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dandy
Sep 1, 2005, 03:20 AM
Ok guys, first of all you'll excuse my english. I'm a foreigner but I've found this board very valuable...

Here's my situation. I'll try to be as short as possible..
I've been with my (ex?) girlfriend for almost 6 years. We used to be very close, everything went almost perfectly, we had at most 2 fights, only one serious, in all this time. We lived apart, and we met every w-end, since I came back to my parents' just to be with her. I'm 30, she's 26. She's about to graduate (don't be surprised. She's only 1 yr late, college graduation here comes at that age.. ), and I've been working for 5 years. Everything was normal, we had so much fun, we talked a lot, no crisis or fights whatsoever as I told you.
Everything was normal till she finished attending college, and she came back at her parents' moving from her university city where she used to live by herself with friends (and basically having fun all the time). Which was almost a year ago. Then, slowly, things started to change. I could almost feel some kind of distance very slowly growing between us, nothing serious but over time she became less caring, I would say, less "passionate".
Then we had our first two "crisis". She told me there was this guy she met which at first she found to be attracted to somehow. First time (last january) this thing was brought up, we decided to try to find our passion back, because she apparently absolutely didn't want to break up. Second time, this guy asked her out and she told me. I was quite shocked and told her that since she didn't refuse him at once (we were supposed to meet that night) that meant we were over, and closed the communication (phone). Then, texting each other all the afternoon, telling me she didn't want to throw past 5 yrs away, we finally went out and she told me that guy was nothing and (again) apparently we decided to go on.
Up until two weeks ago. I felt her distance, and brought up the issue. She told me she didn't feel the "passion" anymore, and wasn't sure why it was (I guess there can't be any ratio in passion, we here use to call it "butterflies in your stomach"... ). She told me the only way she could tell how she felt, was to take a break, and of course I agreed.
Now some facts.
1. She is writing her final essay (one yr work) and it's an analisys of the company I own. For many reasons I'm the only person she can refer to, so we're writing email each other on that subject. I'm trying to be as "professional" as possible. I'm also trying not to say anything personal in those emails. Just plain work stuff. And I take my time to return emails. But because of that, we haven't "cut" completely. No phone calls, no meetings.
2. She always freaked out when she was living with her parents. Apparently they're completely un-supporting, and they throw up on her a terrible pression. She doesn't go out often with friends of hers, she doesn't have any hobbies that could get her out of the house. She feels a terrible pression on her (she can't afford to live on her own) and told me that this thing could have had an impact on her feelings. But who knows.

So. Obviously, I'm devastated. I thought that once she graduated we could move in together.. but never made that clear not to add pressure on her. I tried to be as supportive as I could, I was as caring as I could. Reading around here, now I know this doesn't work.. I have the feeling that I became her older brother.. supportive, always there when she needed.. I rarely went out with my friends, although I had a LOT of occasions, just to stay with her, going out as a couple and basically doing routine things. I knew that if we had been where my friends were, we would have had a LOT more fun, but she rarely went over, since her parents didn't want her to stay out at night.
I think about her a lot. I'm really still in love with her, but I try to force me not to do anything to express that anymore. I try to keep the distance.. but I think I look almost "angry" in my emails, like it bothered me now. I try to go out, though it's not easy since I'm trying to get back to all the friends I lost in those years. But I still can't see my life w/out her.
I'm wondering if I'm doing the right thing... I'm wondering if I should text her or call her for her birthday which will be in a month.. I'm wondering if I should be more like "I'm happy anyway see I make jokes" in my emails, or stay put and be professional.
And I'm wondering if there is any possibility that she could come back..

Thanks a LOT for any advice or comment...
D

shenda
Sep 1, 2005, 08:04 AM
Change of atmosphere, environments influence the behavior of people. When she was away at college, she experienced a type of liberation, she was free to keep a schedule conducive to her liking; however, back at home, she is subjective to rules of the house. This indicates that she is a woman of integrity and respect, and honor; however, it is important for you to understand your role in this... in your mind, you create expectation without communication. You assumed that she would naturally move-in with you after graduation; however, you did not clearly offer her such an option. She returned home because she values security and stability, whereas she is willing to subject herself to a lifestyle befitting an adolescent. Her parent's may be pressuring her; however, what are you willing and able to do to alleviate this. Are you willing to have her merely kive with you, or are you ready, willing and able to make an honest woman out of her. Can you provide a stable atmosphere for her security. This concept of passion is blown out of the water... think about it... you saw each other during a small window of time, admittedly, in small fractions of time, we can endure, tolerate or enjoy most anyone; however, when that window of time increases, we are now able to see the person for who they truly are and not what we have created them to be. If you find that you can not relate to her on a pure professional level, advise her of this. At some point, the Truth must surface otherwise a season of "what if" will be you portion of life

Wildcat21
Sep 1, 2005, 09:22 AM
This is a really tough one.

I do agree with Shenda on the change of scenery - her moving in with her parents - not good. It appears her parents influence her a lot.

I also think it's the same old problem - you're too available her through communication.

After a while woman get VERY annoyed with text messaging.

I would have shut off all cimunication for a couple months. It may be too late and damge done by your e-mails - seriously.

I really think she IS seeing this other guy, but doesn't want to hurt you.

You also CAN NOT be angry in e-mails - you WILL chase her away. She ALWAYS wants a fun guy who makes her feel safe.

Here is the biggest problem - you are in a long distance relationship - they are extremely hard. I have no idea how you guys stayed in it for 6 years. After about a year someone has to move. You can't keep that up - you miss too much, it's too easy to cheat, you take each other for granted. She has taken you for granted. I am not sure she even knows the real you.

6 years is a long time too lose interst. You needed to be there more for her.

The only way she comes back is IF you shut off ALL communication for like 3 months. Make her miss you. Make her wonder. NO TEXT, NO E-mail.

Staying in contact moves you to the friend-zone.

It sounds like your too much of a 'nice guy' and maybe a little needy. You may have put this woman way too ahead of yourself and too much importance in her

Wildcat21
Sep 1, 2005, 09:53 AM
Also - because you've felt her pull-away - have you become a needy-clingy, soft?

You should have pulled away yourself. Given her space. I bet you came on stronger.

I also bet a ton of money you texted and called and e-mailed several times a day - bad for business.

Less of you is MORE in a woman's eyes.

dandy
Sep 1, 2005, 10:53 AM
Thanks a lot to both of your replies..
Wildcat, actually shutting off all communications is a bit difficult. As I said, I have to help her out in her final dissertation. We both, together, decided the subject of this work, and I gave my word I would be her reference. I know this sounds like "good guy", and it might be. But she went through a lot of difficulties to graduate, and I can't ignore her right now she's so close.
Apart from this "professional" contacts, nothing more. And, no, no more than 1 email per day, and actually only in response to her queries. The point is I tend to be "this thing is really bothering me. I do it just because I have to. I can't wait for it to finish", while I don't know if I should act more like the "cool guy", OK I email you but the way I write is more "confident", just like Ok I'm helping you out, but, see, our break-up doesn't really affect me, I'm always the fun one... what do you think works best?
In know about long distance relationships. We actually weren't that far, we lived about 40 miles away, we went out every w-end, sometimes she came over. But yes, the longest we stayed together was on a vacation. 2 weeks. And it was really fun. But, again, this were a vacation..
And I tend to agree it might be the "friend" thing. That's why it would be better off if we didn't hear from each other: but, again, there's this work to do.
I'm not the kind who gets needy-clingy when refused. In fact, I never tried to contact her ever after, just only if I really HAD to ask her something about the work. And wrote only on that matter.
But, I mean.. 6 years.. distance relationship, but not thousand of miles away.. You can't stay together for all this time just to fool around..
I think the whole point is about "taking me for granted". I never really gave her the possibility to think I might be cheating. I never gave her any doubt. I always said that if that happens (cheating), then be it, but never really gave the look it might actually happen..

Shenda.. thanks for your point of view. That might be possible, but actually I always tried to be supportive as far as I could go. I told her she could come stay at my place some days per week, to study, but she refused saying her parents wouldn't let her. Excuses? Might be, might be not, knowing who they are. And even in the very first times, when we were so close and passionate, just the very idea of programming the future, or thinking of, say, "grow up" in a way, really got her sick. She always stated that one has to live day by day. Yes, sometimes I think she's willing to live more like an adolescent, maybe she feels like she's lost something in these years, while her friends fooled around, but nobody (not me for sure) imposed anything. I always let her make her decisions, and respected them, and she did as well. In a way, I always thought this was the most "mature" relationship I've ever been into.
You see, all this "other guy" thing, I thought it was somehow a consequence of being at home, changing lifestyle completely, constantly being under pressure.. Like at some point she thought "wait a minute. I'm always doing what other people think I should do. I need to give it a try, make my mistakes, take my own decisions, find some space between my parents, my studies, and, why not, my boyfriend. Let's reset".. And I respect that, whatever consequence it might bear. Only thing, I'd prefer to have her back... While I can't shut off completely, though in the future days we'll need to hear from each other less frequently as she's finishing...

Really, really thanks to all of you...
D

Wildcat21
Sep 1, 2005, 11:10 AM
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

"wildcat, actually shutting off all communications is a bit difficult. As I said, I have to help her out in her final dissertation."

NO YOU DON'T!! She's a big girl and can do this her self. Make her do it herself - your busy.

This smells of DOORMAT! She wants to end it - yet she depends o nyou to help her - NO!

AND NO! It's not a good guy - it's a "nice guy" - you do not understand woman. You think this is the logical nice thing to do - nope... deep down she is repulsed by you now. She will never have feelings for you again by you sticking around. WOMAN don't want nice guys that will do anything for them.

You will never be with this woman again. Cut it off now - you're a busy guy. She is using you now.

You OWE HER NOTHING!! She can find some one else to help her.

You provided and STILL provide NO mystery for hr - "People want what they can't have" - she tries to end it, yet your still there - her faithful lap dog. Yuck!

Man, I just want to puke reading your last post. All these excuses for her - yuck - no wonder she sees another guy.

End all communicatins - I know you won't.

She wants a challenge and you don't provide it. She wants a man and you act like her girl friend.

dandy
Sep 1, 2005, 11:29 AM
I might be stubborn and all, but.. this work is on my company. She needs technical data, informations.. It's not the kind of help like "would you help me rehearse my speech?".. and we'll be finished in a week or so.. I don't know.. I mean, maybe I don't OWE her anything, but after all, this would be the last thing, a thing we already started, and for how much I still love her, I can't let her throw away another year in the college.
I actually am thinking that the good mix of all positions would be to answer her emails trying to be casual and funny, like "ok i'm helping you out but I don't need to ask or know anything more abt you, because I have my life and all". I know it sounds goofy, but, for God's sake, I've always been a smartass, I just need to get back to what I was before. Granted, the moment we're finished on this, I'll shut down.
(as a really small proof of my intentions, she already asked a phone call to clarify some point in her works, a request I never replied. Nor, of course, I called)
Thanks, wildcat... I guess I need some shaking..

Ps. I just re-read your last post. You know what? I'm scared as I think you might be right.. and there's no way to know who's actually right here..

Wildcat21
Sep 1, 2005, 12:43 PM
Ok, tell me how that works out for you.

Woman don't want nice. I assume you do not want to ever have a chance to get back with her?

I am not saying being mean to her, but be a man about this - but you have to change your actions now. You have to change - you turned her off some how.

I am not being mean here. It's tough love.

"I actually am thinking that the good mix of all positions would be to answer her emails trying to be casual and funny, like "OK I'm helping you out but I don't need to ask or know anything more about you, because I have my life and all". " - nope.

"I guess I need some shaking.." - yes.

dandy
Sep 2, 2005, 12:18 AM
Well, wildcat

I thought about it last night.
In the end, I think you're so right, and I'm wrong.

She's waiting for me to send her a doc. I'll send her that document, and I'll tell her that from now on I can't help her anymore, that I'm sure she'll understand, I don't feel like having any more contact thereafter. I'll give her somebody else to take as reference, she'll work this out by herself. All in all, this was all her decision.

I hope this is the best choice. After all, I guess this is the best decision for me, which at this time should be my top priority (just see where I'm heading, I don't even recognize myself.. ).

Thanks a LOT, really.
D

Wildcat21
Sep 2, 2005, 08:21 AM
If you don't screw it up it is the best choice.

She doesn't deserve your time tight now and she knows it.

dandy
Sep 5, 2005, 01:43 AM
Little update.

This morning I did it. I sent her the last doc she asked for, and I wrote that from now on, we can't hear from each other anymore, and so I can't help you anymore. Just like this, two lines.

The reply almost killed me.
She went something like "Ok, thanks. From your being cold I could understand we could not hear from each other ever again. But this is right, and there's nothing more to say. Take care, I'll work things out by myself".
I made a mistake, somewhere.. I didn't want her to take it this way.. I'm trying with all my willings not to reply her back, tell her that this was all her decision, explain why I've decided this...
I don't know.. maybe I should not reply anymore, but I didn't want for us to break up on these terms..

Wildcat21
Sep 5, 2005, 12:55 PM
The onlly things screwed up were before this point by being a push over/she walked all over you.

This is ANOTHER test, because she knows your going to come crying back. Hell, I know you're going to contact her again soon. She's playing you again.

Break ups are break ups. What terms? Ha! That's funny. I guess you want the 'friend zone'?

See, you need to prove you have a spine and you certainly don't now in her eyes.

She NEEDS your help and her - she knows you're a sucker and will come back. She's trying to manipulate her here.

I know if you wait this out you will hear from her.

She broke - all your doing now is getting yOUR power back - this takes time. You want something resolved today and that won't happen.