I am having a great deal of problems trying to figure out how exactly we should dicipline our children. My husband believes in spanking yet rarely has to because the kids really listen to him. I think a good swat on the bum might be okay but I would like some other opinions. Thanks.:rolleyes:

I agree with you and your husband. My wife and I believe in spanking only for repeat offenses where other punishments have not worked - or for very serious infractions.

About age 8 is where we stopped spanking altogether with our kids.

I think spanking is OK as long as it's not in excess... I mean if my kids run out in the road I'm going to swat their little butts and they're going to hear about it. I think that spare the rod and spoil the child is a bad thing... look how kids act this day and age. My mother was brought up that way and she's just now grown up enough to realise life isn't handed to her on a silver platter.

I have a 5 1/2 year old and a 1 1/2 year old. We have never spanked either of them and they are the sweetest kids you'll ever meet. I believe our success lies in the fact that my wife and I are on the same page as far as parenting goes so we are consistent with our views towards the limits and discipline. I have had to forcibly remove my older one from the mall twice because I told her "If you don't stop that then we're leaving." - she didn't stop so we left. I knew that when I had kids I did not want to be that 'empty threat' parent that you see so often - if I say I'm going to so something then they know I'm going to do it.

To each his own but if the child has consistent parenting from both parents you may find that spanking may not be necessary.

You answered another question about at the age you stop. What do you do after that?

After age 8 we focus more on withholding privleges: Grounding them to their room, the home or the yard, No computer, No video games, No TV, etc.

I agree with every answer here. Karma, you are an oddball with most of your views (just kidding) I have done the same thing, remove the children from the situation rather than spank.

However, I do believe in spanking if the situation warrants it. If your child puts him/herself or another in danger then it is okay.

As I said, I do believe in it, although, like Karma, I have not had to do it.

I did spank my daughter once, she "ran away" once when she was in first grade. An older girl talked her into it, Rae did not really understand what she was doing. But they went into a stranger's house. So... I spanked, and spanked. I have never had the need to raise my hand again.

Consistent parenting from both parents is not always possible, especially if you are in a monitary situation that requires one to work horrific hours so the other can stay home with the kids. But, the parent who does work must agree with the discipline tactics of the parent who stays at home.

As Karma says, "empty threats," they are just that, if you do not back yourself up and follow up with your threats then the child will know how to push your buttons and your child will be in a world of confusion.

Spanking, yes, if the circumstance requires it.

In your case, since we don't know circumstances, it is hard to say whether you should spank or not.

Thanks, I don't want to beat my kids and I would never use anything other than my hand. I do want my children listen and understand.

One of the things that is going on right now is my 7 year old grunts, groans, moans, complains and just plain *itches every time we ask him to do anything. His job is to unload the dishwasher and if he complains about it, we offer to give him another job. Well, my husband has had enough and says we should just spank him. Our son should be able to do his job without complaining. The kids should do what they are told, shouldn't they? Maybe a couple of spanks and he would see that we are serious. Am I wrong?

We try to do appropriate punishments here.
-If you have disrespected your sister, then you can give me a list of 10 reasons you love her.
-If you are caught fighting then the two of you can do something constructive together. e.g.. Clean the bathroom
-If you hurt someone you can help them. e.g.. Make their bed for them

Stuff like that.

It's the whining and complaining that really has me stumped. Their mouth can drive me nuts.

For not unloading the d/w I would not spank... but would say "You can go out and play only when your job is done".

Ah, I hate the whining and complaining. What I do under these circumstances is add another job. If the whining continues, another job is added and so on. They then become aware that unloading the dishwasher is easier than unloading the dishwasher, cleaning the toilets, and sweping the kitchen floor.

I keep to my word too. If the moaning continues I make sure that all jobs assigned are done to my specifications otherwise the job must be done over. Yes, there is whining, but it should only last a few days if you stick to your "guns" so to speak. If you give in, your kids will know it and will take full advantage of it. If the moaning bothers you, go into another room while the job is being done so you don't have to listen to the whining.

Yes, a swat on the hiney may make him realize you are serious, but under these circumstances, I would just assign more work.

Rick,
Aaawwweee, positive reinforcement. Good one. I'm glad you said that. Maybe it is better to reward for good behaviour. Again, the key would probably be consistency.

This is a very tough juggling act.

Maybe a combination. You can complain and get more work or you can just do it without the grumping around and then go do something you really want to do.

Well I guess I'm an oddball like NeedKarma because I don't spank either. I have been pretty tempted though, especially lately!

I might spank in a situation like Janine described... if the child puts themselves in grave danger. I would want them to remember a situation like that so they wouldn't do it again. I wouldn't spank for whining, though. I have a whiner (almost 5) who also used to throw bad temper tantrums, but my way of dealing with it is to ignore him completely. I don't acknowledge the whining at all, with any kind of attention, bad or good. I will walk out of the room, talk to someone else, pretend he isn't even there. It sounds mean, but my mother recommended it to me and it actually works very well. As soon as he speaks in a normal voice again I acknowledge him. I've found that he whines a lot less now. It's taken a lot of patience but it's working.

I also take away privileges, as Rick and others mentioned. If the kid continues to misbehave I continue to take away privileges until they have nothing and have to start earning everything back... I learned that from Dr. Phil, haha. But it seems to work, too. My 9 year old nephew is staying with us right now, and we've done that with him. When he first arrived, he was probably the worst behaved kid I've ever seen (! ), and since he's the oldest child, the others were all following his lead. Over the course of 2 days or so we have stripped his room of all the stuff he likes, his games, books, etc. I feel especially mean doing it given his recent circumstances, but it was obvious he was trying to run the household, and we had to stop it before it got worse. This morning there was a real difference in him, and he asked (nicely, wow!) how he could earn back his stuff.

Regardless of whether you spank or not, being consistent, following through on threats, and the adults being a united front and agreeing on discipline are all really important. And really hard to do, but definitely worth the work.

Regardless of whether you spank or not, being consistent, following through on threats, and the adults being a united front and agreeing on discipline are all really important. And really hard to do, but definitely worth the work.

I think this will be what I can stick to the most. I will have to work on this one. Consistency, consistency, consistency. We are united for the most part. My husband tends to say things when he's angry. We will keep working together. It is hard when you are alone for weeks on end but I guess that means I should get away from them for a little while. I think it would mean a much better me for the kids. They know I am not consistent and they feed on that.

The problem I have with taking things away, is where do I put it? Where do I put all of the stuff I am taking away? I think deep down I am kind of a softy.

Great advice everyone.

I forgot to ask..

Today my 11 year old daughter came home with a grade of 61% on her science test.

She doesn't have trouble in school, she was just too lazy to study. This is not acceptable in our family. Her friend is having a birthday party on Friday. Any ideas of what a fair punishment would be?

*I thought maybe grounding from the party and for the weekend.
She was so upset and she had no idea what to expect as a punishment and I think that was frustrating for her. (Like Dr. Phil says "children should be able to predict the consequence to their actions 100%. Mine obviously can't.)

Well, 61% is that so bad? Really? My daughter (12) is a straight A student and she came home with a 57% on a Science test. No, I feel that it is not acceptable, but I do know that she studied and knew the material, but the test was rough. She punished herself worse than I could.

You cannot expect perfection. If you punish her for one grade you will harm her ego. As I tell Rae, "I know it was a bad grade, and you don't have many, so I am sure it will not happen again."

Your daughter was probably embarrassed to bring that home. Remember, psychologically you can do a lot of harm to a child by punishing and rewarding for grades. Really, 61% on one grade, will that make or break her for the year? Nah, it won't let her punish herself. It is actually worse than what you could do.

This one is a tough one. I like all the answers given. I don't think any of them were necessarily right or worng because each child is different. Need and Orange, I don't think you're oddballs because that is what works for you. I believe in spanking but also not in excess. I also believe you need to be consistent with the punishment or at least follow through with the punishments threatened at the time. I am going through a similar thing with my 2 1/2 year old. He blatenly disobeys me. I have spanked him more than I have wanted to but not hard just a little swat. He hates it when I do it but goes right back at it. We have taken away toys before. We also try to give our son positive reinforcement when he does good things. We try to praise him when doing good and even give him back one of his toys we took away if he has been good. We also explain why we are giving this back. Some say he is too young to understand but I think he understands enough to know what is good and bad behavior.

I would keep the spanking at a minimal. Like Rick said, for repeat offenses.

J9, I wouldn't be punishing so much for the grade except that she admitted to be lazy. She didn't study, didn't even try and that's the part that I think we need to deal with. That's the frustrating part. (Maybe I should copy the test and make her do it again after she's spent a little time on it... maybe not?) You are right, she was very upset when she came home from school.

PS... this has been happening a lot this last month. I know part of it is it's June and the kids just want to be enjoying the weather, and schools almost done, and...

The problem I have with taking things away, is where do I put it? Where do I put all of the stuff I am taking away? I think deep down I am kind of a softy.


We put Liam's things (and the other kids' things, if and when they get taken away) in the closet in the master bedroom. The master bedroom is off limits to the kids when we are not in there. This sounds way harsh, but it was my mom's idea... she said if they "steal" the things back, throw them in the garbage or donate them to charity!! So we've told Liam that if he takes something back without permission he will never see it again. Of course I wouldn't do that with a very personal item like a diary or something special given to him by his mother. But most toys and games are not like that and can be easily replaced.

I understand being a softie, I certainly feel like being less tough on him and the others, but with 6 kids in the house there has to be order and consequences, otherwise I think we're all going to go insane.


Today my 11 year old daughter came home with a grade of 61% on her science test.

She doesn't have trouble in school, she was just too lazy to study. This is not acceptable in our family. Her friend is having a birthday party on Friday. Any ideas of what a fair punishment would be?

I wouldn't punish her, either. If her marks are consistently good, this might be just a one-time event, or it could be due to stress or some other problem she's having at home or at school. I would explore all those possibilities before concluding that she's lazy. If you're certain she's being lazy though, I would just tell her that I expect her to get a good mark next time. And I would supervise her studying, to make sure she's putting enough time in, tell her she needs to study before watching TV or calling friends, etc. And if the marks continued to be bad, I would hire a tutor. I don't think punishing her is a very good idea in this situation, because if she has any aversion to studying at all, punishments will just make it worse.

Too much rep. sorry.

Chava, you have a good point about making studying a problem for her. That is something I do not want to do. I guess I will just have to make sure she studies. I will have to make it more of a priority. Time, time, time, something we never have enough of. Thanks again.

To each his own but if the child has consistent parenting from both parents you may find that spanking may not be necessary.

Well said!

I agree with this post.

I don't think spanking is necessary.

Personally, I believe it sends the wrong message. How is spanking your child OK, yet hitting a classmate is wrong?

What if your child then went and spanked a class mate when they did something wrong?

There are plenty of ways to discipline the kids without spanking.

As NeedKarma said, back up your threats. If they are going to leave the mall, then leave. If they are going to miss a hockey game, then they miss it.

I agree that you have a point there. I don't want to teach my kids that it is okay to hit. I think they need to know that it is a disciplinary tool used by those (parents only) who are entitled to use it. I don't see my kids trying to give another one in their kindergarten class a time out. I think that kids need to know why it is used. Every situation requires something different.

e.g..
-fighting is not allowed in school
-my son was pushed by a bully in grade 1
-my son pushed back
-the bully walked away
-my son got a demerit for fighting
-RIDICULOUS!
-he was not punished at home for these actions although he did get into trouble at school
-we teach our children to stand up for themselves
-I think if everyone did, bullies wouldn't be such an issue.

Do you see where I was going with this, because I'm not sure I've connected my points here.

Oh... I was just saying that every situation is different and requires different punishments. I think the kids need to know who can punish them and know that they are not in charge of punishing anyone else.

I realize this may go over a little one's head. Anyway, I'm done... I think I've said what I mean.

I agree with you there. Just because I don't spank my kids doesn't mean that I won't teach them to defend themselves against bullying (that can be a whole other thread:)).

Since my kids are younger I don't yet face the challenges you mention here. If anyone does have younger kids you'd better believe in the power of positive reinforcement as it is more powerful than punishment in shaping behaviour. Imagine catching your child playing nicely with the baby, walk over to her and give her a great big hug and a kiss and tell her "You're doing a great job playing with <baby>, that makes me happy. Good job." That behavious is now incredibly reinforced. Same goes with making the bed, going to bed at the proper time, etc. Got to catch 'em at a young age for this to work though.

Spanking is fine, because spanking isn't beating up your kid, it's a punishment with no lasting damage, where the only side effect should be that the kid starts to grow up and behave!

I didn't get hurt or scared by spanking, taught me a good few lessons! And I think it helped me, just like it will help others.

=]

Another good punishment was getting sent to bead with just a piece of bread and a glass of water, man I missed my dinner, that tought me too! ( I love food! )

WARNING too much spanking and you could risk your kid getting a... fetish... :S (I joke, although it might be true)

Aqua and Karma, I agree with you both.

As I said before I only spanked Rae once when she was in 1st grade, never spanked Johnny (4). Positive reinforcement can do WONDERS!!

Some parents take spanking way too far. Some children that get spanked just laugh it off after it has been done too many times. There are so many different ways to use discipline and I agree with you when you say that each child and each circumstance calls for different reactions from parents.

I think the important thing is variety.

Possitive reinforce meant is great but like with anything, shouldn't be your only method, and should happen to offten.

Same with spanking, same with raising your voice, same with getting things taken away, same with getting send to your room, a bit of everything is the healtiest way!

I do agree with the positive reinforcement. I do remember to use it, some days being better than others.

Here is a thought: positive reinforcement does not require us to respond to negativity. When a child whines, screams, tattles, etc or makes it so someone else does, then we respond. It is sometimes easier to respond than it is to take the innitiative and really see what is going on.

I notice that when I am in a good mood, I am much more able to notice the good things. When I am under stress, I tend only to react. Wrong, I know, but I am only human.

I get what you mean Aqua. One of the things I do for the whining is NOTHING! I totally ignore the whining and praise when the job is well done. Sure it is easier said than done to ignore the whining, but almost 20 years of practice sure does help.

If parents present a united front I think it goes a long way in letting kids know what is expected and what is not tolerated. There must also be balance as children need not only love and hugs and rewards for very good behavior.

Yes, I am going to try to work more on possitive reinforcement. I think it is important for their self-esteem and teaches them at the same time. I guess we will not rule out spanking, but use it accordingly.

Great ideas!! That is pretty much how I do it. I have threatened Johnny with spanking, but never done it.

With positive reiforcement he, at 4, has learned to say "I'm sorry" before I even step into it.

I think the occasional spank with the hand is not a bad idea. It all depends on the situation. Anything else would be considered abuse.

What would you guys do with a 2-3 year old? We have tried numerous things and he just laughs. We are generally consistent but it is hard because you rfeel like a broken record. Some behavior we thought of just ignoring and maybe he will grow out of it but we didn't want him to think it was OK and continue to do it.

Jduke, can you distract him, like, if he's touching something you don't want him to touch, give him something to play with? Or simply remove him from the situation? Like for example, if he's misbehaving in the mall, put him in a cart? My 4 year old is a little older, but he knows if he doesn't behave at the store I will make him ride in the cart, which he hates. I say to him, "you can either not run in the store, or you can ride in the cart". Then if he keeps running, I pick him up and say, "I see you decided to ride in the cart." It works for me, anyway.

Btw, have any of you ever read the book, How To Talk So Kids Will Listen & Listen So Kids Will Talk by Adele Faber and Elaine Mazlish (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0380811960/sr=8-1/qid=1151435533/ref=pd_bbs_1/104-3348484-0861515?ie=UTF8")? It was given to me as a gift when I found out I was pregnant, and it's been very useful to me in dealing with the kids.

I like to "redirect." When Johnny (4) acts up I try to find other things for him to do. I like the advice that Chava gives though, and I also use that. It teaches from a young age that they make their choices and they have to live with the consequences to their choices.

BTW, I did the cart thingy to Johnny just yesterday at Wal-Mart.

My oldest used to throw a huge fit when she didn't get what she wanted in a store. I kept telling her no and she wouldn't listen. One day it started up in the grocery store... I think she was five or six at the time... I had finally had enough. I took her in the cart to the busiest isle I could find and I threw one hell of a temper tantrum myself. Needless to say she was so embarrassed that she never again threw a fit in any store when she was with me. It beat spanking her and really got better results... lol... I didn't care that I looked like I was crazy and that people from other places in the store came to watch it got the results I wanted. Now all I have to do is ask her "what does no mean?" and she always says "no means no". I try to use the child against themselves... like if they know they aren't sapposed to be doing something I'll get one of their toys and start playing with it and tell them that they can't. Pretty soon they forget what they were doing and want to know what you are doing with their toy. I guess it's a form of reverse psychology but I'm really not sure... It has worked with most of the kids I've cared for though, no matter what their past so I keep doing it... lol. I still believe that a swat on the rear drives home a point when they are putting themselves in danger. I think I only use it when it becomes the lesser of two evils.

You are too funny Myth. I think I saw you in Wal-Mart in Millington LOL. I saw a woman do the same thing, and the kid turned red and got quiet real quick.

Hey it works wonders though... they get embarrassed by the same things we do... lol

Yeah, and it can be fun if you know what you are doing. Hey, those people will probably never see you again!!

I still swear it was you LOL

Orange, yes I/we have tried to distract him. It usually doesn't work. He'll just go right back to it. He has a memory like an elephant. He could be complaining about something just before nap and I distract him enough for him to forget and when he wakes up the first thing he mentions is the thing he was complaining about. This is usually at home he is like this. When we are out I put him in the stroller when he is acting up. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. At home, however, it is one thing after another. For example, up the stairs, get him down; on the coffee table, tell him to get off; don't hit your brother, he laughs; don't drink your brother's water, again laughs, etc. This is all within 10 min. It gets frustrating and tiresome. Especially when I am trying to get work done around the house. Of course, both my wife and I are on him constantly. I hope it is just a phase. Thanks for your input.

JDuke - you have to offer up some negative consequences to his behavior.. not necessarily spanking but something that has some affect. Saying "no" is only the beginning of a negative consequence - i.e. should be a warning to the kid that if this escalates, stuff is going to happen. I don't see that you are "armed" with any stuff... time-out, stand in corner, no toys etc.

Jon, we've been trying that. We take toys away, make him sit on the couch. We only use spanking as a last resort. Time-outs we haven't used as far as sitting in a corner. He is a little hyper so that'll be a little more work. I feel like we are losing control and I don't want to have a spoiled brat. On the positive side, he (they both) are really good kids. He just goes in spurts with his misbehaving. Thanks for your input.

Jduke, he sounds like a really smart kid! It could be a phase that he's going through... my friend had a terrible time with her daughter having tantrums, tried everything and nothing worked, but since she's turned 3, the tantrums have just basically stopped on their own. So hopefully it's something he will outgrow, too. Being consistent is best, no matter what discipline methods you are using. Also, considering how smart he sounds, he may be picking up on the fact that you are frustrated, and acting up to get more attention. The laughing part definitely sounds like he's enjoying pushing your buttons!

I am hoping too that it is just aphase. You might be right, he might be picking up on my frustration. Maybe I should cool it a bit or even ignore some of his behavior and see how that goes. He definitely does like to push my buttons.

Oh BTW I do have a very smart boy. I may go and see if he is a genious :p

Thanks for the compliment and support.

I hope aqua_home is getting something positive out of this. I didn't meant ot take over her thread.

jduke44, you go right ahead. I can't think of all of the questions. I am glad others talk, I can learn from what you all have to say. As far as I am concerned it is not my thread, but here for all of us to use. I'm glad to see I am not the only one with questions.

I know this is a little off topic but I thought I would thank you all for listening and answering. With this particular thread it has almost been like a parenting group for me. When I am at my witt's end, it's nice to see there is help. I don't feel alone because it seems, there is always someone online. I can't always phone my husband or a friend at 2am, but someone is on here. Thanks again.

I am just waiting to tear my hair out in the wee hrs of the morning after the twins get here... I just hope that I have enough energy to get up and vent to you guys cause there really isn't anyone else to talk to and get soooo much from at any hour day or night... only nine weeks or so left before that happens...

If its necessary, spank... but don't abuse. My parents spanked me and I am thankful for the way they raised me.

What's interesting (and why I said "If necessary") is that in the 8 years my daughter has been alive, I have never needed to spank her. I have slapped her hand when she was really young but once she hit the age of about 4, she listened. She has a wise soul and just seems to know better.

I think I still got the belt when I was like 12.

Yes, I know some see the belt as abuse.. it only happened once and it was because I was playing with fire in a dry area on the 300 acre ranch that I grew up on. And I am still thankful for the way my parents raised me :cool: