I'm 34. I am/was dating a girl, currently 28, for approximately five years. We broke up 2 1/2 years into the relationship after constant fighting and mistrust. I thought she was having an affair with her married boss after I found her texting him late at night and his name was in her cell phone as "My Husband". She denied it and said the name was a joke. I could never prove anything occurred, but the mistrust was planted. Things went downhill thereafter. She moved out and we broke up. After not speaking for 9 months we eventually got back together because after we saw each other out one night she claimed she knew I was the one she wanted to be with. It was rough at first because I had trust issues. And, I found out she was texting other guys she "saw" when we broke up. She claimed that nothing inappropriate was going on and they were just "guy friends". I moved past it trusting her.

For the past year, things have generally been great. She's settled down and we haven't had any real problems. Things have been so good, we actually signed a lease together to move in, in two weeks. She talked about how she couldn't wait to marry me and for us to start our life.

Believing that I could definitely spend my life with this woman. I bought and engagement ring and set up a proposal for this weekend.

Last night, I was at her house visiting and was getting ready to leave to drive to her parents to ask for their permission to marry their daughter. We had both recently got new phones, so I was looking at hers while she was in the shower. It definitely was an invasion of privacy, but something told me to do it. I had trusted her for the past 9 months and didn't have any issues. But something made me think I should look.

When I looked, I saw she had a voicemail from a number I didn't recognize at 1am the night before. Curiosity got the best of me and I listened to the voicemail. It was a man's voice who was highly intoxicated, it said... "Princess, I loved spending time with you yesterday. I miss you. I'm sorry I couldn't come over tonight. I can't wait to keep my promise to you...". I wrote down the number from the message. I called the number, it was her married boss's cell phone.

In shock, I stormed out of her house. Mistake. Minutes later I called her to question her on it. She denied that any message existed ever existed. She said "I have no idea what you are talking about I never got that message". When I returned, we called her voicemail together, she had deleted it from her phone.

She claimed that I was crazy and accusing her of something that I had no bounds. She got very defensive and insulted me and said I issues for checking her phone. She's right. What I did was wrong, but there was just something that told me to do it.

I left. Hours later, in what I can only guess was an effort to resolve the situation, she gave me her T-Mobile login to check on calls that night. What she didn't realize was that the voicemail logs were in a different part than what she likely looked at and didn't see anything. Apparently, incoming calls don't show on the online log if they are not answered and go to voicemail. Sure enough, though, there was a call to her phone that night 30 seconds after the timestamp on the message I heard (1:03am) where she checked her voicemail. I also saw a series of phone calls and messages between them from that day. Although, it was not a regular everyday correspondence, just periodically spaced between weeks, but sometimes at 1am or 2am in the morning when she claimed she was out with friends.

When confronted with this information, she continued to claim that no message ever existed, that anytime she called her voicemail was for other reasons and that any messages between her and her boss were purely work or friendship related. She said sometimes she would text him when out at night innocently.

All that being said, what do I do? I know she's lying. But I can't prove it. I'm not making the voicemail up. And, coincidentally the online log confirms she just happened to check her voicemail seconds after the message that supposedly didn't exist was left at 1:03am? My guess is she will go to her grave denying it because if she admits it she thinks I will tell someone that works at her company and she will get fired. And/or her boss's wife.

In an attempt to get the truth, I told her if the message and calls were one sided (and it was just her boss contacting her inappropriately) all she had to do was tell me, I would understand and we could work through it. She would only say that no such message ever existed. And continued to tell me I was the one with issues. I've seen this pattern before, when she is caught in a lie she gets defensive and tries to turn it on the other person.

In my head I KNOW she's lying. I've always believed, if if walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck... But the fact that she continues to deny it is now making me think that I'm crazy and I'm wrong? How can that be?

Curiosity got the best of me and I listened to the voicemail. It was a man's voice who was highly intoxicated, it said... "Princess, I loved spending time with you yesterday. I miss you. I'm sorry I couldn't come over tonight. I can't wait to keep my promise to you...". I wrote down the number from the message. I called the number, it was her married boss's cell phone.

[edit]

All that being said, what do I do? I know she's lying. But I can't prove it.
You heard the message. You called the number and know it was her boss calling. What do you do? You've done it. Why do you have to prove she's lying? To whom?

Yes, I heard the message. And, called the number. And, saw that she called her voicemail seconds after the message was received. But she still adamantly claims no message ever existed? I feel like I would be able to move on if she just admitted it. But she won't. And swears that I'm crazy and making it up. This is the girl I've spent the past five years with and has told me everyday for the past two years, she loves me and wants to spend the rest of her life with me.

You poor fool, you want to believe her so badly, and you are hurt by what you have found.

You have the facts, so that makes her a liar, so dump her and put this behind you.

You will always be miserable if you stay, and will be miserable about ending things. So take your pick, and act in your own interest by ending it. At least the lies will end.

You know what you know, you heard the message,you checked the log, it was there, what's confusing you now is the barrage of 'it was'nt me!'

She was been with her boss before and it ended your relationship, now it has happened again.

You don't have to prove anything, she was the one who had to prove she could be faithful, I don't believe in once a cheater always a cheater, I believe people can make mistakes and they can prove themselves trustworthy again, but from your post I believe she is seeing him again, I may be wrong, this is purely opinion.

Cancel the lease, get your money back on the ring, close the door on the relationship and thank your lucky stars you know now and not when you got married.

1. You don't trust her
2. You KNOW she's lying to you.

So... what do you do?

1. Break it off with her. Now. Permanently. Write off the deposit on the lease as a loss, and return the ring.
2. Get checked for STD's.

I agree that you don't have to prove anything as you already know it.now its upon you to decide how badly you want to be in this relationship knowing all the facts.. or just move on.

It's devastating, planning your whole life around someone to find out they're lying to you. What makes it worse is I don't have real proof. If I would have just been smart enough to play the message for her before I left, it wouldn't have even been a question. But she denies it. And has turned it around on me, saying I'm crazy and she would never want to be with anyone who could accuse her of something like this?

What are the chances that I'm not right for whatever reason? It can't be. I heard the message, and saw the call record at the same time online. Yet she continues to deny it? After five years, how can someone be so manipulative and heartless to deny in the face of knowledge and then try to spin it around? If she would have said it was just her boss drunk leaving a message and it was unreciprocated from her, I WOULD have actually believed her! But the fact that she claims the message never existed? I checked the time and date stamp and the number. How would I even know the number if I didn't hear the message? She claims, I could have seen it before? ***? The denial is driving me insane.

she would never want to be with anyone who could accuse her of something like this

Well, that takes care of it then.

Why are you trying to justify that she is clean? She will never admit it and has even gone to the trouble of erasing and purging her phone. And you've walked down this road before.

Question: Is it possible, I somehow blew this out of proportion? I know she lied about the message. But maybe it was her boss just being drunk? And she didn't want to admit it. It would be very difficult for her to be cheating as I know where she is almost every night. But there have been a few occasions where she is unaccounted for. According to the call records I KNOW they aren't calling/txting every day? But I can't get over the message knowing that I heard him say "I miss you... and sorry I couldn't see you tonight..." The worst part is, I was the one that was likely being cheated on; and I'm the one that feels awful. Like I would almost do anything to get her back and return to "normal". But from what I've heard she's out acting as if everything is great.

Oh, it's possible.

It's just not very PROBABLE. It's possible that I'm going to win the lottery this week, too---but I'm not holding my breath and planning my life around it.

Why would she take the time and trouble to erase the message, etc. if there was no problem with it -- and then deny it even existed, plus assert there's nothing going on between them? Why is she so defensive? Why am I even posting this?

You know the truth of it, just will not admit it to yourself,
If it was nothing she would not lie, so no you do not need her to "confess" to move on, her confessing will only make you think you feel better or have some advantage, You want to "WIN" be proved right and have her admit it, so you can perhaps rub it in her face a little to make yourself feel a little better.

Leave with dignity

Take it from someone who has been in a similar situation... in the state you are in now, you want to believe her. But, guess what, the die has been cast. What would it matter if you played the message in front of her... there would be some other type of lame excuse/explanation. You're not crazy, just stunned right now.

Things will become much more clear once the dust settles and you will realize you just dodged a huge bullet. Tie up all the loose ends and do not so much as say goodbye to her.

Wake up and smell the roses sunshine, she's playing you like a fool and keeping the idiot boss on the hook for the 'down times' when she 'needs' something fresh and exciting.

She's a compulsive liar who needs the attention of men to feel 'wanted & needed'.

You're an idiot if you keep trying to justify her actions. They are not the actions of a woman who loves one man. She needs many to feel whole.

Time to pick up your ego and pride and kick her to the curb. You're asking for nothing but heartache if you continue to pursue her. You're never going to get an honest answer out of her because she doesn't realise what she is. Worse thing is, she doesn't think she's doing anything wrong.

DONEZO! You sound like a nice guy and there's tons of single, hot, sweet, available girls in their 20's and 30's looking for their prince. Let her and the boss have each other. It's going to be a hot mess and she will end up alone and lonely. I'm glad you found out now and not after you got married. I'm sorry you're going through this but in time and with no contact this will all be a thing of the past. Everything always works out as it should. Have faith!

The fact that she's lying and still continues to allow those texts is all you need to know.

You should have dumped her the first time. Really, had balls then.

Screw this. Sounds like she's been playing you the whole time.

Wake up, my man. NC from now on.

Ewww...

Your days with her are numbered any way because now she knows you are on to her. Handle your business, and cry later!

Why are sticking to the same thing again and again?it seems you don't want to let her go?

You know what happened. You know what you heard. You don't need us to tell you what you should do.

Face the truth and act accordingly.

You'll be happy you did a couple of months down the line.

Yes, I am having a hard time letting go. After five years and me being ready to propose I honestly believed she was the woman I would spend the rest of my life with. It's sad, but even after what she did, I have trouble sleeping and wake up in the morning in a panic because I can't bare the thought of life without her.

Just to be sure, I went through the tmobile call logs again. One thing I am certain of, is she did receive the message I heard from her boss at 1am. It did say, I miss you and sorry I couldn't see you tonight, etc. But I know for a fact that night she was at home and had messages me at 11pm. And the same the prior night. So, it would have been impossible for her to have been with him on those two days unless he came over after.

While the message is definitely an indicator that something happened between them at some point. I can't be sure when. Now that I look at the call logs again, their conversation (at least on the # I know) is sporadic. Sometimes a week or more in between. Although they do see each other at work. And there would be somewhat of a legtimate reason for them to be talking or texting. A lot of texts happen after work hours (8pm, 9pm, 10pm). The kicker is a 7 minute phone call at 2:28am on December 18th. A minute after she called me drunk and told me she was going to bed.

It's obvious she lied. And maybe at one point (when we were broken up or not) had some sort of inappropriate reltionship with him. But for some reason I can't but help thinking maybe the message was just him being drunk and there was nothing currently going on. Maybe she felt she had to give in to the messages because her job was in his hands. Maybe not, and I am completely naïve.

I have a call log of every txt and phone call between them from October to present. Do I send it to the Boss's wife with a description of the message I heard? On one hand it is extremely spiteful. On the other hand, as a spouse, I would want to know.

Nope. You don't get that luxury.

You just need to break it off with your girlfriend and walk away from the whole mess.

Besides--the wife isn't going to believe you anyway.

Leave it,chances are she either knows or will find out sooner rather than later-concentrate on moving on from the lies and the cheating.

Consider yourself lucky, a little bit anyway.

Lucky for finding out BEFORE the wedding.

A loving relationship is based on mutual trust.

The world is full of women who know how to be faithful. Go find one of those.

Stop wasting your time on this cheater. Let her "husband" have her.

Good luck to you.

Not sure what that's going to do. Just a waste of time now. More drama.

The trust is already gone. And probably been gone for a while.

Just NC, now.

Let her deal with her own life lessons.

I agree. Probably not good to get involved in someone else's failing marriage. Let it fall apart on its own and I don't want to be the cause. Even though it makes me furious at the thought his wife is in the dark like I was; everyday going out of our way to be faithful and doing things for our significant others - while they were doing whatever.

What bothers me the most is not having closure after 5 years of being faithful. And, the fact that she denies it and claims that nothing ever happened and the message didn't exist. I just want her to admit it. How about emailing her the log and simply asking her why? The last we spoke I never mentioned I found the proof that she called her voicemail. And, I believe she has no idea I was able to access the records for the past year. She will probably deny it again. But right now I think she's living her life thinking that I have no proof. It's juvenile, but maybe she'll at least suffer a portion of what I've gone through knowing that I know.

But best case scenario, maybe she'll admit it. And I'll be able to move on much easier. And not have doubts for the rest of my life.

Even though it makes me furious at the thought his wife is in the dark like I was
His wife may be more aware of his probable infidelities than you can imagine. If she thinks she has a lot to lose in a divorce, she may be closing her eyes.

But right now I think she's living her life thinking that I have no proof. It's juvenile, but maybe she'll at least suffer a portion of what I've gone through knowing that I know.
She knows you know, but is floating down a river called Denial. Don't push for what you consider closure. She will always float along on that river. All you would be doing is trying to one-up her. Just walk away. That would be the best solution.

Dude, this IS your closure. May not seem that way.

Your peace of mind without someone you can't really trust. Im sure you don't want that anyway.

Karma has its way. Don't worry about her or the wife. Not your business anymore.

Just live well. And look out for the bad ones out there next time.

Its normal to want revenge, but that's futile.

What? Have her tell you that she lied & wanted this other guy the whole time, as you were her solid BF?

Or, I love you, & I will never do that again, I promise.

See my point?

My ex dumped me after 5 years for someone else. Over the phone.

I went NC. Immediately. Never faltered. Its really the only way.

If you have to put blame (which also doesn't serve a purpose) Blame yourself.

For not using your gut earlier. Or getting with her to begin with.

There's cool women out there. Just got to use your experiences & radar..

You'll be OK. Takes time & some personal soul searching.

Cheers.

You were all right. Before reading your responses, I sent her the log. And, said, look, I know the truth it's right here plain as day, you don't have to deny it. If you will just be honest with me, perhaps we can work it out no matter how bad it is. Her response, "Thanks, Stalker. Believe whatever you want. We're friends and we work together. It's a blessing things happened the way they did. I don't want to have anything to do with someone who makes crazy accusations and doesn't respect my privacy. Good riddance".

I guess it's exactly what I expected. Even when I heard the message. Had the proof he left it. And saw that she called and texted him multiple times at hours when no woman should be texting her married boss (2:45am, etc.) she turns it around to place the fault solely on me, continues to deny and cause doubt.

Makes me think I'm crazy. And might have actually believed it based on how defensive and adamant she is; if I hadn't heard the voicemail. The scary part is it is actually crossing my mind that maybe his message telling her "he missed her, etc."; was innocenet? No, that can't be. Why couldn't I have somehow gotten a copy of the message?! How could I have spent five years of my life with someone who could blatently lie. In all honesty, maybe she believes she didn't do anything wrong?

Hope you got your closure.

See? She got exactly what she wants. Him. Without guilt. (again)

Some people are just twisted. Don't let it screw with you anymore.

Time to move on.

You're never going to get an honest answer out of her because she doesn't realise what she is. Worse thing is, she doesn't think she's doing anything wrong.

Im quoting myself because I'm to lazy to retype it.


Makes me think I'm crazy. And might have actually believed it based on how defensive and adamant she is; if I hadn't heard the voicemail. The scary part is it is actually crossing my mind that maybe his message telling her "he missed her, etc."; was innocenet? No, that can't be. Why couldn't I have somehow gotten a copy of the message?! How could I have spent five years of my life with someone who could blatently lie. In all honesty, maybe she believes she didn't do anything wrong?

No you're making yourself chase your own tail trying to justify how you didn't see this trait in her earlier. The screwball will be when you start thinking if she's done this before and you start thinking back to if she texted at silly times and said it was a girlfriend she was replying too. What would you get from having a copy of the message? She's burnt her bridges you've heard the proof what would you want it for except to torture yourself with it. You could have the guy standing in front of her saying it and she'd blow it off and make you second guess your own beliefs.

Time to pick yourself up, dust it off, put it down to 'life experience' and move on. Just means you'll be that little bit wiser next time around.. and aware of what 'could' be going on.

Close the book now.

She is who she is and now she's no longer in your life.

You dodged a bullet.

In days to come you'll be thankful you did.

Well, I thought it would help. But it just made it worse. Based on her response that it was me who "is making crazy accusations" and being adamant that they are "just friends and coworkers". I feel guilty and to blame. All that I can seriously think about is what if the message was innocent? Or if the calls and texts were innocent and they WERE just friends? Or, if something happened in the past (i.e. when we were broken up) and he is still hung up on her.

I just don't understand. If it were me and I spent five years in a relationship constantly telling the person I wanted to marry them. And they were under the mistaken belief that I was having an affair. Even though I would be mad for them invading my privacy; I would do everything I could to make it right. Her response, is to call me "crazy" and still say no message ever existed. Claim that she calls and texts her "friends" late at night.

She then goes further to tell me "it's a blessing things happened the way they did" and SHE "refuses to be with someone who jumps to conclusions or makes accusations".

I mean, she did give me her t-mobile login? And, to be honest, I was with her or talking to her almost all the time; it would have been very difficult for her to see him. Unless, he would sneak over after she said she was going to bed. Or, during lunch at work. I mean the logistics would have been very difficult. Maybe she was innocent? But how can that be? I listened to the message three times, he called her "princess", said he "missed her" and "was going to keep his promise to her"... and it was at 1am!

And, I'm the one who is devistated, unable to sleep, just thinking about how I will never find anyone that I shared so much with. And just content to say "everything happens for a reason". It's what she said the time we broke up 2 years ago.

You are repeating yourself.

While I fully understand the frustration you feel, its time to leave her alone, so you can get your head together.

Its been stuck up her butt far to long so get some fresh air and look around at the rest of the world.

Nice rants though.

Stop going round in circles-make the choice to put it behind you.

The option is to swim around in this c**p for a long time-now that sounds like a waste of time,don't you think?

I just received an email from her. Essentially it said this: you were right, I lied to you. My boss did leave me the message. He was really drunk and didn't remember what he said. I didn't tell you the truth because I was worried how you would take it. He and I became "very close" when you and I broke up. I cut some ties with him when we got back together, but we still kept in touch. Yes, the voicemail sounded affectionate, but we have a very affectionate relationship. However, we are just friends. He is the type of person that is very touchy, feely, etc. Whether you like it, I will continue to be friends with men in my life. It is your preogative but I cannot promise you that I will not maintain a relationship with him. As we are friends and work together. But I can promise you that it is an innocent relationship.

Ha!

You will never be able to trust her.
She can't have her cake & eat it too. Doesn't work that way.

You don't need this. Go NC now. She's made her bed.
Too late.

Funny,isn't it,how the story changes?

Stop clutching at straws.

NC.

Yes, it's OK to have friends of the opposite sex as long as you are open and honest with your partner. Once you start sneaking around and withholding info it becomes inappropriate and unacceptable. It's a gray area but I think if you can confidently say that your husband/wife would be comfortable with your convos and interactions then yes you can claim innocent friendship.

Seriously, if the love of my life told me that a relationship of mine caused him grief I would end it in a heartbeat. If it was a relative or girlfriend I would push back. In other words it has to be within reason but I think in this scenario you are entirely justified.

May I also add that I believe there is more than one person out there for us. You are only 34. You have your entire life ahead of you. Don't just settle because you fear not meeting someone that you're as compatible with. It will totally happen especially if you believe it will.

What are you going to say and do?

Don't know. In all honesty, she'll never admit it, but I am positive they had an affair. Likely around the time we broke up. I always suspected another man and it now kind of fits in place. I'm guessing the full fleged affair stopped when we got back together or shortly thereafter. Although they still talked frequently. Currently, he likely still has feelings for her, hence the message. But I don't think they've been together recently. She's not going to quit her job, it's the best she's ever had. And, she's not going to stop talking to him.

It's a tough decision. Do I want to be with someone who likely had an affair with a married man in the past that she still works with and lied to me? Could be a recipe for certain disaster. And, how will I ever trust her going to a work function?

You don't have to if you get a life without her and leave the emotional BS alone.

I'm just going to suggest you read through the advice you've been given and l e t it sink in.

Then make your mind up-what is real and what isn't.

It's a tough decision. Do I want to be with someone who likely had an affair with a married man in the past that she still works with and lied to me? Could be a recipe for certain disaster. And, how will I ever trust her going to a work function?

Really? She must be feeling very smug. Oh don't get me wrong she'll do the woah's me BS and I'm sorry.. I didn't want to hurt you.. I love you... blah blah freakin blah

You.. will fold faster than paper through a shredder. You're an idiot if you do. You don't want to be lied to. You don't like being used. You don't like being taken for a fool.. but really.. if you go back you will be. And you will have to get used to putting up with playing second fiddle.

Your life. You have a choice. Start a new life on a new path or go down the same uneven, unstable on already battered out.

Guess we'll see you back here in 4 months when she does it again or receives another 'drunken' call at early hours.

Just leave her. You are going to get hurt even more than you are now if you take her back.

One of the benefits of her giving me her password is that I had access to all her call logs from the last year.

This I can say with relative certainty. There is a high likelihood she was not cheating with her boss in the past six months. Unless, they didn't call or text each other to meet up. 90% of her calls and texts to him were during times when I know she was at home alone before or after she was talking to me. Or, was with me. Now this may seem strange, but I am fairly confident that logistically they couldn't have been together; unless he would come over once every two to three weeks and spend less than 40 minutes with her.

Regardless, I am almost positive at one point they had an affair. This could have been when we broke up 2 years ago. I am not dumb enough to believe that people who are "just friends" (one of whom is married); leave messages for each other saying they "miss them".

Her call records also indicate that when she got really drunk back in December she called and texted her x-boyfriend, some other guy she met when we broken up and her boss. I recall this particular evening because we got in a fight because she told me she was going to hang out at a bar where I knew her x would be. She called me multiple times at 2am; I didn't answer. She then called her x at 2am, her boss and this guy. She then called me and left me a nonsensical message. Then there was a text message from her to him at 5am. She called me the next morning apologizing, saying she was wrong for even going, and we made up. Her call records indicate that she has not called or texted her x or the other guy since.

All that being said, I am not stupid. And, I realize her behavior shows a pattern. Which, in all honesty, there is a VERY good chance she will only repeat if I give it another chance. I also realize that getting back together with her would only likely result in something similar happening down the road. On the other hand, at what point does a person deserve a second/third chance? I myself have not been perfect in the relationship. We've had our ups and downs. And, during the downs, I've definitely done things that could be considered inappropriate. So who am I to hold her to a perfect standard? On the other hand, I've never had an affair with a married man I still work with. I haven't ever had any sort of affair with anyone while I was dating her. Of course it is difficult to let go after 5 years, but I guess the real question is; is it possible for someone to change?

Ot that it deserves clarification. But I'm not 100% positive what the message said, except for the "Princess, I miss you and keep my promise" parts. I'm pretty sure it said "sorry I couldn't see you tonight". But I could be wrong. I do know that, that particular day and before, they had a large group work function. So that explains the "spending time with you yesterday". And the "see you tonight". Not sure how that could be possible. Because that night, she called and texted me all night and before she went to bed. I guess though, if he "couldn't see her". That wouldn't make a difference. She explained that "the keep my promise part" was because he didn't help out with the event. And he "promised" to do the work for the next event the following week.

Like I said, the calls logs don't lie. I doubt that an affair is currently going on. It would just not be logistically possible. But there is NO doubt in my mind that something happened at some point. You just don't call someone "princess" and say "I miss you"; if there wasn't a romantic relationship.

I guess the question would be; if you knew your significant other had an affair with a married man at some point. But that it was likely over now. Would you give it a chance to reconcile?

Read all the advice again. And then again, Then one more time.

She doesn't deserve any more chances.

If you take her back, you will only be in for more of the same.

Unhappiness.

Go NC & move on.

Guy, you can go over this in your mind as much as you like and figure all the angles, possibilities, and option.

Fact remains the way you handled things has already poisoned the well, and either made them harder, or burned a bridge. Take your pick.

So back up, and give this some thought without her influence, because I doubt you will ever trust her again even if she walks the straight and narrow.

Here's the thing:

The trust is gone between the two of you, and neither of you communicates well with the other.

Those two things alone would mean that your relationship is doomed to disaster.

Walk away now.

Quit running in circles.
Even if there isn't an affair going on right now - she LIED to you about the message. Then turned it against you basically calling you a crazy stalker, when SHE was lying to YOU. Who does that?

You got that right!!

Here's the thing.

There were already trust issues. She knew that.

No one should have to go through phone records to find out if their mate is true.

It was her responsibility to nip this in the bud. But continued as if nothing was wrong.
UNTIL you called her on it. It could have gone on forever.

I work with lots of women, but sure as hell don't send lovey, dovey texts to them.

Im not saying what you did was right, but what she's doing is worse. Shows you exactly what her priorities are. Zero respect for you or your relationship. (let alone self-respect)

Women like that give women a bad name. She needs to grow up.

And you need to chalk this one up. And learn for the next time.

Just don't let mistrust ruin the next one just because of her...

She showed up at my house last night. Said she wanted to talk. Wanted to apologize and again admit she lied about the message. Said she lied because the message "sounded" bad. And she knew how she would react if she heard it. She said she was wrong as her initial instinct was to lie because she didn't know how to explain it. She said she was mad that I checked her voicemail and invaded her privacy, that is why she continued to deny it and her first reaction was to blame it on me instead of explaining.

She claimed again and to my face multiple times that she has NEVER had a sexual relationship or affair with her boss. Instead they are VERY close friends, who know all the details of each others lives and talk constantly at the office. That they may talk late at night and she admitted that it could likely be seen as inappropriate (at least on his end because he is married), but that SHE is just friends with him and has never been with him physically. She reiterated that she would never be with a married man.

She claimed that he was incoherently drunk when he left the message, and that the "I miss you" and "miss being with you" was because they spend all day together at the office. She also said that he never said "sorry I couldn't be with you tonight". I thought I heard something to this effect, but can't remember. He may have said "sorry, I couldn't be there today" (i.e. the work event). But again I swear he said "tonight".

She said she told him about this whole thing and he was so upset that it caused us to break up. He wanted to call to apologize and confirm that there is absolutely nothing going on. But she told him not to.

She also claimed that the one time she called him at 2:58am for seven minutes was when she was drunk and she left him a rambling voicemail. I remember this evening, she also left me a long drunk message. Other than that, there have been a few calls and messages (every other week) after work hours; sometimes around 10pm. She claimed that this was either them talking as friends but mostly related to work.

I confronted her multiple times and said there is no reason a married man would leave a message at 1am saying "I miss you" and "miss being with you". Unless, there was something going on. Or, had gone on. She adamantly denied it. Reasserting she would never be with a married man with two kids.

To prove her innocence she gave me her password to her AT&T account and gave me permission to check ANY of her call or texts records for anytime.

At this point, my instinct tells me she's still lying. It just doesn't add up. Married men don't leave messages like that, even when completely drunk, unless something happened. But, she is being transparent?

It doesn't matter.

You don't trust her, and she compounded that with lying.

The ONLY way this relationship even has a CHANCE is if she cuts ALL contact with her boss outside of work, allows you access whenever you want to any message system she has, and a LOT of counseling.

In fact, I recommend you end the engagement, back off from dating seriously, and see if you can build the trust back up before being involved at a committed level with her at this time.

I do not know what's what, but do know that she does not conform to what YOU think is the proper girlfriend, and she may never meet what standards that YOU have, and that's what makes this a useless endeavor.

This relationship is poison, and I do not see the point. If you do, please explain.

The great thing now is that you no longer have to be paranoid or second guess, spend your days & nights in question. Living in the past.

She's not it. BetrayedPA. Period.

You've let her run things long enough. Was it worth it? Obviously not. Forget what you though was going to happen.

Go NC, now. Fully.

You're free, thank your lucky stars. The past behind.

Now you can use your gut.

Well, just wanted to provide you with an update. Over the past week, she has gone (somewhat) out of her way to make an effort to rectify things. She still claims that nothing sexual ever happened with her boss. That she always loved me and always wanted to marry me. And that those things have never changed.

I shouldn't have, but I've been seeing her again. In all honesty, it's kind of a limbo state. Her saying she wants us to be together. And, me staying with her because despite all that's happened and knowing she is probably an awful person, I still somehow cling to a false sense of hope that she means what she says and can be a good person.

She claims she talked to her boss and told him not to contact her anymore outside of work. And that she hasn't spoken to him outside of work since. She said she'll quit her job if that is what it takes; but ONLY if I financially support her until she finds a new job. I seriously doubt she's telling the truth about quitting her job.

She also claims she'd marry me right now; no wedding, etc. Just so that we were married. Because she knows she wants to marry me. On the other hand, I am now moving into the place who's lease we jointly signed and am solely responsible. She is staying where she is currently renting. But claims that she wants to move in with me. She, however, says that she will not move in until I ask her to marry me and give her a ring. A very expensive ring.

Since I last wrote, I've also had the time to do some investigating of my own into the phone records she gave me. I can again confirm that she was talking to her boss outside of work at inappropriate hours. In all honesty, it could have been innocent over the past few months. But right around the time we were breaking up and even after the time we got back together there were texts and phone calls late into the night. Some coming from him at 1am. Despite what she claims, I have NO DOUBT in my mind, based on the message and the call records, that something definitely happened. Maybe not recently. But definitely at some point.

In addition, her call records show that a few months after we got back together she was still talking to one guy who I know she "hooked up with". There is nothing good for the self esteme like seeing that she was texting this guy (at the same time as me) all hours of the night; at a time in our relationship when she was telling me she knew she only wanted to be with me again and she wanted us to be together forever. She has always claimed that they are just "good friends". Same as what she said about her boss. He has a girlfriend now. Which might explain why they stopped talking a few months ago.

Finally, I found out that she likely was considering submitting herself to be on the Bachelorette TV Show two days before I discovered the message from her boss and a week before we were planning on getting engaged and we were supposed to move in together. I can't confirm it, but I would say it's about 90% likely based on the timeline. Of course, I haven't brought it up, because all it will result in is denials. And maybe I'm just paranoid, but after all this; I'm guessing it's probably true.

To be honest, it's an awful situation I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. I've spent five years of my life completely dedicated to someone. That appears to just do whatever the **** she wants. And only care about herself.

I've spent the last few months spending my life savings on a ring. And moving into a place that is extremely inconvenient for me, just to be with her. All the time listening to her tell me how she can't wait to live with me and spend the rest of her life with me.

I guess the question really is, why? Of course, only she can answer that.

But why would a person tell someone they want to marry them and spend the rest of their life with them? Why would someone spend five years dating someone? Sign a lease to move in with them? And, now after being caught and everything that happened want to reconcile the situation and call and email them and tell them they love them and want to be with them? When they've clearly ONLY looked out for themselves by staying in contact with other men, probably having an affair, and then consider applying to be on a TV show to find a husband?

WHY WASTE THE TIME AND EFFORT, WHEN IF THERE WAS ANYONE ELSE SHE WOULD RATHER BE WITH; SHE COULD JUST DO IT! No need to spend all her time with me. No need to email and call and tell me she loves me. No need to plan to move in with me. No need to say she still wants to marry me. No need to keep doing all of it and then in the background talk to other guys, have affairs and apply to reality TV dating shows.

Yes, she's extremely materialistic and probably thinks I can provide a good life for her. And, yes, she's getting older and probably wanted to be married long before now. But why spend the time and go through all of it, with someone you've betrayed and are just going to betray in the end? It just doesn't make sense.

And why do I, after five years and all this ****, still believe her? Still want to be with her? Still believe that she is the only one who makes me happy?

"I've spent five years of my life completely dedicated to someone. That appears to just do whatever the **** she wants. And only care about herself.'"

Doesn't that say it all?

I would leave her alone. This whole thing stinks to high heaven.

Honestly, I would rather be alone than with someone like that. Especially if I couldn't trust her. She's a user.

You are confusing love with desperation.

Just go NC. End your problem.

OK, look... basically to her you have been "Mr Safety".. the honest,dependable hard working guy she can go to for love,support.. whatever. She knows that as long as she has you she's safe.. always someone there for her when things don't go right with these other guys. Well, now that the cat is out of the bag, she's scared... at this point she will do or tell you whatever will convince you to stay with her.

She has even dangled the "marriage carrot" in front of your face. Would you say this whole experience has brought the both of you closer?

I know it's hard but, don't let your emotions cloud your judgement. Go NC, give yourself the time to let all this emotional dust settle.. things will be more clearer then.

Well here is a testimate of how she's changed so much in the past few days.

All I've wanted to do for weeks was go to this concert. But didn't get tickets because they were sold out and very expensive. Turns out she got tickets through her work for free. Guess what message I get after she gets the tickets.

Guess who got tickets? But, sorry, I'm taking my friend. We already had plans tonight and she's never been to see this band. I'll call you after!

Never ceases to amaze me how she only cares about herself. If I even said anything, I would look like the a**hole. Maybe I'm ultra sensitive, but this stuff like this happens all the time. I won't even speculate on "who" from her work may be also going as I know the boss has standing tickets at this venue.

Put the shoe on the other foot. And, I would have taken her 100 times of a 100. If I didn't. God forbid, and took someone else, god forbid what I would have had to listen too.

Starting to realize more and more, how one-sided this all is.

C'mon, man.

How much more proof do you need?

Its getting pathetic.

Go NC & you will never again have her as a problem. You are actually doing it to yourself now.

When she calls, make arrangements to return each other's personal property and cover any outstanding business. Then break off ALL contact with her.

Please don't take offense, but... She isn't in or ready for any relationship that doesn't revolve around her. If you keep trying, perhaps you should call her 'Sun' and change your name to 'Pluto'.

You need to take time for yourself.

Boy, your head has to be busted by now, as many times as you have banged it into a brick wall!!

Oooooooooooohhh you're going to be one of 'those guys'.. the 'i've seen the light', 'i see her for what she is', 'she treated me like crap'...

She snaps her fingers and you'll go panting back to her as soon as she says she's sorry and she'll change...

/popcorn anyone?