I cry when I am forced to express things in words that have an emotional connection. It is not sad-crying, it is to mask emotions (positive or negative doesn't matter). I can express things with art but not words.
This is interfering with school because there are some writing assignments that are hard because of this. If I am under a lot of pressure I will hesitate to say or write things with even a weak emotional connection. I can finish some things with a writing tutor but I do this only by blocking the emotional connection. If I read my writing afterwards I will start crying. I've tried drawing things first and then trying to put things into words but it doesn't work. I can't "make up" things because I have no verbal imagination (Not going to be helped by reading more books. I already read books faster and I read more advanced-level books than anyone I know that's my age.)
The school did a lot of tests and did not come up with any results that would allow modifications to be made so I am expected to be capable of doing this stuff. I'm currently seeing a psychiatrist but things are moving too slowly. Also it's hard to tell the psychiatrist a lot of things because they have emotional connection and I start crying when I try to say them.
This problem has gotten worse over time and I'm really at a loss for what to do.

You are seeing a psychiatrist, which is great! Things are moving too slow. Well, there is always a downside. Have some patience, I understand the frustration, but all you can do is take things step by step.
Do and try everything your psychiatrist suggests and see how it turns out.
Most importantly is that you should give this a chance before asking for any other help. I mean, who cares if you're making a slow progress as long as you're actually improving?

You are seeing a psychiatrist, which is great! Things are moving too slow. Well, there is always a downside. Have some patience, I understand the frustration, but all you can do is take things step by step.
Do and try everything your psychiatrist suggests and see how it turns out.
Most importantly is that you should give this a chance before asking for any other help. I mean, who cares if you’re making a slow progress as long as you’re actually improving?

The psychiatrist doesn't exactly suggest a whole lot. I'd like to tell him to take note of every question he asks me that I don't give an answer to or start crying because that would maybe show more clearly which kinds of things are more difficult. But that in itself would be one of the more difficult things. And I'd take note of those questions myself but I don't have that good of a memory and I can't exactly write everything down. And I'd also like to find a psychiatrist that is willing to consider drawing my answers a form of therapy because then I would be able to 'say' things more clearly and also do it without crying (most of the time with the psychiatrist is either spent quiet or crying). And he also doesn't even understand core the problem itself, which is a difference in the way I express things. Which I wouldn't consider a problem if I wasn't failing my classes because of it, so 'improvement' is not the word, 'change' is more like it.
And the psychiatrist that did the school testing understood everything I said perfectly but he's not a real psychiatrist if you know what I mean so I can't just switch to him, and I only talked to him for a short time after I finished testing.

Um.. hello? Is anyone still reading this? I still don't have answers. I told my mom I want to switch because I'm not getting anywhere with the current psychologist. She said she would look for someone but I've already been through 3 different psychologists and I never want to see any of them again so there aren't really a lot of options left.

Psychiatrist or psychologist? Two different animals.

Find a master's level counselor/therapist who deals with young people and their emotional problems. Be sure to meet with this person at least once a week -- or even twice a week.

I know the one I'm seeing right now is a psychiatrist and he has a master's. The woman who referred me to him had a PhD and a master's in clinical psychology (her website doesn't specify whether she is psychiatrist or a psychologist) and "specializes in neuropsychology with a subspecialty in children, trauma and balance" and it also says she deals with adolescents, and she tried to convince me that I was crying because I was depressed. I was referred to her by another psychiatrist (psychologist? I don't remember) who actually understood what I said and listened but she mostly dealt with family and relationship problems.

I know the one I'm seeing right now is a psychiatrist and he has a master's.
A psychiatrist is an M.D. and is far above a master's level.

The woman who referred me to him had a PhD and a master's in clinical psychology (her website doesn't specify whether she is psychiatrist or a psychologist)
A Ph.D. level is a psychologist.

Thus --

psychiatrist = M.D. = doctor (has been through medical school and can prescribe medications)

Ph.D. = psychologist and cannot prescribe (although there are changes in that recently, depending on additional education)

Psy.D. = similar to a Ph.D. but without all the research and math, and concentrates on the client/patient situation

M.A. or M.S. in counseling or clinical psychology = one to three years of grad school

Usually, a student interested in psych starts with a bachelor's in almost anything, gets a master's in some aspect of psychology, then may go on to a PH.D. in psychology program (separate or combined with the master's program).

Ok that clears things up a bit, thanks

Ok that clears things up a bit, thanks
Do you live in a populated area or near one and have master's level choices? Those are the therapists who will spend time with you and will work with you on what you really want and need. They don't work off their own agendas like psychiatrists and psychologists too often do.

I live in a city with about 90,000 people so not very populated. My mom is looking for a therapist so I can tell her to try to find someone with a master's.
Also I've been researching alexithymia a lot and it kind of looks like it would fit the description. But even though it's pretty well researched it's not considered a real "disorder" so it would not show up on the usual tests, although some of my scores correlate with alexithymic traits, like verbal and opinion problems being exceptionally low.

I live in a city with about 90,000 people so not very populated.
There should be a nice choice of counselors in a city that big. (I live in a village of 53,000 and there are counselors here in town as well as in nearby suburbs.)

Also I've been researching alexithymia a lot and it kind of looks like it would fit the description.
Please do not diagnose yourself. I tried that once with a medical problem and ended up in the hospital with something totally different. My diagnosis was way off the mark. Yours might be too. (The term means "pushing away emotions," being unempathic, and that's not what is going on with you.)

Were you always like this or did something spark this problem? Does anything cross your mind that makes you cry? If there is no reason for it, then take a brain scan instead?

I guess I was kind of always like this, and no, nothing in particular that makes me cry, just being forced to find words for feelings. I got an EEG because the previous therapist recommended it (the one that said I was depressed) and that resulted in nothing. She also suggested a hormone level test or something but that never happened.
But I guess it wouldn't hurt to get a brain scan.

I was thinking about PET scan. Maybe you should ask if this is possible (I read about it A LOT).

I looked up PET brain scans and basically it's only for really specific and easily noticeable disorders - dementia, epilepsy, and stroke.

I don't quite understand. Are you saying you can't write stories/fiction? If that is true, you can't even write happy stories?

What would be an assignment you wouldn't be able to do?

It really doesn't matter if it's a happy story or a sad story or a story that appears to be completely unrelated to me. If it is not 100% factual and objective, it ends up getting some kind of emotion attached to it, which means that it can't be put into words. And even objective things develop emotional connections over time, which means I hate re-reading any of my old assignments.

It really doesn't matter if it's a happy story or a sad story or a story that appears to be completely unrelated to me. If it is not 100% factual and objective, it ends up getting some kind of emotion attached to it, which means that it can't be put into words. And even objective things develop emotional connections over time, which means I hate re-reading any of my old assignments.
So you can do non-fiction writing, but nothing fictional?

Yup. That's kind of what confused my teachers. I can write lab reports just fine and I love science class but I can't write stories or answer questions about love and Shakespeare so I hate everything in English class.

Yup. That's kind of what confused my teachers. I can write lab reports just fine and I love science class but I can't write stories or answer questions about love and Shakespeare so I hate everything in English class.
Yet you are expressing yourself very well here and even discussing your emotions.

Can you tell stories out loud (rather than write them), for instance, when babysitting?

Here I'm not really naming or expressing emotions using words. I'm saying I love this or hate that but that's not really naming what I feel, I'm just trying to describe events and causes and effects (for example writing assignment, unnamed emotion, and crying) and trying to avoid actually describing feelings.
Also it changes depending on how much pressure I am under, so "you have 45 minutes to write a paper about how love is portrayed in Shakespeare" actually made me cry just from thinking about having to do it the next day.

And it doesn't matter whether I am talking or writing, just that it is with words.

And it doesn't matter whether I am talking or writing, just that it is with words.
Has any psychologist or psychiatrist given you the T.A.T.

No and I don't think it would make any difference in whether I put things into words because it would be just like writing a story which always has a bunch of feelings in it and even though they may not be expressed directly they are still expressed in words.

No and I don't think it would make any difference in whether I put things into words because it would be just like writing a story which always has a bunch of feelings in it and even though they may not be expressed directly they are still expressed in words.
Do you know what the T.A.T. is? It would be a very good indicator of how things play out for you.

Yes it's the Thematic Apperception Test. And I know exactly how it would play out: I would say nothing and then start crying.

Yes it's the Thematic Apperception Test. And I know exactly how it would play out: I would say nothing and then start crying.
I would show you three pictures and ask for three sentences each. That's all. None of them are loaded with emotion and can be responded to unemotionally. No crying would be necessary.

I cried when I was asked to write 1 sentence that used a certain set of words under a time limit. It wouldn't seem to have emotion but there was more than one way to write the sentence and there wasn't an obvious answer. And I cried when I was asked to list different kinds of food under a time limit. The time limit created a lot more pressure but the TAT seems scary even without a time limit. It has infinite possible answers and none of them are obvious or normal or right so whatever I say will have feelings in it.

I cried when I was asked to write 1 sentence that used a certain set of words under a time limit. It wouldn't seem to have emotion but there was more than one way to write the sentence and there wasn't an obvious answer. And I cried when I was asked to list different kinds of food under a time limit. The time limit created a lot more pressure but the TAT seems scary even without a time limit. It has infinite possible answers and none of them are obvious or normal or right so whatever I say will have feelings in it.
The T.A.T. can be responded to as emotionally or as unemotionally as one wishes.

It doesn't sound like emotion has much to do with your writing. Something else seems to be going on.

PET can be used to detect brain disorders (ex- alexithymia). Just ask someone who knows, if you can take a PET test.

Give me one example of how you could respond to the TAT in a factual and objective manner.

Give me one example of how you could respond to the TAT in a factual and objective manner.
Give me a picture suggestion as an example.(Just briefly describe one of them in a couple of words -- I know them all.)

Here's an online TAT. TAT (http://www.utpsyc.org/TATintro/)
And the instructions say "Try to portray who the people might be, what they are feeling, thinking, and wishing" which is completely non-objective and would definitely require writing something that has feelings in it.

And the instructions say "Try to portray who the people might be, what they are feeling, thinking, and wishing" which is completely non-objective and would definitely require writing something that has feelings in it.
But that is not what I would ask you to do. I'd ask you for three objective sentences in two minutes or less.

Well, what is your objective and factual 3-sentence answer to that picture?

That picture has been thrown out, by the way.

Two women are in a lab. One is testing something. The other is watching her.

All right, if I can be that objective, I'll see if I can do it.

By the way what do you think is the "something else going on" that you mentioned earlier?

PET can be used to detect brain disorders (ex- alexithymia). Just ask someone who knows, if you can take a PET test.

Who would be the person that knows?

Let me ask you this -- if I showed you three T.A.T. pictures and asked you to come up with three objective sentences in one minute for each one, what would happen?

I guess I would be really nervous. But I can't predict the outcome. There is a chance that I could start crying but that might depend on the individual picture. Some pictures have less obvious answers than others and sometimes if there are multiple answers that might work but none of them are good then I would start crying.

I guess I would be really nervous. But I can't predict the outcome. There is a chance that I could start crying but that might depend on the individual picture. Some pictures have less obvious answers than others and sometimes if there are multiple answers that might work but none of them are good then I would start crying.
All of them lend themselves to objective descriptive sentences. I would show you only three that would be as "unloaded" as possible..

Why would you be nervous?

I don't know, I guess if it's totally objective then I don't have anything to worry about...
In part of the testing that the school did, there was this thing where you were given part of a sentence and you had to complete it under a time limit. There was one sentence with dialogue of 2 people talking and I could have filled it in with several different things that I was thinking of but none of them seemed quite right and they all felt like they would reveal something about me and I kept thinking there had to be a different answer that I hadn't thought of so I just said I can't do it. And it was the sort of test that had different levels so when you can't do something on one level they take you down one. So the previous level was just writing a sentence using 3 words they gave you and then I got to a question where I had a couple different things that I could've put but they all seemed wrong and there had to be a different answer so I started crying.

Are you a perfectionist?

Kind of I guess.. But this never happens with objective writing so it doesn't make sense that that's the only thing causing the problem.

Kind of I guess.. But this never happens with objective writing so it doesn't make sense that that's the only thing causing the problem.
So you'd have no problem with my assignment of giving three sentences in a minute for each of the three pictures.

but none of them seemed quite right and they all felt like they would reveal something about me

a couple different things that I could've put but they all seemed wrong and there had to be a different answer
Weren't those objective?

"reveal something about me" -- interesting.

Who would be the person that knows?

Ask your next psychologist/psychiatrist of course, or the same person who suggested EEG scan for you.

Weren't those objective?

"reveal something about me" -- interesting.

When you say "interesting" I think you mean "that means you could actually be avoiding the whole creative-writing thing because you are afraid of your writing revealing something about you". Correct me if I'm wrong. But then why does art not feel like that? Why would I only be afraid of revealing things in words, but never art? None of my theories cover everything.

why does art not feel like that?
Art DOES reveal a lot about you. I don't know why you don't think it does.

I know art reveals things about me, I just don't feel bad revealing them like with words. Or maybe I know how to reveal the things with art in a way that feels right. Sometimes words feel wrong and they don't fit with anything. When writing a paper, even objectively, I obsess a lot about having the exact right set of words to say exactly what I want them to say. But with creative writing, there never is a right set of words. Anything I write is wrong. Sometimes someone else has already found the right set of words for me, and they're in a book or a poem. But still, if I write it, it doesn't feel true or right.

“-it doesn't feel true or right.”

Is this what makes you nervous?

So, if you can't express your true emotions then act as if that you are someone else, like Sherlock Holmes or anyone that come to your mind, can you then think of him/her as you, and act and talk normally, reveal your feelings (that person's feeling as if you were that person)? Can you do it without crying?

Can you read fictions, that talk about feeling and all that sort of stuff, without tearing-up?

“-it doesn't feel true or right.”

Is this what makes you nervous?

So, if you can’t express your true emotions then act as if that you are someone else, like Sherlock Holmes or anyone that come to your mind, can you then think of him/her as you, and act and talk normally, reveal your feelings (that person’s feeling as if you were that person)? Can you do it without crying?

Can you read fictions, that talk about feeling and all that sort of stuff, without tearing-up?

Well that's kind of it, like I feel bad writing that because it would be wrong and I'd be lying to myself.

I have no problem reading things with feelings, I just have a problem expressing them myself.

Maybe I can try your idea to act as a different person in writing. It would be really hard though because I can't take away everything about me and just become that person, there would always be a little bit of me left. But that is an interesting idea because when I am speaking in front of a lot of people I'm usually very nervous. But when we were doing this play in English class and I was being a different character and all I had to do was say my lines I wasn't nervous at all.

(I wrote most of this about an hour ago and it seems incredibly stupid and wrong now. Everything I write becomes more horrible and wrong and untrue over time. I am resisting the urge to erase it and never think about it again. I am also trying very hard not to look at the writing above because I don't want to remember it. And I am also trying not to read any of my previous posts because they are horrible and wrong and untrue too. They might have had a little bit of feeling when I wrote them but that has gotten much worse over time, to the point of being unbearable and I have to type fast and not think or re-read any of my sentences, even the ones I wrote less than a minute ago because then I will feel like deleting them. When I think about it it's actually pretty hard to write this stuff but I try to avoid thinking about it because that could result in thinking about what I wrote.)

“Well that's kind of it, like I feel bad writing that because it would be wrong and I'd be lying to myself.”

I think you are having internal conflicts, to write or not to write, to say or not to say? But if you do it without thinking, then you will get it right (like you said). I think.

“Maybe I can try your idea to act as a different person in writing. It would be really hard though because I can't take away everything about me and just become that person, there would always be a little bit of me left. But that is an interesting idea because when I am speaking in front of a lot of people I'm usually very nervous. But when we were doing this play in English class and I was being a different character and all I had to do was say my lines I wasn't nervous at all.”

I was not suggesting that you pretend like you are someone you are not for the rest of your life. I just thought it could be a great head start.

“I wrote most of this about an hour ago and it seems incredibly stupid and wrong now. Everything I write becomes more horrible and wrong and untrue over time. I am resisting the urge to erase it and never think about it again.”

Everything you said so far sounds perfectly logical to me, when considering what you are going through; inner conflicts? Your mind tells you it is wrong/not you the more you think about it. Also, you can't control it, I believe. If I am correct, then maybe you should let your next psychologist (?) know about it.
I am not suggesting that inner conflicts (IF that is what you have) is the problem. This is just another possibility.

I'm conflicted because I want to write this so you can understand me and help me but I have to do that quickly or else it becomes untrue before I can even write it down which is what usually happens with the more creative / emotional writing.

The process of becoming untrue is kind of like radioactivity. Some elements decay so quickly you can barely keep them in a particle reactor long enough to know they're there, some elements decay so slowly that they actually seem to be stable.

I'm conflicted because I want to write this so you can understand me and help me but I have to do that quickly or else it becomes untrue before I can even write it down which is what usually happens with the more creative / emotional writing.

The process of becoming untrue is kind of like radioactivity. Some elements decay so quickly you can barely keep them in a particle reactor long enough to know they're there, some elements decay so slowly that they actually seem to be stable.
You're trying to rationalize.

Pressure to perform (write) -> stress -> fear of loss of control -> crying in frustration

Pressure to write > Trying to write > Everything wrong > Crying because ? I don't know why. It's not frustration or fear, I've cried because of frustration and fear and that's a different kind of crying. This kind of crying starts soft and slow at first but if I keep trying to write it results in hyperventilating and feeling like my throat is constricted.
I can't describe the emotions I have when I'm crying because I don't have any words for what that is. Not even words that are partially wrong.

Pressure to write > Trying to write > Everything wrong > Crying because ? I don't know why. It's not frustration or fear, I've cried because of frustration and fear and that's a different kind of crying. This kind of crying starts soft and slow at first but if I keep trying to write it results in hyperventilating and feeling like my throat is constricted.
Art is using your brain and hands/fingers and imagination -- so what is different about art from writing? Have you ever been told what to draw or paint, or is that always your choice?

If you were told your assignment is to draw a cabin in the forest and surround it with wildlife, but had only 45 minutes to do it, how would you feel? Could you do it?

I could do any art assignment with a time limit, no problem. I like art class - I had 2 years of art in junior high, now I'm going to have a freehand drawing class this year, and then I'm going to the art academy at my high school. But I also enjoy doodling random things on the margins of my homework assignments and drawing whatever I feel like.

Words are difficult to put together because they are limited in number and meaning and you have to rely on grammar and syntax. Art isn't composed of small pieces of color that all artists have to use according to a set of rules.You can take any color, any material, anything at all and make art with it. If it doesn't seem right, you can change it until it does in whatever way you want, and eventually it will be right and true. But if I can't find a word that means what I want it to mean, I can't just change a few letters and say it means something else.

Words are difficult to put together because they are limited in number and meaning
Nope.

and you have to rely on grammar and syntax.
And there are huge possible variations.

I can't just change a few letters and say it means something else.
Yes, you can. I do it all the time.

I can't manipulate words to make them say what I mean. I know other people can, but whenever I try to say something - especially something with feeling - I only get an approximation of the real meaning. And as soon as that approximation is written down, the real meaning separates itself from the words and the words drift away into nothing and decay, and everything I write becomes empty and wrong.

“Art is using your brain and hands/fingers and imagination -- so what is different about art from writing? Have you ever been told what to draw or paint, or is that always your choice?”

Because there are left and right- sides of the brain that have different functions. So the right side of the brain is more subjective, and the left side is more objective. Could it be possible that her right-side of the brain has taken over/doesn't work right? Maybe it is some kind of disorder? She can't control crying, so maybe it's possible?

I can't manipulate words to make them say what I mean. I know other people can, but whenever I try to say something - especially something with feeling - I only get an approximation of the real meaning. And as soon as that approximation is written down, the real meaning separates itself from the words and the words drift away into nothing and decay, and everything I write becomes empty and wrong.
Well, you certain have done a stellar job writing in this thread.

You actually sound like a poet. Do you judge yourself so harshly in other ways or just with your writing? The perfectionist in you...

Write me a sentence containing these words: Margie, sister, angry

So the right side of the brain is more subjective, and the left side is more objective. Could it be possible that her right-side of the brain has taken over/doesn't work right? Maybe it is some kind of disorder? She can’t control crying, so maybe it’s possible?
Art, like writing, is subjective. If she couldn't do either of those but could rebuild an automobile engine or tutor trig, then you might have hit on something.

Well, you certain have done a stellar job writing in this thread.

You actually sound like a poet. Do you judge yourself so harshly in other ways or just with your writing? The perfectionist in you....

Write me a sentence containing these words: Margie, sister, angry

All right, I know that particular sentence was actually pretty good. In terms of radioactivity, it might even be stable. But that doesn't happen very often, and I can't do it on-demand or with a time limit.
It's not really that I'm judging myself, the writing just loses its meaning over time and I can't bear to read it because it isn't true anymore.

"Margie's sister was angry."
Or : "Margie was angry at her sister."
Or: "Sister Margie was angry."

I guess I'd put the first one because it's the most obvious.

“Art is using your brain and hands/fingers and imagination -- so what is different about art from writing? Have you ever been told what to draw or paint, or is that always your choice?”

Because there are left and right- sides of the brain that have different functions. So the right side of the brain is more subjective, and the left side is more objective. Could it be possible that her right-side of the brain has taken over/doesn't work right? Maybe it is some kind of disorder? She can’t control crying, so maybe it’s possible?

I was thinking about right vs. left and the left side usually deals with language but without it you can still have a very basic understanding of language, although if you disable the right side you can't understand the inflections in a person's voice, or things like sarcasm and jokes and subtextual meaning.
My right-side can "hear" but not "speak" - I can read right-side oriented things like poetry and fiction but I can't write them. And also I hate it when people analyze poetry and art because it's painful. Almost physically. It's taking something creative (right-side) and doing something analytical (left-side) with it and taking away all its meaning and beauty. My english teacher disagrees and says you can't see the meaning unless you've taken the poem apart. And to me that feels like not just taking the poem apart but dismembering it while it's still alive.

I can read right-side oriented things like poetry and fiction but I can't write them.
But you have written poetry in this thread.

taking away all its meaning and beauty. My english teacher disagrees and says you can't see the meaning unless you've taken the poem apart. And to me that feels like not just taking the poem apart but dismembering it while it's still alive.
The high school English teacher I had for three years said the same thing. Read a poem for its beauty, but explicate it for its meaning. Beauty goes only so far.

The word you're looking for is evisceration, not explication. When you analyze something for "meaning" you are pulling its guts out. You can never find meaning that way. You can only find death. And it's painful to watch a poem taken apart the way it's painful to watch someone bleed to death.

This is making me cry. And not the way I do when I force myself to write.

Maybe I can write poetry, but not when I'm asked to. And most of the things I write are wrong. They are only right when the feelings actually match the words I'm writing, and most of the time they don't.

When you analyze something for "meaning" you are pulling its guts out.
What about "Jabberwocky"? Or "The Road Not Taken"? I need to know what they mean, the background, in order to appreciate them.

Maybe I can write poetry, but not when I'm asked to.
Ah, thus the pressure thing.

And most of the things I write are wrong. They are only right when the feelings actually match the words I'm writing, and most of the time they don't.
Oh, but they do, they do.

No, they don't. What you hear is not always what I mean. What I say is almost never what I mean, and I know that because I can feel it. The entire English language is a maze of lexical gaps. That is why, when writing a paper, I spend more time reading the thesaurus than my paper. And I still don't get to say exactly what I wanted to. I sound poetic, maybe, because I read so many books that I've learned to borrow pieces of their sentences and put them together like a collage.
I guess poetry is different because the meaning is subtextual, like in art. But I still can't write something I'm told to write. If I'm told to draw a picture of a log cabin, I can make that picture true through the way I draw it. But I can't make a poem true because of the way I write it unless I choose what I write.
Also, it is very difficult to see what I'm typing and concentrate on writing when everything is blurry because I'm crying. Which is happening right now.

“I was thinking about right vs. left and the left side usually deals with language but without it you can still have a very basic understanding of language, although if you disable the right side you can't understand the inflections in a person's voice, or things like sarcasm and jokes and subtextual meaning.

My right-side can "hear" but not "speak" - I can read right-side oriented things like poetry and fiction but I can't write them. And also I hate it when people analyze poetry and art because it's painful. Almost physically. It's taking something creative (right-side) and doing something analytical (left-side) with it and taking away all its meaning and beauty. My english teacher disagrees and says you can't see the meaning unless you've taken the poem apart. And to me that feels like not just taking the poem apart but dismembering it while it's still alive.”

(Several parts of the brain take care of language.)
You do sound like a poet. But I think that breaking down poetry, or anything else, into little details takes us to the true nature of one's self.
Have you ever read “Catcher in the Rye”? You might find lost details if you pay a close attention, but it all depends on how YOU perceive them.
Words are like fish lost in the sea water, and because the sea water is so viciously dark you can't see through it. So if I am you I would take a swim!
Do you notice some people around you? If you take how they perceive/act/react… to a situation, label them in your head, and put them each into a category. You might notice, in time, that they will repeat the same behaviors over and over again. Thus, people are so predictable.
“Art, like writing, is subjective. If she couldn't do either of those but could rebuild an automobile engine or tutor trig, then you might have hit on something.”

Thanks for correcting me.
I guess that some people put themselves in a painting, while some force themselves to overdose (?).

"No, they don't. What you hear is not always what I mean. What I say is almost never what I mean, and I know that because I can feel it. The entire English language is a maze of lexical gaps. That is why, when writing a paper, I spend more time reading the thesaurus than my paper. And I still don't get to say exactly what I wanted to. I sound poetic, maybe, because I read so many books that I've learned to borrow pieces of their sentences and put them together like a collage.
I guess poetry is different because the meaning is subtextual, like in art. But I still can't write something I'm told to write. If I'm told to draw a picture of a log cabin, I can make that picture true through the way I draw it. But I can't make a poem true because of the way I write it unless I choose what I write.
Also, it is very difficult to see what I'm typing and concentrate on writing when everything is blurry because I'm crying. Which is happening right now. "

You are the meaning of your words. They will cry like a rainy day when you do, they will scream in pain when you are in pain, they will smile when you feel better. Once you lose that feeling the meaning will be lost too. But for the reader who goes through that, your words will live for them not you. Even if you will not feel them, others will.

My words are not always my words. Sometimes they are WRONG. I don't want other people to read them if they aren't true. I don't want to read them if they aren't true. I want to fold them into paper airplanes and throw them into a fire and watch them burn.

"You do sound like a poet. But I think that breaking down poetry, or anything else, into little details takes us to the true nature of one’s self. "
It doesn't take you to the true nature of anything! It only results in horrible pain and death and nothing beautiful left in the world! It is like watching someone you love die! It is painful to even read what you just said. It makes me cry.
And no, I have never read The Catcher in the Rye. But I suggest that you read Introduction to Poetry by Billy Collins.

You can't tell me the nature of my own writing.
When they are wrong, my words die. Fast.
And they don't live again, for me or for anyone else. If you can hear something in the words that have become wrong, you are seeing the corpses of dead meaning.

Why are you talking about death so much?

"It only results in horrible pain and death and nothing beautiful left in the world!"

Words result in death? What do you mean?

"It is painful to even read what you just said. It makes me cry."

I am sorry. I didn't mean to upset you on purpose.

I don't remember that you have ever told us how old you are. I'm guessing 15.

I'm 14 actually.

And when I say death I mean the poem dies when you take it apart. I read a poem in English class once and then had to listen to people analyze it and when I read it again it wasn't beautiful anymore. It was just an ordinary bunch of words. It wasn't a living thing, it didn't have an author's voice, it didn't have any soul left in it. I knew it was going to happen that way and I don't want that to happen again to any poem.

Evisceration is a more exact word for that process. It was in Ray Bradbury's A Graveyard for Lunatics, describing the state of Roy Holdstrom's studio and its plastic creations after it had been destroyed and vandalized, "His beasts had been eviscerated, decapitated,blasted and buried in their own plastic flesh."

It's kind of the same thing with art. It's okay when people say that the art represents a certain style, or is about a particular subject, but when people try to put the "meaning" of the art into words, it loses some of its meaning.

when people try to put the "meaning" of the art into words, it loses some of its meaning.
And that really makes sense.

And age 14 makes perfect sense too.

Wait, why does being 14 make perfect sense?

Wait, why does being 14 make perfect sense?
Hormones churning, the search to figure out who you are. I knew your twin back in 1985. She was 15 then and said almost exactly what you are saying.

For some reason, "My hormones are acting up" does not seem like a response that a high school English teacher would accept for not being able to do my homework. Neither does "I'm searching for my identity right now. Check back in 10 years."
Although I could get that hormone test that my previous therapist suggested.

For some reason, "My hormones are acting up" does not seem like a response that a high school English teacher would accept for not being able to do my homework. Neither does "I'm searching for my identity right now. Check back in 10 years."
Although I could get that hormone test that my previous therapist suggested.
At 14 hormones are raging. At 14 young teens, especially girls, are searching for who they are and what they will be someday, how they will make their mark in life, who they will marry, how many kids they will have, how long they will live. My mother went through it, my sister did, my nieces have gone through it, my classmates went through it, and so did I.

I'm guessing no hormone test is necessary. You are 14.

If all of this is normal, all the other girls would have to nearly fail English too. I am the only one who nearly failed English.
Although I am not the only one who disagrees with the English teacher about analyzing poetry.

If all of this is normal, all the other girls would have to nearly fail English too. I am the only one who nearly failed English. Although I am not the only one who disagrees with the English teacher about analyzing poetry.
Oh, no. There is every variation under the sun. That's your particular schtick, crying and nearly failing English. Other girls dye their hair with Jello or get their nose pierced or search the house for adoption papers.

Yeah, analyzing poetry is hard work. I didn't like to do it either and searched for excuses not to. I was a Lit major in college and explicated more poetry and wrote more term papers about the meaning of poems than you could shake a stick at.

Deconstructing a poem is an exercise in futility. To begin with, a poem is "holistic" (if that's the right word) and breaking it down for "analysis" destroys the essence of the thing. I had the same problem in school as the poster - re poetry, not the crying.

To do this with a piece of fine art is even worse. Don't tell me about brush strokes and the many shades of color. Just let me look at it, and allow it to enter into my interior world.

Taking things apart is for engineers, not for the appreciation of beauty.

Taking things apart is for engineers, not for the appreciation of beauty.
Lit majors are engineers as well as appreciators of beauty.

I can appreciate "Annabel Lee" much more now that I know where Poe wrote it, who she was, and why he wrote it. I even know someone who visited the cottage he wrote it in and described that cottage to me (which, for me, adds to the meaning).

Lit majors are engineers as well as appreciators of beauty.

I can appreciate "Annabel Lee" much more now that I know where Poe wrote it, who she was, and why he wrote it. I even know someone who visited the cottage he wrote it in and described that cottage to me (which, for me, adds to the meaning).

Well, that's true, but not the same as breaking down the words of the poem is the historical/physical background of the poem.

Poe wrote that poem (I think) in New York City's Bronx borough.

Well, that's true, but not the same as breaking down the words of the poem is the historical/physical background of the poem.

Poe wrote that poem (I think) in New York City's Bronx borough.
Yes, he did. Part of explication is figuring out/finding out the historical and physical background. Arguments are still being made as to who "Annabel Lee" was in Poe's life. That's also part of the explication process. Explication is much more than picking apart each line and even each word. I would get a much better understanding of Shelley's "Ozymandias" if I know who the heck he was. As I read the poem, I read about one man but the real meaning is that all leaders inevitably decline, as do the "empires" they build, however mighty those empires are in their own time.

My high school English teacher, Mr. Explication himself, laughed when we tried to explicate "Daffodils" by Wordsworth. "Just read it and enjoy it," he said. "Don't pick it apart." Poe's "Bells" is another one like that -- just read it (out loud!) and thrill to the rhythm.

I've probably memorized over 250 lines of poetry, 129 of them Lewis Carroll, 25 Billy Collins, 51 Rudyard Kipling, about 50 Edgar Allan Poe, some Shel Silverstein, and Invictus. Plus the entire periodic table of the elements, which isn't a poem, but it does rhyme somewhat and I think it's poetic. In a nerdy kind of way. And I recite them when I'm crying (for whatever reason) and it actually helps because it takes my mind off whatever I was crying about, but I will start crying again if I think about that thing again so it's not permanent. It's useful in English class when I don't want people to notice that I'm crying or ask why.

I had to memorize "If you think you are beaten you are" (Walt Whitman) for my woodshop final (My first year of art was actually one semester woodshop/ one semester art). Weird, but the teacher was an english major. Needless to say I memorized it in a day so he told me to memorize Invictus too. And when I memorized that in a day he told me to go and memorize The Wasteland.

I've probably memorized over 250 lines of poetry
I challenge you to memorize some of the Psalms (23 and 118 to start with), Ecclesiastes 3, Matthew 5:1-12 (the Beatitudes), and Luke 2 (all King James Version of the Bible).

I've never actually read any part of the Bible. I don't think there's even a Bible in our house.

I've never actually read any part of the Bible. I don't think there's even a Bible in our house.
All of those are online -- King James Version. Just Google the one you want + KJV.

I looked up 23 and gave it a try but I don't think I can memorize anything if my heart's not in it. I memorized Invictus very quickly because the words meant something to me and they stuck in my head. I always remember interesting lines from books, too, if they mean something to me, like "We are a tiny race, involved in a vast pursuit, amidst the cold stars, and all bound together by reason and amity." - Dr. Trefusius, The Astonishing Life of Octavian Nothing, by M.T. Anderson. I'm reading the second volume of that now.
And I always remember bits and pieces of Bradbury and Vonnegut.

And I am currently obsessed with reading everything that China Miéville has ever written, and I'd memorize everything meaningful in all that too but I don't think I'm capable. Every single word is in the exact right place and every sentence has meaning and significance.

Oh and I almost forgot - I also have 24 lines of Emily inson, A Bird Came Down the Walk and Death is a Dialogue.

I looked up 23 and gave it a try but I don't think I can memorize anything if my heart's not in it.
We had to memorize Bible verses and certain chapters every night as homework from 5th to 8th grade in the Lutheran school I went to (along with all sorts of famous and no-so-famous poetry). Our hearts weren't always in it, but it was terrific mental discipline.

I can attain mental discipline by reciting the electron configurations of the lanthanides. Plus it will be very useful in chemistry later on.

I can attain mental discipline by reciting the electron configurations of the lanthanides. Plus it will be very useful in chemistry later on.
After I got my two sons into school full time, I got a part-time job shelving books at my public library. While I did that, because of my affinity for numbers, I unconsciously memorized the Dewey Decimal system, which skill later came in handy when I was a cataloger for 15 years. To each his own.