Hello,

I have a delta faucet in the kitchen sink. Plenty of pressure from the hot and cold side.

However, the water on the hot side never gets hot. It gets lukewarm, and then cooler again, but never hot.

Hot water seems to work pretty well throughout the rest of the house, even upstairs in the shower.

Wash machine hot water has very little pressure and doesn't get very hot, either. I disconnected the hot water hose from the back of the wash machine and checked the pressure. It seems to be great... and got steaming hot... as long as it wasn't connected to the wash machine.

The water heater is in the basement and there is a bell & gossett hot water pump attached to the hot water line, but we haven't been using it.

What could be keeping the hot water from the kitchen sink and the wash machine?

Hi Jc...

How long is the house/buillding? Any chance that pump is a recirculating hot water line that is supposed to be used to get HOT water over to the sink area? In other words, if you use the pump do you get hot water at the sink?

Possible that the mixing valve at the faucet has failed and needs to be replaced. What DELTA model faucet do you have?

Have you actually chased the water lines from the sink over to the washer and seen if you could find a common link here? Possible that you have some pipes connected between that may be a CROSS CONNECTION between hot and cold water..? Look around and see what you find.

Check washing machine hot water hose for a screen that may have sediment built up and plugging the hose. May be that this is just a coincidence... sounds like it to me... ;)

What kind of water heater exactly..

Let me know more...

MARK

I've considered the hot water pump question, but I haven't been able to figure out why the showers and sinks on the second floor seem to get hot water fine without the pump.

I'm not really familiar with pumps, so I've never had it on longer than 5 minutes to test it. I cannot even tell if it has water flowing through it or not.

It is connected to a line coming out of the bottom of the water heater. With the pump on and the hot water on in the kitchen sink, the hot water line coming out the TOP of the water heater is much warmer than the line running from the BOTTOM of the water heater and through the pump.

The Delta faucet at the kitchen sink has aluminum lines running all the way up to the diverter and I have not disconnected them yet to test the pressure and temperature of the hot line from the shut off valve.

That would be my next step, I assume.

I have not chased the lines to the wash machine and the kitchen sink, however, they are on the same side of the house and probably within about 15 feet of one another.

If the pump is a recirculating unit, how long should it take for the hot water to get to the kitchen sink?? Would I have to leave the pump on linger than just a few minutes??

I haven't done that because I couldn't tell if water was flowing through the pump or not and I didn't want to burn the motor up (there's a warning in the very poorly produced owner's manual that was left with the pump. Acutally, the instructions tell you that the unit must be oiled and that it must be primed, but it doesn't tell you HOW to do it.).

If it's something as simple as just leaving the pump on longer... then great.

Hi JC...

Sounds like you have a STORAGE TANK more so than a water heater... right? This storage tank and its piping connect to a boiler somehow... right?

Sorry Mark,

I was at the office while posting the previous comments.

I've arrived at the house now and have the following to report...

It is an American ProLine, 80 gallon water heater.

I found that there are TWO (2) temperature setting swithces. One upper and one lower.

I had previously set the upper one from @ 120 degrees to the highest setting of about 150 degrees, but failed to set the lower one because I didn't know it was there.

I also turned the pump on and will leave it running. In the morning (giving the lower tank enough time to heat up) I will check the temperature in the kitchen sink and see if there's a difference.

The lower temperature setting switch, by the way, was set to below 120 degrees. The woman who lived in the house before we moved in was afraid of scalding herself, so she had it set very low.

Hopefully, this will cure the problem.

I'll report back to you and let you know.

John

Good info. Here... look forward to update!

All right,

I enjoyed hot water in the kitchen sink last night before retiring for the evening.

I'm not sure if it was the pump being left on or the fact that I turned up the temperature setting on the water heater. However, apparently, I turned it up too much as sometime during the night, the reset switch on the water heater was tripped and this morning I had no hot water anywhere in the house.

I reset the reset switch, turned the temperature settings down a smidgen, and will check the water temperature when I arrive back home in about an hour.

John

Water heater temperature should be set at 120-125F... especially if kids in the home!

Thanks for the update... keep 'em comin'.

All right now...

I've got hot water everywhere in the house except in the kitchen sink and the dishwasher that's adjacent to the sink.

The dishwasher water inlet is just below the kitchen sink hot water shut-off valve.

The best that it has gotten so far today is lukewarm in both the sink and the dishwasher.

The fact that the dishwasher inlet is below the sink cut-off tells me that there may be a problem somewhere between that cut-off and the water heater.

It's really weird because I actually had hot water to the kitchen sink for a short time last night before going to bed.

But today, even after the resetting of the safety switch on the water heater and waiting 3 hours, still no hot water to the kitchen sink.

I'm going out for a bit, and I'll check it later and see if it's had time to warm up to set levels.

John

OK.

With the pump running and the water heater operating normally, I now have hot water everywhere it's supposed to be, although there is some grit coming out of the spout in the bathtub spout upstairs - probably because the line the pump is on is being cleaned out.

Here's a new development... As mentioned earlier, the water heater safety switch had tripped, I am assuming because the temperature was too high.

I have now reset the switch and adjusted the temperature settings down for about the fourth time since yesterday morning. As of 4 AM this morning (I got up that early to check it so that we're sure to have hot water for showers later), the reset switch still has been tripping, and I have the setting almost down to 120 degrees.

The dial goes up to 150 degrees, which is about where I started with it yesterday.

My question now is... if the dial goes up to 150 degrees, why is the safety switch tripping even when I've set the temperature down now to about 130 degrees?? Why does it keep tripping?

John

If it keeps tripping and you have it set at 120 F then next logical step here is to replace that thermostat. May be fluke, but sometimes when these thermostats get touched after a very long period of NOT being touched... they fail (especially when set to 150 F... ;) ) .

The thermostats for water heaters are pretty much universal, but bring the defective onr along to be sure you get one like yours.

Simply, shut power off at the breaker. Then double check that power is out at the water heater junction box on top with an electrical tester (remember you are testing two-110V legs (220V), so touch one wire with a tester lead and then touch the junction box screw with the other tester leg to be sure power is down)... and then disconnect the wires going to the thermostat and replace.

If wires look a little confusing then draw out the connections on paper BEFORE disconnecting defective thermostat!

I have attached a couple wiring pics... just in case!

Sounds like you may be on your way here... ;)


.

Hey, thanks Mark,

I was online at 4 am this morning and looked up the owner's manual from American Water Heaters... I've got an American Pro Line 80 gallon electric with two thermostats - an upper and a lower. It was originally installed in 2006 but the house was empty for at least four months.

The manual did say that the thermostat may be bad if experiencing conditions such as mine.

Do you think the elements are still good, or could they need to be replaced as well?

By the way... there is no junction box on top of my heater, just the romex wire going straight into the top of the heater.

Oh, and which thermostat should I replace, the upper or the lower... or both?

Replace the upper thermostat... the one with the RESET button.

The elements sound like they are fine... but never know. Start with replacing the upper thermostat and read the manual that you located online to cover all bases~

Do you have an electrical tester that tests for CONTINUITY? Let me know?

No... I don't have a tester, but I know where the breaker is in the breaker panel.

In fact, it was shut off for the four months that the house was empty.

Buy a cheap electrical tester... one that tests continuity ($20.00 at home depot).

Then confirm power off (just a good habit to get in if you ever touch electrical again... of course, must check that the tester works FIRST by using it on a working outlet... ok? ).

After power is shut off and the thermostat is replaced I want you to disconnect the two wires going to each element (power is still off here) and test them for continuity... just need to touch each lead to each screw. If you have no continuity then the element needs to be replaced. If have continuity then elements are fine.

Just so you can be 100% sure of all issues here... ;)

I'm off to work... again!

Keep me posted.

If the power is still off and the wires are disconnected, should there be continuity?

You may have to explain that one a little more to me because I don't think I'm getting it.

I've just arrived home from church and the safety switch has remained OK with the water heater running now for at least 10 hours.

The water in the kitchen sink is warm, but not hot.

Water to all other spouts is hot.

I have closed the by-pass line to the pump, as I just noticed that it has been open the whole time.

The water coming directly from the bottom of the heater must now pass directly through the pump if it is to leave the closet where the heater is at all.

Hopefully, this is not a mistake and will help get hotter water to the kitchen.

I may also try to nudge the setting up a little bit more since the reset switch did not kick off.

If the power is off and the wires are disconnected AND THE ELEMENT IS GOOD then there will be continuity. If the element is bad there will be no continuity. Remember, it is the element we are testing for coninuity... ;)

Waiting for results... bypass should be closed!

Boy am I getting frustrated.

Water to kitchen sink is not as hot now as it was.

Could it be that the "by-pass" line to the pump is really some kind of recirculation line for the pump? I've heard of some pumps being recirculation pumps??

The pump is a Bell & Gossett booster series 100. Not much at all on their website about the pump.

Good news is that the water heater has remained on all day.

I'm really flabbergasted! What could cause this kind of intermittent hot water supply?

My 15 year old daughter informed me, too that her shower is hot and then cooler and up and down like that basically the whole time.

I've experienced similar in my shower.

Both of these showers are on the second floor.

Kitchen is on the main floor.

Water heater is in the basement.

Any ideas?

I'll think about this overnight and then post in the AM...

Any chance you could post a couple pics. Of the hot water heater piping and circulator piping..?

I'm also thinking one of your mixing valves is bad... talk tomorrow. Off to work again!

I will post some pics after I get to the office in the morning.

Here's another question...

I opened the drain valve slightly at the bottom of the heater to test the water temp coming out of the heater. It was cool to the touch.

Shouldn't the water be hot.

FYI...

Tonight after coming home from being out for awhile, we turned on the kitchen faucet and the water was cool.

When my wife went up to take a bath... the water coming out the kitchen faucet got hot instantly.

The line did put out more grit into her bathtub, but the water was hot.

OK JC...

Try this real quick:

Shut off the incoming COLD water supply to the water heater. Then go upstairs to kitchen sink and shut the HOT water shutoff under the sink off.

Then rotate the handle to hot side and see if water still flows.. if it does then the cartridge is gone in the kitchen faucet and needs to be replaced.

If water doesn't flow from the hot side, then with the hot water heater still turned off (but kitchen sink HOT shutoff turned back on), turn all of the tub/shower and lavatory single handled valves one by one to the cold side and recheck the kitchen sink faucet until you have discovered which one has failed.

Let me know what you find...

MARK

How will I know which one has failed?

What am I looking for?

Hi JC...

You will know which one has failed (if one has failed.. ;) ) when cold water comes out the HOT side of the kitchen faucet with the hot water heater cold water supply shutoff... that make sense? Test each valve individually and then go to kitchen faucet to test each...

Reread my last post and take one step at a time.

Mark,

I posted some pics and actually a short video. You can access them here...

Video and Pictures (http://timesofrefreshing.us/jcchampion)


John

I'm at the office...

I won't be able to do that check until I get home later.

I'll let you know what happens when I get it done.

Hi JC:


Thanks for pics./video... good stuff!

That is definitely a recirculating hot water line at the pump. I'm wondering if the pump is actually pumping/working? I know we hear it pumping... doesn't mean it is pumping..?

Wonder if there is another valve that has been shut on the recirc. Line..? Look under farthest sink for a shutoff that can't be explained and chase that re-circ. Line as far as you can go... let me know.

Anyway, start with checking the valves as discussed earlier... maybe more than one issue here... let me know more.

Ok Mark,

Here's what I did...

I turned off every valve surrounding the pump, including the bypass and the cut-off in the line coming out of the bottom of the heater before reaching the pump, and shut the pump off.

I did this before leaving for work this AM. I just went home around 3 PM and checked the water...

HOT WATER EVERYWHERE!! Including the kitchen sink.

However, the safety switch on the water heater was tripped again, so I went to Lowe's and bought and installed a new upper thermostat. I would have replaced the lower one as well, but they were out of them. Apparently, there's been a big run on thermostats lately :rolleyes:.

I haven't done what you suggested yet, and hopefully won't have to. I did check to see if there was an extra shut-off under one of the sinks, though, but I didn't find one anywhere.

Now, I do have to wait about 60-90 seconds for the hot water to show up at the kitchen sink, but when it does arrive, it is hot!

There seemed to be no problem with hot water getting to the upstairs tubs, either... PLUS, there was no grit in the tub when I turned on the faucet :).

I really appreciate your help and all of the advice. I will certainly be back if for some reason this doesn't stick.

Until then...

HAPPY PLUMBING.

HAVE A MERRY CHRISTMAS!

JC

Ahhhh,

It appears that this will be my very last post on this issue.

I've just arrived home after having the new thermostat installed for about 4 + hours now, and...

STILL HOT WATER IN EVERY FAUCET!!

Victory is SWEET!

Thanks Mark,

John

Good news John...

When you have time we should investigate the recirc. Pump and find out why that's not working...

Good night.

MARK