[mike 165278]

A tamper proof GFCI should be $12 to $15. But you only need 1 per circuit.

[shuntripper]

Oh and where are you able to find GFCI recepticals for $8. Everywhere around here I'm finding them at about $15 even in bulk. Any good online retailers?

How many circuits are you planning for the receptacles? Why not just line/load one GFCI at the beginning of each circuit? I would try going to a local electrical supply house and see how much they would charge for one.

I like Pass and Seymour/Le Grand
Specification Grade or tamper proof if needed
http://www.legrand.us/electrical-out...x#.UB2FSk1lRN-

And get good(at least commercial grade) U ground receptacles too, as long as you're doing a quality job

[shuntripper]

I doubt you have a 240v ballast. It's mostly likely a universal voltage ballast, meaning is operates at 120v single phase or 277v 3phase (480/277). If it were 240v it would have to have 3 leads for power, 1 for each hot leg and 1 for the neutral. I'm sure it doesn't. No 240 and 277 are not the same. But ur ballast is 'smart' so you wire it the same. In your application you have to wire it 120v. Nice choice of fixture by the way. If you check with your local utility they probably have a rebate program and will pay you back for most of the fixture.

Those ballasts have a black and a white lead, you always connect the white to an incoming neutral with either 120 or 277 which both have a hot and a neutral, when connecting them to 240V the white lead just connects to L2 ( the second hot leg) there aren't 3 leads

[shuntripper]

Thanks for the responses. I'm learning alot. I'm also realizing there are alot of details. One more thing. Maybe is sounds odd but I'm planning to wire up the lights in the ceiling but rather than hard wire them I would like to install 20A 120V recepticals in the ceiling for each light fixture. Is this ok to do? Are there any code violations prohibiting this? Being that each receptical is dedicated for each light fixture and that this is being in the garage, will I have to used GFCI recepticals in the ceiling?

Thanks,
Royce M

http://www.platt.com/platt-electric-...px?zpid=853492



I prefer fixtures hard wired and mounted directly on the ceiling ( you may find this necessary if your garage doors are on tracks parallel to the ceiling) It gets them up a little higher and uses less hardware, one less top surface to collect dust too. These fixtures look like they have a full size can rather than some of the skeleton-y fixtures I've put up lately, should be simple to just screw them up over a round plaster ring?

Skeleton-y T5HO
http://www.e-conolight.com/pdf/SpecS...LF34X54U30.PDF

But they offer nice little cable hangers and are cheap, the last ones we got had ballasts made by Advance, which In my opinion is always the best ballast maker. We haven't had any callbacks yet with these fixtures, only been up for 2-3 years now, (new technology)

Well, new tech in that up until just a couple of years ago the ballasts offered weren't very good, made by fly-by-night brands you never heard of and broke down a lot. Frankly, I had no confidence in these (48" T5) until Advance Ballast Co. started making the ballasts for them. Little short T5 has been available for 20 years, but these big ones weren't really viable until the reliability problem got worked out about 3 years ago. Now we are using the 6 lamp ones where we used to put 250W Metal Halide fixtures

[roycemek]

I'm planning 1 circuit for every 4 recepticals. Each receptical is dedicated exclusively for each light fixture. In total I'm planning 4 circuits. I will lay out the wall switches to turn on two fixtures at a time. The recepticals will be in the ceiling at 18ft high and if I'm interpreting the NEC code and the conversations correctly the GFCI test and reset needs to be easily accessible, I'm assuming the 18ft ceiling is not accessible? And are there no more exceptions in the 2011 NEC for GFCI? Humm. Maybe this might be easier and cheaper to hardwire the lights.

Thanks,
Royce M

[shuntripper]

I'm planning 1 circuit for every 4 recepticals. Each receptical is dedicated exclusively for each light fixture. In total I'm planning 4 circuits. I will lay out the wall switches to turn on two fixtures at a time. The recepticals will be in the ceiling at 18ft high and if I'm interpreting the NEC code and the conversations correctly the GFCI test and reset needs to be easily accessible, I'm assuming the 18ft ceiling is not accessible?? And are there no more exceptions in the 2011 NEC for GFCI? Humm. Maybe this might be easier and cheaper to hardwire the lights.

Thanks,
Royce M

Remember you are allowed to "line/load" a protected string of receptacles out of one GFCI, Seven on a 20A circuit, (180VA each for load calcs) the eighth one is the GFCI. A light fixture is a lighting outlet

Two circuits would allow this.
Each circuit goes to GFCI recptacle on wall first, hot and neutral in on the LINE half, out on the LOAD half to the (first, if 3way) switch for half of the lights. This would require two separate duplex recepts, but why not one double duplex GFCI on the same wall near the switches? Feed two switches (each does two lights so 4 switches right?) out of each one of the GFCIs, the GFCI's will then be protecting each bank of 2 lights, where you can use regular 15A Uground receptacles instead of GFCIs
Note: manage your neutrals carefully when wiring this, keep them marked and separate

Hardwired always looks cleaner when done well and since they aren't receptacles they don't need all this GFCI arrangement, don't even need to be fed from a GFCI


The 18ft ceiling is "accessible" just not "readily accessible" since I assume you cannot fly... you're OK, but you don't care anyway because the set and reset buttons are over next to the door into the house... hunh?. unless you're hard wired, and then none of that stuff even applies to you.

[mike 165278]

those ballasts have a black and a white lead, you always connect the white to an incoming neutral with either 120 or 277 which both have a hot and a neutral, when connecting them to 240V the white lead just connects to L2 ( the second hot leg) there aren't 3 leads

Um, no. A ballast needs a neutral to work. I've never seen a 240v ballast for 4 lamp F54T5. If you have, I'm interested in checking it out.

[mike 165278]

What are the dimensions of the room you are lighting up. Also what color walls and floor. I'll do the light calc for you. Also. Standard 4 lamp F54T5HO ballast draws just under 2 amps at 120v. You can comfortably put 8 fixtures on a circuit and still be under 80% of the circuit rating. I recommend you come out of the panel and wire a faceless GFCI in the wall of the garage. From there feed your lights (standard outlets). Depending where you live the outlets might need to be tamper resistant. The faceless GFCI will provide GFCI protection for the whole circuit, but not provide an outlet. And mounting it on the wall will make it easily accessible.

[roycemek]

In total the dimensions are 50ft x 35ft. The side with the 17.5ft ceilings is 25ft x 35ft. The other side is 25ft x 35ft and ceiling height is 8ft. The IBZ-454-WD is for the high bay side. For the 8ft ceiling area I'm looking at the same IBZ's but in a T8. Plans for now I believe to have the walls and ceiling white and floor a concrete color. Thanks for all the help.

RE the GFCI's. Is it fine to just buy a 20A GFCI breaker and put that in my main panel and forgo the extra wiring box layout etc, for placing a blank GFCI somewhere on the wall. I checked and it looks like I can get a replacement 20A GFCI for around $50. Is cost usually the factor here are is there something else I should consider?

Thanks,
Royce M

[tkrussell]

Outlets in the ceiling for lighting do not require, and is not recommended to be GFI protected.

[mike 165278]

Royce, you need 6 fixtues for the larger area. That will give you 42 foot candles at 30". On the T8, are you going with 4 lamp or 6 lamp? Also are they 'super T8' or standard? A super T8 is more efficient, basically you are overdriving a T8 lamp to get more lumens, increasing efficiency.

[shuntripper]

Um, no. A ballast needs a neutral to work. I've never seen a 240v ballast for 4 lamp F54T5. If you have, i'm interested in checking it out.

You need to go look at one then, lots of ballasts have been wired this way for years

[shuntripper]

Outlets in the ceiling for lighting do not require, and is not recommended to be GFI protected.

I agree they aren't recommended, as far as required, I was just dinged on a recertification test for not counting a lighting receptacle in the ceiling of a garage as one that needed to be a GFCI.

Of course Jade Learning could have been mistaken? I think their reasoning is that the light can be unplugged and an extension cord can be plugged into it.

[mike 165278]

you need to go look at one then, lots of ballasts have been wired this way for years

Show me one. It's an electronic ballast. It needs a neutral. A fluorescent ballast rated at 120-277v does not mean it's quad tap (120, 208, 240, 277v). It means it is 120 OR 277v. That is it. No other voltage will work.

[shuntripper]

Show me one. It's an electronic ballast. It needs a neutral. A flourescent ballast rated at 120-277v does not mean it's quad tap (120, 208, 240, 277v). It means it is 120 OR 277v. That is it. No other voltage will work.

OK

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T5-High-Bay-4-Lamp-Fluorescent-HO-Electronic-Ballast-/220940136536#vi-content

[mike 165278]

Nope. The description says the fixture is a Howard Industries Fixture. Check Howards site. Below is a link to that fixture on Howards site, clearly saying on the lower left that the fixture is rated 120 OR 277V ONLY. Try again

http://www.howard-ind.com/HowardLigh...escent/HIB.pdf

[shuntripper]

Nope. The description says the fixture is a Howard Industries Fixture. Check Howards site. below is a link to that fixture on Howards site, clearly saying on the lower left that the fixture is rated 120 OR 277V ONLY. Try again

http://www.howard-ind.com/HowardLigh...escent/HIB.pdf

Whatever, I'll concede your point. This is getting too much like pointless w---nie wagging and we don't need to irritate any moderators

[roycemek]

Royce, you need 6 fixtues for the larger area. That will give you 42 foot candles at 30". On the T8, are you going with 4 lamp or 6 lamp? Also are they 'super T8' or standard? A super T8 is more efficient, basically you are overdriving a T8 lamp to get more lumens, increasing efficency.

Thanks Mike. I really appreciate you doing some calcs for me.

On the 8ft ceiling side I guess I haven't given as much research as I should have regarding T8's. I didn't know there was a super T8 and a standard. How can I tell the difference? Is there a wattage difference that designates a super T8 vs a standard T8? I'm looking at 4 lamp models. The model I am looking at is the Lithonia IBZ-432-WD.

Thanks,
Royce M

[mike 165278]

Thanks Mike. I really appreciate you doing some calcs for me.

On the 8ft ceiling side I guess I haven't given as much research as I should have regarding T8's. I didn't know there was a super T8 and a standard. How can I tell the difference? Is there a wattage difference that designates a super T8 vs a standard T8? I'm looking at 4 lamp models. The model I am looking at is the Lithonia IBZ-432-WD.

Thanks,
Royce M

What are you using the space for? You can probably just use T8 tandum 8' open strip lights.

[roycemek]

Mostly workshop. But a little of everything. Woodworking, mechanic work, machining, etc. Really nothing specific.