I have moved nothing. And I never agreed to any compromise before on this issue because I'm not gay. All I do is stated my opinions thru out the debate on here and all the current events threads. Obviously in real life gay people have pressed on.

I stand by the opinion that the court is the only binding agreement there is subject to any appeal.

You made this very distinct charge: "You have no middle ground that opens up reasonable dialog. There is no meet you in the middle."


Tom and I both reminded you that we are waiting in the middle and ever since you've steadfastly refused to meet us there. Don't ever accuse us of no middle ground if you aren't willing to show up.

Okay does your middle ground include the benefits of taxes that married couples have?

You made this very distinct charge: "You have no middle ground that opens up reasonable dialog. There is no meet you in the middle."


tom and I both reminded you that we are waiting in the middle and ever since you've steadfastly refused to meet us there. Don't ever accuse us of no middle ground if you aren't willing to show up.
So you are willing to expand civil union rights to be the same as marriage rights?

So you are willing to expand civil union rights to be the same as marriage rights?

Did I stutter?

Did I stutter?
No, but you are sidestepping.

No, but you are sidestepping.

After this exchange with Tal today you think I'm the one sidestepping? LOL. Stay tuned...

After this exchange with Tal today you think I'm the one sidestepping? LOL. Stay tuned...
So you won't answer my question.

Okay does your middle ground include the benefits of taxes that married couples have?

From a 2008 post (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/current-events/gay-marriage-279582-11.html#post1372722):


As tom said earlier and which I've agreed with is why can't we "reach an equitable compromise?" Granting civil unions with all the associated rights and benefits to me should be an equitable compromise. Marriage is more than "historical aspects" just as Christmas and Easter are more than traditions.

That would especially include tax benefits, health care, and property, etc. Nearly 5 years later you guys are still feeding us the same, tired old crap and accusing us of having no "middle ground."

So you won't answer my question.

What is it about "stay tuned" you don't understand?

From a 2008 post (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/current-events/gay-marriage-279582-11.html#post1372722):



That would especially include tax benefits, health care, and property, etc. Nearly 5 years later you guys are still feeding us the same, tired old crap and accusing us of having no "middle ground."
Why didn't the Republican legislators see the light?

What is it about "stay tuned" you don't understand?
Is it the Texas heat that makes you this way?

Is it the Texas heat that makes you this way?

What way is that? Sarcastic? It's a Texas trait and it has nothing to do with heat, it's generally given in doses proportionate to the bullsh*t flung our way.

What way is that? Sarcastic? It's a Texas trait and it has nothing to do with heat, it's generally given in doses proportionate to the bullsh*t flung our way.
I took your "Stay tuned" as another put-down to me. You could have said, "Stay tuned...I'll do some checking on that."

I took your "Stay tuned" as another put-down to me. You could have said, "Stay tuned...I'll do some checking on that."

I believe you're smarter than that, you know what stay tuned means.

Okay does your middle ground include the benefits of taxes that married couples have?

Of course... they just can't call it marriage because it isn't marriage.

If the only sticking point is what they call it, why can't they file a joint tax return? Or get any other benefits of their union? Maybe that is what's fueling this whole issue, lack of progress on any front by the congress.

If the only sticking point is what they call it, why can't they file a joint tax return? Or get any other benefits of their union? Maybe that is what's fueling this whole issue, lack of progress on any front by the congress.

Got no problem with any of that .

got no problem with any of that .
And recognized by all states?

I must've written this 25 times already...

Article IV Section 1.

Full faith and credit shall be given in each state to the public acts, records, and judicial proceedings of every other state. And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof.

got no problem with any of that .

While you are in such a good mood can I have Adam Lind and Buster Posey for a week? :D

Maybe I should throw in Jean Segura too ?

Maybe you shouldn't

While you are in such a good mood can I have Adam Lind and Buster Posey for a week? :D

I'll answer for him. No.

I wonder what comes next? Perhaps some parents are going to have to explain to their dughters why they are suppose to shower with them in the same room.

Transgender first-grader wins civil rights suit after girls (http://news.yahoo.com/transgender-first-grader-wins-civil-rights-suit-girls-114816124.html;_ylt=AvW160SaNeuDutpzNlP6Jwqs0NUE;_ ylu=X3oDMTUybTBxMmgzBGNjb2RlA2dtcHRvcDEwMDBwb29sd2 lraXVwcmVzdARtaXQDTmV3cyBGb3IgWW91IDUgU3RvcmllcwRw a2cDYjk0OWEwNGUtZThiMC0zYWNmLWI3MjAtNTQyMDUwYjAyZG Y0BHBvcwM1BHNlYwNuZXdzX2Zvcl95b3UEdmVyA2Y5NzdkNjEw LWRjYzMtMTFlMi04Zjc0LTdiYzQ3OTgwZTBkZQ--;_ylg=X3oDMTB1aW5vdHU4BGxhbmcDZW4tVVMEdGVzdANidWNr ZXRfcmVtb3ZlZA--;_ylv=3)

I wonder what comes next? Perhaps some parents are going to have to explain to their dughters why they are suppose to shower with them in the same room.

Transgender first-grader wins civil rights suit after girls (http://news.yahoo.com/transgender-first-grader-wins-civil-rights-suit-girls-114816124.html;_ylt=AvW160SaNeuDutpzNlP6Jwqs0NUE;_ ylu=X3oDMTUybTBxMmgzBGNjb2RlA2dtcHRvcDEwMDBwb29sd2 lraXVwcmVzdARtaXQDTmV3cyBGb3IgWW91IDUgU3RvcmllcwRw a2cDYjk0OWEwNGUtZThiMC0zYWNmLWI3MjAtNTQyMDUwYjAyZG Y0BHBvcwM1BHNlYwNuZXdzX2Zvcl95b3UEdmVyA2Y5NzdkNjEw LWRjYzMtMTFlMi04Zjc0LTdiYzQ3OTgwZTBkZQ--;_ylg=X3oDMTB1aW5vdHU4BGxhbmcDZW4tVVMEdGVzdANidWNr ZXRfcmVtb3ZlZA--;_ylv=3)

I mentioned a public school directive in Massachusetts (https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/3410780-post19.html) back in March so this is no surprise. Anybody can be anything they want to be now in spite of the distress it may cause others or the negative consequences.

What do you recommend?

What do you recommend?

Do you want anatomical males showering with your 13-year-old daughter?

Do you want anatomical males showering with your 13-year-old daughter?
If they have been mistakenly assigned as males at birth and are medically determined to be females, it's okay with me.

If they have been mistakenly assigned as males at birth and are medically determined to be females, it's okay with me.

I find that disturbing but not surprising, and I'm betting the majority of young girls and their parents would agree with me on that.

I find that disturbing but not surprising, and I'm betting the majority of young girls and their parents would agree with me on that.
Why disturbing? She's a girl and has no interest in anyone's daughter. If anything, the administration would allow an intact transgender male to shower privately before or after the others.

Why are they showering in the first place? Do kids still shower after gym class? I thought that is passe'.

Eyes bulge at the mere mention of showering around other students, which was common — mandatory, even — in middle schools and high schools across the country just a decade or two ago.

"I wouldn't do it," said 16-year-old Adrian Alequin, a junior at Winter Park High School. "It's way too weird. I don't want to see another guy like that."

Today, students generally have the option of stripping down to wash off the sweat and grime after workouts in the hot Florida sun. Most of the time, though, they don't.

Even after hours of sports practice and rigorous competitions, many kids wait to bathe at home.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2011-01-02/family/os-florida-students-shower-in-school-20110102_1_shower-after-gym-class-inspections-by-gym-teachers-practice-and-rigorous-competitions

What do you recommend?

As we had seen one of the recommendations was alternative areas for relief. But that wasn't good enough. It had to be in the girls restroom in front of other girls. Imagine the explaining that is going to have to take place.

As we had seen one of the recomendations was alternative areas for relief. But that wasnt good enough. It had to be in the girls restroom infront of other girls. Imagine the explaining that is going to have to take place.
You apparently have never been in a girls' bathroom. Nothing is done "in front of" other girls. There is a row of private cubicles. We don't need urinals.

You apparently have never been in a girls' bathroom. Nothing is done "in front of" other girls. There is a row of private cubicles. We don't need urinals or to fish out our "stuff."

Who is "we" ? Or are you now saying you have a penis? Apparently the person in the article does.

Who is "we" ? Or are you now saying you have a penis? Apparently the person in the article does.
The person (girl) who still looks like a male will enter a cubicle and close the door in order to urinate. We girls don't urinate in front of each other.

The person (girl) who still looks like a male will enter a cubicle and close the door in order to urinate. We don't urinate in front of each other.

But this one can stand up. And later on in school when/if there is still P.E. classes then they will be showering with the girls.

But this one can stand up. And later on in school when/if there is still P.E. classes then they will be showering with the girls.
So let her stand up in her cubicle with a closed door. There is no other place to urinate in a girls' bathroom. (The sinks are too high.)

No one showers any longer. See my earlier post.

By the way, transgender has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's a whole 'nother animal.

So let her stand up in her cubicle with a closed door. There is no other place to urinate in a girls' bathroom. (The sinks are too high.)

No one showers any longer. See my earlier post.

By the way, transgender has nothing to do with homosexuality. It's a whole 'nother animal.

That's simply not true. Your making a blanket statement that isn't true. In some places they have cut back or not made it mandatory but it is still happening in many districts.

Do schools still force students to take showers after gym class? - Yahoo! Answers (http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20111106143343AAm5FI6)

Some Schools Doing Away With Gym Showers « CBS Chicago (http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2011/01/04/some-schools-doing-away-with-gym-showers/)

Thats simply not true. Your making a blanket statement that isnt true. In some places they have cut back or not made it mandatory but it is still happening in many districts.
As far as I know, it's usually not mandatory. My two adult sons never opted to take showers, had been given the choice. They tell me very few students showered (1980s and '90s). It WAS mandatory back in the early '60s when I was in high school, but students have always avoided it like the plague.

As far as I know, it's usually not mandatory. My two adult sons never opted to take showers, had been given the choice. They tell me very few students showered (1980s and '90s). It WAS mandatory back in the early '60s when I was in high school, but students have always avoided it like the plague.

That is why I cited 2 different sources. To show that there may be changes but its still occurring in places also. The first source was as recent as 2011.

Redesign the public bathrooms for privacy, and unisex use. Schools too. I think we are on the tip of the iceberg of changing the way we think about things.

Redesign the public bathrooms for privacy, and unisex use. Schools too. I think we are on the tip of the iceberg of changing the way we think about things.

What could go wrong?

Anything that man does could go wrong.

Oh god now we fighting over toilets. I don't think toilets should be design unisex unless they provide complete privacy to the user, men or women. And this issue is not about gay rights.

Anything that man does could go wrong.

Ever been to a pro football game? I can't wait to see the lines when they go unisex and everyone has to wait for a stall.