I'll try to make this brief. I have a brother who's never been a brother to any of us. He's selfish, belittles everyone and everything, know's everything, has to have the best of everything, lets you know he has the best of everything, looks down upon everyone around him, critcizes, scrutinizes, compares, and basically looks down his nose at everyone. He's as Narcissistic as they come. Very hard to get a word in the conversation with him because he changes the topic to suit his needs. So... we're all aware of the situation and how he treats people. Recently he made horrible remarks to me and my parents. Called me everything in the book because I didn't do exactly what he wanted me to do the way he wanted me to do it. So words were spoken and he and his girlfriend wrote a nasty letter to my parents, and I, in return wrote one back to them and we haven't spoken since. It's been 8 months... and they've been the happiest 8 months of my life. My husband and I and a sister and brother in law couldn't be happier, two other sisters feel different. They say we should all apologise to each other. My parents are getting older and my Mom misses her "son". My parents are old school, and don't believe there's anything medically wrong with him. I have one sister who's a nurse and she says he's got Narcissistic Personality Disorder. So my sister's feel we should all be one happy family again. First of all, we were never a happy family because of his ways. It's been the four girls and "him". He's always been an outsider and too good for all of us.
He went to my parents house and they "made up" yesterday. Now my dad wants me to basically kiss my brother's butt and give in. Am I wrong to not want to be a part of his world anymore. I'm 42 and a grown woman. I don't need a blood relative driving me nuts any longer. But I don't want my parent's unhappy either. There really is no happy medium here is there?

Even if he has Narcissistic Personality Disorder I doubt there is any 'medicine' for it so whether she wants to call it a medical problem or not doesn't really matter. Maybe just makes and excuse for him.
Even if it is a disorder he would deny it and be too above getting help for it anyway.

I always say ''love you from a distance'' in situations like this. Like you can forgive him but it doesn't mean you have to make him a part of your life. When you go to family things and he is there he can stay on 'his' side of the room.
You can't control your parents and they really shouldn't be taking sides anyway. Hopefully they will know how to balance time with him to where he is not being over bearing with them.

Don't apologise just because your parents tell you to do so. Tell everyone involved to move on and drop the subject, since you have already done so. Reassure your parents and sisters that you will not make trouble when your entire family is gathered together for special occasions. If your brother is a narssisist, he'll feed off the attention of continuing this drama. Continue to avoid contact with him and decline to discuss the matter further with your family.

I have a Narcissist in my family as well and I know from bitter experience the hell that you've gone through. Apologizing to a narcissist just reaffirms their view of the world - i.e. that they are right and can do no wrong.

If your parents want to have a relationship with him that is their choice - hopefully they will die happy and he'll have his share of the legacy. Let them know that you're really happy they've 'made up' but don't buy into the drama. Explain that you don't feel the need to apologize, but reassure them you'll be civil and will attend family gatherings. Perhaps let him know that you're glad that he's in contact with the family again - then leave it at that.

Be aware though that he'll be quietly besmirching your name to your parents and sisters and he'll be trying to get them on side against you. You can't win against a narcissist - they are very good at twisting things so that you look like the bad guy.

The best thing with a narcissist is not to give them your energy. They feed on it. Disinterest is what works best. It takes time, but if you act as though you're not interested in their drama and don't feed into it, they eventually lose interest in provoking you.

Of course this is MUCH more difficult in a family situation, but you have to do it, otherwise you'll feel as if you're at their whim and mercy!

Very well said Gemini54. Thank you, it sounds like you're a part of my family.. Do you have experience with this subject?
That's exactly what my husband and my one sister and her husband said. If we talk to him then it's like we give in and he won. Well, he's not going to win this time. I'm sticking to my guns. My parents were over here Sunday and asked us nicely, would we please talk to him? I responded nicely, nope.
He is the most arrogant, self centered, know it all, bragging, lying individual I have ever met and unfortuneatly, he's my brother.

Yep! I sure do have experience and have spent some time on the internet researching it because I thought we were going to go completely and utterly mad unless we could 'manage' it in some way.

My husband's ex-wife is a malignant narcissist, and as my husband has 2 children with her we have no choice but to have contact with her. Although the children are now teenagers she is constantly devising new tricks to get up our noses and make our lives as miserable as possible. It's the nastiness I dislike (apart from the sense of entitlement, lies and arrogance).

We now know that there is no way we can win with her - so we don't play the game - any game if we can help it - but she is ingenious at devising ways to make my husband feel guilty about his children! She hates being ignored and we now do this very well.

Good luck, and if you can, stick to your guns. Strong boundaries and obstinance are good strategies for not letting them get to you!

Unfortunately, I have a similar situation. I am 40 and the youngest of 6. My brother sounds so much like your brother. The difference is I have more than one brother. My other brother, G, has done as my mother requested....G spoke to A, had A over to his house and then A does the unthinkable and G is done, finished...I personally just pretend I am six years old again and have to be nice to my brother. Kind of like Michael and Fredo because once my mother is no longer here, all bets are off! However, before you make a final decision would you please just sleep on it one more night?

Thank you for your post. Due to my current financial status I now get to live with my mother and this brother who is a master manipulator. When I didn't live at home, I had nothing to do with him. When I did, I was civil and polite. Now that I am living there it is a little more challenging. He just wants to remind everyone why he can't work and has to live off his mommy. Pathetic is the word my siblings and I use. If I were living somewhere else I would still continue with my choice of having nothing to do with him unless it were family obligation. It is easier for me to not hear my mother constantly talk about him and what his next great plan is.

Michael and Fredo... love it. We are a very strict italian family too. My husband is a descendant of Al Capone too. I feel for you, it sounds like your situation is more "in your face" then mine. Just the thought of my brother calling me an f------ idiot, or nutcase again makes me cringe. I'm staying away from him. I have peace in my life and in my house and I like it this way. Don't know exactly what the future holds for us, but for now bye bye Fredo!

Hilarious

All I can say is I feel your pain. I have been dealing with something that I could not put a finger on for many years. But now I can. There is actually a medical term for it. Its called Naccistic Personality Disorder, true. But what to do about it.

After much ta do about the situation and without boring you to tears your situation sounds so familiar to me. But I have one additional thing going on. It also has a name. Kleptomania. This is a man that even steals from himself and blames me.

Enough already. The only real help is serious psychotherapy and intense counseling. According to everything I read. And then it will take a will of steel to change it. Unsure of what the future holds I have descions to make about my future and so do you.

My story is a bit different from yours but still hold the same truths about it. Lying, stealing, judgement and criticism are not a daily thing. We have business and a exciting life of travel and blessings. And then BAM. There it is again. We can go months without incident. We have broken up for years at a time to rejoin and start over. Its nuts and I am getting older and more confrontational as the years go by.

Bottom line this last trip around I took him kicking and screaming to the VA hospital for a 90 day program that will knock the snot out of him or kill him. Its his decision. I may or may not be here to find out.

I also am aware that all this has taken a toll on me. His family no longer associates with him at all. My mindset is confused, hurt and vulnerable. Its very hard to love someone like this. Its hard to walk away when hope is right around the corner. But when hope is washed away with constant belittling and irresponsibility of ones actions it makes it easier to conceive of a happier life somewhere else.

Your best bet is to heed your own gut feeling. Your brother will never change unless he gets help. And getting help means having someone close enough to him shove him into a hole that he can't climb out of. Your family is enabling him to stay the same. You might have to be the one person to say "Dude" you need help.
Good luck,
Suz

Thanks Suz for sharing your story... it's funny, my brother's first wife was Suzan... She divorced him... gee, I wonder why?
It's very hard when it's someone you love or very close to you. I never got close to my brother, he doesn't let you in. He is a brother from a distance if that makes sense.
I am going to stay away from him... He refuses to believe he needs help or that there is anything wrong with him. It's all the rest of the family that has problems according to him.

And that's typical of NPD... they always project their stuff on to other people. Anyway, NPD's very rarely seek help and when they do the rate of success is low.

Sorry to hear about another narc making trouble for normal folks!

Same old thing: Crazy narc sister constantly throughout her life causing trouble! She did so many horrible things to me, which I always forgave her for doing... including sleeping with my ex husband while I was 9 months along expecting our child... (he was a narc too) since I made the mistake of allowing her to stay with us. She horned in on my dream wedding to a wonderful normal man, wrecking my plans, canceling my orders... which is my fault too as I allowed it... she is a drinker and currently drives her kids around drunk with a cooler in the back seat... cheats on her husband... has caused many scenes in my home with her raging and beastly behavior in front of my kids and hers and cussed out our parents telling them she wished they would die and go to hell. My Dad did die. He went to Heaven, hopefully. She lied about his symptoms in the hospital to get him morphine so he could be out of his misery sooner... and she could get forgiven on the old student loans he co-signed on. Finally, I found the Narcissist's Suck website and learned! I recommend it!

Currently, this Narc is banned from our home, since she came on to my teenage boys and their friends and my married friend who was over with his wife and 6 kids!! I have no intention on bringing her back into our lives. Oddly enough, there are siblings who talk about it and feel sorry for her... wondering when I'll forgive her... wondering if it is "right" for me to have cut her out of family get togethers... yet, I don't see them maintaining much of a relationship with her either. In the past, I have been the "handler" of her. I have been the one she went to for "smoothing" things over with the siblings she has fought with. NEVER AGAIN.

I have put this Narc on notice that drinking in my home wasn't allowed & if she came here drunk and tried to drive off I would call in her license # to the police. That made her sooo angry and she emailed a huge rant to all our family in a nutty rage... which opened my eyes to her disordered mind. She has evil tendencies and has threatened to kill me. Why would I need to have her in my life?

At any rate, I love her. She is my sister. That will not change. I have forgiven her. However, her actions remain suspect. I do not need to play the part of an amnesiac in regards to the threat she poses to my family and my sanity. She has never aopologized... not even the half way narcs do-like, "I'm sorry that you don't like what I do...I'm sorry you don't understand me...I'm sorry you got upset....

"I accept my mistakes and that's what makes me a good person"-this is what I got from my sister.

Uh, no. That's what makes you a narcissist.

Hang in there, normal people! Pray for them but don't stick your hands in their cages. They bite.:eek:

~Shelby Grace

Wow... I can relate to a lot of what you said. My brother doesn't drink though, in fact his girlfriend, the other nutcase, is an alcoholic and he's tried to get her help and she blows it off.
My sister's, do not keep in contact with him either, yet I'm the bad guy because I wrote him a truthful letter telling everyone how it is. So now I'm the bad guy. After our last blowout, which was everal months ago, he finally called my parents, only because my sister persuaded him to. Now my Dad is on my back to "make up" with him. Sorry, it ain't happening, not in this lifetime. I did nothing wrong and yet I have to bow down to him all the time. Not anymore. My Dad says let it go. Am I wrong for not wanting to?
I'd like to talk to you some more... here's my email if you feel like corresponding, that would be great. [email protected]

We, Normals,those of us saddled with Malignant Narcissists in our family, need to avoid placing ourselves in the line of fire. When other family members have made truces with these evil-doers, it often disturbs their fantasy world, when a Normal person stands up to the Narcs. Those who cater to Narcs are temporarily in denial, in a type of Stockholm syndrome. They feel "grateful" to the Narc who has chosen to temporarily cease fire/nuttiness/ and mean behavior, towards them. Little do they know that although the Narc is off their case, he is only distracted with wreaking havoc on someone else at the moment. So, when Normals come along and point out the Truth to the Narc or about the Narc, the Caterers instinctively understand that the monster Narc will sweep their evil gaze back in their direction. It scares the crap out of them. They are cowering in a corner and you (NORMAL) have brought the Narc back to the shelter. The caterer knows that they will be used and abused and expected to back the Narc, which goes against every sense of fairness, honesty and decency the caterer possesses, yet they are so cowed that they are unable to summon the personal strength to draw the line against the Monster Narc.
In order to remain healthy, it is imperative that you distance yourself from the Monster Narc. You can simply draw back from their lives. Recede into the background. Do NOT attempt to help them with their "issues" or "problems". Remain aloof. One may be Christian and kind without being drug into all sorts of drama and nuttiness. Simple hellos and goodbyes at family functions. Never ask details about the Narc. Never give your opinion to the Narc. Never talk about the Narc to the caterers, who have been trained to report back. In case of the caterers, maintain whatever relationship with them as possible, however, make it a point to refuse to discuss the Monster Narc with them. If they choose to continue their sick relationship with the Monster, then they must bear their pain alone. You, the NORMAL, may be able to assist them in all other manners and forms but you cannot help them with the drama they choose to put up with in regards to the Monster. In order to put a quick end to the nonsense, gather the caterers all together and tell them once and for all,
"Thanks so much for listening to me. I want to share my feelings with you. I have decided, after much prayer and thought, that I cannot put myself into the situation to be abused and used by X(Monster) any longer. Without going into too many hurtful memories and details, I must tell you that my very life has been affected adversely by Monster X. I love X. It is not my intention to hurt X. This isn't about revenge. I understand how Monster X has affected each of you over the years and you react instinctively to protect X. Monster X has nothing to fear from me as I am releasing myself from bondage to Monster X. I will no longer be making excuse for X, nor will I be a party to seeing X hurt others. I respect your personal decisions to remain Monster X's dutiful minions. Please respect my decision. I do not want to hear any more of Monster X's drama. Ever. I am perfectly capable of remaining pleasant at all family functions that Monster attends, however, I will not be abused nor will I see others being abused. If you intend to report me to Monster X, that is your right, however, I wouldn't like to be you, when Monster X requires you to pester me and abuse me by trying to talk me out of my decision. I will not be moved.
Thank you so much for listening. I love you all. Wow. I need to go. I have to xyz. See you later!

Hello tony:

Move.

excon

Wowo... I don't know what to say, except, very well put.
I love what you said and how you said it, and I will try to repeat what you suggested to my sister and parents... and see what happens from there.
Thank you again.
And excon... I can't move.

I have a sister who acts a lot like your brother...
She is always bringing me down to make herself feel good.
I actually feel like I live with a Paris Hilton!
She lives with me due to having RA. And she is currently looking for another place to live on her own.
Which can not happen too soon! Because living with "Paris Hilton" is draining mentally and finacially.

My mother was the same.
It took years of self help to get back to the norm for me.
Now with my sister here... it has all come back...

I realize now that there is no cure for them.
We can only distant ourselves from them and work on ourselves.
Its not easy but can be done. I did it before and I know that I can do it again!
Hope that this helps you in some small way...

Sweetspirit