The Light fixture in my upstairs bathroom went out over night. I've changed one of the bulbs to no effect. I pulled off the switch and applied a circuit tester (just a bare bulb socket with two wires) to the wires going into the switch and the bulb didn't light.

However there doesn't appear to be anything else out. There is a circuit on the board that is popped, but it appears to be part of a two circuit breaker (there are two switches and two wires going in. So should I change out that breaker? Should I replace it with the same type of breaker or can I replace it with 2 separate 20 amp breakers?

Should I try testing the wires in the fixture first?

If you used the bare bulb socket with the two wires and touched them to the wires on the switch then the bulb would not! Light anyway. One of the wires has to be touching the neutral/white wire and the other wire touching one of the wires on the switch for the bulb to light. Remove the light fixture and connect the bare bulb socket with the two wires to the black and white wires where you removed the light and turn your light switch on. If you have power to it the light bulb should light.

I actually removed the wires from the switch before using the bulb socket. But I'll try from the fixture in the morning.

The bulb in the testor will light when touched to the wires of the switch only if there are good bulbs in the light fixture and the wires are disconnected from the switch or the switch is in the off position, Better to test between switch wires and the neutral or the ground.
The double breaker could be a 240V cirduit or it could be two 120v circuits sharing a neutral, meaning that the tripped circuit could be the one to the light. No reason to replace it. Reset by turning off and then turning back on. Then test circuit at the switch.

If breaker trips again after reseting you will have to begin looking for the reason.

The breaker switch won't stay. It doesn't even click, it just pops back to when I try to flip it. I'll let you know after I test the wires in the fixture.

If the breaker trips to off, when you try to turn it on, it may be tripping due to a short circuit.

If the breaker trips to off, when you try to turn it on, it may be tripping due to a short circuit.

So how do I track this short circuit? If I disconnect the fixture should I then try to reset the breaker? Do I just leave the wires into the fixture unconnected?

First the breaker should be checked to determine if the breaker is tripping due to a short or is defective. The panel needs to be opened, disconnect the wire, and turn the breaker on, to see if it remains on, and check for power at the terminal. This will confirm or deny that that breaker is working.

If the breaker truly is working with no wire connected, then there is a short. Here is where it gets difficult looking for the needle in the haystack.

Since the problem started at the closet light, then leave the switch off and try the breaker. If the breaker trips when the switch is turned on, then the light fixture itself may be shorted.

Disconnect the wires from the light, and try the process again, leave switch off, rest breaker, breaker should hold, turn switch on, breaker should hold, proving the light fixture was the cause.


Lets try all of this first, if you get nowhere's, then we can continue.

Scott, when you say "It doesn't even click, it just pops back " that tells me you have not flipped the breaker to the OFF position before trying to flip to ON. Are you sure the breaker is completely OFF before you turn it ON?

Ok, ballenger was right, I wasn't flipping all the way to the left. So I did that but it still popped. I then pulled the wire from the breaker it did stay on. But when I put the wire back it popped again. I removed the fixture but the breaker still pops when I try to reset it.

You should have other places where you lost power.Check for lost power at other places and see what you find

I have checked and nothing else appears out.

How many wires in switch box?

There are two wires, (white and black) going into the wall switch. Also white and black in the junction box the fixture was wired to.

Must be more wires than that. If you only have two wires (white and black) in switch box there must be four or more wires in ceiling box (two white and two black). If you have only two wires in ceiling box you must have at least four (two white and two black) in switch box.

Did breaker reset?

Whoops, your right. There are white and black coming in from the top and another white and black pair coming in from the side.

When I try to resent the breaker it just pops back out. Even if the switch is off. However, I didn't test the breaker with the switch disconnected. Should I?

In the switch box, the two white wires should be connected together with a wire nut. The two black wires should be connected to the switch. Correct?

No the switch box has only 2, one white and one black, each connected to the switch. The fixture box has a white and a black coming in from the side and a white and 2 blacks coming from the top. The 2 whites are twisted together and were twisted into the white from the fixture. Two of the blacks are twisted together and the other black was connected to the black from fixture.

I just disconnected the 2 wires into the switch and tried to reset the breaker and it still popped!

This was all working fine Saturday night.

Thes wires must be in conduit as opposed to cables.


The fixture box has a white and a black coming in from the side and a white and 2 blacks coming from the top.

Doesn't sound logical unless there are two blacks in switch box.
What color are wires connected to circuit breaker.

Thes wires must be in conduit as opposed to cables.



Doesn't sound logical unless there are two blacks in switch box.
What color are wires connected to circuit breaker.

May not be logical, house was built in '53. Wire going into breaker is black

Can you post pictures of switch, ceiling box and breaker?
If wiring is in cables you will see the end of the cable sheathing inside each box. If wiring is in conduit you will see nuts inside each box attaching conduit to box.
Two blacks with one white sounds like conduit. A three wire cable would have one white,one black and one red. Just trying to figure out what some one may have done. Knowing these things help.

You said that the breaker was a double breaker. Are the wires going to each breaker black?

Here are the pics

Ok, That looks like 2 black and 2 white in switch box and 2 black and 2 white in ceiling box from here. Can't be sure because of shadows.

Pull and straighten the wires in the switch box. Remove the cross bar and pull, separate and straighten the wires in the ceiling box. Post another pic.

From the way the ground wire in the switch box, it looks like someone did some jerry rigging in the past.

After looking again I guess there is only one black and one white in the switch box.

After straightening out all the wires try circuit breaker again just for grins.

Ok, That looks like 2 black and 2 white in switch box and 2 black and 2 white in ceiling box from here. Can't be sure because of shadows.

Pull and straighten the wires in the switch box. Remove the cross bar and pull, seperate and straighten the wires in the ceiling box. Post another pic.

From the way the ground wire in the switch box, it looks like someone did some jerry rigging in the past.

After looking again I guess there is only one black and one white in the switch box.

After straightening out all the wires try circuit breaker again just for grins.

I've basically done that. Just the left the wires unconnected and the breaker continues to trip.

Remove cross bar and send another pic so I can see connections in ceiling box.

Something is shorting out. You need to move the wires around to see is something is shorting to ground because of a break in insulation.

Here's another pic

..

Ok, I'll have to do that tonight. But how could this happen all of a sudden?

But how could this happen all of a sudden?

It happened just to ruin your holiday weekend.

I would try separating all connections in that box, re apply power. If it still trips, have someone reset the breaker while you are in the bathroom, you can sometimes Hear a short.
May actually be in the switch box.
I only see 1 white and 2 blacks coming down from the top.
Is a white hidden, stripped and used for a ground?
Either the 2 pole breaker was all they had, or someone may have used one of the whites for ground(didn't see grounds with incomming wires, but do see a bare ground wire).
2 Pole breakers used for 120 volt circuits, is usuall done when 2 circuits on opposite phases share a neutral. You may want to remove the panel cover and check the whites that are run with the 2 black wires on the breaker, see where they go what they do(Ground/neutral)?

It happened just to ruin your holiday weekend.

LOL

Ok here is another pic hopefully this is clearer

There are 4 wires coming from the top, 2 whilte, 2 black and 2 wires coming from the left, 1 white and 1 black. 1 white from the side is twisted with one white from the top. One black from the top is alone. These two connected to the white and black on the fixture. The black from the side and the other white and black from the top are twisted together.

Scott, the picture of the breaker helps a lot. You originally called it a 2 pole breaker. But the picture of the breaker you show is actually called a piggy back breaker. It acutally takes the place of one full size single pole breaker and gives you 2 separate breakers on that same phase. The 2 pole breaker comment made things a little confusing. It is still had to believe that fixture is the only thing on that breaker.Being an older house a lot of times they would put lights and recepts on the same circuit.

Sorry if I used incorrect terminology. While I have done some electrical work in my time (including adding circuits to my panel) I'm not well versed on the lingo.

I have checked the house and not found any other light or outlet that doesn't have power. I can't say I've checked everything, but close.

I would separate the connections in that box and try the breaker again.

If you separate the connections and it doesn't trip, it will be narrowed down as you connect each wire.

Obviously there is a short some where that is tripping the breaker. Also, there is some other outlet or light on this circuit. The short is most likely either in the outlet you have not yet found or in the wire bring power into and out of the ceiling box.

Disconnect the bare ground wire from the ceiling box and make sure that it is not touching the box in any way. Make sure that the wires in the switch box are not touching the box. Then try reseting the breaker again. If the breaker does not trip the short is in the black wires bring power into and out of the box or in the white wire going to the switch.

If the breaker continuies to trip after removing the bare ground wire the short is most likely in the outlet you have not yet found. Disconnect and separate the three wires (two black and one white) in the wire nut. Reset the breaker again. If the breaker does not trip the short circuit is most likely in the outlet not yet found.

Scott, whatever happened when you separated the wires?
I don't think the ground is connected to anything. It doesn't look like the ground needs to be dealt with.
Are the wires soldered together and won't separate?

I'm going to try separating them and testing tonight.