I have a problem with men looking at other women while in a relationship, fantasizing about other women, etc. I have made peace with the fact that I have a problem accepting a man who does these things. The problem is, I want him to be honest with me, because I feel I have a right to know what I am getting into. I mean, if it’s a deal breaker for me, then petty or not, I should be able to decide that. I want the truth without alienating him. The problem, apparently (no offense to men) is most if not all men do it. So, if it’s a deal breaker for me, I am pretty much screwed. So then, I have to ask myself, how can I get past this? How can I accept this?

Truthfully I can’t. Here is why:

I don’t look or fantasize about other people, when he does it makes me lose respect and my sex appeal toward him diminishes thus our sex life is likely to be worse and so does the overall situation. Nothing is sexier then knowing the person you are with desires you not other people.

I am not single, so why would I shop? If I needed a TV and bought one then I don’t bother shopping for anymore TV’s. To me it’s just a gateway of possibilities.

That is offensive to me because that’s like saying that he feels this is the best he can do with his self esteem and is settling but is not satisfied, I feel if he were, then no matter good looking another women is I would have his attention. She would be just another person to him, not an attractive person per se.

I want the truth, but the truth does cause these problems. So, I do alienate him even against my own wishes. If I live in denial and don’t ask I will be way worse off. I would actually be paranoid. It’s a no win situation for me.

I hear men and women say “its normal” yet I don’t do it. They say “unless he acts on it you shouldn’t care” but to me after the offense it’s like you might as well have, in fact I would almost prefer a man to cheat then look as odd as that may sound. It may remind him how foolish he is and he would stop hurting me for his own selfish purposes.

He says if I stared at some guy or was looking it wouldn’t bother him. That pisses me off more. It’s like I am bazaar for not understanding this crude offense.

I am not a prude, I am freaky, but I don’t like to feel badly about myself. In fact, I am more apt to become less sexually open once I feel I am not adequate. I have even tried harder when I think he was into someone else, and it does not stop it, so I have on incentive. If anything, I get angry because I feel like I am doing all the trying. After all, if there is something he wants, why shouldn’t he express that himself?

No matter good I look, it won't stop him there is always someone better then me.

It's embarrassing to me. Other women see it and look at me like I have failed somehow. Or even think it's funny at my expense. Some women purposely try to get his attention just to get at me. How am I supposed to deal with that? I ignore them, but become resentful towards him for being so oblivious about it.

Sex and anything related to it is deeply emotional for me, while it may not be for men, how can I even value it or continue to want it with him or any man if my feelings are just easily dismissed like this?


I am aware that I am not the best looking person in the world but I refuse to be second best to someone he does not even lay down with. He says it’s not that big of a deal, and while I don’t want to change him, on principle it pisses me off that something that does not matter does not stop happening. If it weren't that big of a deal, I shouldn't have to ask, he should want to keep from hurting me.

Mixed feelings here. In the end, both sides need to be able to come together and have some balance. You need to let him be a living, breathing man, and he needs to respect your feelings on this as best he can.

I have a beautiful, faithful wife who can be a flirt from time to time. So if we are at the bar with a group, and some young buck is buying her drinks and getting beat by her in pool, well OK then. She's having fun. She's getting attention. If he crosses a line, ill go over and introduce myself. If he takes offense, well... then it'll get ugly.

I know what you are saying... and I can't tell you that you are wrong for feeling this way... but unless he is really being a pig about it, you know this is largely a self-esteem issue on your side. Yes, a man should be respectful of his partners feelings. Yes, some men are really, really clueless about how blatent their gawking is.

But... it is a normal reaction for a man, or woman, to notice another of the opposite sex. Its just the truth.

And instead of accepting this and being comfortable, even complimented by the fact that he's true to you, despite he will see other attractive women for the rest of his life, its now turning into a problem.

My wife is going on a 4 day business trip tomorrow. I know a few of the people at the conference were there the last time, when id gone with her, and theyd flirted. She's going to get attention, she's going to even be propositioned, perhaps. I trust in her and I believe all the attention in the world isn't going to make her break her vows.

And I just don't see how her talking to a man she finds attractive is the worst thing in the world. Locks keep honest people out. Vows keep honest people in check from time to time. The best cheaters will do it and you will never know. If his eyes drift for a moment, cut him some slack. He's still with you.

So... again, unless he's being a real pig about it, it sounds like this is a self esteem issue that is now being transferred into the relationship. He isn't cheating. And he didn't become asexual the minute he met you.

Again... I take a different tack. I find a lot of pride and happiness in knowing my partner is looked at by others, and can look at other men she finds attractive, and still be faithful and come home to me. She knows I'm going to see women I find attractive, and still, I sleep only in her bed.

That's a big deal. And not a problem in my mind.

Some will agree with me... others won't.

Thank you for your response. I am trying to be receptive, but I still can't shake it. I mean, I realize it's likely me, but his looking does not help that at all. I didn't assume he'd be asexual, just as I not, yet I don't look. I am to focused on whatever it is I am doing to even notice. I beleve it he were giving me the same attention he once was I wouldn't be so bothered or jealous now. If women were looking at him, that's one thing, but him looking at other women to me still comes off like I am old news. I can even understand flirting because that's a self esteem boster, so long as the most important person in the world is not ignored or it is not done purposely when they are not around or some such to hide it.

We can address the issue of men looking at women independently, but this relationship has a lot of other issues at play here... this from last year...

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/marriage/bi-polar-infertile-husband-gives-up-wife-life-wife-85708.html#post383528

***EDITED***

*** please note her follow-up... her current relationship is with another man, but these issues might still be at play emotionally***

we can address the issue of men looking at women independently, but this relationship has a lot of other issues at play here...

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/marriage/bi-polar-infertile-husband-gives-up-wife-life-wife-85708.html#post383528

This is no longer the same relationship. Given everyone's advice and my need for clarity in my life I have moved on. So, this is someone I am dating. I am currently legally separated.

Thanks for the follow-up and clarification...

You seemed to feel beat up emotionally in that relationship, and I'm guessing some of that is what's at play here... having been in a relationship with a person who was disengaged and having lost that intimacy before. Certainly seems like reason for having issues with trust or self esteem.

IT still has bearing on your self-esteem issues, whether it's the same relationship.

All men look, all that I know of, it has to do with human nature and the way men are wired, they are very visual people who get sexual excietement from the phsycial often.

It if the faithfulness, looking does not mean touching or acting upon it.
To be honest at a concert last night, there was a girl in shorts so short I saw less of my first wife until we were married. I may look, even a slight day dream but that is it.

As for as telling the lady in their life, first a man looks so many times a day, I doubt he could remember most and would less confess them.
It is obvoius you say that it turns you off to know, so you want him to confess, so you can get mad at him, I am sorry but that would be slightly stupid for the man?

If you are looking for a man who will not look, find someone legally blind, that is about the only way it is going to happen.
Looking does not mean he is not the best true person you will ever have.

I don't mean this wrong but you are asking for too much and getting way to worried about it. I would say that there has been issues in your life that is causing these feelings, and perhaps you need to try and deal with your own feelings or you will never find a man you can be happy with

I think you just confirmed everything that bothers me. I just feel very simply, if a man or women can't stop doing something that they know hurts someone they claim to love then selfishness is more important by a long shot. In that case, why would I want to sacrifice for someone who is not willing to do so for me? The fact that you say you the love the women your with but you fantasize about someone else makes me think you would, if you could and not get caught. You don't because your afraid you'll get caught, not because your satisified. Is that not right? If your not satisfied, why do you bother with a relationship? Why not just be a free man?

Ah, forget it. If it's "too much to ask" someone to not do something they claim does not matter, then I would be better off alone I guess.

Well I will be honest and frank, if you demand this in a man, you will be alone. Or find a man who hides it and lies about it ( which is worst)

But no, it does not mean they would if they get the chance, because men get the chance almost everyday of their life if they want to. With people from work, girls they meet and so on.

This is merely human nature and how men are wired.

Seriously, honey... you need to talk to a counselor.

I would think that asking a man not to look, not to "shop" for a new woman is like telling you that you don't NEED new clothes, you have a whole closetful---why can't you just wear THOSE until they wear out?

Even if you like ALL of your clothes, and wouldn't trade them for a shopping spree at Sak's--Does that mean you'd NEVER go window shopping again, just because your man never EVER wants you to look at clothes again? Could you seriously do that?

Or if he told you that he NEVER wanted you to take more than 5 minutes to get ready to go anywhere--including shower--could you, would you want to do that?

The problem is YOUR self-esteem. It's not that a guy looks. All guys look. Hell, I'm female, and married 7 years, and together with my husband for 12 years. I STILL occasionally see a guy that makes my jaw drop and my eyes pop. Not that I would trade my husband for anything (ask anyone, I have the World's Best Husband (TM)), but god, sometimes you just can't help noticing!

If YOU don't EVER notice members of the opposite sex when you're in a relationship, then I'd have to say that something is wrong with you. Either you're not as in touch with your sexuality, or you're deliberately putting on blinders, or you're lying to yourself--I know a TON of happily married people, both male and female, that look when the right "platter", if you will, is placed in front of them.

That doesn't think they'd even DREAM of cheating--it just means that they've noticed someone they're sexually attracted to. Period. End of the line, moving on with the day.

Asking someone to stop drinking because it bothers you AND is a health risk is one thing. Same with smoking, exercising, whatever.

But to ask someone to stop looking at half of the world's population because they happen to be female--you're just crazy.

Please understand we are not attacking you, but all feel you need some help and counseling to help you deal with the issues in your life that makes you feel this way.

Please under stand normally I am very to the "right" on most questions and am close to the most prude member looking at more strict religious veiw points. But I have to agree with the other posters what you are asking for is just not humanly possible.

You want someone who will not look but if they did they have to confess it, knowing it you will go off on them, If you could be open and accepting of their human weakness they may tell you, I even made a joke about that girl last night, told my wife you could tell if she was a real blonde or not by the way she was dressed.

Couples have to admit their faults and love each other regardless of those faults But I will go with the our expert here looking is a normal human behavior, not as often in women as men, but men will have them mind wonder to something sexual many times a hour if not more

But you really really need some help working on your problem, since your goal is not realistic by any means.

We want you to be happy and find happyness with a person who loves you

The fact that you say you the love the women your with but you fantasize about someone else makes me think you would, if you could and not get caught. You don't b/c your afraid you'll get caught, not b/c your satisified.
You and I are on the same planet, different worlds.

I'm in a ten year, monogamous relationship with a loving woman, in an intimate relationship, with open communication.

I don't live my relationship in fear. And please, don't tell me I'm not satisfied.

I have balance in my life and in my love, and it's a great place to be.

I hope you can find the same balance, and know the kind of love I know.

Thanks everyone for your advice. If anything I needed to know if I am crazy or not. I am not offended, because I don’t necessarily want someone to convince me that I am right. From what I understand everyone person in the world is actually this way and I am understanding of the fact that this means I likely can not get along with anyone. This is my problem and no need to torment someone in a relationship with it. There is nothing about hearing how the man I would be with would want to be intimate with someone else that makes me want to even bother trying. I doubt seriously that I could even bother looking that person in the face ever again.

Please don’t misunderstand. I hurt silently. I am not one of this women who yells, throws things or beats her man up over it. I simply ask. Understanding all this makes me realize I’d better off just using my energy for better pursuits. I am very happy to know that everyone else is happy and accepting of this and it hurts them in no way. I can only aspire to such a thing. I am not capable of such I think because that’s just not how my personality is. I just don’t believe that a person is satisfied if they feel this way. Apparently I am wrong but I can’t bridge the cap. I am somewhat resentful to think that I should go to a counselor to “fix me” or merely conform me. It’s just a no win and I am responsible for that.

Its all about self esteme...

Guys look... women look... there is a huge leap between looking and chasing. It has nothing to do with respect if all that happens is a glance.

If they chose to be with you that speaks volumes.

Heck wife even points out the women that stand out to me, she knows what I like and isn't afraid to point them out to me. And believe me she sees them before I do many times.

When you come to understand human nature and know that partners aren't property you can keep on a short leash then you won't need counseling and you will be far happier. And yes this applies to both men and to women.

Looking is one thing... but flirting or chasing is another totally different thing. No harm ever comes from a glance... if that's all the further it goes.

I am somewhat resentful to think that I should go to a counselor to “fix me” or merely conform me. It's just a no win and I am responsible for that.
Having been to a counselor once some years ago to help with depression that was affecting a relationship, I can tell you it sounds like a pain in the arse, and even insulting to be told to go... walking in I hated the idea. Walking out, I was glad I went.

And I'm not a touchy, feely guy. Id rather suck things up and "deal" with them myself. Counseling isn't about converting you to some other person... its about talking to a "neutral" party about what you feel you are struggling with and finding ways to possibly modify your behavior or to find ways to be at peace with your behavior or feelings.

Walking out of a session, I was the same person... just had a few ideas about how to deal with a few things better. So if someone mentions this, it isn't about you being broken... its about helping you get through the noise, such as issues with your marriage, in a manner that can be faster and more effective than just dealing with it yourself.

Like I said... for as much as I like helping people, I hate asking for help... but just a few sessions talking to someone helped me deal with some issues I was struggling with. I was still the same person walking out... just had a different perspective about a few things that helped.

Its not that much different than coming here for advice, except its with professional who can better address any issues you want to talk about.

Thanks. I suppose I have felt like I have compromised on so much in my life that this was one of those thoings I don't feel like I should "have to". I realize it's not helping me. I am not against counseling. I have gone before. I suppose at some point I will have to go again. It is a lot about pride at this point. I have to be able to wrap my head around the idea that I'm working through this, not being conformed in some way. I have a lot of anger. Most of my anger comes from feeling like I have to be the one to do all of the work. I suppose right now I have this bad attitude that someone should fulfill my demands for once, but obivously that's not going to work.

"I hear men and women say “its normal” yet I don't do it."

I don't think that means you're "abnormal". Just "uncommon". I think "common" might be a better way to describe looking at other people, than a loaded word like "normal".

By all means, it would be great for you to work on being more secure and more able to trust (and to be able to weather being hurt some) in relationships... But who knows -there maybe be men out there who don't fantasize or look at other women when they're in a monogamous relationship -but it's just very uncommon if so, so you probably shouldn't /expect/ that... But also know it's okay to have some unusual or quirky preferences for characteristics you'd love to find in a mate -most people do...

Ah, forget it. If it's "too much to ask" someone to not do something they claim does not matter, then I would be better off alone I guess.
Umm.. . that kind reminds me of "your breathing too loud . . stop"
I don't mean to be mean, but you HAVE to get over it!! Maybe what you need is to not get into a relationship until your other one is fully divorced.

I have a lot of anger. Most of my anger comes from feeling like I have to be the one to do all of the work. I suppose right now I have this bad attitude that someone should fulfill my demands for once, but obivously that's not going to work.
I've been there... done the heavy lifting when a previous partner wasn't, so I do empathize. It is no fun at all.

You'll still need balance in the end, with both sides taking the weight... but maybe you are right... maybe you aren't willing to do the work it takes right now...

If it isn't a good fit, you don't need to force it... even if some of the issues are things we call "no big deal".

You get the respect you demand, and sometimes not even that. So... if he isn't enough of a match that you feel like you are working too hard, or you are too distracted with the anger and frustration, maybe it is time to step back.

You have come to this relationship with so much unresolved "baggage" that you are unable to have a real relationship with this guy... you are a controlling person, a very unpleasant quality, not a spontaneous girl enjoying life and men.

Time to go to therapy with a "good" therapist and get all your negative feelings and history out in the open and talk it over. Life is no way perfect, and it never will be!! We do have to know how to live in an imperfect world, though, with the least amount of suffering. :)

I think you will surprise yourself at the amount of progress you can make in dealing with this problem. :):):)

Good Luck in 2008!

You have come to this relationship with so much unresolved "baggage" that you are unable to have a real relationship with this guy.... you are a controlling person, a very unpleasant quality, not a spontaneous girl enjoying life and men.

Time to go to therapy with a "good" therapist and get all your negative feelings and history out in the open and talk it over. Life is no way perfect, and it never will be!!! We do have to know how to live in an imperfect world, though, with the least amount of suffering. :)

I think you will surprise yourself at the amount of progress you can make in dealing with this problem. :):):)

Good Luck in 2008!

I am very spontaneous actually. Again, I am not a prude, but I can't digest that enjoying men means enjoying his appreciation of someone I look nothing like. I appreciate all your perspectives, but to deny that there is some need to protect what's supposed to be yours in a relationship is a bit like denial. I am not an extremist. I don't cover anyone's eye up. I am simply asking what makes it so simple for some people to not care and for others not so much, not an attack on my character. I have a very hard time believing that everyone on here absolutely adores everything about themselves and has no self doubts, that you don't mind it when your mate ogles someone ten times better then you, and that it does anything for your sexuality when they do. Thanks for the well wishes.

Actually, I have a LOT of self-doubts. Ask anyone that knows me personally--I put myself down pretty often. I really do NOT see myself as attractive as people say I am.

That being said--I don't care HOW hot she is, I know I am as good as any woman my husband is looking at.

Know how I know that? I completely trust my husband. I *trust* that when he says I'm beautiful, he means that I really am, at least in his eyes. When he says that I'm sexy, and turn him on--I *trust* that he means it. When I see him looking at a woman that has features I don't, if that makes me depressed, I can express that to him, and he tells me all the things that *I* have that *she* doesn't.

I'm not a skinny young 20 year old anymore. I'm 33, I have gray hairs starting, I'm a size 16, I have stretch marks from a previous pregnancy, I'm short--I'll NEVER be a model, in other words. Hell, I can't even dress stylishly, and I refuse to spend more than 5 minutes doing my hair, and makeup confuses me.

So what?

I have a killer smile. I have intelligence and wit, both more valued by men with decent priorities than good looks are. I'm a good friend, and a good listener, and I have a good sense of humor. I'm willing to drop serious grown up stuff like cleaning and balancing the checkbook to have a snowball fight or a pillow fight or neck on the couch or whatever. I'll never look like that skinny little girl in the half shirt and shorter than short shorts at the mall that my husband got caught looking at last week--but his comment about her when I elbowed him was that he was wondering how anyone would want to go to bed with someone that had NO curves.

So... don't assume that guys are looking at other women and lusting after them. And have some faith that the guy you're with is with YOU for a reason, that there's something about YOU that he values more than looks. You have to TRUST and BELIEVE that there is something incredibly *Better* about you that your guy is with YOU, and not one of those women that is, in your words "ten times better".

The fact that you have so little belief in your OWN qualities is what has us concerned about you. The fact that you don't trust that the guy you're with wants to be with YOU.

How do you know he's not looking at her and thinking that YOUR legs are better,or that YOU have prettier eyes, or that while she has big breasts, YOURS are perkier?

The fact that you don't TRUST your man is a HUGE concern. I know for a fact that while my husband may look and wonder what her breasts look like bare for 20 seconds... but then he starts thinking about MY breasts and wants to go home and play.

So does everyone look? I don't know. I know I don't go out looking for guys to ogle, but every now and then there's a guy that I notice, either because he's dressed so well (or so horribly!) or because of the way he carries himself or because he's so tall or because he has great eyes, or whatever. It's like catching a sunset that just holds you frozen for a second, or seeing a rainbow, or whatever. I'd like to think I notice the beauty in people in general.

That doesn't mean I want to sleep with them!

I've been caught looking at 80 year old men, because they hold themselves so well that age seems to disappear. I've stopped and stared at small children because their very innocence seems to glow, and holds my heart. I've noticed breathtaking women in their prime and felt jealousy, yes, but also awe for their smile, their stride, their confidence. ALL people are beautiful. It's just that our society makes it so that it's not "okay" for men to notice that beauty in other men, or in children, without being labelled perverted.

So is it okay to disrespectfully stare? Of course not. But it's not okay for ANY person to do that to any other person. You don't stare at disabled people, or really beautiful people or really ugly people or really short people, or people with 2 heads. It's rude regardless, both to the person you're staring at and any company you're with.

But not noticing what we we find to be beautiful is just silly, whether that's a woman, a man, a waterfall, a snowdrop after a long winter, lights reflected on water, a newborn baby. And noticing beauty has nothing to do with lusting after it.

Ok, I am old, fat, limp, blind in one eye and those are some of my good qualities, but quess what, I am happy with myself, I can look in the mirror and say I love WHO I am, not any one thing about myself but I am happy with the me I am. So I have a wife other men look at, she is 10 years younger, a previous college cheer leader and a professional musican, men turn to look at her walking down the street, and I say hey great,

Thanks Synnen and Fr_chuck that's a really good take on things. I wish I had half the confidence you have, just not there yet. It's not that I don't trust that he wants to be with me, I suppose I feel that some people want all that they can have, but accept what they get. I hate that. I feel like, people aren't satisfied. That they take what the best is of what if offered to them. I suppose what I am talking about is lust versus observing, one can not prove such a thing. I suppose it's the classic fear of the unknown. I will certianly think on your thoughts for a long time, you have been an inspiration. I have a fear of this blind trust thing, and certainly will need to sort through a lot.


WikiAnswers - Is it normal for your mate to look at other women and then deny looking (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_it_normal_for_your_mate_to_look_at_other_women_ and_then_deny_looking)

Other takes

You think it's possible maybe it's like making fun of yourself, perhaps she is trying to beat you to it?


Its all about self esteme....

Guys look.....women look.....there is a huge leap between looking and chasing. It has nothing to do with respect if all that happens is a glance.

If they chose to be with you that speaks volumes.

Heck wife even points out the women that stand out to me, she knows what I like and isn't affraid to point them out to me. And believe me she sees them before i do many times.

When you come to understand human nature and know that partners aren't property you can keep on a short leash then you won't need councelling and you will be far happier. And yes this applies to both men and to women.

Looking is one thing.......but flirting or chasing is another totally different thing. No harm ever comes from a glance.....if thats all the further it goes.

You think it's possible maybe it's like making fun of yourself, perhaps she is trying to beat you to it?No, Like Synnen has said, she has self confidence and knows I picked her to be with. She knows who I'm going home with. She also knows I don't flirt with other women as well.

Its not all about physical attributes, but the entire package. My wife knows a lot of outstanding beauties are shallow and more than a bit conceited. Something she knows puts me off.

My wife doesn't have big boobs, she isn't tall, but then again she knows I don't dislike any of those attributes. She also knows some of the women I have previously dated and knows why I picked her over them. And yes some of them had physical features my wife wishes she had, like big boobs. Or more of a pronounced hourglass figure than she has.

I've never made fun of her for being short or having small boobs for example. There is no beating me to the punch because its not something I ever joked about.

But then like I said, she does have pretty decent self esteme and knows she can point out an outstanding woman or woman with outstanding features and know I'm not going to sneak off and hit up on that woman.

It's that part that I think is the key to it all. My wife knows me... and trusts me.

Certainly you know her best. I was looking at it from the perspective that if I pointed out something like that to someone, it would be because I don't have those attributes, and feel very badly about it and pointing it out would be my way of being able to give something I can't give. It's sad actually. I mean, I doubt seriously a guy would say "Honey, check out the pecs on that one" you know?

I mean, what your saying is specific to your relationship so I may not understand it, just inquiring so that I could. I am saying, I have known people to do it for that reason. Much like when a person is insecure about something like being overweight, they will often times make fun of it before someone else will because it gives them a sense of control in the situation. I took it like that, "Hey honey check her out" to be something like 'I don't look anything like her and I don't want him to make me feel bad by doing a 180 so if I point it out it's like he's looking because I asked him to" having a sense of control over the situation. I always say things like "she's hot" and he goes on his peaceful way, deep down inside I hate it, the whole situation, but if I complain well, it won't resolve anything. it does make me feel like my feelings don't matter though and that builds resentment.

Everyone keeps bringing up trust and that's not it, I don't have trust issues. I trust that he likes to be comfortable, I trust that it is human nature to stick with what your comfortable with. I trust all of you will go home to the same person every nite, but it does not mean you wouldn't want some one on one time if you could with someone else. FR-Chuck post "To be honest at a concert last night, there was a girl in shorts so short I saw less of my first wife until we were married. I may look, even a slight day dream but that is it."

People might like steak but they may feel they can only afford a burger. In other words, just because he brings themself "home to me every night" is not much of an honor if they are doing it b/c they aren't confident enough to have a steak, per se. I once asked a boyfriend who was gawking at a chic casually why he didn't pursue someone like that if that was what he was into, he had said "because no women who looks like that would want me" that told me that I wasn't as great as they were to him, but that he was comfortable with someone "at my level". So, when everyone points out *trust* I am sure in some cases that is very true, and in others it more about the mate's level of confidence for why they choose to be with their mate, not that they don't wish for more. This is the distinction I am sorting out right now. But having all this discussion is helping me sort through all that.



No, Like Synnen has said, she has self confidence and knows I picked her to be with. She knows who I'm going home with. She also knows I don't flirt with other women as well.

Its not all about physical attributes, but the entire package. My wife knows a lot of outstanding beauties are shallow and more than a bit concieted. Something she knows puts me off.

My wife doesn't have big boobs, she isn't tall, but then again she knows I don't dislike any of those attributes. She also knows some of the women I have previously dated and knows why I picked her over them. And yes some of them had physical features my wife wishes she had, like big boobs. Or more of a pronounced hourglass figure than she has.

I've never made fun of her for being short or having small boobs for example. There is no beating me to the punch because its not something I ever joked about.

But then like I said, she does have pretty decent self esteme and knows she can point out an outstanding woman or woman with outstanding features and know I'm not going to sneak off and hit up on that woman.

Its that part that I think is the key to it all. My wife knows me.....and trusts me.

Would I love to spend one night with Sean Connery or Johnny Depp or John Cusack? Sure--but as well as being eye-candy, those men seem like they'd be incredibly interesting to TALK to.

Look, I don't know your age, but that might be a big part of it. I seem to remember going through some of the feelings you are when I was in my early 20s--wondering why a guy would choose ME, when he could have HER---or wondering if a guy was just settling with me because he didn't think he COULD get her.

It really is self-confidence. It's knowing that I'm a worthwhile human being, a good woman, and that even though I'm married, I've had guys tell me "If you weren't married, you would be PERFECT for me".

YOU have to believe it though. This is my concern for you--not that you have trust issues with men, but that you have trust issues with YOURSELF. You don't believe in yourself, you don't think you're attractive or "as good as" other women.

Baloney.

From the conversation we've been having, you're intelligent, thoughtful, and nice. I have no idea what you look like, but I don't really care. If we were having this conversation in person, I would probably have a pretty good time with you over coffee, which could easily develop into a friendship.

The only thing is--I don't let my friends put themselves down. If they don't have the confidence to believe I want to hang out with them because I like them, and constantly doubt my affection---well, I get frustrated with that pretty fast, and then I don't want to hang out with them as much, because I end up being their therapist and not their friend.

Honey--you NEED to have confidence in yourself. You need to TRULY believe that you're worth having, and that any man with a brain would want to hang out with you. YOU need to believe it.

Until you believe in yourself, you're always going to doubt your partner.

Certainly you know her best. I was looking at it from the perspective that if I pointed out something like that to someone, it would be because I don't have those attributes, and feel very badly about it and pointing it out would be my way of being able to give something I can't give. It's sad actually. I mean, I doubt seriously a guy would say "Honey, check out the pecs on that one" you know?

I mean, what your saying is specific to your relationship so I may not understand it, just inquiring so that I could. I am saying, I have known people to do it for that reason. Much like when a person is insecure about something like being overweight, they will often times make fun of it before someone else will because it gives them a sense of control in the situation. I took it like that, "Hey honey check her out" to be something like 'I don't look anything like her and I don't want him to make me feel bad by doing a 180 so if I point it out it's like he's looking b/c I asked him to" having a sense of control over the situation. I always say things like "she's hot" and he goes on his peaceful way, deep down inside I hate it, the whole situation, but if I complain well, it won't resolve anything. it does make me feel like my feelings don't matter though and that builds resentment.

Everyone keeps bringing up trust and that's not it, I don't have trust issues. I trust that he likes to be comfortable, I trust that it is human nature to stick with what your comfortable with. I trust all of you will go home to the same person every nite, but it does not mean you wouldn't want some one on one time if you could with someone else. FR-Chuck post "To be honest at a concert last night, there was a girl in shorts so short I saw less of my first wife until we were married. I may look, even a slight day dream but that is it."

People might like steak but they may feel they can only afford a burger. In other words, just because he brings themself "home to me every nite" is not much of an honor if they are doing it b/c they aren't confident enough to have a steak, per se. I once asked a boyfriend who was gawking at a chic casually why he didn't pursue someone like that if that was what he was into, he had said "because no women who looks like that would want me" that told me that I wasn't as great as they were to him, but that he was comfortable with someone "at my level". So, when everyone points out *trust* I am sure in some cases that is very true, and in others it more about the mate's level of confidence for why they choose to be with their mate, not that they don't wish for more. This is the distinction I am sorting out right now. But having all this discussion is helping me sort through all that.

Its normal for a guy to look at a woman and even to thinks damn that looks good. But that does not equate to him sneaking out to get some.

If we wanted to we could, but most of us don't. Why, respect for our wives. The fact it wouldn't be fair to them to repay faithfulness with infidelity. I know that might sound a little off but I'm speaking in guy terms. THere is little I wouldn't do for my wife.

I could be knocking the bottom out of a lot of women if I was that type of guy. There certainly are enough willing women out there. But like I said, being able to do something doesn't equal actually doing it. Its not fair to my wife, and its not the right thing to do.

Does my wife wish she had big ones... certainly... but she knows I like a nice shape with nice perky nipples, a bit on the larger side, features she does have. She will be quick to point out women that she sees going braless that fit that bill just as quick... and like I mentioned, she see's them before I do many times. Same goes for outstanding body features as well.

She also knows that we are a pretty good match in the sack and that I had left a lot of really attractive women over any number of personality issues and sexual hangups they had. She knows that the odds are against me finding another that would mesh so well as we do. In other words while she knows from a distance that grass on the other side of the fence may look great, but the closer you get you start to see all the weeds etc.

Oh she will point out some guys she finds attractive as well. Not that its my thing as it isn't but I don't get offended either. Hell she has enough of her own quirks I know many guys wouldn't deal with. Besides fooling around isn't in her nature. She's an all or nothing type...

I think what I am discussing the difference of lust versus looking. So my use of the word looking probably wasn't as accurate as I could have explained it. To me, if a person, man or women is thinking "god, that looks good, wish I could hit that" then there is no intimacy, even if they aren't hitting it, they wish they could there is not much integrity there to say "but I don't" but you wish you could. We're not talking about relationships with other people, we're talking about the desire for someone.


Its normal for a guy to look at a woman and even to thinks damn that looks good. But that does not equate to him sneaking out to get some.

If we wanted to we could, but most of us don't. Why, respect for our wives. The fact it wouldn't be fair to them to repay faithfulness with infidelity. I know that might sound a little off but I'm speaking in guy terms. THere is little I wouldn't do for my wife.

I could be knocking the bottom out of a lot of women if I was that type of guy. There certainly are enough willing women out there. But like I said, being able to do something doesn't equal actually doing it. Its not fair to my wife, and its not the right thing to do.

Does my wife wish she had big ones...certainly...but she knows I like a nice shape with nice perky nipples, a bit on the larger side, features she does have. She will be quick to point out women that she sees going braless that fit that bill just as quick....and like I mentioned, she see's them before I do many times. Same goes for outstanding body features as well.

She also knows that we are a pretty good match in the sack and that I had left a lot of really attractive women over any number of personality issues adn sexual hangups they had. She knows that the odds are against me finding another that would mesh so well as we do. In other words while she knows from a distance that grass on the other side of the fence may look great, but the closer you get you start to see all the weeds etc.

Oh she will point out some guys she finds attractive as well. Not that its my thing as it isn't but I don't get offended either. Hell she has enough of her own quirks I know many guys wouldn't deal with. Besides fooling around isn't in her nature. She's an all or nothing type....

I think all people are "allowed" some primal instinct response, and I don't think it makes that person, or their relationship less intimate or lacking integrity.

You and I are simply not going to agree... and I'm not trying to make you cross over to my side.

But, again, don't think for one moment that my wife hasn't felt some strong attraction toward a man other than me somewhere along the way. Now... for the most part, if I see a woman I find attractive my heart might race a little, there isn't a primal feeling that isn't "gee i wish i could hit that right now... if i only wasnt married" but it isn't completely asexual either. And then its over.

So... if my partner reads an erotic novel and then self stimulates, does that mean our relationship has no integrity? If I see a woman I find attractive and experience a rush, something that is like a reflex, that means my relationship is grounded in lies or oppression?

We just aren't going to see eye to eye, and that's OK.

My cousin takes it one step further. He and his wife have "top 5" lists that they share... whod be the top five people you'd be with if you weren't in the marriage. They are 15 years into a solid marriage, two kids, a house, and a future that I think is pretty darn good.

So, if my wife sees a guy at the gym and thinks "i wonder what itd be like to run by fingers over his abs"... OK. I'm fine with that. I accept that much of that response can be a human condition. Some people have self control, some are idiots about it.

But the integrity of my marriage isn't faulty. The foundation of my relationship isn't cracked. The connection we have isn't about oppression and deceit. Its about two people who are grounded in reality and who see eye to eye on many issues, including sexuality, sensuality, and what it mean to be a sexual being in a monogamous, happy relationship.

But that doesn't mean you can't find someone who is wired more like you than me. Just means we aren't wired the same... that's all.

I agree with you. I mean, some people have a things for a particular physical attribute, some people have a thing for a certain personality type. I think it turns out that for me this is my one thing, that really does it for me. That does not mean that you or any of the majority of the free world are wrong, or even that I am I guess. I suppose it's just "a thing" of mine. I mean, there are people not willing to date someone who is outside of a specific qualification they may have, that's there right even if it's silly. I think the point of all this discussion has been to sort all that out.

Not to convert me to the other side, or visa vera, but just to gain clarity on it's my "one of those things". I may be damaged, I may not be. Honestly, I think I have been like this my whole life. I agree that the likelihood of finding someone who feels this way is slim to none. I have two choices then, deal with it or find that person. I am aware of that. I will ponder these thoughts and suggestions for some time as it is not my desire to feel this way I assure you.

i think all people are "allowed" some primal instinct response, and i dont think it makes that person, or their relationship less intimate or lacking integrity.

you and i are simply not going to agree... and im not trying to make you cross over to my side.

but, again, dont think for one moment that my wife hasnt felt some strong attraction toward a man other than me somewhere along the way. now... for the most part, if i see a woman i find attractive my heart might race a little, there isnt a primal feeling that isnt "gee i wish i could hit that right now... if i only wasnt married" but it isnt completely asexual either. and then its over.

so... if my partner reads an erotic novel and then self stimulates, does that mean our relationship has no integrity? if i see a woman i find attractive and experience a rush, something that is like a reflex, that means my relationship is grounded in lies or oppression?

we just arent going to see eye to eye, and thats ok.

my cousin takes it one step further. he and his wife have "top 5" lists that they share... whod be the top five people youd be with if you werent in the marriage. they are 15 years into a solid marriage, two kids, a house, and a future that i think is pretty darn good.

so, if my wife sees a guy at the gym and thinks "i wonder what itd be like to run by fingers over his abs"... ok. im fine with that. i accept that much of that response can be a human condition. some people have self control, some are idiots about it.

but the integrity of my marriage isnt faulty. the foundation of my relationship isnt cracked. the connection we have isnt about oppression and deceit. its about two people who are grounded in reality and who see eye to eye on many issues, including sexuality, sensuality, and what it mean to be a sexual being in a monogamous, happy relationship.

but that doesnt mean you can't find someone who is wired more like you than me. just means we arent wired the same... thats all.

I am 28. Your saying that looking has nothing to do with wanting to sleep with someone and that you are satisfied, but your telling me you would love to spend one night with Sean Connery, Johnny Depp or John Cusack, because their eye candy and interesting people. You look at them, lust after them then no? I mean, again looking meaning looking at someone in that way, not looking like at a stop sign. You wouldn't do it because you love your husband and don't want to hurt him. But if he 'let' you, you'd be all over it? I am very confused. I am not clear on what about that says 'I am satisfied with the person I am with'. To me that's like saying, if you love someone you should want to see them with someone else. "Let's keep our fingers crossed maybe my wife will get to sleep with Sean Connery one day" that's not natural, for me anyway. But, that's normal not to want to let that happen or else people would not have created such things as marriage.

I feel, I only doubt myself because I am not kosher with wanting to see my mate with someone else or am comfortable with them playing with the idea, even if they don't, "looking" being playing with the idea then. I don't think I'm perfect, I know no one is, I don't think I am ugly either. Maybe, I have a problem in thinking I should be good enough that he should not need all that. See, when I think about having an intimate time, I think of him, not someone else, so I don't digest how him thinking of someone else should make me at all aqequate, or him not greedy. You had said in one post "caught him looking", again, if so confident why is it an act of catching someone? If there is nothing wrong with it, then why is it something be caught doing? Maybe it was just terminology and not what you meant to imply, just asking though.
Would I love to spend one night with Sean Connery or Johnny Depp or John Cusack? Sure--but as well as being eye-candy, those men seem like they'd be incredibly interesting to TALK to.

Look, I don't know your age, but that might be a big part of it. I seem to remember going through some of the feelings you are when I was in my early 20s--wondering why a guy would choose ME, when he could have HER---or wondering if a guy was just settling with me because he didn't think he COULD get her.

It really is self-confidence. It's knowing that I'm a worthwhile human being, a good woman, and that even though I'm married, I've had guys tell me "If you weren't married, you would be PERFECT for me".

YOU have to believe it though. This is my concern for you--not that you have trust issues with men, but that you have trust issues with YOURSELF. You don't believe in yourself, you dont' think you're attractive or "as good as" other women.

Baloney.

From the conversation we've been having, you're intelligent, thoughtful, and nice. I have no idea what you look like, but I don't really care. If we were having this conversation in person, I would probably have a pretty good time with you over coffee, which could easily develop into a friendship.

The only thing is--I don't let my friends put themselves down. If they don't have the confidence to believe I want to hang out with them because I like them, and constantly doubt my affection---well, I get frustrated with that pretty fast, and then I don't want to hang out with them as much, because I end up being their therapist and not their friend.

Honey--you NEED to have confidence in yourself. You need to TRULY believe that you're worth having, and that any man with a brain would want to hang out with you. YOU need to believe it.

Until you believe in yourself, you're always going to doubt your partner.

In the end we all need to find the best kind of "weird" that suits us individually. And knowing where your lines are isn't a bad thing. Some lines are drawn in sand, and some are in stone.

An addendum... I also don't believe in soul mates. I think if I died tomorrow my wife, at some point, would be able to find a man that could be a good husband to her and a good father to my son. That doesn't bug me one bit. Doesn't mean her love for me is less than it should be. And maybe she wouldn't find another mate... but I'm thinking she could. A few billion people on this earth, y'know.

Just to stir the pot up a little more.

I agree with you, haha. I bet you didn't expect that. I mean, how would people be able to marry and divorce if there was only one love for everyone? I would never want someone to go on without love in their life, and I agree that it does not make the love I had with them any less valuable. Each relationship is as unique as the personalities that are in it. It's never in vain and that is a beautiful thing. Love can change, people can fall out of love, obviously, but it does not mean your love for someone when you were different once upon a time with them was any less valid. I don't buy the whole soul mates thing either. I think that's a first time love "hope" but not a reality.

I have a hard time believing anyone who said they had this. I would take that to mean they had little experience or something. I'm not the kind of person to love several people at once, I give it my all. But, if it does not work out, and I heal over time, sure I fall in love with someone else.


in the end we all need to find the best kind of "weird" that suits us individually. and knowing where your lines are isnt a bad thing. some lines are drawn in sand, and some are in stone.

an addendum... i also dont believe in soul mates. i think if i died tomorrow my wife, at some point, would be able to find a man that could be a good husband to her and a good father to my son. that doesnt bug me one bit. doesnt mean her love for me is less than it should be. and maybe she wouldnt find another mate... but im thinking she could. a few billion people on this earth, y'know.

just to stir the pot up a little more.

I think I wasn't clear.

I would love to spend ONE NIGHT with them---talking.

I have, in the 12 years I've been with my husband, felt true lust for someone else only twice. And believe me, it was fleeting. That's all it was--lust.

I wouldn't NOT do something just because it would hurt my husband--though of course that would play into it. I wouldn't do something because my husband satisfies me, in every way--spiritually, emotionally, physically, whatever. When I daydream, I daydream about my husband.

That's not to say I don't NOTICE eye-candy when it's around, but seriously, I would wonder about myself if I didn't notice it. Noticing chocolate in the store doesn't mean you're craving it, or that you'd ditch your dinner for it--you just see it and go "oh, chocolate" and carry on with your day.

That's not to say I don't NOTICE eye-candy when it's around...
Glad I'm noticed. ;)

You are not crazy!!
I feel exactly the same way. I can objectively look at a man or woman and say "they are beautiful", etc.. with no attraction. That's all it is--totally objective. As far as I am concerned there are no other sexual beings on this planet other than the person I am in a sexual relationship with. Period. If there were or ever are I would not defile the person I am with by being with them anymore. I realized a long time ago that most people are not like this. Most of the people I see are in "friends with benefits" type relationships where both can have sex with anyone, anywhere, anytime so long as they finish it up by themselves or (more horrifying) on their partner. They say things like "we look but don't touch". Huh? What is the difference? That is a great question for the other people out there! Why would they ever prefer that their partner would use them as some sort of human garbage dump rather than simply finishing having sex with the person they're already doing it with in their head?? That is revolting! I would rather be alone than ever find out that I had been used in such a perverted, disgusting way by the one person that I loved and trusted. The problem is that since most people out there are like this and view it as normal it worries me that they will lie. After all, in most situations the people they are getting off on are not people they could realistically get--a middle aged man staring at some big boobed twenty year old who doesn't know he exists (and is probably totally unaware that she is being visually raped for later) isn't going to go home with him right? So he still needs someone to hug/kiss/hang out with and provide the warm body in bed... I am always honest and up front about this issue since it is so obvious that I am in the minority... but how do you ever know if the person is simpy lying in order to keep the convenient situation they have... getting off on other people all day long and using your body every night to do it??
I'm sorry. I wish I could say something to help you. I am only writing to let you know that you are not alone--you are not crazy. You are simply not in the majority on this & neither am I... :(

Wow... that rant made me feel just... dirty. And for nothing more than being human!

I'm not "visually raping" guys --not even YOU, KP!--when I notice one and have a moment of lust!

I'm not cheating, or lying to my husband about it, either.

And again, there's a HUGE difference between noticing for a moment and daydreaming about someone you saw for the next week. Heck, I couldn't even tell you the last time I saw a guy that I had even a moment's daydream about!

But it DOES happen to most people occasionally.

Frankly, you come across as insecure and judgemental to me. Betcha you feel the same way about masturbation as you do about noticing other people. And frankly, really, you have a holier-than-thou attitude about humans in general for having a weakness that most people have--that of noticing the other people in the world for whom there MIGHT be chemistry ----IF----well, there are too many ifs. If I weren't in a relationship, if I had the time to date even if I weren't in a relationship, if that random guy noticed me as well, if, if, if.

Out of curiosity--do you have the idea that when you are in a relationship you can't touch anyone who is not related to you in more than a casual way? I mean, can you hug or give a quick peck of a kiss to a friend of the opposite sex? Or is that just an opportunity to feel them up and fantasize about someone other than your partner because everyone KNOWS that members of the opposite sex can't be friends unless there is a sexual attraction! :rolleyes:

You have issues, honey. The fact that your post was filled with words like perverted, disgusting, human garbage dump, horrifying, etc... sounds like you have some extreme hang ups about sex.

"Most people" are NOT in a "friends with benefits" relationship. "Most people" are in a normal relationship with ONE PERSON and occasionally notice the hot Fed Ex guy and move on with their day. "Most people" don't have to run to the bathroom to masturbate after seeing an attractive member of the opposite sex, and "most people" don't even REMEMBER that person they thought was hot by the time they get home to their partner/spouse.

I said it before and I'll say it again: It's human, and I think there are trust issues and self-esteem issues involved with someone who assumes every person they date is a lecher.

Then I suppose we're talking about semantics really, your saying noticing, quite simply, looking, not “looking” then is what I assume. What I was meaning to say about why it would bother me to think about “looking” to me meant it takes looking at someone else or a fantasy to keep the passion alive in a relationship.
The only way to survive it is by having some outside stimulus, that thought bothers me.


I think I wasn't clear.

I would love to spend ONE NIGHT with them---talking.

I have, in the 12 years I've been with my husband, felt true lust for someone else only twice. And believe me, it was fleeting. That's all it was--lust.

I wouldn't NOT do something just because it would hurt my husband--though of course that would play into it. I wouldn't do something because my husband satisfies me, in every way--spiritually, emotionally, physically, whatever. When I daydream, I daydream about my husband.

That's not to say I don't NOTICE eye-candy when it's around, but seriously, I would wonder about myself if I didn't notice it. Noticing chocolate in the store doesn't mean you're craving it, or that you'd ditch your dinner for it--you just see it and go "oh, chocolate" and carry on with your day.

I am being a devil's advocate for the most part, so please don't think I am freaked out or something, but, is it primal instinct to watch some guy ogle you wife? Like, you have no primal instinct to bounce on him? Or... instinct when, like a knee jerk reaction, even if you control it, don't show it, but have this instant irritation when she is checking some man out?



i think all people are "allowed" some primal instinct response, and i dont think it makes that person, or their relationship less intimate or lacking integrity.

you and i are simply not going to agree... and im not trying to make you cross over to my side.

but, again, dont think for one moment that my wife hasnt felt some strong attraction toward a man other than me somewhere along the way. now... for the most part, if i see a woman i find attractive my heart might race a little, there isnt a primal feeling that isnt "gee i wish i could hit that right now... if i only wasnt married" but it isnt completely asexual either. and then its over.

so... if my partner reads an erotic novel and then self stimulates, does that mean our relationship has no integrity? if i see a woman i find attractive and experience a rush, something that is like a reflex, that means my relationship is grounded in lies or oppression?

we just arent going to see eye to eye, and thats ok.

my cousin takes it one step further. he and his wife have "top 5" lists that they share... whod be the top five people youd be with if you werent in the marriage. they are 15 years into a solid marriage, two kids, a house, and a future that i think is pretty darn good.

so, if my wife sees a guy at the gym and thinks "i wonder what itd be like to run by fingers over his abs"... ok. im fine with that. i accept that much of that response can be a human condition. some people have self control, some are idiots about it.

but the integrity of my marriage isnt faulty. the foundation of my relationship isnt cracked. the connection we have isnt about oppression and deceit. its about two people who are grounded in reality and who see eye to eye on many issues, including sexuality, sensuality, and what it mean to be a sexual being in a monogamous, happy relationship.

but that doesnt mean you can't find someone who is wired more like you than me. just means we arent wired the same... thats all.

My fear is that your right, and that is what I am asking everyone:

• People accept what they can get, based on what they can offer, their own level of self confidence not what they want. Ex. Bald, middle aged man with beer gut lusts 20 year old with big boobs, but goes home to wife and isn't built like a 17 year old anymore (which is gross if-you're a middle aged man to be attracted to a kid, but hey that's just me) because he feels it's the best he can do, besides, she cooks for him and who else would do that…….in his head he's not good enough, so stick with “what I know I have for sure”, convenience.

• He/she goes home to a warm body, because it'll do as he/she needs affection from somewhere, they have time in together and it's too time consuming to get used to someone else, besides they have a routine which makes life easier, but the very routine makes life with this women he isn't as attracted to as much as the 20 year old boring.


The above are my fears, and is why I am asking everyone. I asked my man this question last night. I asked, if I were lined up with a bunch of playmates do you think you would still pick me; he said “if she had your personality I would”. So to me, that makes me the “warm body”. Then he stereotypes super hot chicks as having a bad personality, which they may not, and I have a decent personality so I guess I'm not superhot in his mind because superhot cicks don't have good personalities? What? I am not unattractive, I am not perfect, no one is, but that tells me that he thinks I am the best he can do, not the best there is. That to me is not a turn on. What turns me on is thinking, I am best thing this person could ask for, wants, desires and not the warm body.





You are not crazy!!!
I feel exactly the same way. I can objectively look at a man or woman and say "they are beautiful", etc..with no attraction. That's all it is--totally objective. As far as I am concerned there are no other sexual beings on this planet other than the person I am in a sexual relationship with. Period. If there were or ever are I would not defile the person I am with by being with them anymore. I realized a long time ago that most people are not like this. Most of the people I see are in "friends with benefits" type relationships where both can have sex with anyone, anywhere, anytime so long as they finish it up by themselves or (more horrifying) on their partner. They say things like "we look but don't touch". Huh?? What is the difference? That is a great question for the other people out there! Why would they ever prefer that their partner would use them as some sort of human garbage dump rather than simply finishing having sex with the person they're already doing it with in their head??? That is revolting! I would rather be alone than ever find out that I had been used in such a perverted, disgusting way by the one person that I loved and trusted. The problem is that since most people out there are like this and view it as normal it worries me that they will lie. After all, in most situations the people they are getting off on are not people they could realistically get--a middle aged man staring at some big boobed twenty year old who doesn't know he exists (and is probably totally unaware that she is being visually raped for later) isn't going to go home with him right? So he still needs someone to hug/kiss/hang out with and provide the warm body in bed...I am always honest and up front about this issue since it is so obvious that I am in the minority... but how do you ever know if the person is simpy lying in order to keep the convenient situation they have.....getting off on other people all day long and using your body every night to do it???
I'm sorry. I wish I could say something to help you. I am only writing to let you know that you are not alone--you are not crazy. You are simply not in the majority on this & neither am I...:(

Responding to "meghanbigworld" not myself

Wow....that rant made me feel just....dirty. And for nothing more than being human!

I'm not "visually raping" guys --not even YOU, KP!--when I notice one and have a moment of lust!

I'm not cheating, or lying to my husband about it, either.

And again, there's a HUGE difference between noticing for a moment and daydreaming about someone you saw for the next week. Heck, I couldn't even tell you the last time I saw a guy that I had even a moment's daydream about!

But it DOES happen to most people occasionally.

Frankly, you come across as insecure and judgemental to me. Betcha you feel the same way about masturbation as you do about noticing other people. And frankly, really, you have a holier-than-thou attitude about humans in general for having a weakness that most people have--that of noticing the other people in the world for whom there MIGHT be chemistry ----IF----well, there are too many ifs. If I weren't in a relationship, if I had the time to date even if I weren't in a relationship, if that random guy noticed me as well, if, if, if.

Out of curiosity--do you have the idea that when you are in a relationship you can't touch anyone who is not related to you in more than a casual way? I mean, can you hug or give a quick peck of a kiss to a friend of the opposite sex? Or is that just an opportunity to feel them up and fantasize about someone other than your partner because everyone KNOWS that members of the opposite sex can't be friends unless there is a sexual attraction! :rolleyes:

You have issues, honey. The fact that your post was filled with words like perverted, disgusting, human garbage dump, horrifying, etc....sounds like you have some extreme hang ups about sex.

"Most people" are NOT in a "friends with benefits" relationship. "Most people" are in a normal relationship with ONE PERSON and occasionally notice the hot Fed Ex guy and move on with their day. "Most people" don't have to run to the bathroom to masturbate after seeing an attractive member of the opposite sex, and "most people" don't even REMEMBER that person they thought was hot by the time they get home to their partner/spouse.

I said it before and I'll say it again: It's human, and I think there are trust issues and self-esteem issues involved with someone who assumes every person they date is a lecher.

Your saying, this moment or moments of lusts, being the only 1 or 2 valid times in 12 years, not looking at someone, not simply checking them out, or people watching, real lust, chemistry, like you share with your husband, and that your decision not to do it was not simply based on not rattling your comfort zone, but because your are satisfied and have already created an established connection but realize that one can be made in another life with this person.

But the desire was rare and completely abstract to the love you have? Not because you aren't satisfied, not because you don't get the attention you want, not because you felt the option wasn't available to you if you wanted to act on it? Sometimes I think people feel that if they were to step out it would have to be for a really good reason, almost like, "well, that guy is hot but not hot enough to end my relationship" but that if the person has that level of "hottness" and chemistry they might be willing to risk it, or under certain circumstances, such as, "well, I am not getting any at home and so and so will never find out" and then justify it. I mean, we're going into the area of cheating now so that's abstract to all this I suppose, but your saying, chemistry was what created lust, not attractiveness, not feeling unsatisfied.


I think I wasn't clear.

I would love to spend ONE NIGHT with them---talking.

I have, in the 12 years I've been with my husband, felt true lust for someone else only twice. And believe me, it was fleeting. That's all it was--lust.

I wouldn't NOT do something just because it would hurt my husband--though of course that would play into it. I wouldn't do something because my husband satisfies me, in every way--spiritually, emotionally, physically, whatever. When I daydream, I daydream about my husband.

That's not to say I don't NOTICE eye-candy when it's around, but seriously, I would wonder about myself if I didn't notice it. Noticing chocolate in the store doesn't mean you're craving it, or that you'd ditch your dinner for it--you just see it and go "oh, chocolate" and carry on with your day.

I am being a devil's advocate for the most part, so please don't think I am freaked out or something, but, is it primal instinct to watch some guy ogle you wife? Like, you have no primal instinct to bounce on him? Or.....instinct when, like a knee jerk reaction, even if you control it, don't show it, but have this instant irritation when she is checking some man out?
I don't think you are freaked out... as much as we take different approaches, this thread has leveled out and become a reasonable discussion.

If I notice a man checking out my wife there's a little internal twinge of "mkay buddy, just watch yourself"... I am a hot enough tempered irish guy... I actually consider myself somewhat jealous, but my trust in her is bigger than my jealousy... and I say that having had two other loves cheat on me. It wasn't easy to get to this place, but I can see by many simple actions how grounded she is and how her word really is her intention. Were she a different person, maybe I wouldn't be OK with her getting attention.

So... if we are walking through the mall and she's getting simple looks, sometimes ill just count them up and tell her when we hit the store "five"... meaning I caught five guys looking at her with interest... and most of them I just stare down, as they watch her and then look to see if I'm looking. OK. No big deal. I'm not going to make my wife go out in a burka, not that I could.

When were are out with friends and some guy is buying her drinks and talking her up, even touching her arm... yes, there is a primal, territorial reflex. But again, I'm not an ape all the time, so I can check out the situation and if I need to step in, I will. She's always removed herself from a situation that seemed uncomfortable or that was escalating.

And if it got to the point that he's over the line and has ignored warnings... then it'll get ugly. I give a lot of room, but when that line is crossed, it would be all out ugly. Ill leave the details out, but a coworker of hers last year hit on her hard... basically asked her, after everyone else had left, if she wanted to "go someplace".. this after a tragic day for her pesonally, and her guard was down. I was on the way to pick her up when she gave me the "can you get here sooner than later" call... the guy left just as I got there, and she didn't tell me until he was out of the lot... which was good because I wanted to beat the snot out of him. Took all I had not to stop in at his work and push him to the wall. But within a year he was fired for inappropriate things done on the job... his wife was, I'm sure, less than pleased. So in this case, where a guy not only showed interest, but was pressuring her... id be happy with him as a grease spot on the wall. That anger reflex is probably similar to what you feel if you catch your guy looking at another woman? I just have a greater threshold?

Now, if I notice her checking out a guys tush as he passes by, and I've seen her do this, it really doesn't rile me so much. I like the fact she's a sexual being who chooses to be with me, even when there are others around that might piqué her interest. She travels overseas and out of town. If I couldn't trust that shell keep control when boys want to buy her drinks, id go mad. That they find her attractive and might look her up and down doesn't bother me for the most part, as long as she's not uncomfortable.

I agree about the burka comment. I mean, Self expression is important, I would be highly upset if someone asked me not to express myself, and I would never do that to someone either. The primal instinct to look for you is more natural and for me the instinct to bounce is more so. I suppose some people have more or less of one or the other and if their lucky their at even. I am not hot tempered, I don't fly off the handle. I don't 'punish' him for it, I don't treat a women different if I know he has looked a her. I feel hurt and to me it was a matter of how much I should express to that person because I would never ask someone to change, so bringing it up is pointless. I mean, I have always been a fan of 'you should love someone as they are' The irony is that if I felt someone I loved was hurt by something I did or was doing I would want to know. So, in this case I think it really is just a matter of what I will/can accept as you said before. You don't think this discussion has been level?



i dont think you are freaked out... as much as we take different approaches, this thread has leveled out and become a reasonable discussion.

if i notice a man checking out my wife theres a little internal twinge of "mkay buddy, just watch yourself".... i am a hot enough tempered irish guy... i actually consider myself somewhat jealous, but my trust in her is bigger than my jealousy... and i say that having had two other loves cheat on me. it wasnt easy to get to this place, but i can see by many simple actions how grounded she is and how her word really is her intention. were she a different person, maybe i wouldnt be ok with her getting attention.

so... if we are walking through the mall and shes getting simple looks, sometimes ill just count them up and tell her when we hit the store "five"... meaning i caught five guys looking at her with interest... and most of them i just stare down, as they watch her and then look to see if im looking. ok. no big deal. im not going to make my wife go out in a burka, not that i could.

when were are out with friends and some guy is buying her drinks and talking her up, even touching her arm... yes, there is a primal, territorial reflex. but again, im not an ape all the time, so i can check out the situation and if i need to step in, i will. shes always removed herself from a situation that seemed uncomfortable or that was escalating.

and if it got to the point that hes over the line and has ignored warnings... then itll get ugly. i give a lot of room, but when that line is crossed, it would be all out ugly. ill leave the details out, but a coworker of hers last year hit on her hard... basically asked her, after everyone else had left, if she wanted to "go someplace".. this after a tragic day for her pesonally, and her guard was down. i was on the way to pick her up when she gave me the "can you get here sooner than later" call... the guy left just as i got there, and she didnt tell me until he was out of the lot... which was good because i wanted to beat the snot out of him. took all i had not to stop in at his work and push him to the wall. but within a year he was fired for inappropriate things done on the job... his wife was, im sure, less than pleased. so in this case, where a guy not only showed interest, but was pressuring her... id be happy with him as a grease spot on the wall. that anger reflex is probably similar to what you feel if you catch your guy looking at another woman? i just have a greater threshold?

now, if i notice her checking out a guys tush as he passes by, and ive seen her do this, it really doesnt rile me so much. i like the fact shes a sexual being who chooses to be with me, even when there are others around that might pique her interest. she travels overseas and out of town. if i couldnt trust that shell keep control when boys want to buy her drinks, id go mad. that they find her attractive and might look her up and down doesnt bother me for the most part, as long as shes not uncomfortable.

It is "too much to ask" to get someone else to oblige by YOUR needs and standards. If you could, then you'd have a complete "puppet" on your hands.

Is this what you want?

You don't think this discussion has been level?
I must have said it wrong. I think it is a good discussion, and one that you've been able to "weather" well... I know there were moments earlier, such as the counseling suggestion, that might have not struck you right... but you've posted a thoughtful discussion that I think has been level headed. Early on I wasn't sure it was going to go this way... as some have posted here before and the minute someone disagrees with them, they walk out.

I think we are at the point where you don't feel your character is being attacked, or you are being told that you are broken. And I don't feel like the integrity of my relationship is in question just because my partner or I might look at others. Make sense?

Good deal
i must have said it wrong. i think it is a good discussion, and one that youve been able to "weather" well... i know there were moments earlier, such as the counseling suggestion, that might have not struck you right... but youve posted a thoughtful discussion that i think has been level headed. early on i wasnt sure it was going to go this way... as some have posted here before and the minute someone disagrees with them, they walk out.

i think we are at the point where you dont feel your character is being attacked, or you are being told that you are broken. and i dont feel like the integrity of my relationship is in question just because my partner or i might look at others. make sense?

Well, that goes both ways does it not? I mean, if you have no standards then you are the puppet.
It is "too much to ask" to get someone else to oblige by YOUR needs and standards. If you could, then you'd have a complete "puppet" on your hands.

Is this what you want?

I totally see everyone's side here especially amIwrong. I used to be this way I hated seeing my man checking out other woman, where the eyes do go up and down. It would piss me off as well. Like what I'm not pretty enough that you have to check out the snobby bleach blonde college chicks. I figure if THEY wanted him he would probably go and get it. And it's the truth I think lots of people would cheat if they could and wouldn't get caught. I do think that "looking" however does play a major part in this role.

I have seen my man almost break his neck looking a some chick passing by in a pink minny skirt. I hate it cause I am beautiful just like you and lots of guys would love to be with us. But it does make you feel down way down. I have also lost respect for my boyfriend years ago. And I was told the same thing everyone does it, so I have been looking around myself and I don't think that anything good is to come of it. It actually made me develop feelings for this friend of mine. Although I would never act upon my feelings cause I will never cheat I am the most honest person you will find.
I also hate feeling like you have to compete if we go out I would like to be showing some cleavage so I keep my mans attention for a longer amount of time.
But yeah I have walked through the mall and seen woman's men check me out I almost wanted to stop them and say walk next to your man, he is walking behind you not to look at your butt, but to look at other woman. I believe that back in the day it wasn't like this, but 2008 you can't even turn the chanel without seeing something majorly sexual on.

Great Post by the way I really loved reading it all.

I do feel where you are coming from and some people may say I am wrong but this is my opinion.

I do agree, of course, and to be honest there are times that I feel bad because I don't want some other women thinking I love that kind of attention, because you know some women feed off it, making other women feel bad that is. I have had a few times when I have seen a guy check me out and the women seemed pissed, and I can only assume that was why. I almost felt like I had to apologize for him. That's not cool. Or worse, when a guy does it and I can tell the women has not noticed, like how gross, their on a date or something and he's looking at me, why is he even bothering to waste her time like that.
I once had a friend who asked me to stop wearing tank tops because her man apprently was eyeing me up all the time when we all went out. I was thinking, because you're my friend and I am not trying to disrespect you I will do what you ask, but, how unfair to me that your man does not have enough respect for you that he can't keep from crossing that line when we're all out.


I totally see everyones side here especially amIwrong. I used to be this way I hated seeing my man checking out other woman, where the eyes do go up and down. It would piss me off as well. Like what I'm not pretty enough that you have to check out the snobby bleach blonde college chicks. I figure if THEY wanted him he would probably go and get it. And its the truth I think lots of people would cheat if they could and wouldn't get caught. I do think that "looking" however does play a major part in this role.

I have seen my man almost break his neck looking a some chick passing by in a pink minny skirt. I hate it cause I am beautiful just like you and lots of guys would love to be with us. But it does make you feel down way down. I have also lost respect for my bf years ago. And I was told the same thing everyone does it, so I have been looking around myself and I don't think that anything good is to come of it. It actually made me develope feelings for this friend of mine. Although I would never act upon my feelings cause I will never cheat I am the most honest person you will find.
I also hate feeling like you have to compete if we go out I would like to be showing some cleavage so I keep my mans attention for a longer amount of time.
But yeah I have walked through the mall and seen womans men check me out I almost wanted to stop them and say walk next to your man, he is walking behind you not to look at your butt, but to look at other woman. I belive that back in the day it wasn't like this, but 2008 you can't even turn the chanel without seeing something majorly sexual on.

Great Post by the way I really loved reading it all.

I do feel where you are coming from and some people may say I am wrong but this is my opinion.

WOW! So sorry. I have never posted a comment on any site before & just felt compelled to comment here, but obviously I'm not too good at it!

I think the people posting on this question have been very thoughtful in their writing--they seem to have really given thought to the issues and been very decent in their responses...


I actually have no problem with any arrangement that any couple has---that is none of my business & why would I care as long as no one pressures me to be the same! If the people in my life are happy and not hurting anyone else than I am thrilled. I don't feel "holier-than-thou" about anyone--just tired of being told that there is something wrong with me for not desiring anyone other than my partner & wanting to be with someone who feels the same. It seemed like AmIwrong had felt some of the same things that I have & still do worry over.

I am actually in a relationship with a man that I think is amazing! I am not jealous or possesive. One of the things I liked about him right away was that he had as many women friends as men & spends lots of time with them (great people we are both very close to), with me & without. (Our sex life is great, so I don't think I'm too screwed up there.. :)) And I have zero worries that he would ever go to bed with someone else. If anything like that ever happened I feel sure that he would be honest about something like that-because that is the commonly accepted line, right? Unfortunately for me it's not where my line is & that's what makes me feel insecure a lot. I would never try to change anyone. If something is a dealbreaker for me then that is my issue--I would need to stay or go--trying to change the other person would never occur to me. Particularly concerning the issues written about here. These are not things that I think people can or should ever be asked to change---but that includes me too! All I want from anyone else is honesty so that I can make the decision about what is OK for me.

What I was trying to get across was simply that in this culture it is so hard to trust. Everyone & men especially get so much sex thrown at them... magazines, TV, etc.. that they really don't have to leave the house or even actively seek it out to cheat anymore. And, yes for me that really is cheating... looking at someone else's face, mouth, body etc. and being aroused/attracted or fantasizing sexually about that person I do feel is cheating. And I don't think it is any better than actually going to bed with that person (unless the only thing you are worried about is an std). I guess I do feel that most of the partnerships & marriages that I see really are a "friends-with-benefits" type of arrangement--again, great if that's what people want. Just like it's my right to not be in that type relationship, right?


I am sorry that people were so taken aback by what I wrote. I guess I just wanted to say to AmIwrong that you are not alone in struggling with these issues...

I am totally open and honest about what my boundaries on these issues are (just as I would hope anyone I was in a relationship would be about anything that would be a dealbreaker for them). But everything I read basically tells me that I am stupid or crazy if I believe he is being honest about feeling the same about me. So, I worry sometimes & feel insecure.

I probably won't write again & I really am sorry to have been offensive. I'll keep reading though--for some reason it helps me to know that there are other people struggling with the same kind of stuff... AmIwrong--I hope everything works out for you!

Thanks so much for writing. I agree with you in that everyone has their quirks they are willing to accept. For me, it was a matter of trying to figure out if I was really one very bazaar person for feeling this way. To be fair, society has conditioned us to feel both ways. To have sexuality pushed on us and on the same token to be faithful to a point that apprently does not apply. I mean, in the sense of women, let's be fair, 'it's really cool for girls to flash breasts on spring break, in fact encouraged, but then is she moves onto another man "to" fast after a past relationship then she's a whore'. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with either statement, just making a point. Most men love 'girl on girl action, they would likely dig it if their women would oblige them, but it's not cool if she were with another man'. Men are conditioned as well, I mean, they may not care, but if they don't at least pretend to they are questioned about their sexuality. I was at a public event once where apprently on commercial break women were flashing, men were holding up their five year old sons to check it out. Do you honestly see a mother or father doing such a thing with their little girl to see a man flash? I doubt it. That's my sociology for the day.

There are many conflicting messages out there. This is very confusing and I doubt seriously I am the first to feel that way. For a moment I did feel slammed bascially for having my feelings, when incidentally my feelings came just as naturally as the opposing views did. Regardless of what is normal, it is a matter of being able to take someone at face value. I saw it as if this is so normal, "looking" at someone wishing you had them but go home to 'old what's his face for example', then how would I have ethically said "Yes we communicate honestly" if I felt repressed to say anything about how I felt?

In other words, I am not some sex nazi, like you said, I have no desire to change anyone, and some on this site have said it would be stupid for a man to tell me such honest notions, but no one I am in a relationship with should have a desire to change me as well. Given that two people can have these dramatic viewpoints that could ultimately ulter the relationship and a compromise has to be reached, some meeting of the minds has to take place that I consider that to be very difficult if someone or both are not willing to change. Otherwise long term resentment will make the decision. Since there is no readily made solution, being honest and accepting each for what they really are at least gives people the right to choose who they are really with. What is likely then to happen is that a person may be inclined to lie about their behavior if not, which is not what makes a relationship, lies. So, by being honest, one is not looking to punish anyone, but seeks the truth so that when they say I love you it won't include "except for" it will mean entirely quirks and all. That to me is integrity, regardless of anyone's views on this topic. It takes real character to tell the truth even if the outcome may be undesirable, and it also takes great willpower to be wise enough to never ask questions you can't handle hearing the truth to.

I like to think I have both of these qualities, otherwise I would not have even considered being receptive and posting this question to begin with. This, is my way of researching and comtemplating because I care for someone. I thank you for your post because even though I need to understand the opposing view, I would like to feel a bit normal and not damaged for what I viewed as my personality. This situation is difficult because it's such a gray area given so many variables I have learned no one person could be right, as the relationship itself will determine that.

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WOW! So sorry. I have never posted a comment on any site before & just felt compelled to comment here, but obviously I'm not too good at it!

I think the people posting on this question have been very thoughtful in their writing--they seem to have really given thought to the issues and been very decent in their responses...


I actually have no problem with any arrangement that any couple has---that is none of my business & why would I care as long as no one pressures me to be the same! If the people in my life are happy and not hurting anyone else than I am thrilled. I don't feel "holier-than-thou" about anyone--just tired of being told that there is something wrong with me for not desiring anyone other than my partner & wanting to be with someone who feels the same. It seemed like AmIwrong had felt some of the same things that I have & still do worry over.

I am actually in a relationship with a man that I think is amazing! I am not jealous or possesive. One of the things I liked about him right away was that he had as many women friends as men & spends lots of time with them (great people we are both very close to), with me & without. (Our sex life is great, so I don't think I'm too screwed up there............?:)) And I have zero worries that he would ever go to bed with someone else. If anything like that ever happened I feel sure that he would be honest about something like that-because that is the commonly accepted line, right? Unfortunately for me it's not where my line is & that's what makes me feel insecure alot. I would never try to change anyone. If something is a dealbreaker for me then that is my issue--I would need to stay or go--trying to change the other person would never occur to me. Particularly concerning the issues written about here. These are not things that I think people can or should ever be asked to change---but that includes me too! All I want from anyone else is honesty so that I can make the decision about what is ok for me.

What I was trying to get accross was simply that in this culture it is so hard to trust. Everyone & men especially get so much sex thrown at them...magazines, tv, etc..that they really don't have to leave the house or even actively seek it out to cheat anymore. And, yes for me that really is cheating....looking at someone elses face, mouth, body etc. and being aroused/attracted or fantasizing sexually about that person I do feel is cheating. And I don't think it is any better than actually going to bed with that person (unless the only thing you are worried about is an std). I guess I do feel that most of the partnerships & marriages that I see really are a "friends-with-benefits" type of arrangement--again, great if that's what people want. Just like it's my right to not be in that type relationship, right?


I am sorry that people were so taken aback by what I wrote. I guess I just wanted to say to AmIwrong that you are not alone in struggling with these issues...

I am totally open and honest about what my boundaries on these issues are (just as I would hope anyone I was in a relationship would be about anything that would be a dealbreaker for them). But everything I read basically tells me that I am stupid or crazy if I believe he is being honest about feeling the same about me. So, I worry sometimes & feel insecure.

I probably won't write again & I really am sorry to have been offensive. I'll keep reading though--for some reason it helps me to know that there are other people struggling with the same kind of stuff...AmIwrong--I hope everything works out for you!!

Thank you for the site, though I do have all of these qualities. For one, I am not a teen as this site suggests, I am a full grown adult with my unique take on life. Most importantly, I do have all of these qualities. I am not sure if you have been reading all of my posts on this topic, but I am not a nazi. In fact I have said nothing to him even on the topic for the most part because I am conducting my own research via this site so that I can be fair. Which I think is reasonable. I do appriciate it though.


Well, that goes both ways does it not? I mean, if you have no standards then you are the puppet.

Just answer one question. Have you ever seen a good looking man and just wondered? If you answer no, never, you are not a human being!! All kidding aside, men AND women look. It is human nature. If you are with someone that lokks and says nothing about it then let it go but on the other hand if you are with someone that lokks and makes verbal comments, then kick the guy to the curb.

I think what I am discussing the difference of lust versus looking. So my use of the word looking probably wasn't as accurate as I could have explained it. To me, if a person, man or women is thinking "god, that looks good, wish I could hit that" then there is no intimacy, even if they aren't hitting it, they wish they could there is not much integrity there to say "but I don't" but you wish you could. We're not talking about relationships with other people, we're talking about the desire for someone.

Oh trust me seeing a great looking woman and thinking "I wish I could hit that" has nothing to do with intimacy. It's a guy thing... guys can and do have sex every day with women they don't give a rats azz about. Seriously, you have seen these guys before. Most do it because they can. Not just because they want to.

But let me also state that the difference between thinking... "I wish I could hit that" and actually trying to is vast. DO I think that every time I see Eva Longoria or Jessica ALba, or any other number of knockouts... damn right and so will any other guy that's not impotent. But liking something we see and wanting to spend out life with them is not the same.

Now women tend to be wired differently than men so that's why so few of them can understand this. No offense but its just that a guys thought process is not the same as a woman's. But it does explain why what a woman might see in a situation is not what a guy sees in the very same situation.


Looking at a woman, and liking what we see does not equal pursuing her.

Keep in mind if a guy choses to be with you and stay faithful to you its because he loves you. If he looks at another woman, likes what he sees it has nothing to do with you. As long as he isn't flirting with her. Looking is one thing (thats just hormones and guy genes)... BUT flirting takes it to a whole different level however and changes everything. You don't flirt with other women when you love the one you are with. That is uncool.

Thanks, it's somewhat comforting, I guess. I mean, I do realize that this is not as simple as man versus women, as some women feel this way as well. I understand that I don't understand but trust what you are saying. Needless to say, for me, or a man/women who feels like me, it's almost like, well, if I were that great your attention wouldn't be else where. Love has nothing to do with it in a way. I mean, for your side of it or mine. In that, I want to think that regardless of love he would want me over anyone else PHYSICALLY not just because we're emotional, even if I am not perfect because no one is. That's probably a cocky thing to even assume, but in a way, it's like otherwise wise I feel he's staying with me out of convenience. Other then that once I know a guy is turned on by someone else, it's like, it's worse knowing "he loves me" like he's doing me a favor by not cheating. At that point I would rather him go make himself happy, doing me a favor would otherwise make me feel pathetic. Like "see I love you so much I resist going after someone else" like, yeah, uh, that really makes me want you. If you have to resist it because the desire for someone else is that strong, then I don't want it. All I can do is go on knowing that this makes sense to a lot of people and I hope one day I have a light bulb moment or turn some corner. Otherwise this is all going to be very miserable for me.



Oh trust me seeing a great looking woman and thinking "I wish I could hit that" has nothing to do with intimacy. Its a guy thing....guys can and do have sex every day with women they don't give a rats azz about. Seriously, you have seen these guys before. Most do it because they can. Not just because they want to.

But let me also state that the difference between thinking..."I wish I could hit that" and actually trying to is vast. DO I think that every time I see Eva Longoria or Jessica ALba, or any other number of knockouts... damn right and so will any other guy thats not impotent. But liking something we see and wanting to spend out life with them is not the same.

Now women tend to be wired differently than men so thats why so few of them can understand this. No offense but its just that a guys thought process is not the same as a womans. But it does explain why what a woman might see in a situation is not what a guy sees in the very same situation.


Looking at a woman, and liking what we see does not equal pursuing her.

Keep in mind if a guy choses to be with you and stay faithful to you its because he loves you. If he looks at another woman, likes what he sees it has nothing to do with you. As long as he isn't flirting with her. Looking is one thing (thats just hormones and guy genes)....BUT flirting takes it to a whole different level however and changes everything. You don't flirt with other women when you love the one you are with. That is uncool.

When I was single and not satisfied, yes. So, that's why I take it as an insult. I am satisfied sexually so I have no need for anything else. I take it to mean if the man I am with is "shopping" then he is not satified, and thus we would just be dating and not in a "relationship", he should date other people, get it out of his system. I don't want to go aroudn thinking I am the best if I am not, otherwise we'd both be settling for what we can get.



Just answer one question. Have you ever seen a good looking man and just wondered? If you answer no, never, you are not a human being!!!! All kidding aside, men AND women look. It is human nature. If you are with someone that lokks and says nothing about it then let it go but on the other hand if you are with someone that lokks and makes verbal comments, then kick the guy to the curb.

Men Look. Women look. If he is really turning his head... That might be problem. I have seen boyfriend glance at other women and I am fine with that. As long as he is not focusing on them. But I also get a lot of attention from men as well when I am around him. So I try not to worry about things like that. He's coming home with me!

Thanks KP:)
Well, that goes both ways does it not? I mean, if you have no standards then you are the puppet.

pregnant. De nada. Its nothing. =)