There was a woman that worked at the same company as my husband in a previous job. The first I heard about this woman was when my husband started telling me about how nearly all the men she worked with were infatuated with her. He told me lots of stories about how all the guys were competing for her attention, texting her, phoning her, e-mailing her etc. He seemed to view these guys as rather pathetic. He seemed appalled when one of the men who worked with her told his long-term, pregnant, girlfriend that he would leave her for this other woman if she would have him. I have no idea how one woman could have such a profound affect on so many men but I classed her as some kind of man-eater. I distinctly got the impression from what I was being told that this woman loved the attention of men and knew just how to get it.

Then my husband started working directly with this woman and his opinion, and behaviour changed dramaticaly. He suddenly decided she was the nicest person he had ever met and it wasn't her fault that all the men were besotted with her. He talked about her loads. It felt like he was infatuated with her. He lost his job there and was really upset. He said he had really loved working there and missed the people he worked with. He kept wanting to get together with the people he used to work with but seemed to do all the communicating about it with this one woman. I often didn't know he was texting her until I was told by someone else. Sometimes he would text this woman and not hear back from her for a while and would get really cross that she was ignoring him. He would act really bad tempered at home and when I got upset about it and asked what was going on he would go on about this woman and how she wasn't answering his messages. He was talking about her to me all the time and it still seemed like infatuation. He got some new pet guinea-pigs for his birthday and named one of them after her, and the other two after 2 other girls he worked with. This meant I had to listen to him calling to his pet,"come on'x'darling". I tried to say that I was unhappy with all this but he kept saying she was just a friend and I was being unreasonable expecting him to not be friends with her. He said it was unfair that I wouldn't let him have female friends. I pointed out that he had had other female friends in the past and I had never complained. He said I was only actling differently because this one was younger and more attractive.

Eventually after a lot of arguing he said he wouldn't contact her anymore but he was very cross about it.

A short time after this he suddenly started spending an excessive amount of time on the internet looking at porn. I was unhappy about the amount and the actual content. This led to more arguments. I felt I couldn't trust him as his behaviour was just so unpredictable. We have been together 25 years and he didn't act like this before. He always liked occasional porn, which I'm not sure what my feeling are about that. I don't like it but I try to accept it. This stuff was a whole new level though and it was for hours every night. I felt he was doing it to punish me for not letting him stay in contact with this woman. When I tried to get him to say why he had needed to look at it he gave several contradictory replies. One of which was that it was to stop him having an affair. He admitted that he had been thinking about it recently but had never considered it before in all our years of marriage. I felt like I didn't know who he was anymore. He said he hadn't changed. He didn't say he wanted an affair with this specific woman though but mentioned the other women he had been working with at the same job. He had never given me any inkling that he had feelings for these other girls so I found this bewildering.

We had an almighty fall out and I told him my trust was shaken and it would take time to rebuild it. He said he would be patient as long as he felt I was trying.

So fast forward a few weeks and now I discover he has been texting and e-mailing this woman again. I knew he had been wanting to set up a night out with these old work colleagues again and that she would be there but I decided I could be OK with that. I didn't know they had been in regualar contact again. Some of the things in the e-mails made me vey uncomfortable.

He said to her 'you're too young to be tied down - at least in marriage lol'
'you're the most intelligent and secretive woman I know'
And 'that's a story for a long bottle of wine not an e-mail'.

He says the first was just a harmless joke, the second flattery to get her to tell him stuff he wanted to know, and the third was a 'standing joke'.

He still maintains it is just a friendship. He also says he wished she was his sister or his daughter. He says he thinks of her as a sister and would be more upset if something happened to her than if something happened to his actual sister. Although, as he points out, he's not that close to his real sister. He says as he isn't having sex with her, and doesn't intend to, it has nothing to do with our relationship. He is very angry with me for pressing this issue. He says I am forcing him to give up the friendship of someone who is really nice and he really likes. He has started saying we should meet and seems to think it would be OK if I could be her friend too. I don't think I could judge this woman fairly in light of all the stuff he told me at the beginning and I feel that if I tried but didn't like her it would be me that would be the evil one in his eyes. This is affecting me so much I can't sleep or eat. In one breath he says he is really sorry that this is hurting me so much so he will stop e-mailing her and in the next he says he will stop because 'it's not worth the hassle', and makes it clear he's very angry with me for pushing him to do so. He says he is really sad about it. He says he doesn't want to say anything to her about ending the friendship because he thinks she would either think it was vey funny or be appalled that I am so jealous. He also says she is really nice so he doesn't want to upset her.

I'm not sure he's fully decided whether to stop contacting her - he seems to be saying he will, then saying he needs more time to think about it. We both realise that even if he does it is going to be hard for me to trust him. When he goes off to do things on his computer I'm going to be worrying whether he is e-mailing her. He is angry that I have stopped trusting him. He says the fact that he doesn't delete all his e-mails and texts and is willing for me to meet her proves he is doing nothing wrong. The fact that he talks about her in such a strong way, started e-mailing her again without telling me, and all the stuff he told me about her in the beginning makes it really difficult for me to accept this isn't an infatuation, albeit a non-sexual one, rather than a friendship. At one point he said that if he has to end this freindship with her it will affect him for the rest of his life. I am so confused...

So take your husband up on his suggestion, and keep an open mind. Meet her, and have an honest girl talk, send your husband on an errand, and see what she is about. That has to be better than assuming, and presuming. You really owe it to yourself to check this out personally, because what if he is right.

That's how my wife stole all my female friends, she made them family friends. Boy do I love her for it.

What do you mean by an 'honest girl talk'? He would not be at all happy if I made even the slightest suggestion to her that I am uncomfortable with their relationship. Are you suggesting I ask her outright if she fancies him? He says she says she doesn't fancy any or the men who she is friends with but he is convinced she wants to sleep with at least one of them. Even if she does just want to be his friend it doesn't mean the way he feels is the same.

A couple of days ago whilst we were arguing, not because he had been e-mailiing her, but because he had been doing it secretly after saying he wouldn't, we tried to come to some kind of agreement about what was OK and while we were supposdlly making up and making an effort to get closer he said he just wanted to go check the sports scores, but in fact went off to e-mail her again. I didn't in fact tell him the first time around that he couldn't contact her he made that decision because he was fed up with me for being upset about the fact he had to speak to her and about her almost constantly. He even said he wished she could be his daughter instead of our actual daughter. That doesn't sound like normal friendship to me. I think he has very strong feelilngs for her that he doesn't understand himself.

He knows is bothering you, so I don't care if they are exchanging cake recipies, he stops since it is hurting you. If he does not stop then he is not taking your feelings into consideration.

And who on this earth cares if he feels he is not trusted, he isn't and in fact I doubt he should be. He has to prove it and earn it.

I would almost say treat him like a child caught, put the computer in a public area and walk in on him often.

In the end, if he wants to stay with you, he needs to show he is sorry and jump though some hoops

Sounds like a mid - life crisis to me. I think that he needs, by your account, to get a reality check... he wants her to be his daughter, instead of your actual daughter..? In terms of your relationship, it's not sustainable for him to be behaving like a love sick fool.

I would suggest firstly that you may need to back off a little - he sounds as if he's constantly on the defensive and contradicting himself. Clearly this whole thing has him anxious and confused and you're adding to it by constantly interrogating him. (As an aside, I don't blame you for being anxious.)

If he'd like her as his daughter, why don't you take him up on the suggestion of meeting her and invite her round for dinner? That way you can meet her on your territory and observe the dynamic between them. It's hard to know what part she's playing in this but it sort of sounds like she likes the attention from all the guys. Perhaps if she actually eyeballs the wife of one of the guys she might back off as well.

I don't disagree with Tal's suggestion - invite her for dinner and then send him out for some beer. You don't need to interrogate her about what her intentions are - you just need to show her that YOUR husband is YOUR husband so that there is no doubt in her mind that her attention seeking behavior has repercussions on other people.

Geez woman find out the truth of the matter. Before you go off half cocked. Seems you already have your mind made up, without all the facts.

I'm just saying if this person has so much impact on your life, find out why, and what needs to be done about it.

Seems to me if it was hanky panky going on, then he would not be so forward about it.

He needs to stop the 'friendship' with the other woman, and concentrate on his marriage. It is unhealthy, it is putting a wedge in your marriage, it makes you uncomfortable, that should be enough. She can go and play games with other married men, not yours. And why should you have to make concessions? Meet her? Be friends with her? Have her over for a barbecue? How ridiculous.

That he fights to keep her as a 'friend', and even wishes he could replace her with his own daughter, is a huge, big, red flag! He has somehow pulled out all the emotional stops to 'protect' her and be there for her, no matter what. It is a very sick relationship, based on lies, and you have every right to demand that it stop.

None of the wishy washy garbage. Make some demands of your own, such as counselling. He is not getting what you are putting down, and he needs to see how his thinking is really screwy, and how it is affecting his marriage.

A third party may very well be able to get through to him, and hopefully, he can see what he will lose by continuing this assenine behaviour.

Well thanks for the repliles folks. Rather a mixed bag of reactions but that kind of mirrors the confusion I feel myself about it so in a weird way is actually helpful.

I decided to write him a note explaining exactly what parts of his behaviour are making me feel so upset in the hope that seeing it in writing might get it into his brain. It really is the excessiveness of his behaviour and his secrecy that is the real problem not his desire to have her for a friend.

I don't feel ready to meet her as he spent so much time when he was first working with her telling me about the relationships that had already been wrecked wherever this woman went that I still have this picture of her as an attention-seeking man-eater. He himself thought this for a long time. I know some of the other people whose relationships fell apart because of the way the men all fell for this woman. The fact that she knows all these men ruined their relationships but she thinks it's OK to e-mail my hubby in secret makes me think she can't be nice. I know she also e-mails in secret , she does so from work because her partner is 'unreasonably jealous'. She talks about this sort of stuff with my hubby.

Anyway I said in the note that I could accept he has her as a friend if he tells me when he is contacting her, is open about it all, and it isn't so excessive that it feels obsessive. I have asked him to cool it a bit with her for now to give us both some breathing space and said that if he can do these things and I feel his behaviour is more reasonable I can probably think about meeting her in the future with an open mind rather than seeing her as this femme-fatal he himself originally painted her as.

I don't know if that was the right thing to do but it seems fair to me. I finally got a few hours sleep once I had done that so at least it helped me. I saw him for about a minure before he was dashing off to work and he said sorry he had to go but he had read my note and we would talk tonight. I did at least get the impression from his demeanor that he had got something from the note so fingers crossed.

Thanks for the help peeps.

No harm done, and maybe some gains to be made yet.

I agree that this woman is an attention seeking man-eater, and she has no loyalty or respect for any of the partners she has caused so much trouble for, by being 'friends'. Obviously you are not alone, others have had problems with their mates because of her as well.

A letter is a really good start. Plant some seeds that he may find some insight with, and talk.

Stay strong. If this woman's past behaviour is any indication, she'll move onto the next victim when your's isn't always as available as he has been.

He name the Guinea pig after he? How pathetic is that? The biggest point of this whole issue, like Fr. Chuck mentioned, is that he knows that this upsets you, yet he continues to do so. He obviously is "slap smitten" with this other woman, and needs to one, act his age, and two, act like the married man that he is. I wonder how he would feel if YOU had a special friend?

No, this is not neither healthy, nor considerate. I think most married women would feel the way that you do if it were them in this type of situation.

Stop doing the things that you normally do for him until you get his attention.

I am a married man, and would NEVER disrespect MY wife this way. I probably would be tent camping on the back of our property, if I ever found myself infatuated with one of my co-workers like this, and was secretly corresponding with her.

I can see it now:

"Hey, honey, can I get another blanket?" "No, tell your little girlfriend to knit you one if she is so fantastic!"

It wouldn't be pretty.

She is a "black magic woman", who has left a trail of men who are under her spell. He needs to snap the he! Out of it.

Good luck on getting your husband back.

Well he came home having read my letter this morning and said that seeing it in writing made him realise how much he had been hurting me and the fact I was still willing to be so reasonable reminded him of how much I love him and made him cry.

He says he still needs some time to sort his head out but will tell me immediately if there is any contact between them while he is working out what to do and that there is no doubt in his mind that I am the one he loves but he doesn't understand himself what he feels about this woman but is going to think hard about everything. He also said that my opposition had probably made him dig his heels in out of stubbornness. I felt a real sense of sincerity about his words that has been lacking for some time.

We put it aside for the evening and had some chatting time and some giggles and it was the most comfortable things have felt for a long time.

It is still there in the background and I don't think I'll really feel OK until he does sort his feelings out but it does seem llike a big step forward and I feel less stressed than I did.

I can't believe what a difference just putting it in writing made so I wanted to share that in case it is of help to anyone else with difficult situations.

Also, although the replies I have had have been quite polarised and no single one has pushed me in a specific direction I have taken something from them all in different ways and it has helped me see things a little more clearly so a big thank you to you all.

Oh and I also decided to start sending him e-mails. We text each other when apart but texts tend to be rather brief. I think he gets a buzz out of finding messages in his inbox so I reckon having some from the wife might be nice for him but might also remind him to think about me whenever he looks in there . I left him a joke in there this afternoon but he doesn't seem to have read it yet which is also a good sign since he has been obsessively checking his e-mails several times a day and every evening up to now.

Oh and I also decided to start sending him e-mails. We text each other when apart but texts tend to be rather brief. I think he gets a buzz out of finding messages in his inbox so I reckon having some from the wife might be nice for him but might also remind him to think about me whenever he looks in there . I left him a joke in there this afternoon but he doesn't seem to have read it yet which is also a good sign since he has been obsessively checking his e-mails several times a day and every evening up to now.

I'm really pleased that there has been a change in the dynamic. In my experience, backing off a little, as you have done can often really help shift the tension. Men do 'dig their heels in' when they feel defensive or confronted, so your approach has been very sensible.

Now the ball is in his court, and he needs to take the time to examine his own motivations and obsessive behavior around this woman. I hope he does take the time to do this.

Let us know how it all goes.

I think that these feelings will fade with time. It's a good thing that he doesn't still see her on a day to day basis.

Good luck to you.

Thanks again for all the help and support everyone.
I must say jmj I found "Hey, honey, can I get another blanket?" "No, tell your little girlfriend to knit you one if she is so fantastic!" very amusing.

Ok, so the planned night out with his ex-colleagues,including this woman, is tomorrow night. There have been a few e-mails between my hubby and her about this since I last posted and he has been open with me about these and has not been e-maliing her otherwise or acting so obsessed.

The thing is she was supposed to make arrangements with most of the other people and my hubby with a few. Now it seems everyone else is cancelling, leaving just my hubby and this woman.

Should I be worried? Should I say I want to go along or should I use this as an opporunity to trust him?

Go with him. No, you do not make this a test of trust, but an opportunity to learn.

Wow, this woman must either really think you are a few taco's short a combination plate, or she is a lot smarter than anybody realizes.

Suddenly a group of people whittle down to your husband, and her. How convenient.

Yes, I would go. Don't let on that anything is wrong. I'd also bring a gift. A going away gift. 'Why You Need To Leave My Husband Alone For Dummies', and hand it to her while she's eating so she can choke on it.

I need to go with you, I'll be a fly on the wall and make sure I take a swim in her soup.

Whatever you decide to do, please come back with the results.

Jake2008 agrees: I like your wife, does she also play golf?

Yes, and she has a powerful swing too!

She also has her own shotgun, and I taught her how to shoot clay targets. She can hit doubles. My daddy told me it was "dangerous business" to teach a woman how to use a gun.

The trick is to not do anything as to earn being shot.

She knows that I'm a good boy, and that I don't have any "special friends".

I want to live in the big house. Where it's nice and warm.

Well, here's your chance to have that dinner with her.

Take the opportunity to look and act fabulous, and share the wonderful times you've have with your husband, with her.

Take pictures of your children and 'share' them with her.

Heh, please let us know how it goes.

I'd love to be a fly in your soup too!

Wow, this woman must either really think you are a few taco's short a combination plate, or she is a lot smarter than anybody realizes.

Suddenly a group of people whittle down to your husband, and her. How convenient.

Yes, I would go. Don't let on that anything is wrong. I'd also bring a gift. A going away gift. 'Why You Need To Leave My Husband Alone For Dummies', and hand it to her while she's eating so she can choke on it.

I need to go with you, I'll be a fly on the wall and make sure I take a swim in her soup.

Whatever you decide to do, please come back with the results.

Oops. I'm an idiot - put the greenie in the wrong post. Duh.

Oh you lot are so funny it creases me up. Thanks for keeping me cheerful at least. I'll let you all know what happens.
*goes off to rummage through the photo album* - sneaky gemini - I like it lol.

He cancelled it.

This was after I said I would like to go. *suspicious*

On the other hand, he is the kind of guy that never makes a decision or sorts anything until the last minute. *maybe not suspicious*

He said just the two of us could go out instead if I wanted. We decided to go out in a couple of days time because there's a restaurant we recently visited with friends and really liked but can't get in tonight.

Time will tell...

Yeah... I'd be wondering about that one too. What did he do then, call her and cancel as well?

Did he say why he cancelled?

He needed to cancel. He needs to stay away from her completely. Good for you!

He also needs to take you out on more "dates".

Yeah........I'd be wondering about that one too. What did he do then, call her and cancel as well?

Did he say why he cancelled?

I got the full story when he got home from work. A couple of the guys who he had been organising to come and thought they couldn't said they could probably come out for an hour or two after all. He texted her to let her know and to say I would probably be coming too.

She then cancelled saying her daughter was not very well.

The other guys then said they weren't that bothered seen as none of the crowd she was supposed to be organising were coming.

So, that's when hubby texted me to say it was off and we could just go out if I wanted.

..?.

OK, that makes sense.

As we speak, I'm trying to get my husband off the couch. It's not easy, but I'm hungry... where's my golf club.

I hope when the two of you do get out that you have a really good time together.

Keep us posted.

This is getting more complicated and difficult.

Our meal out didn't happen because I got a really nasty mouth infection. I got some special mouthwash and gel and if they don't work will need antibiotics. It is very painful and leaving me totally wiped out.

So, hubby got really upset that I had let him down. Apparently this is why he has felt the need to chat with this other woman - because I am not always there for him enough.

I 'don't do enough to make him feel confident.'

He has always been lacking in confidence socially and has relied on me a lot to smooth things over for him in social situations. However, he also used to turn social invitations down a lot, even if I wanted to go. Now, he has decided he wants to be more sociable but he isn't sure how so he expects me to sort it all out for him.

Apparently this other woman is the only person, apart from myself, that he feels comfortable with.

On his day off, I had to spend a whole day on the couch because I was poorly and in a lot of pain. He did nothing all day then complained in the evening how bored he had been because I wasn't doing anything with him.

Suddenly everything is my fault and he expects me to fill all his needs every minute when he is at home, as well as texting him more etc when he is at work, or he needs this other woman to step in to fill the gap. He spends a lot of time checking his phone and moaning that 'nobody ever texts or calls.' He won't make any effort with his friends because he, 'can't be bothered.'

I tentatively mentioned counselling to which he replied, "I don't think you need conselling I think you just need to get better then make more effort." It didn't occur to him I might mean him too...

No offense, but he sounds a bit clueless to me.

Would it be worth your while to book with a counsellor. Let him know (email if he won't listen) what you have done, and that you booked for both of you.

He may or may not go the first time, but my guess is, if he is as dependent upon needing you as a social prop, he won't risk losing you, and he'll go the second time.

Either way, wouldn't do any harm to speak to someone face to face, and get an objective opinion from another source.

Hope you're feeling better, it's like adding insult to injury isn't it.

Take care, keep us posted.

Oh boy the gremlins are being mean at the moment.

Hubby came home very stressed and with an upset tummy. A close colleague's best friend just committed suicide.

Daughter arrived back from boyfriend's unexpectedly. They have split up after 4 years. She has CFS and he's fed up of her illness. I think her being poorly and needing help from me and her dad is part of my hubby's problem as he feels 'put upon and neglected'. My daughter's boyfriend's mum is poorly with secondary cancer so that was an extra stress for them.

I want to help everyone but am still feeling rubbish myself so not being very good at it.

Gee - what do they say about it never rains...

That is a lot of bad luck all at once. Something about this time of year too makes things that much worse.

I am sorry about your husband's experience at work, and then your daughter. Top it off with you feeling unwell. I'd make you some chicken soup if I could.

Hang in there Q, this will settle down in time. Keep us posted.

Thanks for that Jake. Must say I'm sick of soup though lol, as it's all I can eat atm but nice thought. I'll accept your kind words as 'chicken soup for the soul.'

Day at a time strategy for the moment I think.

Thanks for lending an ear to my whinge.

Hi again folks. Time for a little update and to ask what you people think if you don't mind sharing a bit more of your wisdom.

Hubby decided to write me two long e-mails recently. The first was telling me how much he loves me and that we need to work on my 'trust problem'.

The second was a blow-by-blow account of all that has happened with this female friend. In this he mentioned several lifts home he gave her and some friendly hugs but assured me he didn't do anything untowards. Quite a lot of phone-calls, texts and e-mails, most of which he didn't mention to me. He also admitted to taking her out to lunch one day and then driving her home and lying to me about where he had been that day. He says it was because I was upset about something when he got home and he didn't want to make things worse. He says he is really sorry for lying about this.

I am trying to make him understand that I have trust problems, as he puts it, because he has been lying and breaking promises, but that I am glad he has decided to try and tell me the whole truth (I hope) but that it will take time for me to be sure I can trust him.

He mumbled something about degrees of breaking trust and said he hasn't actually cheated on me and could have done worse in 25 years of marriage. He also said I must have lied to him sometimes in all that time. I expect I have, but never about something important which could endanger our relationship.

He says he needs time to think more about everything.

He still wants her as a friend. He hasn't acknowledged that I have a right to be cross when he has been lying. However, he does seem to be trying and he felt that he needed to be honest about everything before he could think about anything else I said. He says maybe some of his behaviour was over the top on occasion (when I first thought he was totally infatuated) but he needs time to think that through.

I am torn between wanting to bash him over the head with a large heavy object, and thinking well he is making some effort.

Need some objective input pleeease...

I think if the situation were reversed it might paint a better picture for him.

If you were the one with a 'special friend', and sent frequent text messages, and suggestive email, and you were infatuated with this 'friend' from work to the point some of your comments about him were:

'you're too young to be tied down - at least in marriage lol'
'you're the most intelligent and secretive man I know'
And 'that's a story for a long bottle of wine not an e-mail'.

You know very well that this man you are infatuated with, has women fawning all over him, and one of your girlfriends who is pregnant with her own husband, evensaid she would leave her marriage for him if he'd have her.

You get angry and defensive when your husband suggests that this 'friendship' might be inappropriate, and he resents that when you don't hear from him, you are miserable, hard to live with, and grumpy.

What would he think about your behaviour.

You would turn around and tell him that it is he that has trust issues, because the relationship is strictly platonic, and you look at this 'friend' more as a son, or a brother. You cannot understand why he gets his girdle in a knot when you drive your 'friend' home, share a friendly hug, and meet up occasionally for lunch. Gee- what's your problem!!

Back to you now, although I could really run with this lol I can't imagine a more effective way to get through to him. Use what he says, turn it around, write it out in a story in an email, and send it to him. See if any lightbulbs go on.

Personally, I think his strong, angry reactions and deflective comments (YOU have a problem not him), indicates that his words and actions to not sync up. He may not have done something, but he's missing some key points such as what does she have, that he needs so badly, that he can't get at home.

I have to also admit, that if it were my husband I'd probably opt for the large heavy object.

Well I'm not happy to be re-opening this thread again but here I am.

Hubby could never admit he was doing anything wrong but said he would not contact her any more as it was making me unhappy. This was never something I stipulated, I just wanted him to see the difference between the excessive behaviour with the lying and a normal freindship but he couldn't see that.

Things have sort of trundled on and we have been working on things between us generally, some improvements but he just isn't the same as he was before this somehow. For one thing, he started checking my computer daily to see who I have been talking to etc, and asking questions about my Facebook and who I have for friends and things like that. Suddenly I am the one who isn't trusted but there is absolutely no reason for that.

A few days ago he started talking about this woman again and saying how he would like to be able to go out with a crowd including her and it not be a problem. At the same time I noticed he had suddenly put her number back in his phone. Now I know looking in his phone is a bit off, but firstly he lied to me several times, and secondly, when I got a bit shirty about him constantly checking my computer he said I could check his whenever I want to. I wasn't really happy with this since I think we should be trusting each other but I went along with it. He actually got very cross about it since he said, 'you can check my computer not phone.' Sheesh silly me! Anyway he had had her in his phone under her first name. When he promised to cut off contact with her he deleted it. Or so I thought. Then I discovered it under her last name. I was sure it wasn't there before so I asked him how he found her number again. Turns out he had it under a false name all the time. He said he put it back in because he was thinking about talking to me about contacting her again but hadn't done yet.

I was still millilng this over and not really happy about it when I discovered that he had already texted and met this woman again. A friend of hers was getting married and the 'reason' he needed to contact this woman was because he wanted to send a card but had no address for the friend - a woman I might add he always said he didn't like.. When the woman got the card she messaged our daughter on Facebook about it. I think she was rather surprised to get a card from him.. Our daughter rang her dad and was asking him about it. We were both in the same room and I could hear what both of them were saying yet he still tried to lie to me about it straight afterwards. Eventually he fessed up, but since he was caught bang to rights I'm not overly impressed. He told me he met her and she was going on holiday but that she wanted to get together with him when she gets back. He thinks I should be fine with this as long as it is in a group.

So we had a fall-out. He says he didn't feel he should have to ask my permission to talk to her again - stubborn pride I suppose. I just feel betrayed that he would make promises then go behind my back. Too many lies.

Now he says that since seeing her he has realised he doesn't want a relationship with her just a friendship. - err that's all he said he wanted before... Now he says he can understand that the way he was behaving before was more like a relationship, albeit without sex, than a normal friendship. He also said that he is starting to think he was behaving obsessively 'like C' (the guy he thought was an idiot for throwing his relationship away because of his infatuation with this same woman). He says, 'I know this is stuff I need to sort out in myself and I am working on it please be patient.'

The trouble is I am having a hard time believing him. I mean if he has suddenly worked this out why was he talking about wanting to see her whilst lying about the fact he already was until he got caught out? He still thinks it is important to him to have her as a friend but 'only in a group'.

I suggested counselling but he thinks it will, 'just make things worse.'

Part of me thinks he is realising he was in the wrong but pride is getting in the way. Part of me thinks he is just saying what he thinks I want to hear and what will get him off the hook.
If this is some sort of mid-life crisis and he is starting to come out of it I am prepared to try to be patient, it seems a shame not to after 27 years together,most of which were not anything like this at all, but I really can't tell how much of this is just stubbornness and how much is desperation to find a way to see this woman without getting it in the neck at home.

He says I have a right to be angry with him but I shouldn't doubt him - if he didn't keep telling me lies I wouldn't - arghh.

Ok my lovely friends, please talk some objective sense into this old nut, I'm too emotional to stand back and do so myself right now. All input will be gratefully received. :)

Have you considered contacting her yourself? Call and tell her you are planning a surprise birthday party, everyone is sworn to secrecy. Then, don't invite anybody else.

Or ask her over for dinner, or the next time your husband goes out in a 'group', you go too, or show up.

Or you could send her an email and say that you realize she is out of town, but when she returns, could she give you a call. Don't say about whqt- make them both sweat.

Not so sure a little reality 'event' isn't a good way to go. He will continue to lie, and she will continue to be 'the other woman', until both of them realize you are in the picture, not sitting idly by. If you can make a polite point with both of them, it may be enough for him to finally stop with the games, and send a message to her, that you are going to continue to be in the picture- directly.

Thanks again Jake. I was mulling over your suggestion.

I don't actually have her phone number myself, and as hubby was very cross about me looking in his phone I didn't want to just go get it there and cause more arguments so I decided I would just nicely say, let's invite her, and her partner if he wants to come, over to dinner.

He got really angry and said 'no way, that's not going to happen.'

He is also angry with her now as, 'I didn't contact her for months because we were sorting us out, so how come she never contacted me? '

He said he's not contacting her again anyway as he's angry she's not making the effort. Then he said if she contacts him he will tell me.

He has been calling me a 'dictator' for the last couple of days but I don't really understand what he means. He said this when I suggested inviting her for dinner. It seems any suggestion I make is dictatorship. It's like he doesn't want me having any control or input in this situation.

We talked (argued) on about all sorts of things that didn't really go anywhere as not only do I not understand where his head is but, he admits himself, neither does he. He said I am trying to control him and won't let him do what he wants. I asked him what he wants to do that I am preventing but he said he doesn't know.

Things weren't getting anywhere so I said, 'Ok, so you need time to get your head straight and this isn't helping so we need to put it aside. You're not going to contact X and you will tell me if she contacts you and we'll take it from there. Can we try and muddle on until you work out whatever it is you need to. Shall we leave it at that?'

He said, 'if that's what YOU want I guess I'll have to agree.' I said, 'I'm just repeating what you said and trying to draw a line under it for now.That's not me dictating the terms.' He said, 'what do you want it in writing?'

He then said, 'I might change my mind and decide to contact her - long pause - but I'll tell you next time.'

He won't go to counselling, I think he's actually scared the counsellor might take my side or something. I have never been to counselling but I don't think that's how it works anyway but as I have no experience I can't really tell him what to expect and anyway me insisting on that would be me dictating again...

I asked him what it is he wants from me. He said, 'stop trying so hard.' 'Just be happy, if everything between us is great I'm sure all this will stop being a problem.' The thing is things seemed to be the best they had been between us for some time just before I found out about the lying and sneaking around again. When I said that to him he agreed and said,'Yeh I know I've blown it again, I keep making bad decisions.'

I hope you can resolve these issues with your husband.

Here again sigh, and no further forwards.

Nearly 3 weeks since our last chat and we're sort of getting on but there's just no closeness at all. The best I can hope for is he is happy reading in the corner or watching TV. The rest of the time he accuses me of criticising him or dictating to him when I'm really not.

Eg. We went on a nice drive and walk. He always seems reasonably happy when we are walking in the countryside. We saw a nice pub advertising food. I said, 'I'll have to treat you to a meal there, do the driving so you can have a drink, and maybe have my wicked way with you, (wink)' All said very light heartedly and affectionately. He then said, 'are you dictating to me again?' He then proceeded to tell me how offensive it was that I would assume I could have sex with him just because I was planning to take him out for a meal and a drink. He likened it to a guy taking a girl on a first date and doing the same. Err - we've been married 25 years?!

Another time we were both running some errands. He said he was going to the bank and hardware shop after lunch. We got home and had lunch then he said, 'so what is it we're doing now?', I said, 'well we said I'm doing... and your going to the bank and hardware shop.' He then said, 'are you dictating to me again?' - I mean he was asking me to remind him!

It's two and a half months since we last had sex, I only know because of my other thread lol:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/adult-sexuality/shy-hubby-437747-3.html

Incidentally I thought we had reached some kind of turning point there, but apparently not...

Apart from the comment I made above I haven't approached him apart from one time I simply got a liittle amorous during a cuddle and he pushed me off saying, 'your'e sex mad!'

I asked him if he is OK today. I mean, it's clear he's not himself but I don't know how to broach it. He said, 'I met T (a friend of him and the female friend) and it reminded me of X but I'm banned from contacting her.'

How many times do I have to tell him that's not the case? - the conversation 2 posts back was our last on it. I asked him, 'what's the problem, is it that you only want to contact her if you do it in secret?' He said, 'I don't know.. '

It's like every time I try and find out what's wrong, this woman is the first thing he mentions, but he makes no sense in what he says, other than sounding totally love-slapped, which he denies. His behaviour has got so odd I can't decide if he's losing his marbles or trying to drive me to call time - I did ask - he assures me he wants to spend the rest of his life with me...

I look back and his personality changed the moment he met this woman and it hasn't changed back, and it's well over a year now. He can't see any difference, but I'm not the only one to have noticed. He sometimes says he's depressed but when I ask him what about, or what he wants to do about it, he just goes on about this woman.

I've said he can text her. I've said he can invite her round to dinner. I just don't know what else to try, short of hitting him over the head with a heavy object to knock some sense in there lol.

Seriously though, this is really dragging me down now, I'm not a happy bunny. :(

Aaawwwwwww QLP, I really do feel for you, I can tell this hurts you very profoundly, I can see and understand why.

There is definitely something going on with you SO for him to be responding to you how he is, your making a little sexual suggestion or remark isn't dictating, nor was your reminding him about some jobs he had to get done.

Those were perfectly normal and acceptable comments, not dictations.

Plus with you having been married for 25 years I would think you're entitled to make all the sexual suggestions you want to him, and that he would love you for it.

I could be wrong, however as you've stated his attitude towards yourself and your marriage does appear to have changed since meeting this woman, I have read back through all posts in this thread.

Could it maybe be he has had an affair with this other woman?

This must be so hard for you and yet you are very understanding towards his changes, more so than many women would be, you're also prepared to make allowances too, what more could any woman do. Or any Man want.

Do you think marriage guidance/relate may help you with this?

I really admire your strength and self discipline in this, you show great strength of character, I think I would have been sorely tempted to whack him over the head with a frying pan by now LOL.

Seriously I hope this helps, and know you are not in the wrong. You're a rock, and this man of yours needs to see this, and appreciate you, before its too late.

Good Luck.

Thanks PP. I really do appreciate the supportive comments.

I'm as sure as I can be that he didn't have an affair. Believe it or not that would be almost a relief - as I would have something I could make sense of! I think it's more that he has built some kind of fantasy in his head which has taken a grip big time. I think most of his frustration is about the fact that he isn't getting what he wants from this woman - which he calls friendship. I think it's something to do with wanting his youth back. I suppose that's what they call a mid-life crisis, but how long do these things last for goodness sake? When he was working with her the crew went out and he did a lot of socialising. More than he ever did since he was a young man. Even wanted to go nightclubbing and the like which is so out of character, he's normally more of a nature lover and quieter type. She was the one that generally arranged things and is younger and very 'fun loving' I gather. 'A free-spirit' is how he put it.

The whole friendship and socialising generally has become much more important to him than it used to be. However, we went to a party at the weekend and he didn't join in and enjoy it at all. He seemed unwell, and was actually sick, but then he got better quickly when we got home. I think it was nerves.

Sorry I don't know if this makes much sense, I'm having a hard time working it out myself. Something about this woman made him want to be all young and sociable but it's sort of in his head and when it comes to it the reality is it's not what he goes for.

He complains now and again that he never has sex but he doesn't offer and turns me down, and yet says he wouldn't want sex with anyone but me.

He moans that we don't socialise enough but when I try and arrange things he finds reasons to say no or seems really uncomfortable if we do go out with people etc.

He complains he doesn't see enough of his friends but rarely calls them. When any of the people he worked with when working with this woman calls then he can't jump fast enough. But then he gets depressed if she herself isn't involved.

He mooches around looking bored. Sometimes he asks me if I 'want to do something'. If I suggest going for a walk he's generally happy. Most other things he doesn't seem to fancy. But then he complains we don't do much. If I ask him to suggest something he gets grumpy and doesn't. I really don't think he can think of what to do.

The best way I can explain it is that he thinks he wants certain things but when he can have them he finds he doesn't. I think he knows he can't really have what he wants from this woman so he is blaming me instead of her. The thing is I'm almost sure if he could be with her he probably wouldn't want to anyway. The last time he did see her he did nothing but complain about her afterwards. She hadn't called him, she didn't do this, say that - i.e. the picture he has in his head wasn't fulfilled. Then he said he wasn't contacting her because he is fed up and angry with her. Now he seems to have forgotten this and seems to think it's me who isn't allowing him to see her - even though I suggested inviting her round!

Ok, even I don't know what I am talking about now lol.?

He won't do counselling. Unfortunately money is really tight at the moment, and when I said I would like to go alone he asked me to wait till we can afford it better, which I can't really argue with, though I think money is not the only reason.

You know I think the only thing left might be for me to invite her round against his wishes, and risk his wrath, it's not like he's in a good mood with me anyway - he needs a reality check here.

Good or bad idea?

Hi Again, I see that this is also causing you to lose sleep, as I notice you too are online, and its only 4:45am or approx.

I do know men go through a kind of male menopause, how long it lasts for Ive no idea. No where near as long as women's though as far as I know.

Whatever the cause of your husbands change of personality though it cannot go on like this for much longer, before it could easily cause you to have a breakdown, or similar, no one can live on a knife edge and not become ill over it, thank God you've held up for this long.

Im at a loss for what to suggest, you've tried talking to him, compromising, making allowances and meeting him more than half way, short of smacking him over the head, I really wouldn't know what you can do.

It must be awful having to live like this, especially when your attempts to resolve these issues aren't being met half way.

My only thought is counselling, of some description but you say he wants you to wait until he can afford for you to both go, but Im thinking that could be anything from 5 weeks to 5 years and I feel you yourself need some help to get to grips with all of this now and I mean NOW.

Could you not go on your own without telling him, sneaky maybe, but he hasn't been totally up front himself at times.

I know I am not being much by way of offering any solution, but it appears he is making this very difficcult, Ill have a word with some relate colleagues I have and see what they can suggest for now I hope this helps if only a little.

Please hang in there, This will improve its got to. Ill get back to you later about what Ive written here. Sending you positive energy and healing vibes. (((((QLP))))) for you...

Re read your last post and I agree he needs a reality check, and making him face his demons sos to speak could be just what is needed here to make him wake up to himself, as you've stated he's not being all that friendly towards you anyway, so what do you have to lose.?

I would do just that and get this female over to your place without him knowing you're doing so, and then he will have no choice but to deal with it.

Good luck and go for it.
Marianne.

Thanks again PP. Feeling a bit better now I have slept on it. Yes I was late to bed, and although him stressing me out does contribute at times, I have a sleep disorder to start with so it's not that unusual. I know you yourself often don't sleep until late - there really ought to be a club for us lol. Or maybe this is it. :)

Ok thoughts now I'm feeling a bit fresher...

I think he is starting to get depressed because his fantasy is starting to fall apart. Obviously I don't want him miserable but reality has to be a step forwards from delusion. I think. It's not lilke I'm a psychologist so I'm not sure.

I'm thinking maybe I will hold steady for a bit longer and do nothing. Not because I'm chickening out but for 2 reasons.

Firstly, if I'm right I don't want to be the one to shatter that fantasy totally as I think it's better if he sees it himself. Although he has these moments of blaming me I think it's his way of desperately trying to cling to the fantasy and I think I sense the cracks growing.

Secondly I remembered that she is going on holiday in August and promised to ring him when she got back. If she does then we can take it from there. I will encourage him to invite her over again or try and get a night out with us all organised. If there's going to be a friendship let's get it on a proper footing. If she doesn't then hopefully he will remember (or get reminded if needs be!) that this is not my doing and start working through his feelings of rejection.

I think it is the fact that he hopes, but doesn't actually expect, her to get in touch after her holiday that is keeping this thing going in his head. So it seems sensible to let that play out first.

If it is showing no signs of resolution by then I will have to act.

So I've given myself a deadline at least.

Sometimes the best course of action is doing nothing at this point, because your driving yourself crazy trying to fix the problems of Mr. Grumpy.

Whatever is his problem, back away and make sure you're not making his problem yours, that ruins your own enjoyment. If he is indeed putting so much on a friendship with this female, that it makes a stress for those around him then that's something he has to see for himself, and correct. Coddling and indulging him also I think enables him, and why even put up with an attitude when you can show your displeasure by leaving his cranky a$$ alone for a time.

You are the reality he has to deal with, not her. Do for yourself, and let him drown in his own sh1t, for a change.

Thanks for that talan. I must admit I have been trying to do that lately to an extent. Luckily I'm a person that can quite easily find my own ways to make me happy if I'm not getting what I want from significant others. I do however get pretty stressed when I'm being got at for no good reason, i.e. being accused of 'dictating' and 'banning contact' etc when I haven't. I'm trying to cultivate an air of keeping cool and just stating the facts when faced with this but it does involve a certain amount of teeth gritting at times. Getting angry and arguing the toss just doesn't work as he simply can't hear me atm so I am working harder at simply stating the case then leaving him to stew in it. Thanks for helping me feel that's a good thing to keep trying, it will help my resolve. I'm a bit of a softie when I see anyone suffering but it is time I remembered to put my suffering up there too.

QLP, you mentioned that you wanted to go alone to therapy. Please find a way to make financial arrangements to do that. This is a torturous journey for you and it could really help you to speak with a good therapist. I have a friend who is on a very tight budget but for a while she has made the space for therapy and does not regret it one bit. I am also in therapy and it keeps me grounded during the toughest times. A good therapist can help you move through an enormous and complex problem like this more effectively than you could alone. A good therapist will reconnect you with your semse pf basic rights as a spouse, which in my humble opinion, are somewhat lost to you.

I see a couple things from all of your posts. First, you are such a strong woman. You have clearly kept your head on your shoulders during an extremely difficult, prolonged period of marital hardship. The compliments you have received from others are well earned.

One thing struck me. Your husband didn't want to upset this other woman. Meanwhile you are devastated. Why does he care about her feelings so much but your feelings are a threat, an obstruction, and an inconvenience to him? You are his WIFE and your feelings should be very important to him.

He has a big problem with his perception that you are too controlling, a "dictator" as he puts it. Have you ever considered listening to his concerns, like you wish he would listen to yours? Another poster suggested that he would be very different if you turned the tables on him, e.g. became intensely interested in another man in the same way as he is with this woman. I'm not suggesting you try that but on the other hand, just for the sake of exploring your options, have you ever considered letting go of everything you hold dear in your marriage and just free floating on paths away from your husband? You see, the reason I'm illuminating that possibility is because it seems you have been chasing your husband for a very long time. He has been running away. Have you ever considered that you may be enabling his running by chasing him? Is it possible that when he accuses you of being a "dictator" he's asking for his freedom from you? I think it probably has occurred to you and given you love him so deeply and he is your husband of 25 years, letting go would seem destructive and appalling. It may ruin your marriage and leave you alone. If you are thinking like that, deep down, take a moment to realize that you are making your decisions based in fear. Forget about the affair for a moment (that is, after all, what it is) and think about you, the way you are treating yourself every day, chasing after a man who should be honoring you, loving you, giving you his attention, and living his life with you. He should be able to chase after his woman on occasion, even after 25 years. Yet challenge yourself to stop looking at him as the sole problem here (even if it is rooted in his affair) and start looking at yourself. Do you have days where your feelings tell you to move forward and try new things in your life that do not involve him but you balk at them, fearing the consequences? I'm not saying you should run off impulsively and do whatever on a whim. What I am suggesting is to consider changing your perspective so that you are viewing the situation from how you respond to it, rather than all the ways in which your husband doesn't respond the way you think he should.

If you are always chasing him and he is running, then you set yourself up as the superior spouse and he is the one that is inferior, ruining your marriage and making your life a living hell. You are constantly in the good spouse position where you are out to fix your relationship and he is always in the bad spouse position where he is out of control, making bad decisions, and acting out emotionally. If that is a case, is there a hidden reward for you in maintaining that position?

I hope that I haven't offended you too much. I understand that he has put you in an awful position in your marriage, it is unfair, and it has been exceedingly painful. You are entitled to your feelings of anguish and disappointment. I suppose I am playing the devil's advocate here but what I am saying is, have you ever actually considered honoring his wishes to let him be and go do what he wants, regardless of the consequences?

What if you did? What if you let go and went into free fall? What if it was up to him to wake up from his passivity and catch you, the woman he loves and wants to spend the rest of his life with? What if he didn't catch you? Would you survive? Would you find a way to live your life that could fulfill you emotionally and psychologically?

Well frankly I have got to the point where it is all rather tiresome so I have indeed been focusing on my own things.

Haven't really thought about it much except when I was trying out some special recipes for a friend of ours who has several food intolerances. I said to hubby, 'well I hope K likes this because I have been faffing about all day to get it right.' He said, 'well you wouldn'd be having that problem if X was coming to dinner instead.' X being 'the woman'. I just said, 'invite her anytime, no problem.' - which I have said numerous times now. No idea why he keeps acting like I have prevented all contact when I suggested us getting together etc but to be honest I'm tired of trying to work it out.

The fact is I can't be bothered to worry about it any more. We are on reasonable terms, and if he wants to get closer he knows where I am. He wanted space to sort out his head so we will see. If this continues in the long term, and it's already gone on a fair while, I will have some serious thinking to do, but for now I'm leaving him to stew and enjoying my own time.

So thanks for the post Rastaban, I don't think we are too far off the same page right now. I appreciate your thoughts as well as your kind remarks.

Quick update. Things seem a lot better. Much more positive attitude from hubby despite the fact that I know his work situation is ridicululously stressful atm, something that often makes him grumpy. I have to say knowing the situtation it must be the worst he ever had to deal with and no likelihood of improvement for at least 3 months but he comes home, says he is stressed, chats for a bit, then seems to deal.

Being much nicer to me. Not mentioned X and I haven't asked. I'm still wary as to whether it will last and where it is going but still have my own stuff to keep me busy and enjoying our relationship more. We will see, but better for now.

I am glad things seem to be getting better. :)

I can't believe I'm back on this thread again. It is well over a year since I first posted this and it is still not resolved. I have given him plenty of space to work on this, have said I can accept it as a friendship if he acts the same way as he would in any other friendship. He is much more open about it and is happy for me to see all their e-mails. However I just don't feel he is emotionally available a lot of the time in this marriage and that his head is still more fixated on this woman that he is now back to e-mailing daily and seems to be constantly thinking about.

He recently confided that, 'when I met her my spirit soared, our souls recognised one another, and I believe she was my daughter in a past life.'

I haven't a clue what to make of that! It seems like some weird non-sexual infatutaion to me but I'm no expert on past lives so what do I know. Maybe it's true...

I'm due to meet her in 2 weeks, if it happens. It has been on the cards a few times and has yet to materialise, so we shall see.

I have been getting increasingly stressed again so I have booked myself a counselling session. He nearly succeeded in talking me out of it, which has happened a few times, but I need this regardless of what he does next.

I have to wait 2 weeks for my first session and it will fall a day or 2 before I meet this woman. I'm hoping that if nothing else it will help me to see how best to deal with that situation. Although I am a bit worried as to whether that is good timing really?

I'm not sure what I am asking right now, guess I'm just feeling a bit scared and also chomping on the bit to get into that counselling as I feel I could really do with talking to someone now.

If anyone has any advice I would be glad to hear it. If not, thanks for the venting space.

QP, being scared is okay. It's better you talk here instead of bottling your feelings up inside.
:)

I am very curious about why he would talk you out of seeing a therapist in the past. If he tries again, don't let him.

Why haven't you been able to meet her? What keeps happening to change plans?

What are his relationships like with the female members of his family? Is he subconsciously using her as a substitute for other relationships?

Big hug. Don't Panic.:D

Whenever I have mentioned counselling in the past there are various issues. If it involves him coming along he says things like, 'it will only make things worse,' or 'what so they can take sides?'

I have stopped trying to talk him round, by assuring him that isn't what it is about, and started focusing on just me going. When I do this he either mentions money (which is tight fair enough) or says, that's drastic I didn't realise you felt that bad I will change. Which he does for a while. Trouble is as soon as I relax and things feel OK, he changes and things go back to being a problem again. It's as though he panics and sorts his act out but it doesn't last or isn't really working. Not sure why the panic when I say I want counselling.

Anyway the appointment is booked and I intend to keep it.

Something just keeps coming up, somehow, on her side, when we are supposed to meet. The only reason it looks to be on the cards in a couple of weeks is because hubby has promised her a spare hutch for the rabbit she is planning to get for her daughter. So she is coming to collect that and meet me supposedly. She doesn't seem particularly keen on getting together. But she does e-mail him daily and lately has been asking him to get her a job with him.

Mmm family. He had a difficult relationship with his mum but she died a few years ago. His relationship with our daughter went downhill when he met this woman. They actually both had very similar work roles within his company and he compared them, not to our daughter's favour. Our daughter and himself get along better now but she isn't at home all that often now and they seem to get on better when they don't see too much of each other. He doesn't really have much other female contact. He makes no effort with any of his old female friends. If anything he seems to push other women away now, except this one. He says she's 'not like other women - she likes rugby, she's really nice, she's yada yada... '
It's like he was one person the day before he met her, and has been a different one since. He doesn't make any effort with his male friends or his son either.Our son lives 200 miles away so we only see him every few months. I mean he never e-mails or phones his own kids, so that's why the fact he has to have contact with this one person every day seems disproportionate to me.

Thanks for the hug. :)

Hi again QLP, and thanks for making me read this whole thing again. Seems to me that this friendship with this female drives you nuts and you seem to put anything that happens between you and hubby clearly in her lap. I think you have made her the boogy man for all you uncomfortable feelings. I have seen this happen many times from the fear of the unknown, and I feel that's what's happening now. Actually is normal for one partner to be very displeased with a part of the others lives that they don't share. Especially one that involves another person. Sometimes it's a habit, or hobby that triggers these fears, but its even more profound when the partner engages in behavior that the other can not participate in. accept fully, or doesn't have enough facts to make a reasonable decision to accept or relate to what their partner is doing. Or who they have chosen to associate with.

I think on some level your husband needs the attention, and connection some other female besides you gives him, especially given he has only you and a daughter whom he doesn't really get on with that well. Heck he didn't get along that great with his mom, and has no sisters.

I think at the root of this whole issue is that you don't know this female at all on a personal level, so are suspicious of her, and that's normal, and natural. I am willing to bet that fear is greatly heightened and magnified during trying times, and gets a bit unmanageable.

Your husband needs to know where that fear comes from, so he can see the problem for himself and take steps to resolve this issue. If I were him, I would make sure that you new her and your fears could be addressed, because its never a good idea to have opposite sex friends, good friends any way, that your partner can't/doesn't know. If this was a sister or daughter he spent some much tie and attention on, or got attention from, you would be as worried, unless you didn't like them at all.

But as long as she is an unknown female, you will always be worried. I would too, to be honest, if I were in your shoes. The only way to confront fear, is with FACTS, as this is not a matter of trusting your husband, its trusting HER, and her motives, agenda, character, or behavior. You know NONE of these things so of course you are insecure about this "friendship".

If you knew he was a father figure, mentor, brother figure, or just a real friend, yo her, you wouldn't be as worried. Your husband needs to know that your fear lies with YOU, not knowing HER enough to trust her, like her, or feel comfortable with her in his life. That's normal, natural, and fixable, with some real honesty between the two of you.

So far you are helpless to get those facts, but you have too, and see for yourself what you are actually afraid of, so you know what to do about it. Knowing what your dealing with goes a long way to resolving issues of FEAR, that leads to jealousy, insecurity, and even curiosity, so a plan of action based on FACTS, and not just FEELINGS, can be pursued.

She is probably as scared of you, as you are her, NO DOUBT, as you both may be afraid of the changes that mat come of this meeting.

I think on some level your husband needs the attention, and connection some other female besides you gives him, especially given he has only you and a daughter whom he doesn't really get on with that well. Heck he didn't get along that great with his mom, and has no sisters.



Sorry I forgot to mention he does have a sister. He just doesn't bother with her anymore. He also had male and female friends that he doesn't bother with anymore. I'm not blaming this woman as such, well at least I'm trying not to... :rolleyes: I just don't understand why his whole personality changed and he lost interest in everyone except her from the day they met. It's like suddenly nobody else measures up to this woman and so they don't interest him anymore. Even if I weren't one of the people being deprived of his attention since he met her I think I would be concerned about his behaviour for his benefit.

I do accept that I may be putting all my apples in one cart inappropriately here in blaming his new friendship for the fact that he has switched off to everything else.

I just don't know how else to handle things. I am willing to meet her, and have said so for a long time but he wasn't willing, then she wasn't willing, and then there was always some reason for it not to happen. Since I told him I am going to counselling he is trying to talk me out of meeting her again anyway. He is afraid the counsellor might say something which will then cause me to say something which will upset her in some way.

Also he seemed to get on fine with his daughter until he met this woman. He got miffed with our daughter because he didn't think she was doing the job as well as this woman. It was our daughter's first job at 18 and this woman was in her 30s and had been doing it years. Incidentally our daughter earned a promotion within 6 months and was highly valued by other people so she can't have been doing that badly. Our daughter actually moved to her boyfriends and said one of the reasons was she couldn't stand the way her dad was behaving. Now she only sees him occaisonally and it is better but I can't call them close. I want things to improve for them too. I have to keep things he has said to myself about our daughter that I know would upset her. Even if he were fine with me the situation with his own child would be upsetting me.

Sorry, guess I'm rambling a bit. I really do need to talk this through with a counsellor I know.

LOL. I can relate to your frustration as, I too also want all the people in my world to get along, so I can be happy, and fixers/peacemakers like us just find it very hard when things are not happy, smooth, or have conflicts. We see this as needing fixing, and when we can't we get frustrated. We have a hard time understanding why they don't go along with our "FIXES" the way we want them too. And its so hard to accept thing may never be as smooth and happy as we want them to be because they are humans, and are flawed and unpredictable in their words, actions, and behavior. FRUSTRATING aren't they? Drives me nuts, when they don't see the logic in our suggestions.

Its hard adjusting to the nuts I am surrounded with, but they are so busy doing their thing, whether I like it or not, that they often just ignore me. Hey, just trying to help!!

I am perfect, and want them to be perfect, but they don't want to be, so what's a perfect person to do, besides being frustrated?? And don't tell me I am not perfect, who the hell do you think you are? LOL!!

You would be surprised at how many times a day I say the SERENITY PRAYER, and say to hell with these imperfect people, they don't listen any way, and do my own thing, which is PERFECT of course.

Oh hell yes I'm a fixer - I practically have a trowel for a left hand, can't leave alone. Maybe, just maybe, the counselling will help with that lol.

Most annoyingly, having had barely a grunt, let alone a hug from hubby for weeks, I mention I'm going to counsellling and suddenly I'm showered with attention and affection. I did enjoy it, but why only now?
Something nice comes from him every time I mention counselling, but now I actually booked something I got the best hubby ever.
Course I shouldn't complain but guess what - I am - well not actually complaining but wondering what the heck??

I know I sound like the whingiest ***** on the planet right now. I have been holding it in so long it's like the biggest verbal fart in history needed release. Sorry I'm not only verbose but uncouth today.

Sweetness and light will be resumed asap.

* That's a lady doggy above. That's the first time I ever got bleeped out by the swear filter. Just shows what a moody moo I am right now.

Hubby is really rattled about me going to counselling. He has a nervous tummy whenever he is stressed which is playing up. It feels bad to hear someone chucking their breakfast back up because of something I'm doing. I have to keep reminding myself I'm not doing anything wrong here, I'm only asking for help.

He started asking me when I'm going. I explained we arranged for the first session to be a telephone appointement so that he (the counsellor) can get an intitial feel for things quickly then take it from there, and that it is booked for the 21st.

He said, 'it's a man? Wouldn't you be better talking to a woman?' I said I just wanted to find a counsellor that I thought seemed good and was local and wasn't concerned about gender and asked why a man is a problem. He then said, 'well wouldn't a woman be more likely to agree with you?'

I don't think that question was actually at the heart of why he doesn't want me seeing a man but I just explained that I wasn't looking for a pity party, that a good counsellor wouldn't give me one, and that I was looking for solutions not someone to take sides.

He then asked why I need a counsellor and said, 'I'm not doing anything wrong you know.' I tried to explain I felt he was not emotionally available, and that I may be wrong in thinking his friendship is the problem, but I hope the counsellor will help me to get some perspective and I'm more than happy to hear if I'm understanding things all wrong.

He pointed out he was emotionally available last night, which I agreed had been great but I needed to know that things were going to be OK for the long term. He said he will keep trying.

I'm feeling OK today, just needed to keep talking as I feel that he is really trying to pull me away from the counselling and I'm worried that if I cancel it will all be back to square one. I would be very happy to tell the counsellor that things are looking better if they are and see what happens but I need to get off this rollarcoaster of everything depending on how hubby behaves one day to the next.

Whatever you do, do not cancel that appointment.

I have a feeling that this is a form of manipulation and trying to get you to feel guilty for something you didn't do.

It's ridiculous that he thinks he can start being emotionally available for such a short period, after previous times where he wasn't, and everything is OK again. That requires a lot of hard work on his part and explaining of himself, so that you can become comfortable with him again. It's not a quick fix like he would like.

Look, I could be TOTALLY wrong, but based on what I've read that is my opinion.

I do feel like I'm being maniupulated but at the same time I do find it hard not to feel guilty that he is suffering. But then I think well I have been suffering and it needs fixing. Thanks for the encouragement, helping me stay strong. :)

QP, he may be suffering, but it isn't because of anything you are doing. It is his own fears that are causing it and I think you may be finally getting somewhere with him.

Encourage him to ask questions. Keep answering them as best you can. Keep being honest with him.

I think the question about why a male is two-fold. One the insecurity of you opening up to another male. The other touches on his previously stated fear of the counselor taking sides. He appears to believe that a counselor takes sides. He is learning that belief is not correct.

Stick to your plans. Keep them open to him. Keep the invitation to go to counseling with you open. Let him come around at his own pace.

To be honest, what you are describing of his actions sounds like a scared puppy trying to get out of going to the vet. Be firm. Don't encourage the manipulation. Reward the positive. That does sound like training a puppy, doesn't it? :D

Feeling a bit gutted today.

A while ago hubby said to keep everything above board he was happy for me to read his emails whenever I want so I can see what him and X chat about and be reassured.

Got up and found a bunch of flowers for valentines day which was nice. Went to text hubby to thank him. Decided to clear out my in and outbox on phone which I just do every so often. Hubby got a new phone just before xmas as his old one conked out. Sometimes he borrows my phone to put his old sim in as his new phone is very fiddly to get the sim in and out, so he can check in case he has any messages to his old phone. Somehow he transferred stuff from his sim to my phone memory so it became clear he uses his old sim to text X. The stuff on my phone was bits and pieces and not particularly incriminating, just feel sad that he still has to find ways to be secretive.

Also about a week ago I walked in on him watching footy in the den which doubles up as our laundry room. He hastily hid a pad of paper he was writing on. He mumbled something about it not being another poem for X and how the first words were 'my wife.' I thought he might be doing something for valentines day and apologised for interrupting. Well I didn't get the poem. Maybe he never finished it or I ruined it or whatever but I think his reaction was more like guilt at being caught out than trying to keep a surprise a secret. Who knows, whatever...

Just a tad sad because it's valentines day.

Its terrible being paranoid and suspicious of everything. Hard to have fun that way. Hard to separate the real from the imagined.

My greatest super power is the ability to be patient, and not get carried away by people, places, and things, or events that I cannot control, and never assume I am not crazy, mistaken, or just plain wrong. This allows me to have those feelings, but not act on them without thought, and file things away until more facts bring better information.

Why ruin a good day over... anything. Acknowledge the feelings (which you have), and file them away for now. Deal with them when you get more facts!

Enjoy yourself for now. Some super power, huh! Takes some practice.

Got myself grounded again today at last. I think everything just got a bit emotionally supercharged for a few days. Filing everything on back burner till I talk to counsellor and focusing on other things again. You talk a lot of sense for a superhero tal. Hope you don't wear your underpants on the outside though - not a good look.

Thanks all for steering me through a big wobble.

Was supposed to meet X this week. We had said, Tues/ Weds/ Thurs. When it came to it she was only available Mon/Fri. So we said we would change our plans and do either of those, or she, and partner if she wished, could come any evening for a meal. She had, 'more things come up.' Really doesn't look like she wants to meet me.

Hubby sent her a secret message on valentines day from a different e-mail address in addition to his regular daily e-mail from his usual account. It was obvious because she mentioned it in her reply saying, 'Oh, thanks for that other e-mail, I was expecting something from you today.' He said it was just a bit of fun and couldn't see why that was a problem.

I have told him the idea that I can read his e-mails whenever I want isn't actually helpful and I don't want to be the e-mail police. I have stated how I feel about things but said it is up to him what he decides to do.

Talked to counsellor this afternoon who said that is a better way to do things. That I should continue to be honest about my feelings but not put any pressure on him or make any judgements about his behaviour. I will try very hard to stick to this.

Counsellor said he would really like to work with us both, or talk to hubby alone if he prefers, as although he is happy to continue talking things through with me he isn't sure how much he can do without hubby taking some part.

Counsellor made some suggestions on how best to approach this. Will do my best.

Fingers crossed...

Is your husband blind, deaf, or dumb, or mentally challenged?

Dear QLP,

Sorry for writing here after almost two years but I am now in a similar situation myself, and I would really like to know how you eventually dealt with the situation. Could you please tell if the counsellor helped, and if yes, how? Many thanks in advance.