies on the dollar since they didn't earn it. It was free money to them.

They swap food stamps for booze and drugs....Casino gambling....sex from crack ho's...

Everything but food. Showing there really isn't a need for it at all.

And for pennies on the dollar since they didn't earn it. It was free money to them.

I don't doubt you have identified what some do, but where is the proof that the vast majority of those who rely on food stamps misuse the program. It could all be changed by insisting that food stamps can only be negotiated for food at selected sales points

I don't doubt you have identified what some do, but where is the proof that the vast majority of those who rely on food stamps misuse the program. It could all be changed by insisting that food stamps can only be negotiated for food at selected sales points
Doesn't work.. legally they can only be exchanged for food now... doesn't stop them. A few crooked store owners in the hood and you have a racket going where more "food" is sold to people with food stamps than they have merchandise on the shelves.

Doesn't work..legally they can only be exchanged for food now...doesn't stop them. A few crooked store owners in the hood and you have a racket going where more "food" is sold to people with food stamps than they have merchandise on the shelves.

Well the dishonest are always among us. I used to distribute food to the needy and no way did we give out certificates, you got your parcel and what it contained was food, no cash for ciggies or items not on the menu. Those who wanted something else went somewhereelse. We did a roaring trade in potatoes and cans with no labels and yesterday's bread

well the dishonest are always among us. I used to distribute food to the needy and no way did we give out certificates, you got your parcel and what it contained was food, no cash for ciggies or items not on the menu. Those who wanted something else went somewhereelse. We did a roaring trade in potatoes and cans with no labels and yesterday's bread
I think that's a far better system... like the homeless begging for money... you find out how hungry they really aren't if you offer to buy them some food... but not hand them cash.

I don't give beggars money, I know these people have a pension. This isn't the third world

I don't give beggars money, I know these people have a pension. this isn't the third world

And around here there are enough soup kitchens... none of them go hungry. Most of them are mental patients off their meds... alcoholics or drug users... the ones panhandling anyway.

Sure not all are but most are. I see homeless smoking (roughly $5.00 a pack).. and with cell phones. So you know they are eating.

I don't give them anything either... I do donate to charities that help the poor... and that also run some of those soup kitchens.

And around here there are enough soup kitchens...none of them go hungry. Most of them are mental patients off their meds...alcoholics or drug users...the ones panhandling anyway.

Sure not all are but most are.

Yes like you would have to be off your head to want to live on the street. Yes we don't handle mental patients well these days, just leave them to their own devices.

There are lots of people helping out but the way to solve the problem is to provide places for them to stay and care, sadly, governments don't see any votes in it

Yes like you would have to be off your head to want to live on the street. yes we don't handle mental patients well these days, just leave them to their own devices.

There are lots of people helping out but the way to solve the problem is to provide places for them to stay and care, sadly, governments don't see any votes in it

Why should WE pay for places for them to destroy... We used to keep them in institutions were they got their meds... I'm sick and tired of paying for public housing for the terminally lazy... I'm not paying for the terminally insane too.

They should open the Asylums back up... would help reduce the crime rate too... at least the part they are responsible for.

Petty crime only the real problem is the drug dealers and gangs look you have a prison system keep them there wouldn't be able to tell the difference anyway

Petty crime only the real problem is the drug dealers and gangs look you have a prison system keep them there wouldn't be able to tell the difference anyway

The one thing Mao actually did well... was deal with the issue of drug abusers... cured them once and for all.

Yes a little work cures a lot of social ills

The food stamp program also allows ADM and the other major food companies to peddle processed corn chips and high fructose corn syrup beverages to the poor on the taxpayer's dime. It's a multi-level scam.

Tom the way I see it the food industry is a total scam but what are you going to do when you let capital tell you what to eat

Tom the way i see it the food industry is a total scam but what are you going to do when you let capital tell you what to eat

We can let the Socialists grow their own food to feed themselves.

THe problem will take care of itself inside of a year. Most of them will starve.

Your farmers might make huge profits... but ours don't. The middlemen make all the money, and even then supermarkets run at a very slim profit margin.. But then.. look at how many of the younger generation really know how to cook. And by cook I don't mean take something out of the freezer and put it in the microwave,

End the raisin subsidies... or maybe we can put them in 55 gal blue plastic drums and sell them direct to the Dominican Republic by passing the Food stamp recipients who are scamming the system.
EXCLUSIVE: Dominican Republic scammers sell welfare food bought in NYC and shipped in barrels - NYPOST.com (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/isle_take_that_welfare_scam_VBsTspIxia2GA9o2oS505L )


A Florida congressman has introduced a bill that would eliminate one of the U.S. government's most unusual institutions: the Raisin Administrative Committee, keepers of the national raisin reserve.

The raisin reserve is a program established by the Truman administration which gives the Agriculture Department a heavy-handed power to meddle in the supply and demand for raisins.

To limit the supply of raisins on the market, the government can simply take tons of raisins from the farmers who grew them. The raisins go into a “reserve.” They are often kept off the U.S. market: sold overseas, perhaps, or given to needy schoolchildren.

Sometimes, the farmers don't get paid a cent in return.

A decade ago, California farmer Marvin Horne defied the reserve, refusing to hand over his raisins to the government. The Agriculture Department took him to court, and this year the case reached the U.S. Supreme Court.

The high court sent Horne's case back to an appeals court in California, which will soon hear Horne's argument that the Constitution prohibits government from taking his raisins without just compensation. Horne's case was featured in a Washington Post article in early July.

On Thursday, Rep. Trey Radel (R) introduced a bill that would eliminate the reserve's legal underpinnings. It would end the 1949 rule, Marketing Order 989, that created the Raisin Administrative Committee and the reserve.

“In my opinion, this is nothing short of theft,” said Radel, a freshman member from the Fort Myers area. He said he had no ties to the raisin industry or to raisin farmers, mainly located thousands of miles away in Northern California.

“I think it violates the Fifth Amendment [principle] of just compensation,” Radel said. “Because there's no compensation. Because they just go in there and take the raisins.”

Radel's bill has been referred to the House Agriculture Committee, of which Radel is not a member.
Florida congressman’s bill would do away with U.S. raisin reserve - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/fla-congressmans-bill-would-do-away-with-us-raisin-reserve/2013/07/26/54efffb4-f609-11e2-861b-70461cc1cd24_print.html)

Raisin Administrative Committee?? Really?? Nahhh the government isn't too big!

I posted earlier about one raisin grower that refused to cooperate. Of course the feds are not happy about that.

Can't get all those DC fruitcakes without raisins I suppose

can't get all those DC fruitcakes without raisins I suppose

That explains it.

Just read an article about the case where the author claims that the selfish farmer is practicing
Free-market absolutism and doesn't care if he hurts the collective with plummeting prices.

Their absolute dedication to the collective is why Democrats get a pass on their personal behavior. It's why the Humas of the world and the Gosnell victims can be sacrificed, they'rejust taking one for the team. What's a few individual casualties for the cause?

Hello again,

Well, if this has devolved into your ordinary b!tch section, nobody sucks worse than right wingers. I don't have to list the reasons. Everybody knows them.

excon

Well done ex you were able to discern something positive out of that diatribe

Raisin protectionism would most likely benefit blue state Kalifornia more than any other . I've already taken positive action . I boycott raisins in favor of craisins .

I've always boycotted raisins, can't stand the things, especially when someone hides them in a cinnamon roll.

Hello again, Steve:

I've always boycotted raisins, can't stand the things, especially when someone hides them in a cinnamon roll.Pssst.. Them ain't raisins... Kalifornia raisin growers substitute rabbit turds in the boxes headed for Texas.

Excon

I knew there was something nasty about raisins.

I thought they were dried up gonads from all those child sex changes taking place in California?

I don't know if I'd go as far as the headline suggests, but good points.


The greatest food in human history (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/the_greatest_food_human_history_5bikMtD5ZJ50x1KMCy GfTJ)
In terms of cost-per-calorie, no locavore, organic veggie can compete with the McDouble

By KYLE SMITH

What is “the cheapest, most nutritious and bountiful food that has ever existed in human history” Hint: It has 390 calories. It contains 23g, or half a daily serving, of protein, plus 7% of daily fiber, 20% of daily calcium and so on.

Also, you can get it in 14,000 locations in the US and it usually costs $1. Presenting one of the unsung wonders of modern life, the McDonald’s McDouble cheeseburger.

The argument above was made by a commenter on the Freakonomics blog run by economics writer Stephen Dubner and professor Steven Leavitt, who co-wrote the million-selling books on the hidden side of everything.

Dubner mischievously built an episode of his highly amusing weekly podcast around the debate. Many huffy back-to-the-earth types wrote in to suggest the alternative meal of boiled lentils. Great idea. Now go open a restaurant called McBoiled Lentils and see how many customers line up.

But we all know fast food makes us fat, right? Not necessarily. People who eat out tend to eat less at home that day in partial compensation; the net gain, according to a 2008 study out of Berkeley and Northwestern, is only about 24 calories a day.

The outraged replies to the notion of McDouble supremacy — if it’s not the cheapest, most nutritious and most bountiful food in human history, it has to be pretty close — comes from the usual coalition of class snobs, locavore foodies and militant anti-corporate types. I say usual because these people are forever proclaiming their support for the poor and for higher minimum wages that would supposedly benefit McDonald’s workers. But they’re completely heartless when it comes to the other side of the equation: cost.

Driving up McDonald’s wage costs would drive up the price of burgers for millions of poor people. “So what?” say activists. Maybe that’ll drive people to farmers markets.

For the average poor person, it isn’t a great option to take a trip to the farmers market to puzzle over esoteric lefty-foodie codes. (Is sustainable better than organic? What if I have to choose between fair trade and cruelty-free?) Produce may seem cheap to environmentally aware blond moms who spend $300 on their highlights every month, but if your object is to fill your belly, it is hugely expensive per calorie.

Junk food costs as little as $1.76 per 1,000 calories, whereas fresh veggies and the like cost more than 10 times as much, found a 2007 University of Washington survey for the Journal of the American Dietetic Association. A 2,000-calorie day of meals would, if you stuck strictly to the good-for-you stuff, cost $36.32, said the study’s lead author, Adam Drewnowski.

“Not only are the empty calories cheaper,” he reported, “but the healthy foods are becoming more and more expensive. Vegetables and fruits are rapidly becoming luxury goods.” Where else but McDonald’s can poor people obtain so many calories per dollar?

And as for organic — the Abercrombie and Fitch jeans of food — if you have to check the price, you can’t afford it. (Not that it has any health benefits, as last year’s huge Stanford meta-study showed.)

Moreover, produce takes more time to prepare and spoils quickly, two more factors that effectively drive up the cost. Any time you’re spending peeling vegetables is time you aren’t spending on the job.

Activists will go anywhere to wave the banner of caring and plant their flagpole of social justice right in the foot of the working class.

Forcing New Yorkers to pay unnecessary high prices, they’ve managed to keep Walmart out of the five boroughs of New York City. The City Council of Washington, DC, recently passed a bill, designed specifically to punish only Walmart, which would mandate a super-minimum wage to benefit a small number of employees while effectively placing a surtax on every Walmart shopper. (Walmart responded by saying it was canceling plans for three stores. The bill may yet be vetoed by Mayor Vincent Gray.)

Fuel prices, like food prices, disproportionately hit the poor, so do-gooders do everything they can to raise energy costs by blocking new fuel sources like the Keystone XL pipelines and fracking. And they are always up for higher gasoline taxes and regulating coal-burning energy plants to death.

If the macrobiotic Marxists had their way, of course, there’d be no McDonald’s, Walmart or Exxon, because they have visions of an ideal world in which everybody bikes to work with a handwoven backpack from Etsy that contains a lunch grown in the neighborhood collective.

That’s not going to work for the average person, but who cares if they go hungry because they can’t afford a burger anymore? Let them eat kale!

I tried kale, ick. But again, who cares if people suffer because of your collective vision? It's for the cause man!

Speech now I know they drank the koodaid and even if they didn't that diet will kill you

His connection of selective dots is interesting, but highly suspect.

Are you seeing dots, maybe you drank the koolaid

His connection of selective dots is interesting, but highly suspect.

OK, so exactly how are poor folk supposed to shop at Whole Foods? Food stamps only go so far when buying organic arugula.

P.S. Plus they don't have them in your most poor neighborhoods.

Progressive elites pay lip service to the needs of the poor and create programs for them that don't work and expect the middle class to foot the bill.

In a tight job market with low wages, and higher prices, and service industry jobs more important after manufacturing higher wage work became increasingly unavailable, then logic indicates higher wages in the lower wage income classes, to better circulate the currency. It's a lack of circulation that has stymied economic growth in a consumer driven economy.

Even supply siders are recognizing that not enough is trickling down to expand growth.

progressive elites pay lip service to the needs of the poor and create programs for them that don't work and expect the middle class to foot the bill.

Unless the private sector recognizes the need for expanded growth there will be no middle class.

Oh they do.. as soon as the gvt gets out of the way you'll see plenty of economic growth

oh they do .. as soon as the gvt gets out of the way you'll see plenty of economic growth

I'm pretty sure I have the next response from Tal memorized...

oh they do .. as soon as the gvt gets out of the way you'll see plenty of economic growth

There is nothing stopping the private sector from seeking growth and expansion. They have been doing great through a faltering global economy. Corporate profits are off the charts. If the government is in the way then they sure ain't stopping anything.

Or slowing down anything either.

Um.. yes the government is holding them back...


Its called Obamacare...

There is nothing stopping the private sector from seeking growth and expansion. They have been doing great thru a faltering global economy. Corporate profits are off the charts. If the government is in the way then they sure ain't stopping anything.

Or slowing down anything either.

In other words under Obamanomics the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, exactly what you whine about daily. It's not that complicated Tal, if you keep growing government, expanding regulations and mandates and protecting your favorites it's the big, rich and powerful you scorn that benefit while the little guy gets choked out.

Corporations are figuring out how to profit from it, just give 'em another year. Leveraging investments is what they do.

Corporations are figuring out how to profit from it, just give 'em another year. Leveraging investments is what they do.

It's been 6 years of Obamanomics and thus far the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Right?

In other words under Obamanomics the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, exactly what you whine about daily. It's not that complicated Tal, if you keep growing government, expanding regulations and mandates and protecting your favorites it's the big, rich and powerful you scorn that benefit while the little guy gets choked out.

Corporations do what they want no matter what the government does. Always has. Corporate profits have gone up for 30 years, wages have not.

Profits-

CHARTS: Corporate Profits Have Skyrocketed Over Last Three Years | ThinkProgress (http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/06/01/493870/corporate-profits-skyrocket/)

Wages-

http://www.dol.gov/whd/minwage/chart.htm

Study: CEO Pay Increased 127 Times Faster Than Worker Pay Over Last 30 Years | ThinkProgress (http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/05/03/475952/ceo-pay-faster-worker-pay/)

It's been 6 years of Obamanomics and thus far the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Right?

Expand your data to 30 years and get a bigger picture of the wage trends.

http://t.qkme.me/3pfim9.jpg

Expand your data to 30 years and get a bigger picture of the wage trends.

Dude, nice try at dodging the fact that under Obamanomics the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. Even more ironic than that is that you guys honestly believe more regulations, mandates and an ever expanding government is going to alter that balance.

http://www.politifake.org/image/political/1009/mission-accomplished-trickle-up-poverty-team-update-political-poster-1284666991.jpg

Dude, nice try at dodging the fact that under Obamanomics the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. Even more ironic than that is that you guys honestly believe more regulations, mandates and an ever expanding government is going to alter that balance.

Why do you dodge the fact that wages have been stagnant for 30 years? Why is this just about the black guy and NOT about the white guys before him?

Doesn't matter even though that's racist, but nonetheless, corporation have done well but have not trickled a damn thing for 30 years.

Smoothy - that doesn't even make sense. LOL!

Why do you dodge the fact that wages have been stagnant for 30 years?

Who's wages? Not my wages. Not anyone's wages I know.

Welfare cheacks aren't wages paid for breeding and occupying space.

Instead of the "poor" blaming business owners for 'keepin them down" why don't they get off their butts and start their own businesses...

Or is it they are simply too dumb and lack any marketible skills to be able to do something of value to another human?

Well you run in the circles that 99% of us will never see, and we already know what a snob you are. Lovable, but a pure non empathetic snob nonetheless. Stuck up to put it simply.

I've got no empathy for the lazy... if they want something better... they need to work for it and earn it. If they are waiting for it to be handed to them... they have a really long wait.

Sorry.. I got were I have with a lot of hard work... and not one bit of help most of the whiners have available to them.

I grew up poor... and my parents had made great strides to rise over the real poverty they grew up in...

I'm no BIll Gates and never will be... but I'm comfortable middle class in the somewhat well off county I live in.

I have empathy for people born with Downs Syndrom and ceribal palsy... they aren't responsible for their condition... and nothing they can do will change it.

Working poor people who get up and go to work everyday are not part of those lazy people are they? And how much has your wages gone up and why? Promotions, COLA? Public, private or government sector?

Why do you dodge the fact that wages have been stagnant for 30 years? Why is this just about the black guy and NOT about the white guys before him?

Doesn't matter even though that's racist, but nonetheless, corporation have done well but have not trickled a damn thing for 30 years.

Damn Tal, how in the hell did you manage to turn this into a racial thing? Oh I get it, when I said "poor" that was a dog whistle right? So repeating one of the most popular liberal memes of all time it becomes racist? Man, you guys have some awfully confusing (and extremely fluid) rules, liberalism is like Calvinball.

FYI, you cannot use the disparity between CEO pay and the average worker and or minimum wage rates to prove wages have been "stagnant" for thirty years. Wages don't remain stagnant for most people, they move on, get a better job. I worked for minimum wage once, in 1976. At sixteen and still in high school the boss wasn't going to start me at managerial rates. You cannot pay someone your magical "living wage" to start their career dropping fries in a basket and dunking them in oil or the "value menu" would start at $9.95.

You need to get a clue (or just stop spreading the myth), the vast majority of workers don't go to work at McDonald's for minimum wage and stay at that rate for the rest of their life.

Working poor people who get up and go to work everyday are not part of those lazy people are they? And how much has your wages gone up and why? Promotions, COLA?

Are they too lazy to find a better job... or just itoo stupid to be able to get one that's better and higher paying?

Your value as an employee is based on your skill and value you have to the employer.

If you can be replaced by a trained monkey... or someone off the street within hours... then you don't have much value.

My first job out of college only paid $16k a year... I had maxed out on student loans that were 8.5% interest (yes Federally guaranteed ones)... I managed to live on that and pay off my debts (took 10 years to pay off that student loan)... and I moved on to better and better jobs all the while increasing my skill set with each job. And with it my pay and value to the next employer.

Maybe neither lazy, or stupid. Just stuck. As you said, it took you years of hard work to show progress. Me too. Seems like every time I wanted a dollar more I had to take a test to qualify. That's a lot of sitting at a desk juggling homework and the need to eat, and feed a family. Wasn't easy, or cheap.

We have lost millions of those types of jobs now though, and service and retail work aren't exactly a road map to success for the average guy. Better than nothing, but wholly inadequate in today's world. School?? I am all for it, but those costs have gone up higher than the ability to pay for it. I've watched younger people work their butts off for a chance at hope and dreams of better.

But a tight job market in a transitional period from major manufacturing, to the service industry is one helluva national adjustment.

Its always easier and less stressful to stay in the job you have.. the one you know... than to look for and find something a little better. However unless you expand your knowledge base... odds of advancement will be limited.

And yes.. that is why many of these people never go beyond what they do.

It's their job to seek out opportunities... not some "Rich" person to do it for them.

Their future really is in their own hands... the key is how hard are they willing to work towards it.

No its never easy... you get what you put into it.