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This question is something that many of our young girls of today must ask themselves. It is a heart-wrenching question for any who contemplate it. Some really don’t know what to do because of the lack of maturity that only comes from experience and age. Some young ladies are only 12 years old, and very confused and frightened.

Society asks, why would anyone want to kill the life of any developing human within themselves? Why would any doctor, nurse or any professional person, who took an oath to do everything in their power to save life, now want to take a life? Answering this question might make some very angry at me but I must write this for the sake of the unborn and for the benefit of a young girl facing such a choice. There are reasons abortions are done everyday. One very main reason is selfishness either on the part of the parents and it might also be on the part of the expecting mother to be. Also they sometimes do not wish to take the responsibility for their choices and so now the unborn must pay the price for their bad actions.

Society feels in some cases it is better to avoid the consequences of the act and to take steps to conceal, rather then to talk about the problem of sexual intercourse and it being used as a pastime outside of marriage. Some want to enjoy sex fully, without taking responsibility of a natural consequence of sex, a baby! Abortion today is being used as form of birth control. This method of birth control is unfair to the unborn child and is just a plain sick method of shrugging ones responsibility and putting their own selfish desires before the life of the unborn. There is no respect for life in those who abort the innocent because they are addicted to the selfish desire of sexual pleasure then to show respect for life.

The Bible says: “In the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. For men will be lovers of themselves” and “lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God.” Is it not obvious that this condition prevails in our day?—2 Timothy 3:1-4.

Do you know that in the medical field and elsewhere the unborn baby is referred to as “the products of conception,” or what about “contents of the uterus”. Doctors who do abortion refer to the unborn as “contents of the uterus.” In the process of an abortion to make look less then killing, a doctor might ask the nurse, “Is the “content of the uterus” completed?” How sad when a unborn human is not even referred to anything but “content.” These ones that commit such horrific acts against the unborn, try to avoid the moral issue by calling an abortion “termination of pregnancy.” No matter what doctors and abortion clinics and those who go to them try to avoid, the fact remains is this: Abortion is the killing of an unborn human.

Just because the unborn is in the uterus does not make any difference. The abortion is done within 12 weeks of conception. What difference does it make though as to when a human is choked to death, 12 weeks after conception or 12 minutes after it is born into this world? Is not killing still killing? Many moral professionals have though quit their jobs because they could not stand seeing a helpless fetus that was aborted, suffer and struggle to live in a disposal container, while other doctors and nurses sit back and watch this fetus fight to live, until it can not fight any longer. What if that fetus was you?

Some claim that the fetus in not human yet and it doesn’t feel. If that is true, then why do some professionals quit their jobs because of seeing the aborted fetus struggle to live?
These same ones say the fetus is not human because it cannot live by itself. This is not a good argument because we have many adults and children, who depend on the use of an artificial kidney machine or the aid of a battery-powered heart pacemaker. These ones cannot live without the help of these machines. Does that make them less human and alive?

Medical professionals agree that life does begin at the moment of conception. I quote The World Book Encyclopedia, page 228b, has a photograph of an egg and sperm taken through a microscope. The caption over the photo says: “A human life begins when the sperm gets through the outer covering of an egg and fertilizes it.” After reading this from the world encyclopedia, can you personally say that the life snuffed out was not a live unborn human?

Remember this, if your mother aborted you, you would have ended up in a garbage can. As a human that was allowed to live and that did not get aborted as a fetus, do you personally regret that your mother was more concerned with the right for you to live and welcome you, then her rights to have an abortion? Then maybe you will feel for the unborn humans that get aborted every day in this world.

If you are a young lady and are faced with the choice of either becoming responsible for your unborn child, giving it up for adoption, or abortion, please read something I wrote that might help you in your choice. Thank you for reading it.

“Mommy, Can You Hear Me?”
By Hope12

“Today I was conceived. I do not have a name as of yet, but my life began today. I can’t wait to see you mommy and tell you how much I love you. I can’t wait for you to hold me in your arms.
Mommy, can you hear me?”

“I am really small, but guess what, I am really here, and I just can’t wait to touch your face and see your smile. I am yours and I am real.
Mommy, Can you hear me?

You should see me mommy I am really growing and getting stronger and stronger each day. Why I am so surprise, because I look and each day I find something new. Now don’t worry mommy, pretty soon I will see you and I know you will love me, because I already love you.”

Today I heard a loud beat, it was my heart and it beats strong. My heart will be important to my future because it will keep me alive when I am born and it will motivate me to always love you and do what is good, especially for you.”

“Mommy, can you hear me?”

Oh, my, what is this, it looks like my arms and legs are growing. I am going to have legs so I can run and jump into your arms. I’m really so excited.”

“Mommy can you hear me?”

I will soon grow so big for this place and I will need more room, and that is when I will be with you Mommy.” It is quit dark here and I can’t wait to feel the sunlight on my face and play outside with you

I wonder what color hair you have mommy? Are you tall or short? Don’t worry; I will love you no matter what you look like. Do you love me? Oh that a silly question because, “I love you mommy and I just know you will love me. I am such a strong and healthy little girl. I am also part of you mommy, so I guess I will be just like you. I think you are special and you are my mommy who I love and can’t wait to see. Mommy, can you hear me?”

“Wait, please wait, don’t do that it hurts real bad. What is going on? Ouch, oh my, I don’t feel so good, mommy. Something terrible is happening to me and it really hurts me.” Please Mommy, make it stop hurting, I’m so scared mommy. I really need your help mommy, something hurts me and it is making me cry.

Mommy, can you hear me?”

What is your comments and can you answer the question: Is this fair? If so to who?

Abortion has been debated here ad nauseum. Both sides aren't going to sway their opinion. A sappy poem meant about a blob of cells that can't talk won't help either. Maybe another story about alcoholic parents will yield better results.

Your picture says 1000 words, I fight the fight one life at a time.

But basically life has little meaning or purpose or value to many, and most lack respect for life so killing is very easy for them.

I don't think most humans lack a respect for life. I know of no people that would easily kill another. That's a very dim view of life on this planet. :(

Hope,
You'll need to read the correct usage of the Comment system:
https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/feedback/using-comments-feature-24951.html

I happen to agree here with NeedKarma, which may surprise him. I don't believe that what you wrote is going to bring out any new view points or perspectives from anyone. People have their opinions regarding abortion and that story isn't going to change it. I am certain that everyone has come to their own conclusions based on their own experiences. I am pro choice and I still do respect life. I respect the right of women to make their own choices and unless a baby is viable outside the womb, I don't see it any other way. Nothing you say will change that. Is is fair? It doesn't matter. People who are pro life believe no one should be able to make that choice, but what about in war? Life is life, so how do you justify one killing and not another? Either you believe in justifying it for your own beliefs or you don't. Also, why do you direct that question at only the girls? Does it not take a male and a female to create life (technically speaking)? Therefore, why are you putting the responsibility on girls to make the right choice, when you don't even direct the question to the guys who have to be part of that baby making process. I don't know how you can ask what is fair, when the question you asked isn't even fair.

Hello Again Hope,

I have very strong views and beliefs on this subject. Do I believe it is fair, no.

I actually go a step further and consider the abortion of a baby, murder.

It has been discussed in length many different threads and posts but I would like to say that here, in this instance I think it is very important for people to stand up and say, this is wrong to kill innocent babies.

I am not here to argue with anybody that has a different opinion or thoughts. This is exactly how I feel and most people know that I will state exactly what I think. Everybody has their different view points and feelings and thoughts on this.

Okay hope, good post.

Joe

I am pro-choice and I value life, I think it is wrong to say those who would abort have no respect for life. I also think it is wrong to say the reason behind it is selfishness. Each story has a different reason... abortion has many faces. Adoption has many faces. No face is the same and neither are any less difficult than the other. It really upsets me when I read this kind of thing... not because I think abortion is right or wrong, but because it means there are people who still expect the faces to be the same...

Of course we could write the same story with different players:

"Father, why did you hurt me?"
"I put my trust in you yet you stole my childhood."
"It hurts when you do that to me, how can you not see that?"
"I just wanted to be a altarboy, I had no idea you would violate every thing that is sacred as a priest."
"Mommy, Daddy, why did you trust this person, my mind is confused and I can no longer trust anyone."
"Why did his superiors hide the fact that there are thousands like me getting violated and abused?"

I don't think most people can say 100% what they would do unless they are in the situation themselves. I support the right of choice. No one should be forced to have an abortion, and no one should be forced to carry a baby they do not want in to this world. It's horrible that some women do use abortion as birth control (having unprotected sex with the idea that if they get pregnant, no biggie, go abort), but just because some people do such things doesn't mean we should all have to endure unwanted pregnancies. I don't think pro-choice people have no respect for life, and Chuck to make the implication that the choice to have an abortion is "easy for them" is insensitive and rude. You have never been in that position, you don't know the emotional turmoil that takes place. But, you are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine.

Here's an interesting article about pro-lifers having abortions, then going right back out to the picket line. The only moral abortion is my abortion, indeed.

"The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion" - When the Anti-Choice Choose (http://mypage.direct.ca/w/writer/anti-tales.html)

Hope,
You'll need to read the correct usage of the Comment system:
https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/feedback/using-comments-feature-24951.html

My apologies if I have used the site in bad form. I will watch that in the future.
Sincerely,
Hope 12

Hello Again Hope,

I have very strong views and beliefs on this subject. Do I believe it is fair, no.

I actually go a step further and consider the abortion of a baby, murder.

It has been discussed in length many different threads and posts but I would like to say that here, in this instance I think it is very important for people to stand up and say, this is wrong to kill innocent babies.

I am not here to argue with anybody that has a different opinion or thoughts. This is exactly how I feel and most people know that I will state exactly what I think. Everybody has their different view points and feelings and thoughts on this.

Okay hope, good post.

Joe

Hello Joe,
I definitely agree with your opinion on this matter. I feel that I can not just sit back and say that wrong is wrong, and abortion is truly murder dressed up with sympathy for the one who choices to abort the unborn.

I too am not here to argue but I have to state what I feel is right just as those who are for abortion give their view on the value of life in their opinion.

Thank you Joe for your reply and I agree.
Take care,
Hope12

Of course we could write the same story with different players:

"Father, why did you hurt me?"
"I put my trust in you yet you stole my childhood."
"It hurts when you do that to me, how can you not see that?"
"I just wanted to be a altarboy, I had no idea you would violate every thing that is sacred as a priest."
"Mommy, Daddy, why did you trust this person, my mind is confused and I can no longer trust anyone."
"Why did his superiors hide the fact that there are thousands like me getting violated and abused?"

I agree the preist are wrong and have violated children, yet two wrongs do not make a right. Abortion are ussually done because a baby is not wanted. The religious leaders molest children, mostly alter boys because they are sexual perverts. The issues are different in one is done to a child or teen against their will. A fetus is aborted because they have are not given a choice and are murdered because of a girl or women who either had sex of their own free will or was rapped. The difference here is the child being carried due to the sex act. Now if the women or girl was rapped, why would she also committ murder to the unborn fetus. The fetus did not rape her. Have the child and then give it to a couple who can not have children.

The other situation where the teen girl or women has sex just to fulfill a desire, and then can not deal with or face the consquences of their actioin, is selfish and a murderer. They had a choice to make then, either have protected sex if they were going to, or not, that was their choice. If another human should live or die, is not a choice any women, girl, man or boy have a right to make. Only God has that right.

Take care,
Hope12

I happen to agree here with NeedKarma, which may suprise him. I don't believe that what you wrote is going to bring out any new view points or perspectives from anyone. People have their opinions regarding abortion and that story isn't going to change it. I am certain that everyone has come to their own conclusions based on their own experiences. I am pro choice and I still do respect life. I respect the right of women to make their own choices and unless a baby is viable outside the womb, I don't see it any other way. Nothing you say will change that. Is is fair? It doesn't matter. People who are pro life believe no one should be able to make that choice, but what about in war? Life is life, so how do you justify one killing and not another? Either you believe in justifying it for your own beliefs or you don't. Also, why do you direct that question at only the girls? Does it not take a male and a female to create life (technically speaking)? Therefore, why are you putting the responsibility on girls to make the right choice, when you don't even direct the question to the guys who have to be part of that baby making process. I don't know how you can ask what is fair, when the question you asked isn't even fair.


I do not approve of killings of any kind. I do not approve of war nor would I kill another because the country I live in tells me to. Murder is murder. I do not go to war nor do any of those of my faith. I would rather go to jail or be killed myself then to kill another person. I am pro for what is right in God's eyes, not pro-choice. When it come to life and taking anothers life I believe that is not my choice or yours to make. So please know I am not pro-choice as society calls it.

My post is directed to all involved. Some parents encourage their daughters to get an abortion, this way they take the easier way out and don't have to face up to their responsibility as a parent and that is to teach their teen that teens should have sex within the marital arrangement. As to the guys that helped in that pregnancy, they sometime beg the girl to get an abortion and then after they think the problem for them is solved they leave the girl anyway. I agree that is wrong and he also as a teen should not be having sex. Why not teach the younger ones to have respect for their bodies.

My question is fair because everyone but the unborn fetus seems to have choices, only those who stand for what is right in God's eyes will take and try to see that a defenceless fetus has a chance to survive without being murdered. I am for what is right in God's eyes not public opinion nor what society feels is right. God watches out for all those who obey his laws and one of his laws is "Thou shall not kill." That covers abortions, and wars, and anything else where one hunan takes the life of another.

Take care,
Hope12

I can't even post what I really feel here.

I hope that Karma works with each of you that judges another's choice and deems it an easy, uncaring choice, regardless how hard it was for the person choosing.

worthbeads agrees: red balancer: When they kill the babies they don't think it's wrong. They may be evil, but hey don't do it intentionally.

Oops, I worded that wrong. A better way to say the end is "they don't necessarily know it's wrong.

I used to feel very strongly anti-abortion until I met a young woman, only 19, who had been her father's sexual victim since she was 12. Her mother fully knew what her father was doing to her and did not stop him. She had 5 pregnancies, starting at age 13. Four of the pregnancies self-aborted. One pregnancy made it until delivery and was born so badly deformed. The baby died within hours of birth. Now, should she have had the right to abort that baby within the first three months? I think so, knowing what the chances were that the baby would not be a healthy and normal child. Plus being brought up in that home.

So while I do not advocate abortion on demand or abortion as a birth control method, I do see circumstances where it is medically necessary. It is not as easy as black and white, or being cut and dried. How many of us have been in a situation that requires this personal decision?

I cannot comment on your poem, Hope. Things like that are overdone and does little to help someone in desperate need of understanding and compassion.

I used to feel very strongly anti-abortion until I met a young woman, only 19, who had been her father's sexual victim since she was 12. Her mother fully knew what her father was doing to her and did not stop him. She had 5 pregnancies, starting at age 13. Four of the pregnancies self-aborted. One pregnancy made it until delivery and was born so badly deformed. The baby died within hours of birth. Now, should she have had the right to abort that baby within the first three months? I think so, knowing what the chances were that the baby would not be a healthy and normal child. Plus being brought up in that home.

So while I do not advocate abortion on demand or abortion as a birth control method, I do see circumstances where it is medically necessary. It is not as easy as black and white, or being cut and dried. How many of us have been in a situation that requires this personal decision?

I cannot comment on your poem, Hope. Things like that are overdone and does little to help someone in desperate need of understanding and compassion.

Hello Shygreyzs,

I was born with Cerebral palsy, I was sexually abused as a young girl. I had to make a choice of keeping my son or aborting him. I kept my son. Why? Would he not remind me of the man who sexually attacked me. He might, but I had the spiritual training and counsel that made me realize the difference is that the unborn child had done nothing to hurt me and when I conceived my son was part of me. It was a very dificult time for me and I being disabled myself knew that there was a possibility that this child would be born deformed and yet I thought . I was born with disabilities and part of me is deformed. Yet I grew up as other kids did, things were harder for me to do, but I enjoyed life and living. The next thought was, if I abort this unborn child, what would be the reason? So I gave birth to my son Johnathan. My son lived a short time and then he died. Would I have changed my choice. No, I would not. I will one day see my son again but he will be healthy and strong. I believe in the resurrection by Jesus Christ. John 5:28,29. Revelation 21:1-5.

My son Johnathan did not rape me, a sexual pervert did. Why would I blame an innocent unborn person that is part of me. And if I had aborted him because he was deformed, then what's next, lets abort all those fetuses that will be born with brown eyes instead of the blue ones that parents want. Or what about those who might be born with down syndrome or other disablities? Who gave us the right to decide what unborn human should live or die?

There has to be laws that govern such things. At the time I was sexully attacked, I was scared, ashamed, I showered about 5 times a day, I would not eat, I hid from people. It was not easy, yet because of the love of my family and the love my God has taught me to have for my family, I realized that this unborn child was part of me and was part of the family. I learned that while the unborn is in the mother's uterus, they are growing and they are in the uterus because that is their protection until all their parts have been developed strong enough to live outside the uterus. God made the uterus as a protection for the growing baby,and if God thought to protect the unborn, what kind of a person would I be, as the mother of this unborn child.

Instead of spending so much money on abortions and teaching young children to protect themselve when they have sex, and passing out condoms in schools. Why not take the money from those programs and teach our children to respect their bodies and that sex is for within the marital arrangement. This then will possible cut down on sexual perverts that rape innocent children and also would leave more money for housing these perverts in prisions where they belong. The money saved can also get young women and girls who are attacked by sexual perverts the proper counsel that she needs. When a young girl is sexually abused she is treated like the criminal and like she did something wrong. Why not spend the time and money helping these young girls get the help they really need. No child should have sex, so why so many programs in the schools?

Parents need to also take back the sex education and put it back in the home where it belongs. When young girls like in you comments get raped by their own father who is suppose to protect that child, then why not get places young ones can go to for help?

Society has it all messed up, they are trying to deal with a problem that God has already dealt with. They poblem lies with the fact that when we start feeling we as humans know more then God does, we go down the wrong road. Two wrongs do not make a right. If a young person is raped then let's kill the consquences of that rape. I say it is wrong to deal with this situation the way society does. Abortions will only make matter worse. We as a society need to work what is good for all, the young girl, and the unborn fetus. Abortions are just a coverup of the consquences of wrong action on the part of another human. How we deal with those consquences will either help future generations or bring them even further away from humanity and compassion for others. The way that abortions are done today and so many of them it teaches future generations it is okay to kill and hate and be violent.

Here is my understanding for any women or girl claiming to believe in God or to follow God' s laws on such matters.

Ps. 139:13-16: “You kept me screened off in the belly of my mother. . . . Your eyes saw even the embryo of me, and in your book all its parts were down in writing.”

Has God ever stated that a person would be called to account for injury to an unborn child?

Ex. 21:22, 23: “In case men should struggle with each other and they really hurt a pregnant woman and her children do come out but no fatal accident occurs, he is to have damages imposed upon him without fail according to what the owner of the woman may lay upon him; and he must give it through the justices. But if a fatal accident should occur, then you must give soul for soul.”

Some translations make it appear that in this law to Israel the crucial matter was what happened to the mother, not to the fetus. The original Hebrew text, however, refers to a fatal accident to either mother or child.

How serious is the willful taking of a human life for a reason not authorized by God?

Gen. 9:6: “Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image he made man.”

So in conclusion God made all of us is my belief, so who am I to take anyone's life, especailly the life of an innocent unborn child, my child, Johnathan who I love and can't wait to see again. Why not listen to the one who created us and knows what is best for each of us and in all situations. If we listen, we might not have the problems our young ones are facing in today's world. Mankind is his very own worst enemy.

Take care,
Hope12

Hope,
In listening to your experience with such tragedy, I want you to know I respect and value your opinion and your decision. The ability to make the choice to keep your baby was yours to make and you did what you felt was right and necessary. NO one will disagree with that. I think your courage and your character, as a person, shine through and that your inner strength is something to be proud of and to share with others. With that said, I do not think this entitles you to make everyone feel the same way as you, or to have the same perspective. Part of being a child of God and recognizing your faith, means not placing judgment on those that are different than you. Maybe your opinion, your belief is one that doesn't include an acceptance of any killing or any death, that is an honorable way to live your life. However, that doesn't entitle you to enforce those beliefs on everyone around you. Maybe you see it one way, someone else's experience is different, and the outcome to their situation is different. Either way we were graced with the gift of free will. From the beginning of time, men and women alike have abused that right and have killed unnecessarily and harmed many, unmercifully. It isn't our job to judge that person. We have laws that society deems appropriate to deal with such abuse and murder. The law regarding abortion doesn't give anyone the right to kill a person, this is where your argument begins. The law protecting one's right to choose to terminate a pregnancy, is determined by the viability of the fetus. That meaning, if the fetus cannot survive outside of the womb, it is not considered a separate human being with rights. IT is still part of the woman's body and without the woman, the fetus could not survive. This is a much heated debate and will continue to be, because you assume that the fetus is a complete person like you or I. It is my OPINION, that if the child is viable outside the womb, it is then considered to be a separate entity and then is guaranteed the same rights as you or I. I am not saying that is everyone's perspective, but it is what I have come to find as true for me. Your situation, experience, heartbreak or tragedy doesn't change that for me. If my child was raped and couldn't live with herself by becoming a mother at a young age, by her attacker, than I would support her in choosing to abort. If she had sex before she should and became pregnant, and wanted to be the mother, I would support her. You assume that because someone is pro choice than that means that they would suggest abortion as the first and only means of resolving the issue. THat is simply an assumption based on your opinion. NOt everyone sees everything in such limited terms. IT depends on the circumstance and no one's situation is the same. Everyone doesn't have the same capacity to handle what you went through. I knew a girl in high school who was raped by her uncle and her family refused to let her get an abortion and she shot herself in the head. I don't know what the right thing was for her to do, but some people do not have the coping skills or the strength to endure such a painful situation. I am not preaching anything to my child except to be a good person, to value her body and to preserve herself and see herself as holy. I cannot say what she will do in the future, or if she will take heed to my advice. I don't think she will engage in sex but I cannot say for sure what she will do. Not everything is absolute and in a perfect world, maybe everyone will be able to handle themselves with the tenacity and courage that you have.
As far as what should be taught in school or at home, is again your opinion. All you can do is raise your family or your loved ones, to have the faith and resolve that you have and teach them what you think is right or wrong. CHildren learn about sex way before it is taught in schools and most of what they learn is from each other. Whether it is accurate or not is up to the parent to discuss with the child. Not every parent has the awareness, understanding, the skills, energy or time to have such discussions with their child. Most are trying to get through the work week, take care of their bills, their home and keep their children fed. Many people are living pay check to pay check and they don't realize the importance of teaching their children certain values, beiliefs or ways to build character. Even hundreds of years ago, children were raised by an entire village of people. Grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, siblings all helped each other. Many would utilize their own strengths and involve themselves in raising the children. In this day and age, many people are struggling, alone to raise their children. They don't have the ability to do it all, and this is where things have fallen apart. To judge the parent and to criticize how people raise their children, doesn't solve anything. If you want to help others, do it with compassion and understanding with the things you don't necessarily understand or agree with. This is what God wants. We can be messengers of hope, peace and love, without imposing our beliefs or judgments upon those that see it differently.
I too, do not believe in war. I respect life and I respect nature. I love people and I love animals. I do not believe that my views hinder that in any way. I teach my daughter to accept others for their differences and to embrace what she may not understand or be comfortable with. This is all I can do, that is my truth. I feel that God loves me and accepts me regardless of my beliefs, or my mistakes along the way. It isn't the destiny that is important, it is the process of living and learning.
As for as for me, God lives within and I answer to that and no one else. Your views are so narrow in scope because you equate the right to choose, with an acceptance of violence and hatred. This is not fair or true. I do not think one is determinate of the other and I do not believe that anyone preaches that abortion is the answer in any public forum. In fact, most schools are very limited in teaching about sexuality and the consequences of what happens if they engage in it. It is not a permission slip to go have sex. Whether a teenager decides to have sex with someone, isn't because they learned about it in school. Some of the most promiscious people are those that do not have a love of self, or any idea of what they want in life. This comes down to each individual's experience and what they have learned about themselves. We should be teaching our children about how to develop and nurture their gifts as humans and how to relate to those that are different. We should begin to bridge the gaps between those who are of another status, religion, race or orientation. We should teach our children about loving themselves and seeing themselves as good and worthy, so they don't look to things like sex for acceptance or love. To find solutions, we must begin with ourselves and our ability to accept that which we do not understand. NOt everyone views God, religion, the right to life or anything else like you, so we cannot impose that and expect positive results. YOu can preach all day about what you think is wrong and immoral and unethical, but it doesn't affect change, it creates discord. If we find ways to accept others, and their differences, we begin to find ways to connect and teach true compassion and forgiveness. Forgive what you don't understand, find ways of being supportive of that which you don't agree with, and look for solutions, rather than problems. This will enable you to help more people, to affect change and have us learn to unite through our differences. I am not trying to make you change your point of view, but make you see that yours isn't the only valid, or worthy one.
You sharing the loss of your beautiful son will touch many and will show how your love for him, was more important than what you were feeling or going through. It will also show your ability to accept what you didn't want, agree with, or understand. SO, maybe by you find it in your heart to use the same compassion that you did with your pregnancy, with those that do not have the same ability to endure what you did.

Hope,
In listening to your experience with such tragedy, I want you to know I respect and value your opinion and your decision. The ability to make the choice to keep your baby was yours to make and you did what you felt was right and necessary. NO one will disagree with that. I think your courage and your character, as a person, shine through and that your inner strength is something to be proud of and to share with others. With that said, I do not think this entitles you to make everyone feel the same way as you, or to have the same perspective. Part of being a child of God and recognizing your faith, means not placing judgment on those that are different than you. Maybe your opinion, your belief is one that doesn't include an acceptance of any killing or any death, that is an honorable way to live your life. However, that doesn't entitle you to enforce those beliefs on everyone around you. Maybe you see it one way, someone else's experience is different, and the outcome to their situation is different. Either way we were graced with the gift of free will
You sharing the loss of your beautiful son will touch many and will show how your love for him, was more important than what you were feeling or going through. It will also show your ability to accept what you didn't want, agree with, or understand. SO, maybe by you find it in your heart to use the same compassion that you did with your pregnancy, with those that do not have the same ability to endure what you did.


Some people have the gift of wording things in a way of not being offensive to others. You my friend have that gift. I have only what I have when it comes to my ability of explaining things in words. If you took offence at my words, please don't, I was not judging you or anyone else. Maybe what you took as offensive or judgemental of others, is just my lack of using words when writing my thoughts or opinions to others.

First, I am just a human as everyone is. I would never judge another, only God is our judge. You may have thought I am judgeing but maybe it comes across that way because of the inabiltiy to word things correctly or because of my sincere desire to help others who might be going through what I did. Also my strict religioius believes could also be taken as me being judgemental of others. You see in my religious beliefs there is no choice because of my adherence to God's laws. I truly believe in my heart that when it comes to God's laws, they take preference over my deed inner feelings. God protects the unborn from any harm and left laws which govern the unborn fetus. When I explained my experience and my decsion on having my son, it was not something I was judging others on or telling them what they should do. I am sorry if you felt that way, I did not mean it that way. I Was relating how I personally felt about my situation.

I Truly understand that not everyone has the same feeling or capacity to deal with such things however I was expressing how I dealt with it and why. I had to answer to God for my decsion just as everyone else does. My purpose was never to create discord. My adherence to my understanding of what God's guidance with my decsion might cause some to misunderstand that and that is what causes discord and bad feelings.

I believe that compassion and love is shown by never doing anything that will harm another. If you feel that life because of not being able to survive out or the mothers womb is not life, I respect your right to that belief. I though believe differently because I believe according to the scriptures God went and made laws to protect the unborn and he would not have done that if the unborn was not considered alive in the mothers womb. But as you so nicely expressed we all will have our own beliefs on that point. Does that make anyone of us less compassionate or loving in our heart because others can not understand where we personally are coming from or what we personally believe in our heart? I say no, because when one truly believes a matter deep down in their heart, they govern their life by it, and they express themselves showing that they truly believe what they are saying or expressing.

I would never intentionly be judgmental of others, I am just someone who loves others and because I believe in my heart what I express in my opinion, does not make me lack understanding of what others face. It just show the love I have for others because I myself have already experienced the pain, and emotions that are involved in such issues as abortion. Those who have faced such horrific things as being sexually attacked or having had to face agony of being pregnant when just a child themselves, wants to make the pain and hurt easier for those facing it at present.. No my friend, I do not lack understanding or love or compassion, but it is those qualities that so much wants me to rid this world of such pain so not one other young girl will have to face such a horrible situation.

The only way I know how to do that is to stand up for what I feel is right, not in my eyes or in societies eyes, but in the eyes of the one who created us and knows what is best for us. If that makes me come across as judging others, then my apologies to you, because I do not judge you, nor anyone elese. God is our judge. My purpose in writing my original post was to draw attention to another means of dealing with unwanted pregnancy and unwanted babies. It was not to judge others. As to my beliefs they are my beliefs and I have expressed them, maybe not with such writing ability as you have, but it is my opinion and if that helps one persons pain to be less, then I have accomplished my purpose.

I do agree with some of what you have stated, I too teach my daughter to respect life and to not have sex until she meets the right guy and gets married. I do though feel that understanding is not the same as compromising what we feel is right and what is wrong in our Creators eyes. If I truly believe in what my God has taught me, then I will bridge the gap between me and others, not by changing my belief or compromising what I believe to be right, but I will bridge that gap by the love that is in my heart for them. God loves all humans, who would I be to hate any or judge any? Compassion only comes if one has love. Just because one does not accept a matter because they feel it to be wrong, does not mean they do not understand or have empathy. One can find the good in all situations and still not compromise their own stand on any situation. That takes love, compassion and understanding.

Again my apologies if I came across as judging anyone, that is not my intentions nor for me to do. Thank you for your expressions and opinion.

Take care,
Hope12

Hope, we all have choices to make in life, that is what it is all about. We choose our reality, our responses, our lifestyle, our outlook and our beliefs or perspectives. This is what the gift of free will is. This is what we were born with. For you to take your own choices and explain them as God's truth, means that it is only your perception of what God wants for us.This eliminates anyone else's views, experiences, or beliefs.
Moreover, To equate the right to choose with hatred and violence, assumes that one must be hateful and violent to make such a choice. YOu don't have to agree with it, or accept it as right, but when you direct that to everyone else, this becomes judgmental.

What you believe is right and wrong is different than what others believe. This is also based on previous experiences, dynamics and consequences that you have had in the past that have led you to believe what right and wrong is.
IF God created us with the ability to make our own choices, don't you think we ourselves would have to determine which ones are "good or bad" or "right or wrong"? What if there really isn't any absolutes and it is all about perspectives? Well that would mean that God would love us regardless of our choices, actions or beliefs about what is morally ethical or acceptable. The power is not on some throne waiting to judge us, the power is within. WE can either take responsibility for it, or put it on God.

We are all given life, regardless of our circumstances, and what we do with it, is up to us. (For the most part)
Further, I think that your are well intentioned and you speak just as effectively as I do. I just don't think you realize that when you take what you believe as true and right, and want everyone else to view it the same way, this is viewed as judgmental. This is because you think their perceptions are flawed and yours is the correct one. That is what YOU believe. IF they don't have the same upbringing, experiences, knowledge, belief system or religion as you, how can you expect other people to think just like you? Many people will agree with you and that is great, but you are trying to reach out and tell everyone that abortion is murder and it is your duty to tell all of us. Well, you can tell us your opinion, but it is no one's duty to make anyone believe anything. I don't think I have anything more valuable to offer to this post, than anyone else, but I just feel like standing up for those of us who do think of this subject much differently than you, and for many different reasons.
All in all, I think you want to help and be compassionate and loving. However, the way you are presenting your opinion, makes it difficult for those that think different to feel that it isn't an attack on our perception or beliefs. We have to embrace what we don't understand or agree with, to be truly compassionate. To say that you are being compassionate, but than imposing your views as the only correct one, is hyppocritical. It isn't your responsibility to make everyone think or be like you. You can live out your truth in your own life and respect that of others at the same time. I think you believe you are saving someone out there from making a choice that you see as a horrible situation. YOur intention is good. IF I personally read your post and was dealing with this decision, it would make me feel more resolved in making my own choice of what to do with my life, my body and my future. I don't feel it is anyone's else's business but mine and the person I am involved with. This is my own perspective but I don't expect anyone else to agree with it or accept it as their truth. That is the difference between you and I. I believe we both want to help people and do right by others, I just don't impose my morality on others and then justify it by my religion or what God laws are.

I don't think God will punish us, we punish ourselves. YOu said it best, we are our own worst enemy. Not God. So, we all have to answer to ourselves. WE have to look in the mirror and face who we really are. That is who we have to answer to here. If we live a life of integrity and try to be the best that we can be, what else can we do? WE are human after all. Born to make the mistakes, feel the effects, and travel the journey of life, and realize the goodness within. Regardless, of our individual choices.

Wow, you guys always seem to amaze and impress me with your thoughts on serious issues. Lot of things said here to put into my brain. I am pro-choice realistically (my husband would die if he heard me say this) I am very pro-choice for life but not anti-abortion. Although there are definitely certain things that help me understand why a woman would go through with an abortion, it doesn't mean we have to agree with it. Some are good people in bad situations and some are selfish people in other types of situations. What about the girl that is embarrassed about being pregnant, that is not a good enough reason, at least not to me it isn't, the girl that got pregnant by her day over and over, there you go, I understand that. The girl or woman that got raped, well, I guess I would have to walk a mile in those shoes before I would be able to have an opinion on that. But the selfish acts and the "just because I want to and can" acts are killing me inside. Good answers, ALL of you

I used to be staunchly pro-life and am now singing a different tune. Having an abortion is no easy choice to make, and whatever the reason for that choice, I don't think it should be limited. Do you really want children to be raised by parents who hate them? How do you feel about the fact that making it illegal will not prevent it from happening, but will make it more dangerous? What about the fact that after it was legalized, the rate of infanticide plumetted? Should a woman be forced to carry to term a fetus that has little chance of surviving and can actually cause her to die?

I would say that there is a huge difference between abortion and infanticide because a fetus at 12 weeks doesn't feel pain and a baby does. I would say that legal abortion, for as gross as it may seem, actually has more benefits to society than making it illegal.

http://images.43things.com/entry/278835pw91.jpg



This question is something that many of our young girls of today must ask themselves. It is a heart-wrenching question for any who contemplate it. Some really don’t know what to do because of the lack of maturity that only comes from experience and age. Some young ladies are only 12 years old, and very confused and frightened.

Society asks, why would anyone want to kill the life of any developing human within themselves? Why would any doctor, nurse or any professional person, who took an oath to do everything in their power to save life, now want to take a life? Answering this question might make some very angry at me but I must write this for the sake of the unborn and for the benefit of a young girl facing such a choice. There are reasons why abortions are done everyday. One very main reason is selfishness either on the part of the parents and it might also be on the part of the expecting mother to be. Also they sometimes do not wish to take the responsibility for their choices and so now the unborn must pay the price for their bad actions.

Society feels in some cases it is better to avoid the consequences of the act and to take steps to conceal, rather then to talk about the problem of sexual intercourse and it being used as a pastime outside of marriage. Some want to enjoy sex fully, without taking responsibility of a natural consequence of sex, a baby! Abortion today is being used as form of birth control. This method of birth control is unfair to the unborn child and is just a plain sick method of shrugging ones responsibility and putting their own selfish desires before the life of the unborn. There is no respect for life in those who abort the innocent because they are addicted to the selfish desire of sexual pleasure then to show respect for life.

The Bible says: “In the last days critical times hard to deal with will be here. For men will be lovers of themselves” and “lovers of pleasures rather than lovers of God.” Is it not obvious that this condition prevails in our day?—2 Timothy 3:1-4.

Do you know that in the medical field and elsewhere the unborn baby is referred to as “the products of conception,” or what about “contents of the uterus”. Doctors who do abortion refer to the unborn as “contents of the uterus.” In the process of an abortion to make look less then killing, a doctor might ask the nurse, “Is the “content of the uterus” completed?” How sad when a unborn human is not even referred to anything but “content.” These ones that commit such horrific acts against the unborn, try to avoid the moral issue by calling an abortion “termination of pregnancy.” No matter what doctors and abortion clinics and those who go to them try to avoid, the fact remains is this: Abortion is the killing of an unborn human.

Just because the unborn is in the uterus does not make any difference. The abortion is done within 12 weeks of conception. What difference does it make though as to when a human is choked to death, 12 weeks after conception or 12 minutes after it is born into this world? Is not killing still killing? Many moral professionals have though quit their jobs because they could not stand seeing a helpless fetus that was aborted, suffer and struggle to live in a disposal container, while other doctors and nurses sit back and watch this fetus fight to live, until it can not fight any longer. What if that fetus was you?

Some claim that the fetus in not human yet and it doesn’t feel. If that is true, then why do some professionals quit their jobs because of seeing the aborted fetus struggle to live?
These same ones say the fetus is not human because it cannot live by itself. This is not a good argument because we have many adults and children, who depend on the use of an artificial kidney machine or the aid of a battery-powered heart pacemaker. These ones cannot live without the help of these machines. Does that make them less human and alive?

Medical professionals agree that life does begin at the moment of conception. I quote The World Book Encyclopedia, page 228b, has a photograph of an egg and sperm taken through a microscope. The caption over the photo says: “A human life begins when the sperm gets through the outer covering of an egg and fertilizes it.” After reading this from the world encyclopedia, can you personally say that the life snuffed out was not a live unborn human?

Remember this, if your mother aborted you, you would have ended up in a garbage can. As a human that was allowed to live and that did not get aborted as a fetus, do you personally regret that your mother was more concerned with the right for you to live and welcome you, then her rights to have an abortion? Then maybe you will feel for the unborn humans that get aborted each and every day in this world.

If you are a young lady and are faced with the choice of either becoming responsible for your unborn child, giving it up for adoption, or abortion, please read something I wrote that might help you in your choice. Thank you for reading it.

“Mommy, Can You Hear Me?”
By Hope12

“Today I was conceived. I do not have a name as of yet, but my life began today. I can’t wait to see you mommy and tell you how much I love you. I can’t wait for you to hold me in your arms.
Mommy, can you hear me?”

“I am really small, but guess what, I am really here, and I just can’t wait to touch your face and see your smile. I am yours and I am real.
Mommy, Can you hear me?

You should see me mommy I am really growing and getting stronger and stronger each day. Why I am so surprise, because I look and each day I find something new. Now don’t worry mommy, pretty soon I will see you and I know you will love me, because I already love you.”

Today I heard a loud beat, it was my heart and it beats strong. My heart will be important to my future because it will keep me alive when I am born and it will motivate me to always love you and do what is good, especially for you.”

“Mommy, can you hear me?”

Oh, my, what is this, it looks like my arms and legs are growing. I am going to have legs so I can run and jump into your arms. I’m really so excited.”

“Mommy can you hear me?”

I will soon grow so big for this place and I will need more room, and that is when I will be with you Mommy.” It is quit dark here and I can’t wait to feel the sunlight on my face and play outside with you

I wonder what color hair you have mommy? Are you tall or short? Don’t worry; I will love you no matter what you look like. Do you love me? Oh that a silly question because, “I love you mommy and I just know you will love me. I am such a strong and healthy little girl. I am also part of you mommy, so I guess I will be just like you. I think you are special and you are my mommy who I love and can’t wait to see. Mommy, can you hear me?”

“Wait, please wait, don’t do that it hurts real bad. What is going on? Ouch, oh my, I don’t feel so good, mommy. Something terrible is happening to me and it really hurts me.” Please Mommy, make it stop hurting, I’m so scared mommy. I really need your help mommy, something hurts me and it is making me cry.

Mommy, can you hear me?”

What is your comments and can you answer the question: Is this fair? If so to who?
Amen! Hope12 has a heart for humans and a desire to help others know they can have true peace by having the baby and giving him up for adoption or keeping the baby and entrusting this life to Christ. God promises He will never leave us nor forsake us. That is sooooo cool. He knows every single need and He loves us more than anyone on the face of this earth. I work at a pregnancy center teaching "relationship" classes to young pregnant moms. The joy of a person making a decision to keep their baby and to accept the help of our center is beyond words. Only God can work this out and we grow stronger every time we see his outcomes, not ours. That's how faith in Him grows. The relationship classes teach youg women HOW to date. Contrary to what the world teaches, God has an awesome plan for relationships that involves getting to know one another and having Him as the Head of that relationship. This means abstinence! Until married. Oh wow that's where these girls look at me like "you certainly are a fossil!"... their generation has not heard much about abstinence. As long as we act on our "feelings" and do whatever we wish without considering God, life will be very tough. Let me make myself clear. God did not promise a life without pain and suffering but He did promise that He will be with us in all situations and will give us discernment and love beyond comprehension when we decide to place Him over our lives. Embrace Him today and feel freedom like you have never experienced. He loves these unborn babies and He loves these young moms and wants the best for them. He knows us even before we are born and has a plan for our future. Now that's exciting!

Amen! Hope12 has a heart for humans and a desire to help others know they can have true peace by having the baby and giving him up for adoption or keeping the baby and entrusting this life to Christ.

I haven't had a day of "true peace" in the 15 years since I place my child for adoption.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

That isn't to say that abortion would have been a better choice--but let's give people their options, hmmm?

If "God has a plan for each of us" (I'm not Christian, btw), why don't you leave it between him and the person making the choice? I'm sure that those mothers choosing to abort because their child is already dead inside of them resent you judging them for making what is probably the hardest choice they'd ever have to make.

I disagree about holding sex until marriage--Frankly, sex is such an important part of marriage that, like living together, I'd want to make SURE of before I made a lifelong commitment to someone.

Want to get a better handle on unwanted pregnancies? Start teaching kids how their bodies really work in sex ed, and teach birth control. Studies have shown that teaching abstinence hasn't helped in the least.

Abortion is murder, and it all can be avoided if MEN would recognise, and be responsible for their actions. Do the deed, pay the cost.

Can open... worms everywhere!

Surely the whole point here is the question of choice? People can make their own minds up either way, with the help of their own family / friends / faith / religion / conscience!

Saying it's murder is a very harsh way of looking at it... surely you can see there are times when it HAS to be an option at least?

Good discussion though!

**edit** Oh, and I don't think that blaming men for it all is right either!

Abortion is murder, and it all can be avoided if MEN would recognise, and be reponsible for their actions. Do the deed, pay the cost.
Not all abortions are because men want the girls to have them.

On this subject I can only speak for ME.

On this subject I can only speak for ME.
But, you spoke for the women that had no man telling them to get an abortion. So not all abortions are equal, you see?

No I don't! Getting an abortion is not something I would tell any one let alone a female.

Let me ask if aborting a fetus with anecephaly is considered murder. Anecephaly is a cephalic disorder that results from a neural tube defect that occurs when the cephalic (head) end of the neural tube fails to close, usually between the 23rd and 26th day of pregnancy, resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, skull, and scalp. Infants with this disorder are born without a forebrain, the largest part of the brain consisting mainly of the cerebral hemispheres (which include the isocortex, which is responsible for higher level cognition. The remaining brain tissue is often exposed - not covered by bone or skin.

These children typically do not live one hour after birth, if they live this long.

Is this murder if the woman chooses abortion then?

Does no one believe there may be medical reasons for abortion?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Anencephaly_side.jpg/180px-Anencephaly_side.jpg

Is it murder to have an abortion when you know that this baby will not live but a few hours at most?

I believe there are medical AND emotional reasons for abortion. I do not agree with the just because abortions.

I don't believe that abortion should be a form of birth control. But I believe there are reasons for it.

Yup, same here. A reason like it was an accidental pregnancy is not reason enough for me but if someone was to have BIG problems (health) while being pregnant, I can see why someone would make that choice, OR incest or rape may qualify too. At least in my heart.

I believe there are medical AND emotional reasons for abortion. I do not agree with the just because abortions.

But you can't have it both ways. You can't just pick who can terminate and who can't. It's sad that there are women who have so little respect for their bodies and future that they would rather abort than use a condom or take the pill. But you can't tell those women they aren't allowed to abort, but other women are. It has to be an option for everyone, no matter what their reasoning is.

Well said, Hope12. I have seen a fetus struggling in a specimen pan folloiwng an attempted abortion. It is embedded in my mind and has made me aware of how precious life is. We live in an age where being responsible for our actions is fading away. It's always someone else's fault when things go wrong. When a young girl gets pregnant and is disappointed, frightened, embarrassed, why is that? If we learn to love one another and not lust one another it wouldn't be so complicated. Real love is not selfish. Real love is patient. Real love puts the other person first. Real love wants the best for the other person. Real love lasts respects the other person's opinions. Real love is not based on just feelings alone but on the big picture - savoring the uniqueness of the person we love, just as they are, through good times and bad. There seems to be a "disposable" mentality when it comes to relationships today. Whatever happened to commitment?

So far it seems that everyone is looking at abortion as a form of birth control. Has anyone else considered that abortion may be used for other reasons?

I didn't think so.

But you can't have it both ways. You can't just pick and choose who can terminate and who can't. It's sad that there are women who have so little respect for their bodies and future that they would rather abort than use a condom or take the pill. But you can't tell those women they aren't allowed to abort, but other women are. It has to be an option for everyone, no matter what their reasoning is.
I know, it sure is sad... BUT true...
J, not sure if you noticed but I pretty much said the same thing. There are many reasons that a woman may want to make this choice and it would be dangerous for us not to let them have that right. Even though many of us feel like it is the wrong reason for it, or not a good enough one. I had a friend in high school, she got pregnant, and because of her heath issues and what not, she was advised to have an abortion. Death would become her or the baby, she got the abortion, even though she could have died carrying that baby, she still has guilt. Poor girl, I felt like there was nothing I could do ever to help her get through but to give her many hugs and I love you's!

Jillian always seems to have the "right" answer.

Jillian always seems to have the "right" answer.

It's because I'm so smart; S-M-R-T! I mean, S-M-A-R-T! :D

It's because I'm so smart; S-M-R-T! I mean, S-M-A-R-T! :D

Yes, girl, you are!! :D :D :D

And level headed too!! :p

As a man I'm glad it ain't my call. But I stand behind my woman's choice. That doesn't mean I agree, or like it.

Not all abortions are because men want the girls to have them.
This is true but it stll is murder. No matter what, not you nor I nor anyone else has the right to take the life of another. Abortion is just the worlds way of placing the wrong actions of another on the innocent. Their solution is to rid the situation of the innocent one so the causer of the situation in the first place can do their own thing. Where is the fairness in that kind of solution. Isn't that only fair to those able to protect themselves. What about the helpless human waiting to be born, who protects them?
Jadona2006

How far back do you want to take this argument then?
When the egg begins dividing?
When the sperm reaches the egg and begins fertilization?
The point of ejaculation?
The point where the egg and sperm are created?

Is the morning-after pill murder? Is wearing a condom? How about having a vasectomy?

Hope, you cannot murder something that is not conscious. There is not evidence that a fetus can feel pain until 24-28 weeks.

I agree with the post above. When does it stop becoming murder? Are the billions of men who masturbate murderers? A sperm could turn into a life, too, so is each ejaculation of semen a massacre?

When it comes down to it, it is better for society to allow abortion; however, I do agree that we should do all we can to prevent abortion through education.

Hope, while you are entitled to your belief that a clump of cells is a valid human being--it is just that, a BELIEF.

I personally believe that until that clump of cells is a fetus, and is viable outside of its mothers body, that it is JUST A CLUMP OF CELLS.

I am trying desperately to get pregnant. I placed a child for adoption. I STILL believe that choosing abortion is no more callous and selfish in some cases than choosing to get cancer removed from your body. When one chooses abortion they are choosing to get rid of a GROWTH that is UNWANTED and can affect one's health and sanity.

I am not imposing my beliefs on you. If you don't want an abortion, by all means don't get one. I didn't get one either, because I thought that little life should have a chance. I don't, however, run around imposing my beliefs on other people because I disagree with them. Legal abortion = SAFE abortion, and there are enough valid reasons to get an abortion that it needs to stay legal. Of course some people abuse that--just like people abuse the Welfare System. That doesn't mean it should be gotten rid of entirely because SOME people abuse it.

If you don't like abortion - GREAT! It's a free country, and luckily, you can believe what you want.

If you start trying to make it illegal, I'll be forced to stand up to you and fight to keep it legal.

As to your argument that women who choose abortion are murderers--are you going to start putting them on trial for that? And if that's the case, are you going to try women who have miscarried for manslaughter (which is, of course, accidental death)?

You can not possibly imagine what goes through the mind of a woman who chooses abortion. Please stop assuming that everyone is just aborting fetuses left and right because it's "inconvenient". Every woman I know that has had an abortion, did it for health reasons.

I'll pray for you, since you obviously have problems with the whole idea that God will judge men and women for their hard choices, not you.

I remember driving by an abortion clinic with people standing outside with their signs and their retoric and full of rage. I stopped and tried to see what the commotion was. They were all trying to stop a woman from entering the clinic and she was crying so hard. I had to get out of my car and defend her. This situation frightened and appalled me. These people were so cruel and angry. I don't know how they can preach in God's name. IT IS NOT AN EASY DECISION FOR ANYONE TO MAKE. Being a parent is the most difficult and challenging thing that anyone can ever do. To dictate your beliefs and your values to others is not only counterproductive, it is also often hurtful. NOt only do you disagree with abortion, but you put everyone who has one in the same category. If one does believe that life begins at conception, that is an OPINION> If one doesn't it is a different OPINION. We are not going to change our beliefs because of YOUR OPINIONS. IF you want to save someone, than help the children that are already alive without parents. There are plenty of them around to choose from. Trying to have control over someone's else body, that is the most invasive and unhealthy thing to do. You have a right to your beliefs, so do those that think and choose differently. God gave us our own bodies, and our own ability to decide what to do with them. There are limits to what is appropriate and what is ethical. The standard by which you apply it, is subject to each individual's perception of what they believe in. Nobody is saying abortion is the answer, we are saying it is an option that has been used since the beginning of time and to ensure the safety of women, we must keep it safe and legal. Women will abort babies whether they are legal or not. It isn't a matter of opinion, it is a fact. That fact makes it our responsibility to make sure it is done in a way that is safe for the woman, and that it occurs BEFORE viability.

Hope, you still have not answered this question. Is it murder if the child will be born dead? Don't you believe that in medical situations that it sometimes may be necessary?

See the baby in this picture? It is a real baby with absolutely NO chance for survival.


Let me ask if aborting a fetus with anecephaly is considered murder. Anecephaly is a cephalic disorder that results from a neural tube defect that occurs when the cephalic (head) end of the neural tube fails to close, usually between the 23rd and 26th day of pregnancy, resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, skull, and scalp. Infants with this disorder are born without a forebrain, the largest part of the brain consisting mainly of the cerebral hemispheres (which include the isocortex, which is responsible for higher level cognition. The remaining brain tissue is often exposed - not covered by bone or skin.

These children typically do not live one hour after birth, if they live this long.

Is this murder if the woman chooses abortion then?

Does no one believe there may be medical reasons for abortion?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Anencephaly_side.jpg/180px-Anencephaly_side.jpg

Is it murder to have an abortion when you know that this baby will not live but a few hours at most?

I think its very clear that there can be some valid reasons for terminating a pregnancy, and we must also recognise that there are some very selfish ones also. They shoot horses to keep them from suffering, and doctors can go to prison for helping the terminally ill die painlessly with dignity. Life may not have the same value to all and it may not be fair to label all females that have abortions murderers, but I think the facts will support that most of them, the selfish or foolish ones, can wear the label, and I can make no excuses for that, that they have brought knowingly on themselves. My apology for broadbrushing ALL females.

Ok, so then there are those babies that are doomed inside us... they are born... and with mercy and miracles... they begin to eat, drink, sleep, grow, talk, walk, tell you they love us... ahhh... the stories I have heard and the things I have gone through to see these miracles... You just never know... this is a very hard subject because by no means would I want to see a child die...
EDIT::::
Especially one that may live a good life... A good life can be different for all of us...
But for the doomed and cannot be born... I would understand...

"The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion" - When the Anti-Choice Choose (http://mypage.direct.ca/w/writer/anti-tales.html)

To sum up a terrific article... to most people, the only moral abortion is their OWN abortion.

Until you are faced with the choice you DO NOT KNOW how you will decide. Period. Many anti-abortionists and right-to-lifers have had abortions, their only horror was the idea that their peers would find out.

This is very true... what you say Synn..

It takes a sperm and an egg. Life begins AT CONCEPTION not merely ejaculation as in masturbation. There is a fetal heart beating audibly on ultrasound around 8 weeks. There is a human life there. It is a miracle! For those that have had abortions, God wipes the slate clean and does not carry around a list of people who have made wrong choices. ALL of us have and still make wrong choices every day. Some abortions are medically necessary. Others are not. We can't judge others.

I argue that abortion should be unrestricted until there is evidence that the fetus feels pain.

Hope, we all have choices to make in life, that is what it is all about. We choose our reality, our responses, our lifestyle, our outlook and our beliefs or perspectives. This is what the gift of free will is. This is what we were born with. For you to take your own choices and explain them as God's truth, means that it is only your perception of what God wants for us.This eliminates anyone else's views, experiences, or beliefs.
Moreover, To equate the right to choose with hatred and violence, assumes that one must be hateful and violent to make such a choice. YOu don't have to agree with it, or accept it as right, but when you direct that to everyone else, this becomes judgmental.

What you believe is right and wrong is different than what others believe. This is also based on previous experiences, dynamics and consequences that you have had in the past that have led you to believe what right and wrong is.
IF God created us with the ability to make our own choices, don't you think we ourselves would have to determine which ones are "good or bad" or "right or wrong"? What if there really isn't any absolutes and it is all about perspectives? Well that would mean that God would love us regardless of our choices, actions or beliefs about what is morally ethical or acceptable. The power is not on some throne waiting to judge us, the power is within. WE can either take responsibility for it, or put it on God.

We are all given life, regardless of our circumstances, and what we do with it, is up to us. (For the most part)
Further, I think that your are well intentioned and you speak just as effectively as I do. I just don't think you realize that when you take what you believe as true and right, and want everyone else to view it the same way, this is viewed as judgmental. This is because you think their perceptions are flawed and yours is the correct one. That is what YOU believe. IF they don't have the same upbringing, experiences, knowledge, belief system or religion as you, how can you expect other people to think just like you? Many people will agree with you and that is great, but you are trying to reach out and tell everyone that abortion is murder and it is your duty to tell all of us. Well, you can tell us your opinion, but it is no one's duty to make anyone believe anything. I don't think I have anything more valuable to offer to this post, than anyone else, but I just feel like standing up for those of us who do think of this subject much differently than you, and for many different reasons.
All in all, I think you want to help and be compassionate and loving. However, the way you are presenting your opinion, makes it difficult for those that think different to feel that it isn't an attack on our perception or beliefs. We have to embrace what we don't understand or agree with, to be truly compassionate. To say that you are being compassionate, but than imposing your views as the only correct one, is hyppocritical. It isn't your responsiblity to make everyone think or be like you. You can live out your truth in your own life and respect that of others at the same time. I think you believe you are saving someone out there from making a choice that you see as a horrible situation. YOur intention is good. IF I personally read your post and was dealing with this decision, it would make me feel more resolved in making my own choice of what to do with my life, my body and my future. I don't feel it is anyone's else's business but mine and the person I am involved with. This is my own perspective but I don't expect anyone else to agree with it or accept it as their truth. That is the difference between you and I. I believe we both want to help people and do right by others, I just don't impose my morality on others and then justify it by my religion or what God laws are.

I don't think God will punish us, we punish ourselves. YOu said it best, we are our own worst enemy. Not God. So, we all have to answer to ourselves. WE have to look in the mirror and face who we really are. That is who we have to answer to here. If we live a life of integrity and try to be the best that we can be, what else can we do? WE are human after all. Born to make the mistakes, feel the effects, and travel the journey of life, and realize the goodness within. Regardless, of our individual choices.

Hello Again,

What I have stated in the past is my opinion and how I express it is the best way, I know how too. If one takes offence because of my opinions and expresses that offense as if I am judgemental and wanting everyonue to change to my way, are they not being judgemental of me?

I have free will as you or anyone else does, therefore, I express my opinion freely as you do, and very well I must say!

When we come on to websites such as this where a variety of opinions and cultures and religious and none religious views are expressed, we need to understand that not everyone will agree with one another. You and I my friend disagree. Why?

1) I never intended to offend anyone.
2) What I have stated is from my heart and I have expressed it freely.
3) If anyone takes offense then they are not agreeing with my opinion and can express that.
4) To say I am judgemental and then turn around and judge me as, and I qoute: "For you to take your own choices and explain them as God's truth, means that it is only your perception of what God wants for us.This eliminates anyone else's views, experiences, or beliefs."
In your above statement you are judging. I only state what is in my heart. As to my beliefs, I understand that not all will believe as I do, yet you judge me as thinking that way. When a person truly believes in their heart something and truly feels it will benefit others, are they really being judgmental to express that? I say no, for if I have something or know something that will benefit others and I believe it with all my heart, would I not be selfish and unloving not to share it?
5)
You stated:"All in all, I think you want to help and be compassionate and loving. However, the way you are presenting your opinion, makes it difficult for those that think different to feel that it isn't an attack on our perception or beliefs. We have to embrace what we don't understand or agree with, to be truly compassionate."

First of all the online dictionary says to embrace something is "3. a close affectionate and protective acceptance; "his willing embrace of new ideas"; "in the bosom of the family"

If one totally disagrees with someone elses opinion, why would they embrace it? Isn't that hypocritical? Is it not better to just be honest with others and state your heartfelt opinion? Why just follow the crowd because that is what makes you get excepted by others?

Many here have expressed there opinion in favor of choice. That is the right and part of their free will. I have done the same except I stated what I feel God has told us in his word the Bible. If that has offended you please take my deepest apology for the way I have expressed, but I have not learned any other way but honety from my heart. I though do not apologize for my opinion or my beliefs. I can only state what is in my heart and my concern according to my beliefs for others. If I "embrace" something I truly feel is wrong and against God as I personally and truly believe, then I would be a liar and a hypocrite and not truthful to my faith in my God.

Again please except my apologies ifI offended you with my expression, that is never my intention, nor anything that would enter my heart.

Thank you and have a good day.
Hope12

Hope, I do see your point here. Yet you continue to avoid the issue of my question. I asked if you believe that there may possibly be a medical need for abortion. Did you read that?

If not, please do, it's up there, and respond back, I would like to hear your thoughts on what you would do if you had that baby inside you.

J, how far along is that baby in the picture you posted..

Did you even read this before giving the reddie? Imagine if this was your baby.


Hope, you still have not answered this question. Is it murder if the child will be born dead? Don't you believe that in medical situations that it sometimes may be necessary?

See the baby in this picture? It is a real baby with absolutely NO chance for survival.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J_9
Let me ask if aborting a fetus with anecephaly is considered murder. Anecephaly is a cephalic disorder that results from a neural tube defect that occurs when the cephalic (head) end of the neural tube fails to close, usually between the 23rd and 26th day of pregnancy, resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, skull, and scalp. Infants with this disorder are born without a forebrain, the largest part of the brain consisting mainly of the cerebral hemispheres (which include the isocortex, which is responsible for higher level cognition. The remaining brain tissue is often exposed - not covered by bone or skin.

These children typically do not live one hour after birth, if they live this long.

Is this murder if the woman chooses abortion then?

Does no one believe there may be medical reasons for abortion?



Is it murder to have an abortion when you know that this baby will not live but a few hours at most?
__________________

J, how far along is that baby in the picture you posted...?

That baby is 24 weeks post conception and has absolutely no chance of survival if it even makes it as far as term.

You see. I had a baby like that 22 years ago. Do you think my decision was an easy one? No, it wasn't and I still live with it to this day.

I would never "kill" a child, but mine had no hope for life and the fetus itself made my body septic. Without doing what I had to medically do, both the child and I would have died. I didn't have a choice Hope12.

Now, I don't agree with terminating a pregnancy as a form of birth control. No, to me that is wrong. Yet, you go on and give me a reddie without responding to the REAL issue at hand.

I have had 4 more children since then, and all are healthy and wonderful. I never would have terminated if my life were not in danger.

You can preach your holiness all you want, but until you walk in my shoes you will never know what it truly feels like.

And yes, I am offended by most of what you have said. You can't truly understand the pain I feel when I see someone like you posting and preaching your holier than thou attitude the way you do, on a subject such as this, without having some compassion for those of us who are not given a choice but to terminate.

You see. I had a baby like that 22 years ago. Do you think my decision was an easy one? No, it wasn't and I still live with it to this day.

I would never "kill" a child, but mine had no hope for life and the fetus itself made my body septic. Without doing what I had to medically do, both the child and I would have died. I didn't have a choice Hope12.

Now, I don't agree with terminating a pregnancy as a form of birth control. No, to me that is wrong. Yet, you go on and give me a reddie without responding to the REAL issue at hand.

I have had 4 more children since then, and all are healthy and wonderful. I never would have terminated if my life were not in danger.

You can preach your holiness all you want, but until you walk in my shoes you will never know what it truly feels like.

And yes, I am offended by most of what you have said. You can't truly understand the pain I feel when I see someone like you posting and preaching your holier than thou attitude the way you do, on a subject such as this, without having some compassion for those of us who are not given a choice but to terminate.


J9,
You are so strong to have made such a tough decision.

I agree with you J9, though I have never experienced anything like yours, my belief/religion will allow me to abort any pregnancy if it is an endangerment to me or to the baby in my womb.

Hope,
I don't really think you understand what to believe about anything, without referring to the bible. THat isn't a bad thing, but it isn't the way all of us decide what we believe and what is true. You think because you say that the bible says this or that, that you are just telling us what the "truth" is and what is in your heart. Well my question to you is, what is in your heart and your mind, without looking to the bible for answers? After all, those are words written by men who think they understood what God's message was and wanted to share it. However, this was done with their own perceptions and therefore, it too, is not the end all be all of What God wants for us. I was raised in a Catholic conservative family. NO one believes abortion is the right choice, for most circumstances. I too believed this, until I got older and became more aware of life and what I really believe. I am a mother, and I am one who believes in God, not the way you do, but just the same, I believe. I don't have any judgment about you thinking abortion is wrong, except that they way you preach religion, you are giving everyone the impression that you have to save everyone and help them see the REAL TRUTH. The truth is, you don't know what other people have to go through to make that decision. As J9 mentioned, her experience was one that left her no choice but to abort a child who would have died anyway. IT doesn't help when people like you write these kinds of posts talking about a fetus asking a mommy why are you doing this? It appears as though you are trying to make people feel guilty about making such a decision, through guilt and religion you are trying to sway people. IT isn't effective. It engrages those of us who have experienced this for whatever reason, and feel like they are being personally attacked. I don't think you realize that those people that are pro choice, don't go around preaching about why they are pro choice, unless they are being attacked or their rights are being limited, by those that are pro life. Abortion is something that is always going to be controversial. People will always have their own opinions. YOu choose life, others don't. Being compassionate means to understand that those that do choose different, aren't any less close to God than you are. It means that they have decided what is best for them. NO one is preaching to you how to not keep your baby, so why preach to those that don't want to keep theirs? The hippocrisy comes in the way you feel your approach and perspective is the only way. I am not saying my way is the only way, but to respect my difference. That is what I mean about being compassionate. To be a soldier for God, you must be compassionate about what you don't understand or agree with. I don't understand or agree with your perception, but you put it out there for me to give you my opinion. I wouldn't berate you with my outlook, if you weren't asking the question, IS this fair? I would let you live your life and never tell you that you should think the way I do. That is the difference between you and me. I am saying this is my belief and my truth, and anyone can disagree, but respect my opinions. You are saying ,this is your belief and it is your duty to make everyone understand it, so that they won't decide to abort their baby.VERY different than my approach. So to say that I am a hippocrite or that I am judgmental, is simply not true. I am not judging your perception, I am simply arguing that your perspective is not the only one, and thus, I disagree that it is harmful to IMPOSE YOUR beliefs on everyone that does think different.

Let me ask if aborting a fetus with anecephaly is considered murder. Anecephaly is a cephalic disorder that results from a neural tube defect that occurs when the cephalic (head) end of the neural tube fails to close, usually between the 23rd and 26th day of pregnancy, resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, skull, and scalp. Infants with this disorder are born without a forebrain, the largest part of the brain consisting mainly of the cerebral hemispheres (which include the isocortex, which is responsible for higher level cognition. The remaining brain tissue is often exposed - not covered by bone or skin.

These children typically do not live one hour after birth, if they live this long.

Is this murder if the woman chooses abortion then?

Does no one believe there may be medical reasons for abortion?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Anencephaly_side.jpg/180px-Anencephaly_side.jpg

Is it murder to have an abortion when you know that this baby will not live but a few hours at most?

J9,
I just saw the above post and it is so sad,but true.Some medical conditions make a baby less likely to survive.
I agree with you, it is not murder to have an abortion when you know that the baby will not live but a few hours at most.
There are and can be medical reasons for an abortion.

Hope, while you are entitled to your belief that a clump of cells is a valid human being--it is just that, a BELIEF.

I personally believe that until that clump of cells is a fetus, and is viable outside of its mothers body, that it is JUST A CLUMP OF CELLS.

I am trying desperately to get pregnant. I placed a child for adoption. I STILL believe that choosing abortion is no more callous and selfish in some cases than choosing to get cancer removed from your body. When one chooses abortion they are choosing to get rid of a GROWTH that is UNWANTED and can affect one's health and sanity.

I am not imposing my beliefs on you. If you don't want an abortion, by all means don't get one. I didn't get one either, because I thought that little life should have a chance. I don't, however, run around imposing my beliefs on other people because I disagree with them. Legal abortion = SAFE abortion, and there are enough valid reasons to get an abortion that it needs to stay legal. Of course some people abuse that--just like people abuse the Welfare System. That doesn't mean it should be gotten rid of entirely because SOME people abuse it.

If you don't like abortion - GREAT! It's a free country, and luckily, you can believe what you want.

If you start trying to make it illegal, I'll be forced to stand up to you and fight to keep it legal.

As to your argument that women who choose abortion are murderers--are you going to start putting them on trial for that? And if that's the case, are you going to try women who have miscarried for manslaughter (which is, of course, accidental death)?

You can not possibly imagine what goes through the mind of a woman who chooses abortion. Please stop assuming that everyone is just aborting fetuses left and right because it's "inconvenient". Every woman I know that has had an abortion, did it for health reasons.

I'll pray for you, since you obviously have problems with the whole idea that God will judge men and women for their hard choices, not you.

Most people do disagree with what I say because it is not what they want. When it comes to God's laws, I feel it is not important what I want but what God requires of me.

Thank you for your reply however there is no debate with me when it comes to obeying God's laws, and personal ideas and choices.

Take care,
Hope12

I guess the big difference lies in the fact that a lot of people think for themselves versus following the verses from a book than can be interpreted various ways.

Most people do disagree with what I say because it is not what they want. When it comes to God's laws, I feel it is not important what I want but what God requires of me.

Thank you for your reply however their is no debate with me when it comes to obeying God's laws, and personal ideas and choices.

Take care,
Hope12
Hope12, Sweet, God wouldn't want you to suffer in that instance... he would forgive you if there was reason to... I think he knows how faithful you are and I really don't think you are understanding what he is really about... God would be like this... (in my own mind)
"Hope12, I am sorry, I am not ready for you to have this child yet, please I am also not ready to lose you....you have a choice....please make it" Hope replies... "But God, it is against your laws to get an abortion" God says " Hope, it ia against my laws to kill your self...."
This is all I can come up with... I see your faithfulness... but sometimes... we have to be reasonable...

Most people do disagree with what I say because it is not what they want. When it comes to God's laws, I feel it is not important what I want but what God requires of me.

Thank you for your reply however their is no debate with me when it comes to obeying God's laws, and personal ideas and choices.

Take care,
Hope12

You still avoid my question to you. Why is that Hope? Because in my instance you know I am right?

My termination was NOT CHOICE, yet you skirt over my personal issue and reply to everyone else. You only see abortion as a choice, not a necessity in some instances.

What is the matter Hope? What scares you about that Hope?

You still avoid my question to you. Why is that Hope? Because in my instance you know I am right?

My termination was NOT CHOICE, yet you skirt over my personal issue and reply to everyone else. You only see abortion as a choice, not a necessity in some instances.

What is the matter Hope? What scares you about that Hope?



You know. Your realii starting to take it to major offense. j9 I don't like how you're just acting with this whole situation. Hope is just stating the opinions that feel are important to mention. OK your termination was not choice, but it doesn't mean you should be arguing with hope. Abortion is wrong. Period. Done with. I agree with hope. If you don't, then that's you. Hope knows what she's saying, and that's all there is to it.
Any more questions, feel free to email me
EMAIL REMOVED
Thanks
Bye
Kathy
GOD BLESS

What did you just read the last post and that is it? I hate to tell you but NO that is NOT just IT... Apparently you are new at this but you need to be more well informed before you open your mouth about what everyone on this thread has discussed. Hope has very distinct and strict religious beliefs, but that doesn't mean her opinions are the ultimate truth or correct perspective for EVERYONE. READ THE ENTIRE THREAD BEFORE MAKING SUCH ASSUMPTIOnS. To assume is to make an A$$ of you and me!

I don't know but it irks the SH!t out of me when people do that!!

j9 i dont like how you're just acting with this whole situation.

Personally, Kathy, I don't care if you don't like how I am acting with this whole situation, who am I to care what you think? I know what was right for me and other women in my shoes.


hope is just stating the opinions that feel are important to mention.

Opinions are like a$$holes, we all have one. Sorry if I offended anyone with that remark, but I hate it when people post and run like Kathy did. Just look at her name, most likely she signed on here just to put this last jab in improchoice_ichooseLIFE

And, lastly, Hope started the thread, she should expect all the repercussions that come along with opening a can of worms and starting a thread that is such a sensitive subject for some.

I know this is dragging up an old discussion, but I thought people from both sides of this argument would like to read this news item;

BBC NEWS | UK | Abortion stories: Relief and regret (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7059122.stm)

Which puts across two sides of the story!

J