[appy151]

I have to run an outlet for a 5hp 14 amp 220 v motor. The motor will be about 10 feet from the panel, but by the time I have run up, over, and down, it is about 20 feet.

What size wire and breaker should I use?

[miraclemant]

I do my own wiring, and am NOT an expert...
Having said that, if this is running on its own separate breaker, then a 15amp breaker with 12ga wiring would handle the load. This would also be a usable line if in the future you should ever take out your motor, and want to use the line for standard outlets running 120 v on the wiring.

[stanfortyman]

I do my own wiring, and am NOT an expert...
having said that, if this is running on its own seperate breaker, then a 15amp breaker with 12ga wiring would handle the load.

No, not exactly.

First, why use #12 if you are suggesting a 15A breaker. Obviously distance is not a concern.

Second, 15A is not enough, unless this cannot be a continuous load motor, like for a compressor, then a 15A would be acceptable. Acceptable but not advisable.

Appy, you need 12/2 on a 2 pole 20A breaker.

[tkrussell]

Sorry but all answers provided are incorrect, and I base my comment on the following:

Branch circuit conductor for a single phase motor shall be rated 125% of the amperage listed in per Table 430.148 of the NEC, and a 220 Volts is not listed,but allowed touse the amperage listed for 230 Volts, which is 28 Amps.

28 A x 125% = 35 Amps = #8 copper wire.

Nameplate amperage is only used to size overload protection, if not built into the motor.

Something is fishy about this motor data provided as being 5 HP and 14 amps at 220 volts.

So, exactly what type of motor or machine is this?

My guess is one of those over rated air compressors that over state the HP, but the amps is correct.

We haven't even got to rating the breaker size, I will hold on that until more detail is provided on the motor/machine.

Also, 220 volt? Does the motor nameplate sate this exactly?

What country are you located in?

[appy151]

Hey tkrussel

The motor actually says 230 v, 14 amp and it is single phase. The motor is on a horse treadmill. The factory plug says 30 amp and has the ground at the top with two horizontal blades below, so for the receptacle I just picked up one that matched the plug configuration and specs. I was also assuming that because the plug said 30 amp that the breaker should match?

The machine will be in the barn so I was planning on putting the wire in PVC conduit just so the critters don’t eat it. The panel is 100 amp and only has a few lights and wall outlets on it.

About the only electrical experience I have is zapping myself on the electric fence when I forget to turn it off before going into one of the paddocks, but I figured that one breaker (yes I know, remember to turn the main feed off first), a bit of wire and an outlet can’t be that difficult as long as I size it correctly?

The machine is made in the US but I am in Canada.

Thanks for the advice so far.
Appy

[KISS]

Advice stolen from here: Sawmill Creek - View Single Post - How many Amps does a 5 HP motor need?

So, that's #14 and a 20 Amp breaker. 125% * 14.

Use #12 and 20 A double pole breaker since this is a plug connected device. A treadmill generally will not have the startup surges that say an air compressor might have because of the electronics.

I'd go with a NEMA 6-20R/6-20P receptacle/plug and I'd use a right angle plug. Alternatively, you could go twist lock.

FYI: Current would be ~ 240 V/(746 W/HP * 5 HP) is ~ 15A. Generally you would consider start up currents etc, but treadmills use control circuitry to minimize this. Using nameplate values and oversizing to 125% would be fine in this case.

[medic-dan]

Horse treadmill = appliance.

There are exceptions to determining the ampacity requirements in table 430.248 (2008 NEC).

NEC 430.6 (a) (1) exception #3:
"For a listed motor-operated appliance that is marked with both motor horsepower and full-load current, the motor full-load current marked on the nameplate shall be used instead of the horsepower rating on the appliance nameplate to determine the ampacity or rating of the disconnecting means, the branch circuit conductors, the controller, the branch-circuit short-circuit and ground-fault protection, and any separate overload protection."

[tkrussell]

Just a city boy here, even thou I now live in the country, so now I have seen everything, a treadmill for a horse. I won't go near a horse, scare the be-jesus out of me.

Imagine my distress and hyperventilating when a horse riding club parked their 20 + horses in my front yard one Sunday morning while I was out working in the yard. And why were they there? A rider was severely injured by a horse she was riding next to kicked her. And people ride these things. Not this boy.

Now that we know that the motor is part of an appliance, medic is correct, using Table 430.248 (Sorry, I was lazy and referred to same table but numbered in the 2002 NEC, they changed table numbers, I should know better).

But the plot thickens, Appy now mentions the units comes with a 30 amp plug.

Back to the fundamentals, what does the manual or instructions of this unit explain?


Per Section 430.22, branch circuit size is full load amps + 25 %, so 14 * 1.25 = 17.5 amps, so #12 is fine.

Circuit breaker is sized per 430 Part IV, and the max CB size can be up to 250 % of the FLA, which is 35 Amps.

You may try a 20 Amp CB, the 30 amp rating of the plug indicates to me the manufacturer is sizing the circuit at 30 Amps.

So, what does the manual state?

This is why getting ALL the information is so important.

[appy151]

Hey tkrussell,

The horse is nothing to be scared of, now some of the bills that come along with them, that’s a different story.

The manual that comes with the unit has no electrical details other than a simple chart that shows the model, HP, and that it is a single phase motor. I got the amps from the plate right on the motor and what is on the plug. I also checked out the manufacturers website (I bought the unit used) and there is nothing there either.

Based on what you guys have said, I should be fine going with the 30-amp breaker but could go down to a 20 amp if I wanted to. For the wire I can use #12. Ok that seems fairly easy. I moved the machine into place this afternoon; it weighs in at just over 2000 lbs, so pulling the wire is tomorrows chore.

Thanks to all of you for the assistance and sound advice.

[Missouri Bound]

Ahh... no. 20 amp breaker requires 12 ga wire, 30 amp requires 10 ga wire.

[KISS]

You made me look: I found this: Horse Treadmill Model 101A - HydroHorse All I can say is WOW!