It's been nearly 10 years since I graduated from college and a year or more before that since my last dating experience. I guess you could say I've been focused on my career, and even though I have been, I have more free time any anyone I know, mainly because I don't share my time with a significant other. All my friends are busy all the time because their wives and kids keep them that way. With all my free time you'd think I'd be able to drum up a date every once in a while, but this just isn't so.

I'm willing to admit that I've got some mental barriers to my goals in relationships and sex, but as a matter of principle I'm not one to subscribe to psychobabble or medications as a viable options for self improvement. A good conversation with a close friend can go a long way to setting one's mind at ease about a wide variety of problems. My issue, and reason for seeking anonymous help online, is however, that I have a very hard time relating to my friends about the topics of relationships and sex. I think this is mainly because they've all been getting married and having kids for so long now they simply can't see things from my perspective, or are unable to relate to my apprehensions, inadequacies, fears about dating and sex because they themselves overcame these obstacles long ago at a younger age when it was easier for them to do so. In short, I genuinely have no one to talk to about my relationship problems.

Day by day I see people on the streets simply holding hands with or sharing a romantic gaze with their partner and this is something my friends all take for granted. Having been completely devoid of any and all physical & emotional contact with women for the last decade, when I see someone holding hands with their partner or exchanging a loving gaze it's enough to bring all my fears and anxieties to the surface in an instant. Through no will of my own, I'll be taken on roller coaster ride of emotions where I first hate the couple for having each other when I've got no one. Then comes a rush of fear and doubt followed by self loathing for my own sort comings in relationships, sex & life in general.

Because simple things like holding hands are so 2nd nature to my friends and their partners, I find it very difficult to accurately convey my feelings/fears/etc about relationship woes, because they simply can't relate. My one married buddy always says something like “you can do it!” or “its not too late to whip it--whip it good! ” comments that although entertaining, offer no actual advice, comfort or solace; and so here I am asking the faceless horde of internet goons for advice.

I turned 30 this year, and getting older is shaking up a lot of new fears and anxiety about being alone forever that have only become more amplified over the last decade. I **** you not, this year I've found myself worrying about experiencing erectile dysfunction or death before I ever spend the night with a woman—not pleasant thoughts, and given my track record thus far, not outside the realm of possibility.

Back in high school and college I dated a few girls briefly, but never have had a lasting relationship. In the brief relationships I have had, even if we got along great, some minor fooling around is as far as anything ever went, and to this day sexual intercourse remains as elusive as Sasquatch, Chupacabra, peace on earth and good will towards men.

I have never had trouble talking to girls in general, even the ones I'm attracted to. I generally have no trouble stirring up conversation, but I think my problem is I have no method for turning casual conversation into anything more than that—I've got no game. Sure I can speak passionately about politics, science, religion, sociology or whatever, but I have little to say about relationships, intimacy or sex in particular, simply because I have so little exposure to these things. Walking up to a stranger at the bar with the proverbial “hay baby how it going” just isn't my style, so even meeting new people I never manage to send clear signals of my own interest and end up in the 'friends only' bin because either I miss the queues women are sending, or failed to send any of my own.

In the past I've fallen pretty hard for the few girls I have dated, and I think sensing this, these girls ended up viewing me as some kind of lost puppy or charity case, who wasn't offering what they were looking for, thus kicking me to the curb. Having fallen hard in the past, I have a lot of anxiety about dating now because I simply want to avoid the horribly disparaging feelings associated with rejection which have only become amplified for me over these past 10+ years. It is a flight or fight response, and my brain is choosing to run for the hills.

Consciously I know that all I have to do is 'just do it' or 'whip it,' but to borrow yet another cliché, it's 'easier said than done.' My psychosis tells me that: being 30, having little if any relationship experience, and zero sexual experience, is a turnoff to women of my age and standing (or any woman) who are quite simply looking for more than I have to offer. At my age it's getting to the point where unless I start claiming religious celibacy (which I don't), women will think there is something intrinsically wrong with me when they learn I “haven't dated in X years, and have never had sex.” I know better than to state that verbatim, but it illustrates my point.

Another fear I have in relationships and sex is inadequacy. Even if I find a woman who doesn't mind or notice my dating inexperience, inevitably she will learn about my sexual inexperience as well. Sure I've seen the 'movies' and can tell you what buttons to push and which levers to pull, but that doesn't make me Ron Jeremy or Dirk Diggler—or Casanova for that matter. You can watch gymnastics all day long, but that doesn't make you a gymnast, and you're definitely not going to win any medals.

When partners are both young and/or inexperienced, there is little expectation, and the awkwardness I feel constantly is felt by both partners. At my age, most women I'd be dating will probably have made their rounds and overcome their awkwardness. Most would also know what they're looking for in a sexual partner, and chances are, given my inexperience, I'm not it. Maybe being good in the sack is over rated, but try telling that to the rest of society—they just don't listen.

So where does this leave me? What can I do to overcome these obstacles and find a woman that I'm right for and that is right for me? I'm not into the club scene, and online dating still feels as awkward as hitting on randoms at the club—these things just aren't my style. I'm into camping, hiking, biking, boating, sailing, skiing, flying, photography and lots of other fun stuff, but I've always done these things solo, and its frankly very hard meeting women on a back-country camping trip surrounded by miles and miles of pristine wilderness.

Meeting new people is good, and dating a bunch of them to find someone right is fine, but at this point, I'm not sure I have the energy for all of that, and I'm getting too old to be wasting my time with a bunch of dating head games and nonsense. What I'm looking for is a companion. Someone I can talk to about my fears and anxieties, likes and dislikes—someone who shares my interests and goals—someone who can understand me and who genuinely wants to spend time with me—someone to hold hands, or share a deep gaze with. These are the things I want most, and the other things that come along, intimacy, love, sex, family & spending a lifetime together, are only icing on the cake from my perspective.

For the love of god, I'm not reading all of this self pitty feminine crap. Do you drink? Go out, drink a few beers, meet a nice friendly woman, drink a few more beers and then kiss her. Women don't want this 'i don't know how to tie my own shoe and I get nervous crap!' they want a man that will free them from their own insecurities. Take charge. You sound like you would ask a woman if it was OK to kiss her.

Women are complex and chronic overthinkers. Men are simple and women appreciate simple and direct men. The last thing they want is someone gushing over potentially holding their hand and overanalyzing everything. It doesn't matter how educated and successful you are. You have to relax, take charge, and act like you've dated before.

.. and so here I am asking the faceless horde of internet goons for advice

As one of these goons you speak of and a woman..

Ok so this is the fourth and final time I'll attempt to write this. See completely fallable. We all have failings. One of those is being able to exert what it is we're trying to put across, failing and trying again till you get it right.

You are a blank canvas. And to any decent, intelligent smart woman out there.. you are a catch worth keeping. So you're not 'down' with how relationships work, is anyone?. Trial, error, communication, more communication and mooorrree communication. And as for the intimacy. Doesn't practise make perfect? I confess if someone like you walked into my life, I'd take a week or two.. maybe three off work... (I jest).

You need to relax and go with the flow and leave your insecurities at the door. Everyone has insecurities and skeletons and pasts that are or can be embarrassing and feel invasive for any future relationships. You're not alone. And your not 'too old' to do anything and you'd be surprised at who you could meet, boating, skiing and anything outdoorsy. Perhaps your just not looking in the right places :)

Faceless horde signing out

you sound like you would ask a woman if it was ok to kiss her.

There is nothing wrong with that. A respectable woman wants a man who will ask her permission.

I would swoon over a man who asked my permission to kiss me. He would have my heart forever.

Please read Kyle's threads before deciding to take any of his advice.

There is a very big difference between being confident and being a jerk.

You may not like the concept, but seeing a counselor may help you work through the blocks you have developed over the years. Instead of thinking of it as psychobable, think of it as talking to a friend who can give you good advice.

for the love of god, i'm not reading all of this self pitty feminine crap. do you drink? go out, drink a few beers, meet a nice friendly woman, drink a few more beers and then kiss her. women don't want this 'i dont know how to tie my own shoe and i get nervous crap!' they want a man that will free them from their own insecurities. take charge. you sound like you would ask a woman if it was ok to kiss her.

If I had to choose between you and Slackard, I'd go for Slackard hands down.

To Slackard, don't listen to this advice, it's from a young guy that obviously acts like a player. It takes more than big talk and beer to get a girl worth your time. Guys like him eventually learn that all the fake bravado is not the way to get a girl. At least not a girl with an IQ bigger than her bra size. :rolleyes:

There's nothing wrong with you that a little confidence can't fix. I don't normally read a post as long as yours but I was intrigued, not only by your story, but your writing style. You are an intelligent man, you have a sense of humor, you know your shortcomings and you're willing to admit them. You have a lot to offer, so start with the things that are good about you and leave the other crap behind, because in the long run the stuff you're worried about really doesn't matter when it comes to finding love.

You need to allow yourself to get out there. You need to allow yourself the pain that comes with rejection. It's all part of the process of finding someone you are compatible with. Rejection happens. Most people don't find "the one" their first time out.

You're only 30. You're still young. There's nothing to be ashamed of, especially when it comes to your virginity. The right girl, heck, most girls, would find it a real turn on to be with a guy that saved himself just for them. Will you be a bit clumsy? Well most couples aren't totally insync when they first start sleeping together, despite past experience. It's a learning process. Find a girl that you are comfortable enough to talk to and she'll tell you what she wants, you just need to follow directions.

I know you said that dating sites are out of the question but that really is something I think you should consider. It's much better than meeting some drunken girl in the bar. The people on dating sites are looking for the same thing you are, companionship, someone to spend time with, get to know. The nice thing about dating sites is that they match your criteria fairly well. You won't have to date random girls hoping that you two match, or have the same interests. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this as an option.

Dating is hard. It can be work, but it's also a great time in your life, a time to explore, meet new people. It shouldn't be something that you fear, it should be something you embrace.

I'll put it this way. What do you have to lose? Loneliness? Well, that sounds like something worth striving for. Put yourself out there, allow others in, and see what happens. That's the only way to get what you want.

I hope you come back despite Kyles posts. There are many wonderful people on this site, sadly the first to post on your thread is not the person that can help you with this.

<Altenweg> What do you have to lose?

Altenweg,
Sleep, and a lot of it!
Thanks very much for the thoughtful reply..

To those who think my post was too long or that I'm just over thinking things.. spend 10 yrs thinking about something and you'll have a lot to say too.
Thanks for your comments.

If I had a daughter, I'd hope I could get you to go out with her.

Like Alty said, you sound like an impressive, intelligent, well-spoken young man. My younger son is 35 and is in the same boat as you. He had a few gfs in high school and college, but was more into getting a good education and finding a job rather than scoring or settling down with a wife.

I'll tell you what I've told him (and he actually has been following some of my advice!) -- join a public library book discussion group and/or writing group, and get to know people in the group. Someone might have an unmarried daughter or niece or sister whom they will introduce you to. I suggested he actually leave his house and do something worthwhile. Jeremy is now a volunteer at a local cat shelter and joined a large church. At both places he is making new friends. He has also joined a couple of secular and Christian dating sites, and has been on dates with several women in the area. He joined a local gym that caters to young singles (but anyone is welcome to join).

Wedding bells aren't ringing yet, but at least he's gotten himself "out there" and is meeting people of all ages and is making new friends -- and best of all, has become more confident and happier with himself. And there's a ripple effect in that his work situation has improved, he has become a better housekeeper (because of having people over to eat or to hang out), and he's into fitness and better nutrition now.

Follow in Jeremy's footsteps, and let us know how it's going.

Altenweg,
Sleep, and a lot of it!
Thanks very much for the thoughtful reply..

To those who think my post was too long or that im just over thinking things.. spend 10 yrs thinking about something and youll have a lot to say too.
Thanks for your comments.

But you may loose sleep with someone next to you. Isn't that worth a bit of stress? ;)

You're not over thinking things, that's just who you are. I can see in your post that you weigh the pros and cons for most things you do, which is what you're doing now. That's great in most things in life, but when it comes to relationships, it can be a negative. Falling in love, dating, it's not about thinking things through, it's about feeling. You have to allow yourself to feel, the good and the bad, in order to get somewhere with the opposite sex.

You're a smart guy, that's evident in your post. You do have confidence, I can see that in your post too, even if you can't see it. To know you in real life would be a treat. You sound like the type of guy I could spend hours talking to and never be bored for a moment. You have to go with that, use what you have and put yourself out there, despite your fear.

You've lived 30 years with this. You went to college, you have a career, you have activities you enjoy, you have friends. This is no different than that. Each thing we do in life has it's negative and positive consequences. Like college. You could have flunked out. I'm sure you though about it. Did you let that stop you? No, you did it, and you succeeded. Now you have to conquer this. Will you meet your dream girl first time out? Unlikely. Will it end in heart ache? It could. But, is there a chance that you'll find someone you really enjoy being with, someone who's mind, body and soul allures you? Hell you. So put yourself out there, take the risk. I promise you that it's worth it.

Maybe he could send his rejects to Jeremy?