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Home > Society & Culture > Politics   »   Separation of State and Religion. or something like that

 
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Old Sep 10, 2007, 06:03 PM
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Separation of State and Religion. or something like that

i remember learning about separation of state and religion. What it basically said is that the government decisions will not be based on religion.

What i do not understand is why homosexuals' cant get married. Isn't that a religion thing?

 
     

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Old Sep 10, 2007, 06:14 PM   #2  
GlindaofOz
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Yes it is a religion thing. Marriage is a function of the church civil unions are a function of the state. If I got married to a man outside of of a church it would technically be a civil union not a marriage.

However you may notice that a lot of religious ideals push forward our legislative process since that who gives campaign dollars and who is influential. Its not right but politics isn't always fair or right

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excon agrees: Here's a greenie, Glinda, but no. I got married outside of a church, and I was REALLY married.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 10, 2007, 06:58 PM   #3  
Fr_Chuck
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Two main things, First it was the "seperation of Church and State"
But read your consitution and you won't find a single word in it about a seperation, only a protection that there will not be a state religion, One religion rerconised as the proper religion for the nation. And second that the government will not pass a law restricting the freedom of religion.

Most laws murder, stealing are all based on religion. You are learning the re-written constitution that the ACLU is selling, take out a book and read it for yourself.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 10, 2007, 07:05 PM   #4  
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Two pretty good responses. Chuck is correct about the doctrine of separation of church and state is not mentioned in the Constitution. However several of the founding fathers did write about it and it became an accepted doctrine. Since the constitution prohibits establishing a state or official religion, this has been interpeted to prevent the state from promoting any one religion in any way. Hence the removal of prayer from the schools. Hence trying to cover all religions or none during holidays.

Now, you raise any interesting point that the prohibition against homosexual marriage would seen to be mostly religious. but its cultural as well.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 11, 2007, 01:23 AM   #5  
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As ScottGem points out ,it is more of a cultural thing . It is certainly not a religious thing . A marriage is a contract and is licensed by the States. The problem with homosexual marriages being recognized by only some of the States is the 'full faith and credit "clause(Article IV, Section 1) of the Constitution which mandates that the contracts recognized in one State shall be recognized in all. Therefore there has to be a national consensus and at this time there is none .

The Constitution's 1st amendment prohibits the Congress from establishing a church and restricts them from making laws against the free exercise of religion. Nowhere is it implied that there would be a separation as Thomas Jefferson wrote to the Danbury Baptists in 1802 . Even his letter did not address the States establishing a religion ;rather it addressed a national religion. The letter contains the phrase "wall of separation between church and state."

SCOTUS has erred a number of times in citing his letter in their rulings. Indeed the intent was to protect the church from the government and not the other way around. The ideas which lead to this phrase came from a sermon given by Baptist Roger Williams, entitled "The Garden in the Wilderness," in which Williams explains that the purpose of civil government is to allow religion to flourish, not to be regulated.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 11, 2007, 06:17 AM   #6  
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Hey, Sarge.

The answers given above are generally good ones. But please keep in mind that sepparation of Church and State, even by those who accept this extraconstitutional idea, is not the same as sepparation of Church FROM State. There is a group of PC types who go around claiming that any public display of religion is against the law, and the ACLU keeps suing people for public religious displays. A prohibition of the government promoting any single religion is NOT a prohibition on INDIVIDUALS from making religious displays in public. That would be against the First Amendment's freedom of religion and freedom of speech clauses.

As for gay marriage, the argument against it is not religious, though those who make that argument tend to be of a religious background. The actual argument being made is that marriage is a right of the states. States have the right to define mariage however they wish, and have the right to prohibit gay marriage if they desire. However the "Full Faith And Credit" clause of the Constitution requirres that all states recognize the mariages of all other states. Since not all states wish to recognize gay marriage, but would be forced to do so, they are demanding that the term "marriage" be defined in the Constitution as "between a man and woman" so that they aren't forced to accept something they have no wish to accept. What they are looking for is an amendment that defines marriage so that all the states are on the same wavelength. That is the legal basis for trying to push a "marriage protection" amendment.

Elliot

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nicespringgirl agrees: Right!marriage is a right of the states.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 11, 2007, 11:02 AM   #7  
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Oh, i still do not know why these states hate homosexual's so much but idk maybe my generation can fix that (If im not alone on this thought).

That is interesting, i learned a lot from this. I love history and politics so i always have questions on this type of stuff.

Thank you.

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excon agrees: In my view, the people who really hate, are the ones who question their own sexuality.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 11, 2007, 11:07 AM   #8  
GlindaofOz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sGt HarDKorE
Oh, i still do not know why these states hate homosexual's so much but idk maybe my generation can fix that (If im not alone on this thought).

Let's hope so.
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 11, 2007, 02:42 PM   #9  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sGt HarDKorE
Oh, i still do not know why these states hate homosexual's so much but idk maybe my generation can fix that (If im not alone on this thought).

That is interesting, i learned a lot from this. I love history and politics so i always have questions on this type of stuff.

Thank you.


Is disagreement = to hate?






Grace and Peace
 
 
     
 
 
Old Sep 13, 2007, 08:22 AM   #10  
Dark_crow
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sGt HarDKorE
Oh, i still do not know why these states hate homosexual's so much but idk maybe my generation can fix that (If im not alone on this thought).


Thank you.
To the success of our hopeless task…
 
 
     


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