To Val:
I'm sorry. My post was NOT directed specifically at YOUR post. It was just generally directed to the theme of several of the previous posts. Yes, I did read what you'd written.

Val, I am so sorry for what you have endured. You have turned out quite well and have a wonderful attitude.

I went to counselling for my mother's problems, myself. She and her brother and sister were never nurtured and the three of them ended up with disorders. My aunt had severe paranoid schiztophernia, my uncle has been battling manic depression and until recently I didn't know what was wrong with my mother. She has neer been protective and sees the world as a threatening place. She has played the victim, whist she has victimized.

I talked to my doctor about her behavior after I saw her ,and those like her , described online. I specifically asked my doctor if she could be afflicted with Borderline Personality Disorder. He said he cannot diagnose her without her being there, but her behavior sounds classic.

I bought a book,Understanding the Borderline Mother by Christine Ann Lawson. It described Borderlines as "a pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self image, and affects, and marked impusivity".The emtional state of the Bordreline borders between psychosis and neurosis, particularly when faced with abandonment and rejection. In essence, the mother toys with the child's emotional state, sometimes masked with a smile. In the process of the mother seeking affirmation , the child is under attack with much emotional abuse. This is sometimes done with a smile, to further confuse the young child.The mother cannot see her fault as her illness makes her blind to the damage she is doing.

It really helped me empathize with my mom. She didn't protect me because she wasn't protected. She was selfish because she was made to never feel important by HER mother.She makes me feel the bad child because she is feeling bad and wants be to NEED her love which she will only give when it suits.

This affliction is rarely fixed by counselling maybe because the Borderline cannot see their behavior and see themselves so much as the victim. Because of my newfound understanding, I now mother my mother. It works for us. I never look to her to understand me, but I always try to give her understanding. I affirm my worth to myself,as I now take on the role of my OWN mother to me. I also tell my son that he is always welcome to tell me if I am on the wrong path as I will gladly fix any parental mistakes for him,(something my mother cannot do), as I love him dearly and am thankfully well.

I cannot get angry at other children for their anger at their parents. They may have not gotten counselling or may be victims of Borderlines. A lot of Borderlines breed Borderlines, Which as I stated before, are difficult if not impossible to treat. I am fortunate. I cannot use my good fortune against those that cannot cope and therefore cannot judge others on their reactions to bad parenting.

I do get angry when I see bad parenting in the making, as I have so much empathy for the true victims... the children in the homes. My earlier post, was about a coworker that regularly berates her son. I do believe she is a Borderline, as she will not listen to reason and is not willing to change even though I have tried every way I can think of to cajole her out of her anger and funk, especially since it is directed at her son. She is such the victim that she cannot see how she victimizes. Sooo sad. I now pray for the son. I hope he one day receives counselling as I believe the lack of love and understanding is screaming for it.

Blessings to you, a fellow victim. Thank God we have seen into the matters and have turned it around. Love will find a way.

I agree with everyone and my parent make me sad I am 16 years old my all friends go to evrywhere alone but I can't if I will go with them my mother or my sisters will come with me .I asked them one day why do you do this for me don't u trust me they told me that no we do but you are still small and you don't know what your doing ,also I didn't go to my friend house even one time .I donno what's happening with me but I hope that someone will help me and tell me a way to tell them so that they will live me alone

Thank you Sexy for such an illuminating post. I (and I bet a few others) have a sense of not being so alone here (on this site) as people who understand both sides of things like this. My repeat message here is that almost everything we encounter that is damaging is also recoverable from.. but healing does take work. I am impressed by yours too. Semantics, LOL I know but I dare say you, me and countless others here aren't so much victims anymore but survivors having experienced the grace of healing love as we have.

PS - Louna honey, when you need help, it works better if you start your own thread about it just like you did about that boy, okay?

You are very right val, I am a victim no more but a survisor. I am even taking care of my mommy today, as she is an invalid and I want to help her and my dad on my day off. I love them both sooo much and just see my mommy as another one of my children.

In working with families I see so many different styles and also things they have gone through in their life. I think this is one of those questions that is very hard to answer as parents are human and we expect a lot of them, just like we expect of people in other professions, teacher, doctors, social workers, etc. In my experience I think parents aren't taught to be parents and we do expect the best out of them. What I have learned from my own loss that I know every parent wants to be a good parent to their child. Some don't handle that role well due to their own experiences.

Teaching, I mostly agree with what you stated with the exception of "every parent wants to be a good parent to their child." I think that is mostly true, but certainly isn't true for the whole. There are parents out there who are completely abusive and I don't think being a good parent is necessarily a priority. There may be some mental illness but in rare cases, there can be just meanness that cannot be explained.

I do believe, however, that my mother did the best that she could under her circumstances. She was not loved and not nurtured by her mother and therefore, she and her brother and sister suffered and in turn, their children did, too.

I love my mother deeply and have found a way to bridge the gap. She, at seventy, is being babied by me. She thrives on this and it makes me feel good that I am giving her something she desperately needs. I cannot expect her to ever grow up. I accept that.

I just posted a question concerning my mom and I. I feel she would rather see me dead. Im 53 and ever sinc3e I can remember she never said I love you never gave me anything close to a hug. Recently, I went into surgury and thought it was a dream when I was recovering in the recovery room I woke up and my Mom was sitting there looking at me. When all of sudden I couldn't breathe I say Mom call the Dr Im feeling allover for the button thing to press myself and I keep saying Mom call the Dr I can't breathe. Finally, I ready to passout and say you ing call the Dr I going to die and nothing just staring at me. Then I pass out. Actually, is something that happened to me in the hospital, but I wasn't sure if my mom was there. I'd hope that I was dreaming but didn't know how to find out. I asked my Dr was my mom there and he said it was a good thing she was because I stopped breathing and had to be resusated. A month later I went to the hospital to get the nurses notes of what happened when and 50 or so pages I still couldn't say yes or no. However: now 2years later my Mom and I were taking shots at each other and I said why didn't you call the Dr for me and she says you were so out of it you didn't know what was going on. I repeated why didn't you get someone I couldn't breathe she answers
Steven they knew you were taking pills there. OK I may be a pain pill addict but after surgey I went into rehab. My thinking now which I keep denying really happened is just that she was there and waited and waited while I was not able to breathe and then after I passout she told someone , maybe she waited till she thought I was dead! Upon re reading other answers Im sorry for writing this account of mine. Really Im sorry

As a teen who feels like my mom left cause she hates me and my sibblings I would always have questions. On why she will do such a thinng? I need help how would I go to her and ask her why did she do what she did?

Listen honey I am only 22 and waching my mom she don't hate us just because you is a singale mom don't mean that you got to be haten on the other mom so shut up and find yourself a man!

Mothers isn't haten they children all right so just shut up yea some people do but stop jugding them will you like if I judged you so stop!:mad:

Do you hate your kids No so that's how the other mothers feel

I have never known a mother to be like this. Most mothers want nothing but the best for their kids, maybe sometimes intentions are a little misguided, but hate? No I doubt it.

Growing up, my father is the one who destroyed me. He said that I wouldn't amount to anything and that he wish he had a son. He'd yell and call me name's and if I cried I was yelled at more. On the other had, my mother has always had a metnal problem. She never had the time to teach me things, to help me. To talk to me. So I think it's more or less, parent's who don't have time to parent and parent's who are mentally unstable should BY LAW not be able to have children. I have depression and stress and will forever due to the thing's I dealed with as a child. I think any parent not able to support their child mentally and physically need to not be parent's.

I don't agree with that one. My partner has severe mental health problems, but that doesn't stop him from being a damn good father to his kids (his five and my two also!) To say anyone mentally unstable shouldn't have kids isn't fair. Not all nutters are incapable of being good parents!

I'm talking mentally at age 10 or something. My dad is mentally 10 his doc said. My mother has Pick's and all her life has been selfish and out of tune with the world. So parent's like that shouldn't have kids. If it disable's you from parenting there is a problem. But also some mentally unstable parent's can't parent, because they may hurt there kid or scar them for life trust me I know. My dad scared me and so did my mom.

This is going to be a long and rambling post, so, apologies!

I'm not a mother, but I am the child of a mother who hates me. I know someone is going to jump on this and say "you dont know the sacrifices she made" etc, but trust me, she made as few as she could. Especially if she could get other people to make those sacrifices instead.

Frankly, she should never have had kids. Or had an abortion when she fell pregnant (at least with me). It would have been better for everyone. I don't say this to be dramatic, it's simply the way things are.

My mother has always resented and disliked myself and my siblings. She gave birth to us, and kept a roof over our heads most of the time, but she never loved us.

My parents divorced when I was two or three, and she did her very best to persuade us that our father didn't love us, and that his new wife didn't want us around either, and admittedly, when he was supposed to take us to his place every other weekend, he often didn't bother and would ring at the last minute to say he wasn't coming to fetch us. She told us that we were an unwelcome intrusion into their lives. She told us all the time that she was the only person who would ever be there for me (not that she was), because I were worthless and unlovable.
Dad never actively disliked us, even if he wasn't there for us most of the time.. My mother did however.

She was always very honest about it, I have to give her that. She never tried to hide that she didn't like, me, and in fact has repeatedly said for as long as I remember, that she hates me and wishes I was never born. "You ruined my life" is one of the more common refrains.

She used to ignore us when we were little, and left us to our own devices. She would stay in bed all day then either go out and party all night, or have parties at our house (which was really my grandfather- her fathers) which were generally all night affairs, involving a lot of alcohol and various drugs and frankly dodgy guests. We lived in the country a long way from neighbours, so the music would be pumped up as loud as the stereo could handle. For a long time, I couldn't sleep without music playing as a consequence, I was so used to the sound. Oddly enough, my happiest memories are of that time- The house was always full of people, and I played with my uncle's friends who were only really sixteen to eighteen years of age themselves- little more than kids themselves.

In school she told me that my friends were not really my friends, that they were nasty to me behind my back and that she was the only ally I would ever have. Perhaps they did occasionally turn on me, that's just playground politics, but I became hopelessly shy, and ended up letting other children treat me badly and not defend myself because I was convinced that I deserved no better. I was a smart kid, and a teacher suggested putting me in an accellerated learning programme, which meant I would have skipped ahead a few years, where I would have been more challenged my my lessons (which I wasn't in my age group) but Mum refused it, even when another family member offered to pay for any extra tuition and buy my text books. When I became involved in the local theatre's drama school, it was a school friend's mother who paid for the first semester's study, and after that, when I wanted to continue it, I was again, not allowed. I ended up coming to an arrangement with the owner of the theatre, whereby I would assist in the special-needs group instead of paying for lessons. That suited my mother fine, because she was what she called a 'recreation officer' for disability services in the region, and she could make a big deal about how good she was at putting me to socially responsible after school work, even though she had nothing to do with the arrangement.

It sounds childish, but we never had any possessions of our own. Everything we had we were made to share with any stranger who mum happened to have in the house, and often she gave our toys and things away to friends children, saying that we didn't mind. Of course, we did, but we didn't have a choice. Even out clothes were given away. Our house was shared with several families, and the few things we kids had were considered fair game for anyone who wanted it. Even my kitten, (given to me by a friend of my grandmother's) was considered a toy that had to be shared- one of the other families' children tried to drown it, and I was still expected to let that child take her, even if I was patting or cuddling her, after they had harmed her. It was made clear that myself and my siblings owned nothing, and everything we had could be taken away from us.

It's not just myself and my siblings that she manipulates.

(cont next post)

(cont from prev post)

... She also gathered up for herself legal power of attourney (and convinced them to let her organise their wills) over some of her family members, including her younger brother (who has property) and her mother (who owns her own home, has a little money and whom I live with). And a few years ago, she tried to get power of attourney over her sister (who co-incidentally, is rather wealthy), while she was close to death in hospital, and when her sister refused, she told her sister's stalker ex-boyfriend where she was and told him he was allowed to see her in hospital- which he was certainly not welcome to do. When her younger brother, my uncle, told her he was going to change his will, and out of the blue asked me to act as trustee for a family trust he wanted to set up (which was probably only a whim) , she decided I had been trying to turn him against her and then set about turning him against me, and openly telling me about it. I didn't bother rising to it, but she did succeed to a point, (which wasn't hard really because he is paranoid through a combination of brain damage, mental illness and habitual drug use) but he realised it was happening. She did already bully him into dropping the scheme, as she threatened to use her power of attourney to take more control over his finances, and make him come to her for an allowance which she could give or withhold as she wished.

At one point, when I was thirteen or fourteen, she had a boyfriend who I disliked extremely. He used to try and kiss me, and several times pinned me down on the couch and stuck his tongue in my ear and generally molested me- I would run away and was physically ill whenever he was around. When I told my mother, she accused me of lying and said I was just trying to break them up. Because I was jealous of her.
I used to make sure my little sister, who was much younger than me was never left alone in a room with him, because I couldn't bear the idea of something happening to her as well.

She is an alcoholic who refuses to acknowledge it, and insists that she only has a couple of glasses of wine a night, when in actual fact she usually drinks two or three bottles. Invariably, she gets drink and verbally abusive, or worse, if there are people around (for example, at a party) she gets drunk and then wails, moans and cries to get attention, and fawning on anyone male, including my the boyfriends of my sister and myself- if we have them at the time. When she gets fall-down drunk like that, it is incredibly embarrasing- not just for us, her kids, but for our friends, who generally make their excuses and leave.
I've had to put her to bed drunk, ever since I was a kid. Even now, I still sometimes have to, and I don't even live with her!

Her last boyfriend (who was a stereotypical pill-popping raver) introduced her to various pills and powders which she took up with enthusiam, so that he'd like her and think she was cool and with it.

She is a liar and thief (who possibly doesn't even realise she is), who tries to con money out of my siblings and I, and even tried to make me 'pay her back' for my schooling, which in fact, she had never paid for in the first place- she never does anything for anybody unless there is something in it for her, and she has always made a profit by taking advantage of government welfare payments as a sole parent, most of which was promptly spent on alcohol, or treats for herself, while neglecting to get anything but the very cheapest bare essentials for us. She even used to keep separate loaves of bread- the old stuff the baker sold in garbage bags meant for chicken feed for a dollar for us, and more expensive gourmet style loaves for herself. All hell broke loose if we ever cut from the wrong loaf. I think she actually measured the bread to make sure it hadn't been used by us!

She always made my chronically asthmatic brother stand out in the cold and damp outside at night when he suffered attacks, which invariably worsened them to the point where he required hospitalisation, and often wouldn't buy him his medication, saying it cost too much, and it was all in his head. Several times, he was expected to die in hospital, and and it is only due to the efforts of dedicated doctors and nurses that he is alive today. After getting home, she usually would yell at him for making her drive to the hospital.

She has always been promiscuous, and this has led to the only relationship she had with a truly decent man breaking down, although she has always blamed us, her children, and in particular, me, for the failed relationship. In spite of him telling her exactly *why* he was breaking up with her. At one point, she had a hysterectomy so she could not fall pregnant again (shortly after the birth of my sister) and told me (I was maybe eight at the time) that it was because Dad had given her cervical cancer.

She was convinced I was a slut, even though I had never had a boyfriend (and had never had one until I was 22). When I was fifteen, a boy who was a friend of the family, who's entire family happened to be living with ours asked me out and I declined (because that would be like dating your brother... just weird!) but he told some of his friends I slept with him, and Mum believed it, and screamed at me, then broke off her friendship with the boy's mother, who also believed it and told me I was a slut. I told them it was untrue, but even to this day, she doesn't believe it.

I moved out of home at sixteen, or rather, I was packed off to live with my grandmother (who I've lived on and off with ever since) after mentally collapsing under the pressure of years of mental and physical abuse at the hands of my uncle (who is a mean drunk) and mother, and then found out that not everyone lives that way. Not all parents treat their children as servants or scapegoats. In fact, I've never met anyone who's mother was anything like ours! If I hadn't gone to live with my grandmother, I would have killed myself long ago. Ever since then, she has not bothered to make contact with me unless she wants something. I see her quite regularly as she sees my grandmother (who I'm living with again- gosh I love my Narnie it's my grandmother's pet name) every week as they play cards, and once a fortnight it is at our house.

Unfortunately, my mother took psychology classes, and uses the knowledge she gained in it specifically to manipulate others, particularly us, her children. It makes it incredibly hard to work out why she hates us, because she knows exactly how to play people and always gives the impression to others when meeting them that she is a dedicated, loving and self sacrificing touchy-feely mother. At the same time, she tries to set myself and my siblings against each other, but it never works, because we are very close- having really just raised ourselves. When I was diagnosed as having major depressive disorder, and borderline bi-polar, she was furious at the doctors who diagnosed it, saying they should have their licences to practise revoked, and that she was going to complain- she actually wanted them to lose their jobs! She pressured me to tell her their names and practises, which I naturally refused (they shouldn't have to suffer because of her) because I wasn't allowed to be depressed, if you can believe it. It might make her look like a bad mother after she had spent a long time fostering her caring image, as far as the rest of the world was concerned (although there are plenty of people who saw through that).

She recently became engaged to a man (who is very nice, but suffers from sever trauma from his time in the vietnam war) and now does everything she can when he's around to give that motherly impression, but as soon as he leaves the room, the act is dropped. Recently, my grandmother has been quite ill, and has had major surgery, and my mother had begun telling people that I only live with my grandmother because I'm trying to get my hands on her money when she dies. It's horrifying. I know that my friends don't believe her, but her new fiancé does, and so do her friends. My uncle and brother recently told me that she is also trying to turn my grandmother against me, by telling her repeatedly that I don't like her, and that I'm taking advantage of her by living here (apparently she doesn't understand the concept of rent/board arrangements), that I'm not paying the rent, and that I'm only after her money. So far the only success she's had was getting Narnie to complain about lack of rent paid, which stopped once I showed her my bank statement which showed the money transfers that I've been making into her account.

I turned twenty five a few days ago, and I still try to get past all this mental rubbish, but I just can't seem able to. I'm far too broke for a shrink. My few personal relationships have failed because I don't display emotion and affection well and come off as very cold. I have practically no self esteem (which I am fully aware of), and dislike sex, mostly because the whole issue makes me feel so very vulnerable that it's frightening- even though I know that none of this "no-one could ever love you, you are so worthless" stuff is really true, I can't help but believe, deep down that it is. I am an empty shell of a person. I have no tolerance for hysterics or emotional displays, and I don't trust anyone or share what I feel. There have been several times when the only thing keeping me from killing myself is that she would use it to fuel her martyr routine, and use it to manipulate my siblings and grandmother. And I don't ever want to have children myself, in case I am no better as a parent.

If you don't have what it takes to put a child first in your life, don't become a parent, because if you are a parent, you are going to have to do that at least once.

Dear marie,

I am twice your age and have lived your nightmare . After all these years I still .cannot do anything to please my mom, who now is 82. My suggestion to you would be get a nice lady therapist and move on like your doing, it is not worth spending a lifetime trying to get the love you will never get. I'm 56 and my mom can make me feel like a worthless child in about 30 seconds being in the room with her. Don't suffer like I did, distance yourself from her for your own sanity and young life to live.

Its possible, but hate is a strong word and those mothers sometimes have Munchausen syndrome or another psychological disease which may cause the mother to THINK she hates her child, but it isn't necessarily true that she does.

That being said, I came from an abusive/neglective household, so I can empathize with your feelings. My mother sometimes claimed to "hate" me but when I'd try and break ties, she'd run back. I think lots of mom's have trouble with their kids growing up, possibly "outshining" them with their successes, etc. Mine still makes horrible comments because I put myself through college, yet she thinks it was a waste. Personally, I think its selfish thinking because she regrets not doing the same. I think she percieves me as not needing her anymore, so does hurtful things to make me realize she still has power over me. Mothers can be weird.

Anyway, those types of mom's have serious problems that need professional help. Its never the child's fault when a parent is abusive or hateful. Adult children are still adults though, so its important to respect parents who sometimes feel like that's been lost. Rise above it!