I recently purchased an indoor smokeless grill and am wondering if it is tripping my breaker. I thought when a breaker tripped, it went off only part way; not all the way off. I believe you have to turn a tripped breaker all the way off and then back on to get it to work again, which is why I am confused about this situation. Actually, I have had more than one breaker shut off. There is more to this story but if someone could tell me if I am on the right path, I would appreciate it.

Usually true. You can generally push it toward ON and it will spring back a little. To reset, you must go to OFF then back to ON.

There are some breakers that are designed to trip completely to the OFF position although I think this is generally not true for panelboards. It's plausible that a violent overload will cause a full trip. There is the possibility of a bad breaker. One sign is if it is warmer than other breakers.

FPE, C-H series and others typically just go to OFF, not the middle position that is more common.

What is the "more" part of the story?

I recently purchased an indoor smokeless grill and am wondering if it is tripping my breaker. I thought when a breaker tripped, it went off only part way; not all the way off. I believe you have to turn a tripped breaker all the way off and then back on to get it to work again, which is why I am confused about this situation. Actually, I have had more than one breaker shut off. There is more to this story but if someone could tell me if I am on the right path, I would appreciate it.
Depends on the type of breaker. My building uses several power panels with several types of breakers... Homeline, GE, CuttlerHammer. Some trip part way, others all the way off when they trip, which happens from time to time. The more some breakers trip, the more worn they become and eventually need to be replaced. You should call an electrican, but if determined to fix it yourself, the easiest thing to do is determine which outlets are controlled by that circuit, and then see what stuff is plugged into that circuit usually... and how many amps those devices draw. Keep in mind that some units draw more amperage when they kick in, then the amperage drops while the unit is running.

Meriden - I do believe that ( Ferghus gave the best advise, You should follow his advise. Now to get my 2 cents worth in :: The smoke less grill you have got takes a lot of amps to use and if there ios very much on the same circuit ,it is going to trip the breaker several times durning the time you are using it .; I would bet that there are severl things on the same circuit ,probably some are being used at the same time; I seen where a person had one and was in his kitchen using it and it even set the wires inside the wall on fire no joke :: If you are going to use it in the kitchen then get a electrician to run you a 30 amp circuit just for the grill and be safe ;; have a good day and GOD BLESS ::F.B.E.

Two comments.

First off, a breaker tripping does NOT wear it out. Agreed, if a breaker trips due to a short circuit all the time it will shorten it's service life, but occasional tripping does not hurt a breaker.

Second, Eagles advice on having a 30A circuit run is not sound advice. You CANNOT have standard 15 or 20 amp receptacles on a 30A circuit.
The best thing to do would be to have a dedicated 20A circuit run just for this appliance.


Again, what is the "more" part of the story?

The label on the panel cover or door usually explains how this particular manufacturer circuit breaker trips, and how to reset it.


I can't wait to hear the rest of the story. I bet this is a doozy.

I can't wait to hear the rest of the story. I bet this is a doozy. :D :p

The label on the panel cover or door usually explains how this particular manufacturer circuit breaker trips, and how to reset it.


I can't wait to hear the rest of the story. I bet this is a doozy.

LOL... to everyone who wants to know the rest of the story; as I said before, I have had more than one breaker shut off. This is the second time for this particular breaker. The guy upstairs is a jerk and I have had the propane let out of my tank and my gas cap on my car opened, which scared me enough to buy a locking gas cap. I want to be sure it is the grill causing the problem [even though others have been turned off] before I say something. I will return the unit if everyone thinks it is causing the problem as I do not want a fire. Thanks for the help!

"Guy upstairs"?? Is this an apartment?

Stanfortyman - QUOTE-- I did not say anything about 15or20 amp. Recepticals on the circuit, I SAID HAVE A ELICTRICIAN TO RUN A 30 AMP CIRCUIT JUST FOR THE GRILL!
I think that you miss understood <SORRY IF YOU DID .:: F.B.E.

"Guy upstairs"??? Is this an apartment?

Yes; it is actually a double [I live in the lower flat]. Without going into great detail, he is the boyfriend of the landlord's niece and gives new meaning to abusive. We had a run-in one day over his big mouth at one o'clock in the morning and ever since then breakers are being shut off, propane let out of my gas grill, etc. Which is why I posted to this site. Obviously, I am a woman and know nothing about breakers and it is difficult to go to the landlord because of the relationship. I am just trying to understand if this electric grill I bought could be the problem. I have been told that when breakers trip, they need to be turned completely off and then turned back to the on position. Mine are always completely off, which leads me to believe they are having "help" gettting there. So gentlemen, can anyone give me a lesson on breakers and if they just trip part way or all the way in the off position.

Yes; it is actually a double [I live in the lower flat]. Without going into great detail, he is the boyfriend of the landlord's niece and gives new meaning to abusive. We had a run-in one day over his big mouth at one o'clock in the morning and ever since then breakers are being shut off, propane let out of my gas grill, etc. Which is why I posted to this site. Obviously, I am a woman and know nothing about breakers and it is difficult to go to the landlord because of the relationship. I am just trying to understand if this electric grill I bought could be the problem. I have been told that when breakers trip, they need to be turned completely off and then turned back to the on position. Mine are always completely off, which leads me to believe they are having "help" gettting there. So gentlemen, can anyone give me a lesson on breakers and if they just trip part way or all the way in the off position.
Ah... so THAT's the problem. Do you have access to the breaker panel? Because the only surefire way to see if it's the grills fault, is to be sure the breaker is reset... then turn on your grill and see if the breaker trips.

Stanfortyman - QUOTE-- I did not say anything about 15or20 amp. recepticals on the circuit, I SAID HAVE A ELICTRICIAN TO RUN A 30 AMP CIRCUIT JUST FOR THE GRILL!!
I think that you miss understood <SORRY IF YOU DID .:: F.B.E.FBE, I'm not trying to be a jerk, but you did not even have to say anything about 15 or 20A. Just saying to run a 30A circuit was wrong in itself, which is why I posted.

Obviously this thing plugs into a "standard" 15 or 20 amp receptacle, so no matter what, a 30A circuit for it would be illegal/non-compliant.

So gentlemen, can anyone give me a lesson on breakers and if they just trip part way or all the way in the off position.
Can you tell us what it says on the panel?
What brand and series is it?

Because you are in an apartment, electrical work must be done by a licensed electrician, supplied by the landlord.

Since you are clearly inferring that the problem is the loudmouth flicking the breaker off from time to time may I suggest that you lean on the landlord by attacking his revenue stream. Tell him you need an electrician to examine your breaker panel. You are concerned for your safety because the way the breakers are tripping point to a possible problem with a loose neutral connection. This is a definite fire hazard and you would be well within your rights to call for a fire inspector or City Electrical Inspector if he does not have the panel examined and inspected.

If he tells you no, you can then call your city or county electrical inspectors and ask them to intervene.

Either way, the landlord gets the bill. And I'm sure that if it costs the landlord money, the landlord will stop the behavior.

By the way, is your electrical panel in a public place where anyone can have access to it or is it inside of your apartment where only you or the landlord have access to the panel?

Good luck, by regardless of the reason for the problem, it must be fixed by the landlord and it must be done by a qualified licensed electrician.

because you are in an apartment, electrical work must be done by a licensed electrician, supplied by the landlord.

Since you are clearly inferring that the problem is the loudmouth flicking the breaker off from time to time may i suggest that you lean on the landlord by attacking his revenue stream. Tell him you need an electrician to examine your breaker panel. You are concerned for your safety because the way the breakers are tripping point to a possible problem with a loose neutral connection. This is a definite fire hazard and you would be well within your rights to call for a fire inspector or city electrical inspector if he does not have the panel examined and inspected.

If he tells you no, you can then call your city or county electrical inspectors and ask them to intervene.

Either way, the landlord gets the bill. And i'm sure that if it costs the landlord money, the landlord will stop the behavior.

By the way, is your electrical panel in a public place where anyone can have access to it or is it inside of your apartment where only you or the landlord have access to the panel?

Good luck, by regardless of the reason for the problem, it must be fixed by the landlord and it must be done by a qualified licensed electrician.


Huh ?

Because you are in an apartment, electrical work must be done by a licensed electrician, supplied by the landlord.

Since you are clearly inferring that the problem is the loudmouth flicking the breaker off from time to time may I suggest that you lean on the landlord by attacking his revenue stream. Tell him you need an electrician to examine your breaker panel. You are concerned for your safety because the way the breakers are tripping point to a possible problem with a loose neutral connection. This is a definite fire hazard and you would be well within your rights to call for a fire inspector or City Electrical Inspector if he does not have the panel examined and inspected.

If he tells you no, you can then call your city or county electrical inspectors and ask them to intervene.

Either way, the landlord gets the bill. And I'm sure that if it costs the landlord money, the landlord will stop the behavior.

By the way, is your electrical panel in a public place where anyone can have access to it or is it inside of your apartment where only you or the landlord have access to the panel?

Good luck, by regardless of the reason for the problem, it must be fixed by the landlord and it must be done by a qualified licensed electrician.


Thank you for this information. The landlord does all his own electrical work and I doubt he is a licensed electrician. I had some "shared metering" going on and he was required to correct that. Unfortunately, the electric company (National Grid) does not mandate a licensed electrican do the work. And yes, the electrical panel is in the basement which he has access to. I plan on using the grill this evening in a different outlet (not on that particular breaker) to see what happens. If it trips that breaker, I will know it is the unit and will return it before I have a fire. I do appreciate everyone's imput to my problem. And for the record, I am getting the h#ll out of this apartment in the spring!

The electric company does not have a say over the landlord. The NEC specifies identifies the need for a licensed electrician. Just like the NEC states that the meters cannot be shared, nor can common property fixtures (hallway lights, signs) be run off a tenant's meter. They have to be on an independent meter

Your landlord is allowed to make repairs, but I believe he has to be a resident. I do not have any of my books with me but if I get home tomorrow evening, I'll look up the information.

The electric company does not have a say over the landlord. The NEC specifies identifies the need for a licensed electrician. Just like the NEC states that the meters cannot be shared, nor can common property fixtures (hallway lights, signs) be run off of a tenant's meter. They have to be on an independent meter

Your landlord is allowed to make repairs, but I believe he has to be a resident. I do not have any of my books with me but if I get home tomorrow evening, I'll look up the information.

I don't know what NEC stands for but the landlord lives two doors down. All the common areas were on my electric; he got rid of the lights in the basement except over the washers/dryers and coming down the stairs; got rid of the back yard light; and put the porch light on the upstairs electric line (his niece and her boyfriend live up there). I have my washer/dryer light and front hall light on my electric... he said if he had to incur any expenses, my rent would go up. I still believe the boyfriend is turning off my breakers as just this weekend I had another one off. Landlord was here this evening checking the lines (and amps?? ) and found nothing wrong but says he does not want to jump to conclusions this guy is doing it. There are only a few of us with keys to this place, and if we are not doing it and the landlord is not doing it, it does not leave anyone else but him.

Sounds like it's time to put some marbles in the fuse box, so when it's opened a bunch of them fall on the floor. Only you will know to put something under it when you open it.

Lowe's has a wireless motion detector that's designed to mount outside, but it's perfectly happy mounted inside.

The motion part is battery powered. The receiver plugs in the wall and you plug in a lamp and/or turn on the chime.

So alarm goes off, door of box opens. Marbles spill. You go downstairs and see who is picking up the marbles.

How to load the marbles:
Use a piece of file folder paper. Fold on one side on the non-hinge side.
Fold a little at the bottom so, marbles fall onto the ledge.
Close door partially and insert marbles. Pull cardboard out.

How did we get from smokeless grill to marbles? Only here at AMHD!

Anyone missing any marbles? Kiss is using them.

Kiss, I did not know you had a mischievous streak. I like to be a bit more proactive by making certain surfaces live, but cleaning up the dead bodies got to be a bit problematic. But one thing is clear, they only screw with something once.

Meriden, the National Grid (http://www.nationalgridus.com/) is a utility company that manages the transmission of power in some New England states, and New York, and has no jurisdiction over building wiring.

If you review their requirements (https://www.nationalgridus.com/non_html/shared_construction_greenbk.pdf), they refer to on page 24 to the authority having jurisdiction, with installation and/or connection of the electric service to a building, and approval from the municipal authorities enforcing the Code, and that's it.

The State you reside in legislates licensing of tradesmen, and who is allowed to do what. In most states, only owners of single family homes that reside in that home are allowed to do their own electrical work. Any electrical work done in a multifamily dwelling must be done by a licensed electrician.

If your user name means that you live in Meriden, Connecticut, I assure you, this is the case, as I am a certified electrical inspector by the Ct Dept of Public Safety.

While Don makes some good common sense points about who can have what connected to which meter, I doubt he can find anything in the NEC about this. The only reference to occupants is NEC Section 240.24 (B), that states that occupants shall have ready access to their fuses/circuit breakers, with exceptions to large facilities with on site management.

BTW, NEC stands for National Electric Code, which each state adopts into law, and usually modifies with minor but significant changes to suit their needs.

How common usage loads are metered can be dictated by state or even local city housing codes, and/or agreements between owners and tenants.

If your in Ct, then I assure you the landlord has no right doing electrical work.

Otherwise check with your state's building, code enforcement, professional licensing, or consumer protection department. They should be able to direct you to the entity that governs rental apartments and common areas.

So. Looks like you have more issues than just wondering how the breaker for your smokeless grill is getting turned off.

Mischevios streak: Naah

Just when a couple of girls decided to put a padllock on my locker back in high school. I went into the machine shop and fabricated a key (knew that lock inside and out) and placed it on their locker. Our lockers had combination dials integral to the doors. Unbeknownst to me the key was now locked inside. One of the best laughs I ever had.

Now, with that same lock, I provided friends the means to open and switch similar locks placed on lockers, so one day someone's key didn't work anymore.

Safecracking, another skill I learned on my own in high school. It takes me about 20 minutes to open a simple (left-right-left) combination lock or safe. Started messing with safes and combo locks in grade school. Opened them too. It was just one of those things to do when you had lots of time on your hands and computers didn't exist. I opened one for a millionaire's mother. They couldn't find anyone else.

BTW: The marble thing I learned somewhere. You host a party and you fll the medicine cabinet with marbles. Nosy people look in the medicine cabinet. You find the nosy ones by loading the medicine cabinet with marbles.

If you have random breakers tripping, then there is a problem and a qualified person needs to service the apartment's electrical services.

NEC stands for the National Electrical Code. It is the standard rule book (so to speak) for electrical services.

Your local community can have "overrides" to the NEC code .

By NEC definition, common services for an apartment complex cannot be put on a tenants meter. It is the responsibility of the Landlord to provide a separate meter for electrical services of common areas.

I wish I were home where I have my reference books but I'm not. I'll be home either this evening or early tomorrow. I'll get the cites from the NEC code for you then.

Right now, the toy people that I'm baby-sitting for are napping which proves once again that there is a God!

mischevios streak: Naah

Just when a couple of girls decided to put a padllock on my locker back in high school. I went into the machine shop and fabricated a key (knew that lock inside and out) and placed it on their locker. Our lockers had combination dials integral to the doors. Unbeknownst to me the key was now locked inside. One of the best laughs I ever had.

Now, with that same lock, I provided friends the means to open and switch similar locks placed on lockers, so one day someone's key didn't work anymore.

Safecracking, another skill I learned on my own in high school. It takes me about 20 minutes to open a simple (left-right-left) combination lock or safe. Started messing with safes and combo locks in grade school. Opened them too. It was just one of those things to do when you had lots of time on your hands and computers didn't exist. I opened one for a a millionaire's mother. They couldn't find anyone else.

BTW: The marble thing I learned somewhere. You host a party and you fll the medicine cabinet with marbles. Nosy people look in the medicine cabinet. You find the nosy ones by loading the medicine cabinet with marbles.


Don't go to parties at your house!! That's a riot. :eek:

With respect to serving common areas of multi-family residences.

2008 NEC #210.25 (A) & (B):

"(A) Dwelling unit Branch Circuits. Branch circuits in each dwelling unit shall supply only loads within that dwelling unit or loads associated only with that dwelling unit.

(B) Common Area Branch Circuits. Branch circuits required for the purpose of lighting, central alarm, signal communications, or other needs for public or common areas of a two-family dwelling, a multi-family dwelling or a multi-occupancy building shall not be supplied from equipment that supplies an individual dwelling unit or tenant space."

I cannot find documentation supporting the need for a licensed electrician doing the work so I believe that that requirement was put forward by one of the Virginia Beach Electrical Inspectors. I just can't prove it.

With respect to serving common areas of multi-family residences.

2008 NEC #210.25 (A) & (B):

"(A) Dwelling unit Branch Circuits. Branch circuits in each dwelling unit shall supply only loads within that dwelling unit or loads associated only with that dwelling unit.

(B) Common Area Branch Circuits. Branch circuits required for the purpose of lighting, central alarm, signal communications, or other needs for public or common areas of a two-family dwelling, a multi-family dwelling or a multi-occupancy building shall not be supplied from equipment that supplies an individual dwelling unit or tenant space."


Well done Don.

Glad you found the appropriate sections to substantiate your advice.

I probably should not have doubted you this time.

Keep it up.

Mr500:

Don't go to parties with me your liable to be confronted by my friend's boa constrictor happily hanging out around the bathroom mirror above the sink. Yep, it was unexpected.

KISS

How did we get from smokeless grill to marbles? Only here at AMHD!

Anyone missing any marbles? Kiss is using them.

Kiss, I did not know you had a mischievous streak. I like to be a bit more proactive by making certain surfaces live, but cleaning up the dead bodies got to be a bit problematic. But one thing is clear, they only screw with something once.

Meriden, the National Grid (http://www.nationalgridus.com/) is a utility company that manages the transmission of power in some New England states, and New York, and has no jurisdiction over building wiring.

If you review their requirements (https://www.nationalgridus.com/non_html/shared_construction_greenbk.pdf), they refer to on page 24 to the authority having jurisdiction, with installation and/or connection of the electric service to a building, and approval from the municipal authorities enforcing the Code, and that's it.

The State you reside in legislates licensing of tradesmen, and who is allowed to do what. In most states, only owners of single family homes that reside in that home are allowed to do their own electrical work. Any electrical work done in a multifamily dwelling must be done by a licensed electrician.

If your user name means that you live in Meriden, Connecticut, I assure you, this is the case, as I am a certified electrical inspector by the Ct Dept of Public Safety.

While Don makes some good common sense points about who can have what connected to which meter, I doubt he can find anything in the NEC about this. The only reference to occupants is NEC Section 240.24 (B), that states that occupants shall have ready access to their fuses/circuit breakers, with exceptions to large facilities with on site management.

BTW, NEC stands for National Electric Code, which each state adopts into law, and usually modifies with minor but significant changes to suit their needs.

How common usage loads are metered can be dictated by state or even local city housing codes, and/or agreements between owners and tenants.

If your in Ct, then I assure you the landlord has no right doing electrical work.

Otherwise check with your state's building, code enforcement, professional licensing, or consumer protection department. They should be able to direct you to the entity that governs rental apartments and common areas.

So. looks like you have more issues than just wondering how the breaker for your smokeless grill is getting turned off.

Thank you "tkrussell"... Yes, there are many other issues involving my electricity. The investigator found there was shared metering going on: the entire basement, back hall, front porch, back yard light and outside outlet were all on my electric. Because he would not incur any expenses (threatened me he would raise my rent if this happened) he got rid of most of basement lights and backyard light/outlet and the rest went on his niece's electric; which leads me to believe the breaker issue is part of retaliation on her boyfriend's part. I have lived here two years and never had a breaker go once; now all of a sudden, rooms and outlets are off for no reason. I did find out it is not my indoor grill, it uses approx. 10.83 amps. By the way, I live in New York State and Meriden is just the name of my street. Thanks for your imput.

With respect to serving common areas of multi-family residences.

2008 NEC #210.25 (A) & (B):

"(A) Dwelling unit Branch Circuits. Branch circuits in each dwelling unit shall supply only loads within that dwelling unit or loads associated only with that dwelling unit.

(B) Common Area Branch Circuits. Branch circuits required for the purpose of lighting, central alarm, signal communications, or other needs for public or common areas of a two-family dwelling, a multi-family dwelling or a multi-occupancy building shall not be supplied from equipment that supplies an individual dwelling unit or tenant space."

I cannot find documentation supporting the need for a licensed electrician doing the work so I believe that that requirement was put forward by one of the Virginia Beach Electrical Inspectors. I just can't prove it.

Don... thank you for the information. As I told "tkrussell," the shared metering was proved and he has already taken care of the areas in question. The only thing still on my electric is one front hall light and the light above my washer/dryer in basement. National Grid told me they do not mandate that a licensed electrician does the work, just that it is done. My landlord does not want me to have them come back to re-inspect the work; yeah right, in his dreams! After all the breaker issues, I do not trust him. I know nothing about electricity and/or breakers except what I have been told... when they trip, they do not necessarily go all the way off. Mine are completely turned off and after his inspection the other night, he admitted there were no problems with the lines but refuses to admit it is the guy upstairs. I am just glad it is not my indoor grill - I love that thing! Thanks again Don for your imput.

Meriden,

As TK stated earlier, the National Grid is a Utility type service. Utilities are governed by their own rules.

Their jurisdiction ends at the "Service Entry Point" into a residence. From the Service Entry Point throughout the residence it is the Jurisdiction of the NEC Code and the local governing agency having jurisdiction over electrical work in your area.

A simple phone call to your local city, township or county will be able to tell you who has the responsibility to do the work on the complex's electrical systems.

Again, because you are talking about random electrical failures and work being done by a questionably qualified person, you may have a real safety concern.

You can always put a call in to a City Fire Marshall or Fire Inspector and follow their suggestions.

My brother was a Fire Marshall in the West Side of the Bronx, NYC. He always wanted a call before there was a fire and people got hurt of died as a result of the fire.