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    CollegeGrl's Avatar
    CollegeGrl Posts: 2, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Dec 13, 2007, 09:38 AM
    Define Liberal
    What exactly is a liberal?
    tickle's Avatar
    tickle Posts: 23,796, Reputation: 2674
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    #2

    Dec 13, 2007, 10:03 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by CollegeGrl
    What exactly is a liberal?
    The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) indicates that the word liberal has long been in the English language with the meanings of "befitting free men, noble, generous" as in liberal arts; also with the meaning "free from restraint in speech or action", as in liberal with the purse, or liberal tongue, usually as a term of reproach but, beginning 1776–88 imbued with a more favorable sense by Edward Gibbon and others to mean "free from prejudice, tolerant."
    CollegeGrl's Avatar
    CollegeGrl Posts: 2, Reputation: 1
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    #3

    Dec 13, 2007, 12:12 PM
    The doesn't answer my question really. I mean as far as politics and the law goes. A friend of mine and I were talking about political standpoints and she stated that she is a liberal. So I was basically wondering what she meant by that. Does it mean she has no view as republican or democratic? Or is it that she agrees with some points from both sides and can't choose one.. or simply that she is a badass that just wants to have fun lol
    ETWolverine's Avatar
    ETWolverine Posts: 934, Reputation: 275
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    #4

    Dec 13, 2007, 12:44 PM
    Liberal can have several different meanings. In this day and age, in American politics, it tends to mean a belief that the purpose of government is to fix the wrongs of society. Liberals tend to believe that it is the job of government to make sure that everyone has the same health care, the same wealth, the same level of success, the same everything. The idea is that if everyone is equal in every way, there will be no reason for war, crime, poverty, etc. They also tend to believe that people are either not educated enough or not responsible enough to make decisions for themselves, so they believe that the government must make those decisions for people.

    This is, of course, a very simplified explanation of what "liberal" means.

    By contrast, conservatives believe that people, not government, are in a better position to make choices for themselves than government is. They also tend to believe that equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome, is the goal to strive for. Therefore, conservatives tend to believe that government has no place in most issues having to do with personal choices. It is not the job of government to make sure that everyone is equal, and equality of wealth will not stop crime, poverty, war, etc.

    These basic beliefs about the role of government form the basis for all positions taken by both liberals and conservatives. Understanding these basic positions about the role of government in our lives can lead one to understand law and policy from the liberal and conservative point of view.

    Again, these are VERY simplified explanations of what liberal and conservative are. The specific issues become much more complex, especially since we live in the real world, and in the real world the government can neither be totally involved nor totally uninvolved in our lives. So for the sake of reality, compromises are made by both liberals and conservatives that often blur the lines between the two on some issues. So the entire issue of liberal and conservative becomes complicated.

    I happen to be a Conservative. I believe that the government has little role in our lives. I am against things like government bans on trans-fats, smoking, and handguns. These are all cases of the government getting involved in issues that affect our personal lives. I am in favor of smaller government. I am in favor of lower taxes and decreased government spending. I am against welfare, which is a government attempt to take money from the rich (in the form of taxes) and give it to the poor (through welfare programs) in order to make them more equal. I am against government-run universal health care. I am in favor of a strong military, which is, constitutionally speaking, one of the only three real purposes of government (the other two are to run roads infrastructure, and to run a mail system--- which in modern times probably includes telephones and the internet).

    If you believe as I do, chances are you are a conservative too. If you disagree with these positions, you are probably a liberal. But there are so many issues, and so many opportunities to cross lines on so many issues, that it is hard to pin anyone down based on two or three issues.

    Elliot
    NeedKarma's Avatar
    NeedKarma Posts: 10,635, Reputation: 1706
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    #5

    Dec 14, 2007, 08:07 AM
    Here is a good definition: liberalism: Definition and Much More from Answers.com

    "A political theory founded on the natural goodness of humans and the autonomy of the individual and favoring civil and political liberties, government by law with the consent of the governed, and protection from arbitrary authority."

    Also, there is a good definition here:
    Liberalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    "Broadly speaking, liberalism emphasizes individual rights and equality of opportunity. Different forms of liberalism may propose very different policies, but they are generally united by their support for a number of principles, including extensive freedom of thought and speech, limitations on the power of governments, the rule of law, the free exchange of ideas, a market or mixed economy, and a transparent system of government. All liberals – as well as some adherents of other political ideologies – support some variant of the form of government known as liberal democracy, with open and fair elections, where all citizens have equal rights by law."
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #6

    Dec 14, 2007, 08:33 AM
    Needkarma . You gave the textbook definition of classical liberalism which is very much different than the "democrat socialist " version of liberalism that is practiced in America today. Elliot is correct . Modern liberalism tries to straddle the fence of socialist complete control of the economy by the government ;including gvt. Ownership of industry ;and capitalism .

    Their advocacy of expansion of government control of most aspects of life is a far cry from "limitations on the power of governments"
    NeedKarma's Avatar
    NeedKarma Posts: 10,635, Reputation: 1706
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    #7

    Dec 14, 2007, 08:37 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55
    Needkarma . You gave the textbook definition of classical liberalism which is very much different than the "democrat socialist "
    The OP mentioned nothing about democrat socialist, only you and Elliot have.
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    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #8

    Dec 14, 2007, 08:52 AM
    tickle gave basically the same text book definition and the questioner said that it did not answer the question .She wants to know what her friend means when she says she is a liberal and I'll say it again... liberalism in America today has no connection to the classic definition of liberalism as a philosophy .
    ETWolverine's Avatar
    ETWolverine Posts: 934, Reputation: 275
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    #9

    Dec 14, 2007, 09:02 AM
    Hey, NK.

    If you disliked my post above, you're going to absolutely hate this definition.

    A liberal is a conservative who hasn't been raped, mugged or assaulted yet.

    Elliot
    Tuscany's Avatar
    Tuscany Posts: 1,049, Reputation: 229
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    #10

    Dec 14, 2007, 09:04 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by ETWolverine
    Hey, NK.

    If you disliked my post above, you're gonna absolutely hate this definition.

    A liberal is a conservative who hasn't been raped, mugged or assaulted yet.

    Elliot

    Harsh isn't it ET?

    And people wonder why I avoid affiliating myself with either party.
    ETWolverine's Avatar
    ETWolverine Posts: 934, Reputation: 275
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    #11

    Dec 14, 2007, 09:11 AM
    Yes, it is harsh. I'm a bit fed up with NK.

    My prior post in this topic, I though, was fairly balanced. I gave the definition of liberal, the definition of conservative, and examples of what I believe as a conservative. I then stated that the reader can choose either position, and which way that person chooses will define whether they are liberal or conservative.

    So along comes NK who accuses me of pushing an agenda.

    From my perspective, if I've been judged guilty, I might was well do the crime.

    BTW, do you know why liberalism is like cotton candy? Because at first it looks nice and tastes sweet, but under further examination you find that it is made up of mostly fluff and hot air and isn't really very good for you.

    Elliot
    Dark_crow's Avatar
    Dark_crow Posts: 1,405, Reputation: 196
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    #12

    Dec 14, 2007, 09:50 AM
    First, no one but your friend can know how they are using the term “liberal,' and second I have seen little this thread has produced aside from misusing language and by the asking of meaningless questions.

    A definition may either give the meaning that a term bears in general use (a descriptive definition), or that which the speaker intends to impose upon it for the purpose of his or her discourse (a stipulative definition).

    Now just which definition are you looking for? It would seem that if you want a descriptive definition all you would need do is open a dictionary.

    Aside from that we are left only with a stipulative definition where every answer is no more than the author imposing upon it for the purpose of his or her discourse.
    RustyFairmount's Avatar
    RustyFairmount Posts: 165, Reputation: 40
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    #13

    Dec 16, 2007, 03:09 PM
    In context of the US government, a liberal is a person who believes the government should have a more active role doing things for the citizenry. Liberals believe that the government should manage every problem out of existence. But in order to do that, the government needs lots of money. So liberals typically favor higher taxes.

    On the other hand, a conservative is a person who believes the government should have a more passive role in the lives of the citizenry. Conservatives believe that having the smallest, and least expensive government possible will give people the money, and ability to solve their problems for themselves. This typically means lower taxes.

    As a general rule of thumb: Democrats are liberal, Republicans are conservative. Before anybody gets mad, recognize that there are exceptions to every rule. I'm just generalizing to help answer the OPs question. Your friend may be liberal but not interested in the Democrat party. Using the term "liberal" as she did is a very PC way of saying that she thinks independently, and does not want to directly associate herself with a particular party.

    You then get to draw your own conclusions.
    N0help4u's Avatar
    N0help4u Posts: 19,823, Reputation: 2035
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    #14

    Dec 16, 2007, 07:02 PM
    ETW was perfectly right in his reply...

    Quote Originally Posted by tickle
    The Oxford English Dictionary (OED) indicates that the word liberal has long been in the English language with the meanings of "befitting free men, noble, generous" as in liberal arts; also with the meaning "free from restraint in speech or action", as in liberal with the purse, or liberal tongue, usually as a term of reproach but, beginning 1776–88 imbued with a more favorable sense by Edward Gibbon and others to mean "free from prejudice, tolerant."
    Quote Originally Posted by CollegeGrl
    The doesn't answer my question really. I mean as far as politics and the law goes. A friend of mine and I were talking about political standpoints and she stated that she is a liberal. So I was basically wondering what she meant by that. Does it mean she has no view as republican or democratic? Or is it that she agrees with some points from both sides and can't choose one..or simply that she is a badass that just wants to have fun lol
    Here is a basic of what the more extreme liberal liberals believe
    American Thinker: What Does a Liberal Believe?
    BABRAM's Avatar
    BABRAM Posts: 561, Reputation: 145
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    #15

    Dec 17, 2007, 02:20 PM
    All good definitions of liberalism that I agree with here. Sometimes the best definitions are based upon what the opposite of a word means, as defined by both ETW and RustyFairmount in demonstrating what general conservative ideas represent. I'll add to what N0help4u hit upon, and that is with liberalism, to some degree it is in the eye of the beholder. For example, there are other parties that do not consider the Democratic party liberal enough. So it's not just a Democratic persuasion, although by comparisons to Republicans, Democrats are by far less conservative.



    Bobby

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