1993 Honda Civic DX--122,000 miles

Symptoms

Engine cranks but will not start. The “Check Engine Light” (MIL) stays on, along with the oil and battery lights. When the service check connector terminals were jumped, the MIL did not indicate any Diagnostic Trouble Codes. You hear the first click from the main relay's first relay, but not the second and third click from the main relay's second relay. You do not hear the fuel pump run for 2 seconds, as you normally do. Additionally, there is no spark at the plugs.

Work Performed

I replaced the main relay with a new Mitsuba RZ-0159, because of the age of the vehicle and knowing they are problematic. It made no difference. When I jumped the 5th and 7th terminals on the main relay connector, I could hear the fuel pump run.

Using a digital multimeter, all under hood and under dash fuses were determined to be good. The battery is 2 months old and fine. Turning the ignition on and individually disconnecting the 3P connector of the MAP sensor and the Throttle Position (TP) sensor did not cause the MIL to go out.

I disconnected the PGM-FI main relay connector. I checked for continuity between BLK Terminal 2 and body ground. There was continuity. I measured the voltage between YEL/WHT Terminal 1 and body ground (12.52v). Next, I turned the ignition switch on and measured the voltage between BLK/YEL Terminal 5 and body ground (12.52v). Continuity was also fine between GRN/YEL main relay Terminal 8 and ECM A7, A8, individually. The ECM grounding terminal on the thermostat was removed and cleaned, just to be safe.

Since there was no spark, I installed a new ICM (Igniter)—G.P. Sorensen, Part No. 115070; Coil—OEM, TEC, Part No. 30510-PT2-006; and Rotor—Borg Warner, Part No. D712. After installing these parts, there still was no spark. I suspect this model Honda will not spark, if the “Check Engine Light” stays on and there is a power or grounding issue with the ECM. A new Honda distributor housing was installed 20,000 miles ago, therefore I don't suspect bad CKP, CYL, or TDC sensors. I confirmed 12.4v going from the ignition switch to the distributor. Distributor wiring and electrical readings checked out fine.

Conclusion

I suspect the ECM is either not receiving power or there's a control grounding issue involving main relay Terminal 8 (to ECM A7, A8). The ECM controls the second relay, by applying or removing ground to main relay Terminal 8. It's possible the ECM is bad. I request your help in solving this difficult problem. Thanks in advance.

That's a very nice and informative question.

Everything you did makes perfect sense. Also, the problem with CEL staying on is so common on this 5th generation civic, and I heard it so many times, but I never found a solution for it. Try to find a used ECM at a junk yard or something, and put it in. See if that helps.

Also, try to disconnect the battery's negative cable for 10-15 seconds, to clear the ECM from errors. See if CEL will get back on.

Other than those lousy suggestions, I don't have anything better to offer.

I finally solved the problem, after 2-1/2 weeks of working on the car. All of the above symptoms were caused by the ECM. The ECM uses the MAP Sensor (transducer) to control fuel delivery and ignition timing. I turned the ignition on, disconnected the MAP connector, and used my DMM to check the reference and signal voltages (4.94v). Suddenly, when I went to record the readings, the fuel pump started to run. It blew me away! I got the fire extinguisher ready, just in case something weird was about to happen. When I pushed the clutch in and turned the ignition to start, it fired right up and ran beautifully.

It's amazing how vulnerable these cars are. So much for Honda/Japanese reliability. Honda ECMs are much more problematic than most people realize.

CroCivic91, I'm glad you responded. I see you are from Zagreb. My wife served in the Bosnian War in Sarajevo and Zagreb, from 1993 through 1996. She used to wear a Kevlar vest, as she went down "Sniper's Alley" in Sarajevo. She's the only woman in the Air Force to receive the Air Combat Medal, for flying 14 combat missions over Bosnia. She would fly from Rhein-Mein AB, Germany. One of her not so fond memories was doing a "combat" takeoff from Sarajevo, under enemy fire. Gutsy lady.

Yeah, Sarajevo is pretty close to Zagreb. Serbs did a lot of bad things in both my country and in Bosnia. We had a few serbian snipers here in Zagreb too... they were mostly thrown out the window when they were found. I was only 8 when the war started here, but I had my share of fears and bad stories. My girl is from Vukovar, which was devastated by serbs. Her parents took her and her brother with absolutely nothing but what they could all wear at the moment and managed to run out of Vukovar in the last minutes when it was still possible to get out. Ugh... bad memories. Makes me angry...

My hat goes off to your wife... it takes quite some courage to do such things.

Oh, and thanks for sharing your solution with us! :)

Good day
I have the same problem with my PH16 engine non vtec, I think it's the same with D16A6.
By the way I am from the Philippines.
Same symptoms as txgreasemonkey had stated,
I checked pin D19 and D21 and I only get more or less than 2V sometimes 3V.
I suspect that my ECM is bad but sometimes it does work, there are times that I turn the ignition to II and I will hear the click sound from the main relay, the fuel pump will run and goes out after 2 secs, and the CEL will turn off, and the engine will start.

But more often, the same symptoms as above occur. And the engine will not start.

Please tell me what are the signs of a bad ECM, and where does it gets its ground?

I would want to get a used ECM but I doubt how long it will stay fine because it will be the same age as my ECM.

Thanks

The ECM grounds only through G101 on the thermostat housing. Make sure it is perfecto! Cardone remanufactured ECMs are as good as or better than OEM ECMs. Heat and vibration "fries" ECMs over time and water kills them fast.

Don't you mean your engine is the same as the D16Z6 engine?

I have a similar problem, except my check engine light goes on and off normaly, there is spark and fuel, I even tried to read the ECU or ECM error codes it just display a steady Check engine light on test mode, any ideas??


1993 Honda Civic DX--122,000 miles

Symptoms

Engine cranks but will not start. The “Check Engine Light” (MIL) stays on, along with the oil and battery lights. When the service check connector terminals were jumped, the MIL did not indicate any Diagnostic Trouble Codes. You hear the first click from the main relay's first relay, but not the second and third click from the main relay's second relay. You do not hear the fuel pump run for 2 seconds, as you normally do. Additionally, there is no spark at the plugs.

Work Performed

I replaced the main relay with a new Mitsuba RZ-0159, because of the age of the vehicle and knowing they are problematic. It made no difference. When I jumped the 5th and 7th terminals on the main relay connector, I could hear the fuel pump run.

Using a digital multi-meter, all under-hood and under-dash fuses were determined to be good. The battery is 2 months old and fine. Turning the ignition on and individually disconnecting the 3P connector of the MAP sensor and the Throttle Position (TP) sensor did not cause the MIL to go out.

I disconnected the PGM-FI main relay connector. I checked for continuity between BLK Terminal 2 and body ground. There was continuity. I measured the voltage between YEL/WHT Terminal 1 and body ground (12.52v). Next, I turned the ignition switch on and measured the voltage between BLK/YEL Terminal 5 and body ground (12.52v). Continuity was also fine between GRN/YEL main relay Terminal 8 and ECM A7, A8, individually. The ECM grounding terminal on the thermostat was removed and cleaned, just to be safe.

Since there was no spark, I installed a new ICM (Igniter)—G.P. Sorensen, Part No. 115070; Coil—OEM, TEC, Part No. 30510-PT2-006; and Rotor—Borg Warner, Part No. D712. After installing these parts, there still was no spark. I suspect this model Honda will not spark, if the “Check Engine Light” stays on and there is a power or grounding issue with the ECM. A new Honda distributor housing was installed 20,000 miles ago, therefore I don't suspect bad CKP, CYL, or TDC sensors. I confirmed 12.4v going from the ignition switch to the distributor. Distributor wiring and electrical readings checked out fine.

Conclusion

I suspect the ECM is either not receiving power or there's a control grounding issue involving main relay Terminal 8 (to ECM A7, A8). The ECM controls the second relay, by applying or removing ground to main relay Terminal 8. It's possible the ECM is bad, but I understand this is not likely on Hondas. I request your help in solving this difficult problem. Thanks in advance.

As the author of the original posting, your situation seems pretty different to me. Yes, you have a "crank but won't start" situation, but, from there, I don't see the similarities. You have spark and fuel, I had neither.

For starters, disconnect the MAP sensor connector, turn ignition ON, and check for 5 volts going between the reference wire (right) socket (+) and the main ECM ground on the thermostat housing. Let me know what you read.

Some body please help me fast!! I was driving down the dual carriage way in my 1991 crx vtech when it died on me, got it back to my house and checked it over, I have fuel I have spark I have compression timings good but it won't fire!! Please help me.

Answer these 3 basic diagnostic questions for me:

1. When you turn the ignition switch to ON (not START), does the Check Engine Light (CEL) come on and then go off after 2 seconds?

2. When the CEL goes out, do you hear (or feel) the main relay "click"?

3. During the 2 second interval that the CEL is on, do you hear the fuel pump in the gas tank run?

Your answer to each question above:

1.

2.

3.

1.which 1's the cel? Everything happens as it always has done.

2.I will have to go and check the click I never really listened for it

3.yes

CEL should be the yellow light.

Yes it has the little alternater symbol? There's a click when that comes on and when it goes off

What you have told me is that your main relay, fuel pump, and computer are operating normally. Therefore, I would focus on the igniter (most likely) and the coil, both of which are notorious for failing on older Hondas.

Right where do I get a coil from? There's no scrap yards around here that stock hondas. Any good websites?

Where do you live (England)?

Yes chester how did you guess?

Easy.

When you said that your Civic sparks, what did you do to test for that?

I took the spark plugs out and put it next to the body and cranked it over.

Did you have a solid spark?

Yes

It's probably not the igniter or coil, then.

Have you taken a test light or multimeter and checked all under-dash and under-hood fuses?

All the fuses are OK haven't had a light tester or multi meter on it yet. What should it read?

Each fuse has two test points on top. If you have a multimeter, turn the ignition ON, set your meter to DCV, and touch a lead to each test point. You will probably read around 12.5 volts. You are mainly interested in current flowing. Use a multimeter or test light to test under-dash fuses, so as not to replace them in the wrong slot. You're working in a dark and cramped location.

Assuming all fuses check out OK, check your ECM (computer) to see if any codes were thrown. Both of these are crucial steps.

Since you have spark and fuel, something unusual is going on here.

How do I check the codes? My mates on his way round with a tester.

You need to find the Service Check Connector, which should be located about 3 cm from the end of the dash, on the passenger's side. It's a 2P connector, which you jump with a paper clip, and is up under the edge of the dash. The Data Link Connector (3P) and the Service Check Connector (2P) are both housed in a protective rubber mount. Carefully, pry the Service Check Connector free.

Jump the connector, turn the ignition ON, and count the number of long and short flashes, if any, of the Check Engine Light.

See also:

Sticky: Reading error codes on 92-95 Civics (OBD-I Hondas)

Will this work on my honda? Mine is not the del-sol mine is the mk2 cheese wedge shape

I think it should work on "cheese-wedge shaped Civics."

OK I will go and see what happens
How long should this job take?

HA HA that's the easiest way to describe them lol

A couple minutes.

OK well if I'm not back in a few minutes I've blown myself up or its started and I've driven off in excitement.

I did this test on my CIVIC DX 1993 and gives a steady CEL, what does that mean? I ordered a used ECU box from eBay though for $50.

latreche34, the CEL staying on means you have a problem with the main relay, ignition switch, ECM, or a fuse. Your Civic won't start, as long as it stays on.

latreche34, the CEL staying on means you have a problem with the main relay, ignition switch, ECM, or a fuse. Your Civic won't start, as long as it stays on.
This happens only when I jump the OEM pins, otherwise I have no CEL at normal operation, it comes on and goes off, a brand new main relay have been already installed before I do the reading codes procedure, all fuses are good as well as the ign switch, I'll post again when I get the ECU in the mail.

Hi txgreasemonkey its me again. I didn't blow myself up or drive away. Just to let you know. I had someone come out with a fault finder, it cost me £40 to plug it in say there was nothing wrong with it and start it 1st time, its not fair. Anyway the next day it did the same thing to me and I found out all it was, was the rotor arm in the dizzy cap wasn't tight and wasn't spinning. But now it won't rev over 35000revs. It is flashing error code 4 what do I need to get it running properly? Please help because you helped a lot last time cheers.

Glad to hear you're still alive. Code 4 indicates a problem with the Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor circuit. With the ignition switch OFF, disconnect the 8P connector from the TDC/CKP/CYP sensor. Measure resistance between sensor terminals B and F. Check for 350 to 700 ohms. If you don't get readings within these parameters, replace the distributor housing. Here's how to locate terminals B and F:

ABCD
EFGH

View connector's male pins, with the latch on top.


Honda distributors are notorious for having to be replaced around 150,000 kilometers. Normally, the sealed bearings wears out and it sounds like a thrashing machine. When this happens, many of the inside sensors can be destroyed. If you end up having to replace the distributor, buy a new housing from Honda for around $125 and use the ICM and coil from your old unit. I had to do this on my 1993 Civic DX 4 years ago--no big deal.

Hi txgreasemonkey , I'm the guy with CIVIC DX 1993, I got the ECU today I replaced it, no changes the same thing crank won't start, I checked also the voltage on the MAP sensor and it's 4.99V, just to remind you I have spark, gas, checked most of the connectors voltage according to Hayens repair manual and all tests pass, note that it's been checked by two professional mechanics and they just gave up and I will do so soon, but before that I'm going to check the last two sensors nock and crankshaft positioning sensors, can you tel me where they are located exactly? They are not mentioned in hayens manual.

Crankshaft Position (CKP) Sensor and TDC Sensor are inside the distributor and totally inaccessible. Perform tests on outside 8P connector. If they test bad, best bet is to buy a new distributor housing from Honda ($125) and reuse your igniter and coil. Don't give up and get rid of your Civic. This crisis will pass and you will learn a lot from it. Remember, these cars will run 350,000 miles, if you take care of them.

CKP Test (Crankshaft Position), Code 4:
Test for 350-700 ohms on the 8P distributor connector between sensor terminals B and F.

TDC Test (Top Dead Center), Code 8:
Test for 350-700 ohms on the 8P distributor connector between sensor terminals C and G.

CYP Test (Cylinder Position), Code 9:
Test for 350-700 ohms on the 8P distributor connector between sensor terminals D and H.

View of 8P male connector, with clasp ([]) on top:

[]
ABCD
EFGH

Can you hear your fuel pump run?

Can you hear your fuel pump run?
Yes it runs for few seconds after turning on the ignition key, I demonstrated that by removing the fuel rail bolt and I saw the fuel coming out of the rail with pressure. I didn't mesure it though.

Good to hear the fuel pump does run. Did you test the various distributor sensors?

Have you checked for any codes, since you installed the new ECM? Reset the ECM and try cranking the starter for 20 seconds to see if it throws a code. This may help you zero-in on where the problem lies. This is starting to get into the obscure, since you have fuel and spark.

Ok I bought a complete brand new distributor from eBay I got a deal on it, just $120 include. Shipping, as soon as I get it I'll post the results, thanks

Awesome price. Did that include igniter and coil? What did the distributor sensor tests reveal about your old distributor?

My 93 honda civic dose not start. When it was parked 1 month ago it was running fine. Went to start it but it turns over but won't start

Answer these 3 basic diagnostic questions for me, in a 1-2-3 format:

1. When you turn the ignition switch to ON (not START), does the Check Engine Light (CEL) come on and then go off after 2 seconds?

2. When the CEL goes out, do you hear (or feel) the main relay "click"?

3. During the 2 second interval that the CEL is on, do you hear the fuel pump in the gas tank run?

Awesome price. Did that include igniter and coil? What did the distributor sensor tests reveal about your old distributor?
Here (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=012&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&viewitem=&item=220052873520&rd=1,1) it is it looks like it has everything in it:

All I can say is WOW! That's one of the best deals I've ever seen. Did your old distributor fail the sensor tests? Your Civic should run now.

All I can say is WOW! That's one of the best deals I've ever seen. Did your old distributor fail the sensor tests? Your Civic should run now.

I think I no longer need to do tests on the old one, I just wait for the new one and see what I can do, hopfully it's going to run like you said.

Gents,

I have a very similar problem on a 2000 1.6 VTEC DOHC Civic.

The car was being driven on a hill, and then it cut out and has not started since.

There is fuel, compression, spark and the engine management light is going out as normal, and the car has been hooked up to OBDII and there are no error codes.

The entire distributor unit has been replaced out of caution and it is still no different. Spark plugs have also been changed and there is a very strong spark when cranking.

So : Engine management light is going out, fuel pump is running and stops when the main relay clicks and the EML goes out.

What can I do gents as I am at a total loss!

I would check the main relay and various sensors, particularly the MAP sensor, CYL, CKP, and TDC. After the distributor was replaced, was the timing checked? Test the health of your ECM, by checking for 5 volts between the MAP Sensor connector's reference wire (+) and ground.

Got the distributor, installed it unfortunately it didn't help the car still won't start, the last thing I'm going to do is replace the map sensor and the knock sensor if the problem persists I will have to just sell it as is. Note that I have replaced the main relay, the ECU, the spark plugs and the distributor.

Don't give up, "Dawn is Coming." Hang in there! Never, never give up.!

I know you have said you have spark and fuel. However, have you checked fuel pressure? Your fuel pump may be turning but its pressure might be weak or your fuel filter might be old and restricting pressure and flow to the fuel rail. Have you checked the injectors? With ignition OFF, disconnect the 2P connector from each injector and measure resistance between the 2 terminals of the injector. It should be 10-13 ohms. Turn ignition switch ON. Measure voltage between YEL/BLK (+) terminal in the 2P connector and body ground. Is there battery voltage? If no, repair open in the YEL/BLK wire between fuel injector and the main relay. If yes, reconnect the 2P connector to the injector.

How many miles are on your Civic? Have you checked each cylinder's compression? Because you have spark and because MAP sensors are expensive, I wouldn't replace this item now. You must be getting very close to getting it to run.

Hi there tx, my '93 Honda Civic DX is not starting as well. Unfortunately I am about 2,500 miles away from my tools. I have already read through this thread and gone to my car to check things out. I don't have a multimeter or a spark plug socket (not sure if I need one of those). I have a few questions for you, but first I will start by answering your questions.


Answer these 3 basic diagnostic questions for me, in a 1-2-3 format:
1. When you turn the ignition switch to ON (not START), does the Check Engine Light (CEL) come on and then go off after 2 seconds?
Yes. I did the Service Check Indicator and when it was jumped the CEL came on and stayed on steady, no flashing at all. Is that a code? What does it mean?


2. When the CEL goes out, do you hear (or feel) the main relay "click"?I hear a click, I think it is the relay but it may be the sound of the light going off? I don't know that much.


3. During the 2 second interval that the CEL is on, do you hear the fuel pump in the gas tank run?
no.


I had a friend check the fuel pump and he says that fuel is indeed getting to the engine. I changed the distributer cap and the rotory button and when I reconnected the negative battery cable after that I heard the fuel pump run.

My Chilton manual doesn't say anything about a Manifold Absolute Pressure Sensor, what is this and where do I find it in case I need to disconnect it like you had to.

The car died while at a red light, it will not start again, I am thinking that this shouldn't be the spark plugs or the wires because they wouldn't all go out at once right? One at a time seems much more likely and there was no indication that one cylinder was not firing.

Lastly, I am considering just getting a new distributer since I can't figure out what else to do. I don't necessarily have the funds to blow on that and then have other things to fix afterwards. You said something about the igniter, is this a normal piece of the distributer, in such that when I buy a new distributer I will have a new igniter as well.

Do you have any suggestions or information that could help me and maybe even save me the money? I have a few friends down here, and one of them may be able to let me borrow a multimeter, but it will be days before that happens. My car is 20 minutes from the house I am staying at so it is a slow process of working on it, only when I have time and can get a ride.

Sorry, that was a lot of questions. Hope I have enough info for you.

Barbara

If you follow the procedure described in the FAQ section, it should help you get your Civic running again:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/automotive-repair-maintenance-troubleshooting-frequently-asked-questions-46563.html#post219451

I would focus on the igniter and coil. Autozone and O'Reilly Auto will test these for free. If you want to install an inexpensive distributor, with all new everything, look on EBay. They're available for around $110. Also, make sure to install new NGK plugs in your Civic. Go through the new FAQ section and see if it doesn't help you troubleshoot what's wrong.

I did answer the questions, and then I added the part about the service check connector. It turns off after 2 seconds, unless I jump the connector then it stays steady.

TX, or anyone who will help me. I have read through the FAQ section and find that my fuel pump is indeed pumping fuel to the engine (though I can't hear the pumping there is fuel getting to the engine) and the relay is working, but it is still not igniting. I would like to check the ECM and or the MAP but my Chilton Manual does not mention either of these items. I need to know where they are, can someone please tell me where to find them and what they look like. I have the FAQ printed up, but they do not tell me where to find these items in order to do the K-Test.
One other question that seems stupid to ask. When turning the ignition "ON not Start" is that 1 click or 2? My ignition has l and ll. Is 2 clicks correct? 1 click has no lights coming on.
Thank you to anyone who is willing to help me.

Turn the ignition key to II. The MAP Sensor is in the middle of the firewall, right on top. It has a 3-P connector going to it. Very easy access. It has a vacuum hose coming out of the bottom of the sensor, which is about 1.5"x1"x1".

You should definitely be able to hear the fuel pump in the gas tank run, when the ignition switch is turned to II. Roll down your window, if necessary. If you still don't hear it, jump terminals 5 and 7, to the main relay's connector, and then turn the ignition switch to II. You should definitely hear it run now. If you hear it now for the first time, replace the main relay. It's best to run the K-Test before getting involved with the main relay. It's so simple and important, so why not?

Read Section N to the FAQ Table of Contents.

Thank you, I will try that.

Hi I'm the one who was about to give up after replaced ECM, distributor, main relay, spark plugs the total is about $250 plus $90 two police tickets for long period parking, this morning I was going to list it for sale as is, but I decided to give it the last try I jump start it to my second car and kept cranking and cranking and cranking until it started it was rough in the beginning and then the engine starts to pick up speed, what a miracle, now it's running just like before, one of the cylinders is just 50psi but the engine works I don't care, no I got to clean it up and sell it at the actual condition. What do you think txgreasemonkey were they the injectors?

I don't really know--it's likely a combination of a number of things you did. Good news, anyhow.

My 92' DX today decided to stop priming its fuel pump. I normally always start the car with a pause at the ON position. So I knew when I didn't hear my fuel pump; there was no point in starting.

So for the rest of the day I probably tried 20 times turning the ignition to the ON position, and of those tries the fuel pump primed for 3 of them. The first time it primed was after dissconnecting and connecting the fuel pump connector, I thought it was fixed after that, but I think now it was pure coincidence that it happened. The second time, it decided to prime, but I hadn't touched anything; the car started but then died. The third time it primed, I started the car with no problems. Then I turned the car off and tried to ON position, no prime, CEL goes off after 2 secs... I hear a click, but the CEL comes back on. This occurred the next 2-3 tries, and then it went to a solid CEL that doesn't go off. During the day, most of the tries it was a solid CEL; with a few times the CEL went off, not sure about the click.

My car came with these poorly cut keys, it takes me forever to turn the ignition.. I'm wondering if this has anything to do with it. Can a bad key break the ignition switch? Its hard to answer your three questions since my problem seems to be intermittent?

I had an extra ECU at hand to try, but it didn't make any difference.

My cars been a storage car for 6months probably; it had no problems starting throughout that time... the last time I started it with no problems before today's occurrence was only 5 days ago.

Im really frustrated as to why this has SUDDENLy occured; and the only thing I can think of is during the last few days, is the weather, its been cold at night and warm during the day; my car fogs up in the inside so moisture is was forming.

Read sections A and B in the linke below:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-honda-civics-46563.html


Run the K-Test first. Then, try replacing the main relay. Keep me posted.

Yea I've read those already.

I forgot to add that, my is parked outside, after the post I made, I went outside to give II position a try again, it was around 1-2'C; the fuel pump primed... Did it again and the pump primed again..

Today in the afternoon I tried, same problem, no prime...

This evening again with near freezing temps, tried II position twice and it primed both times..

I wonder if its to do with what's in my gas tank... (the needles just above empty) moisture is developing in the day because its warmer.. maybe 7C?

I finally solved the problem, after 2-1/2 weeks of working on the car. All of the above symptoms were caused by the Manifold Absolute Pressure (MAP) Sensor. The ECM uses the MAP Sensor (transducer) to control fuel delivery and ignition timing. I turned the ignition on, disconnected the MAP connector, and used my DMM to check the reference and signal voltages (4.94v). Suddenly, when I went to record the readings, the fuel pump started to run. It blew me away! I got the fire extinguisher ready, just in case something weird was about to happen. When I pushed the clutch in and turned the ignition to start, it fired right up and ran beautifully. Therefore, the "Key Step" is to wait several minutes after you disconnect a sensor wire to see if the "Check Engine Light" goes out.

It's scary how vulnerable our cars are today. So much for Honda/Japanese reliability. As far as I'm concerned, this is poor engineering because MAP sensor failure is catastrophic--you lose both your ignition and fuel system. Failure to properly diagnose a faulty MAP sensor can easily lead you down a path that causes you to replace your main relay, ICM, coil, distributor, and ECM. This is the "Achilles Heel" of Honda Civics from this generation. Shame on Honda for not designing a more fault-tolerant system. A new MAP sensor from Honda, which is about 1" x 1" x 1-1/2", costs around $350.

CroCivic91, I'm glad you responded. I see you are from Zagreb. My wife served in the Bosnian War in Sarajevo and Zagreb, from 1993 through 1996. She used to wear a Kevlar vest, as she went down "Sniper's Alley" in Sarajevo. She's the only woman in the Air Force to receive the Air Combat Medal, for flying 14 combat missions over Bosnia. She would fly from Rhein-Mein AB, Germany. One of her not so fond memories was doing a "combat" takeoff from Sarajevo, under enemy fire. Gutsy lady.
I had the same problem. I was installing a stock air filter for my b16a engine and I accidentally unplugged one of the hoses that go to the MAP sensor. The thing was it was sputtering and I couldn't figure out the problem, after a day of sputtering the engine now didn't start. It would turn over but it wouldn't start. So I finally found out it was the map sensor and I plugged the hose in, and reset the ecm, but the car still won't start. I think I had the hose off to the map sensor too long and I don't know if its not getting fuel or not. So now that I have the MAP sensor on the car still won't start, do I have to unplug the MAP sensor and plug it back in?

daredeezy619, read sections A and B in the link below:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-honda-civics-46563.html

Hopefully, it will help you solve your problem.

Hi there, I came across this post looking for a fix to the same problem, I've tried just about everything mentioned in the last 7 pages with no luck.

Here's the situation:
Engine is a d16z6, ecu is p28.
Engine cranks but will not start, plugs are getting NO spark.
When I turn the key to "on" the check engine light comes on, and stays on, as well as the oil and battery lights.
I tried measuring the voltage between the right wire in the map señor and ground, its getting 8volts, which I see is far above what it should be getting. The other two wires in the map plug have 8 volts as well - Im sure this isn't good.
I don't hear ANY clicking of relays and what not - that I know of anyway, though I'm not sure 100% what its supposed to sound like.
One other weird thing to note, the main lights in the cluster (the ones behind the speedo and tach) will not work, but that same cluster works in a friends car, so its not the bulbs.
Also, when I jumper the cel connector, I don't get any codes, the light just stays on like usual.

Parts status:
My ecu is known good - it runs a friends car fine. I'v replaced the main relay, and checked all the underdash fuses, as well as the fuses in the engine bay.

I have really run out of things to do/check. If anyone here has any other suggestions I would be extremely grateful.

Hi. I have a 1993 honda civic si. Now I was driving on the highway when my battery light went on. Fine I know I was having battery issues(low battery, due to alt needing replaced)
So I was on my way to the shop( to replace the Alt) and just then car seemed to have stalled. So while I was still moving I tried to "bomb start" by releasing the clutch. But all that happened was dash lights went extra bright.
Now I towed it to the shop, changed the alt, but now my acg fuse kept on blowing, after 1.5 day's I finally solved that problem(by removeing the condenser plug(a/c)) that solved the acg(s) fuse blowing, but now the Ecu fuse keeps blowing when I switch the key to II.
Ok now at this point the car is bare bones naked I have the wiring harness from inside fully in my lap checking for continuity(second time) I also checked + changed the engine harness, and this problem keeps on happening. Re: ECU(under hood fuse continual breaking)

Things I've changed already:
Alt, ignition switch, under hood fuse box, under dash fuse box, engine harness, orange junction(due to broken wires).
Rear of the car is not connected, engine harness is not connected, starter sol is not connected. Pw mirrors are not connected, only power going to the main relay is from the yellow wire(12.65v).
Opened up the ecu, and there's no burnt smell, nor any evidence of burned board/connection.
Cannot see if the service engine light goes off, but as I remember the light stayed on.
Now also the main relay only clicks if I turn to start position,
Engine turns over, no fuel pump sound no nothing. Grrrrrr. I've been at this for 6 day's so far, no one wants to help me(but I understand)
Is it time that I changed the ecu?
Please help me.

3y3Ba11, my bet is the ECM is bad. Run the K-Test below:

The K-Test: Remove the MAP Sensor connector and turn the ignition switch to ON (not start). Using a multimeter, check for 5 volts going between the MAP Sensor connector's reference wire (+) and ground. As you look at the connector, this is the socket on the right. Really press the black test lead into a cleaned main ECM ground on the thermostat housing. If the voltage is low, it's probably indicating ECM failure. Most failed ECMs will record a fraction of a volt.

If that doesn't pinpoint the problem, run through the diagnostic tests in sections A and B below:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-46563.html#post219451

If the problem is still elusive, run through the tests below:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-46563-4.html#post358044

The ECM fuse keeps blowing, because the ECM is shorting out internally. If the ECM is not working properly, your main relay won't work properly, either. Everything is downhill from there.

I guess that I forgot to mention that "I performed "all those test's"". Sorry.
ok now today I replaced the "ecu"(computer) with a non known working one(lol), but to my surprise the ecu fuse no longer breaks/shorts, but no crank(grrrrrrrr). Maybe just maybe I just forgot to hook up something, or wrong plug in wrong slot (engine harness).
The reason that I didn't change the "puter" was my pro honda friend told me that "it's not the computer that it's 2(or more) wires fused together, but after x3 continuity test + replace engine harness, and with nothing else connected except the ecu, he went to get me an ecu.
Also hmmmmmmm may this ecu's messed up also, because again I can't hear the fuel pump activate when ignition key in II position.
BTW re: ECM- is that also known as ECU/Computer?
Thanks for your great help

Yes.

If the CEL stays on, when the ignition switch is turned to ON (Pos. II), then the problem is with the fuses, ECM, main relay, or ignition switch. Are you certain your main relay is good?

Is there a way to resolder the board of th ecm? I know the main relay you can.

The ECMs on Civics experience leaking capacitors, fried microprocessors, blown resistors, and a host of electron migration problems. I don't know how to troubleshoot and repair them. My recommendation is to buy a remanufactured ECM, with a lifetime warranty.

Whoa now I hooked everything back up and put the dash in, now there's only an SRS light. Nothing else +still won't crank. With the non ecu fuse blowing computer. Grrrrrrrrrr.
Any help please?

Hi me again; now my car started by changing the computer(ECU), I just forgot to put all the fuses back in.
Now it's from an automatic si civic, and the cel stays on , and give error code 19.
Is that only because my car is 5speed, and the ecu' from an auto?

That's a likely possibility.

Hello,
I am having a similar problem with my 1992 Honda Civic EX 4 Door with a 1.6L engine and manual transmission. This link has been extremely helpful in troubleshooting' this issue.

Symptoms:
1. Intermittently will not start -- no fuel, no spark
a. CEL stays on
b. Main Relay does not click
c. Fuel pump does not cycle
d. When the car does start a,b, and c are not true.

Testing:
1. K-Test
a. When CEL remains lit, no relay, no fuel pump cycle
- No / minimal voltage to MAP sensor
b. When CEL does not remain lit and the relay clicks' and fuel pump cycles
- 4.96 Volts to MAP sensor
2. Main Relay
a. passes all tests per Chilton's manual (x2) using car's battery direct as source
3. K-Test Verification
a. When CEL remains lit, no relay, no fuel pump cycle
- removed the connector for the "D" harness from the ECU/ECM
- turned key to "on" position
- looking straight on at the ECU/ECM socket measured the voltage on pins 19 (+) and 21 (-) or the 8th and 10th pin from the right on the bottom row of pins, measure no / minimal voltage.
b. When CEL does not remain lit and the relay clicks' and fuel pump cycles
- Same results as a. -- no / minimal voltage between pins 19 and 21

Observation:
1. looking at wiring harness for the "D" connector, there is not an actual wire in what would be pin 19.

Question:
1. Is my testing procedure correct
a. should I purchase the "test connector that provides in line test points for these pin positions
b. Am I counting the Pins correctly
2. Are the correct test positions on the 1992 honda pins 19 and 21 or are they different for this model year.
a. I have looked for connector info in my Chilton's manual but have not been able to find it.

1993 honda civic dx--122,000 miles

symptoms

engine cranks but will not start. The “check engine light” (mil) stays on, along with the oil and battery lights. When the service check connector terminals were jumped, the mil did not indicate any diagnostic trouble codes. You hear the first click from the main relay’s first relay, but not the second and third click from the main relay’s second relay. You do not hear the fuel pump run for 2 seconds, as you normally do. Additionally, there is no spark at the plugs.

work performed

i replaced the main relay with a new mitsuba rz-0159, because of the age of the vehicle and knowing they are problematic. It made no difference. When i jumped the 5th and 7th terminals on the main relay connector, i could hear the fuel pump run.

Using a digital multi-meter, all under-hood and under-dash fuses were determined to be good. The battery is 2 months old and fine. Turning the ignition on and individually disconnecting the 3p connector of the map sensor and the throttle position (tp) sensor did not cause the mil to go out.

I disconnected the pgm-fi main relay connector. I checked for continuity between blk terminal 2 and body ground. There was continuity. I measured the voltage between yel/wht terminal 1 and body ground (12.52v). Next, i turned the ignition switch on and measured the voltage between blk/yel terminal 5 and body ground (12.52v). Continuity was also fine between grn/yel main relay terminal 8 and ecm a7, a8, individually. The ecm grounding terminal on the thermostat was removed and cleaned, just to be safe.

Since there was no spark, i installed a new icm (igniter)—g.p. Sorensen, part no. 115070; coil—oem, tec, part no. 30510-pt2-006; and rotor—borg warner, part no. D712. After installing these parts, there still was no spark. I suspect this model honda will not spark, if the “check engine light” stays on and there is a power or grounding issue with the ecm. A new honda distributor housing was installed 20,000 miles ago, therefore i don’t suspect bad ckp, cyl, or tdc sensors. I confirmed 12.4v going from the ignition switch to the distributor. Distributor wiring and electrical readings checked out fine.

conclusion

i suspect the ecm is either not receiving power or there’s a control grounding issue involving main relay terminal 8 (to ecm a7, a8). The ecm controls the second relay, by applying or removing ground to main relay terminal 8. It’s possible the ecm is bad, but i understand this is not likely on hondas. I request your help in solving this difficult problem. Thanks in advance.

Hello everyone I have the same prob and did everything that was said here and still no spark or any fuel...
What could it be?

I neede to know if anything I need to check besides ecu,main relay,new distributor, all fuses changed, new plugs, plug wires, cap and rotor, all relays changed that have to do with car...
Still nothing
Should I just burn it and call it a day...
God please help me!!

LSVTECAL, does your Check Engine Light stay on, when you turn the ignition switch to ON (Position II)? If so, perform the K-Test on the ECM:

The K-Test: Remove the MAP Sensor connector and turn the ignition switch to ON (not start). Using a multimeter, check for 5 volts going between the MAP Sensor connector's reference wire (+) and ground. As you look at the connector, this is the socket on the right. Really press the black test lead into a cleaned main ECM ground on the thermostat housing. If the voltage is low, it's probably indicating ECM failure. Most failed ECMs will record a fraction of a volt. To me, the K-Test is simple, elegant, and accurate.

You really should start your own posting, by clicking the button "Ask About Cars & Trucks." If you do that, I'll be able get your car running shortly and your prayer will be answered.

1993 honda civic dx hatchback.car will not start!
I changed main relay
Fuelpump
Distributor
Ecu
And still won't start
Don't know
And sinking fast
Don't know what else to put in it
Please help
Now the fuel pump kicks on but no spark

Please start a new thread!

Test all underhood and underdash fuses with a test light or multimeter:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-selected-other-vehicles-46563-3.html#post252145

Even though you replaced fuses, this will test for "power through the fuse."

Does the Check Engine Light come on for 2 seconds and then go out, when the ignition switch is turned to ON (Position II)?

94 honda civic fuel pump doesn't come on when you turn on the key

This should help:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-selected-other-vehicles-46563-7.html#post1245523

This should help:

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/cars-trucks/faq-how-troubleshoot-repair-maintain-hondas-selected-other-vehicles-46563-7.html#post1245523

Hello TXGM,

I have read (and hard-copied) many of your posts re automotive
Repair/troubleshoot procedures. I have a question re the
Original distributors in the 90s Honda Civics.

I have a 96 Honda Civic DX w/ original dizzy and 81K mi.
From what I can gather, these dizzys tend to have issues
Beginning at anywhere from 90K to 120K mi.

Question: Is the dizzy currently available from the Honda
Dealer (the TEC model 30100-P2E-A02) subject to the same
Problems as the original dizzy? Has its design been
Improved over the last decade+? Would a non-Honda aftrmarket
Part be better?

Thanks.

MVC

madvladcivic, it's still the same storry. They suffer from the same limitations; i.e. lack of splash lubrication (sealed bearings only last so long) and intense heat that fries the ICM and coil. Again, I would only buy a genuine Honda distributor housing, where it's fine to install an aftermarket ICM and coil. Everything else is suspect and will let you down at an inopportune time.

madvladcivic, it's still the same storry. They suffer from the same limitations; i.e., lack of splash lubrication (sealed bearings only last so long) and intense heat that fries the ICM and coil. Again, I would only buy a genuine Honda distributor housing, where it's fine to install an aftermarket ICM and coil. Everything else is suspect and will let you down at an inopportune time.

Hello TXGM,

Thank you for the very speedy reply!

The reason I asked is because a poster at HondaHookup described
An issue he had w/ his dizzy. In a 96 Civic DX no less. His original
Dizzy fried at 110K mi and he bought a "new" dizzy at a salvage yard.
It fried in a week. Now, he has installed an aftermarket part.
I am aware of the dizzy issues esp wrt/ the ICM and coil. His
Problem was new to me: the heat-induced compromise of the
Plastic encasement of the tdc/cyp/ckp sensor. This happened in
BOTH the aforementioned Honda dizzys.

Honda replaced my rotor, dizzy cap, plugs and wires in Nov '09
Under an extended emission warranty recall. I am simply
Preparing for the inevitable.

Basically, the compromise of the tdc/cyp/ckp sensor casing
Renders the dizzy housing unusable. Even if the ICM and coil
Are still functional.

Thank you.

MVC

Yes, melted internal sensors happen, just not that frequently.

1993 Civic DX Won't Start

Does the CEL stay on, when the ignition switch is turned to ON (Position II)?

Answer these 3 basic diagnostic questions for me:

1. When you turn the ignition switch to ON (not START), does the Check Engine Light (CEL) come on and then go off after 2 seconds?.

2. When the CEL goes out, do you hear (or feel) the main relay "click"?,

3. During the 2 second interval that the CEL is on, do you hear the fuel pump in the gas tank run?

Your answer to each question above:

1.Yes .. But sometimes light won't go off

2.normally when it starts id hear the relay click but does click when it won't start.

3. Not sure

The remanufactured ECM I installed 15 years ago has now failed. Since it came with a lifetime warranty from O’Reilly Auto Parts, I installed another remanufactured ECM. The K-Test identified the ECM as the problem. The 1993 Civic is back on the road earning its keep.