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Home > Society & Culture > Politics   »   Am I getting this right

 
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Old Aug 12, 2007, 12:18 PM
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Am I getting this right

Are all the candidates for President Nationalistic to the point of justifying pre-emptive war?

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Old Aug 12, 2007, 02:03 PM   #2  
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Hmmm, interesting, just thinking of the frontrunners in both major parties, yes, they would use pre-emptive war. ie Obama, Hillary, Edwards;;;;Guiliani, Romney, McCain's campaign is failing.

That's what the most powerful country in the history of the world does, n'est pas?
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Old Aug 12, 2007, 03:06 PM   #3  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Choux
Hmmm, interesting, just thinking of the frontrunners in both major parties, yes, they would use pre-emptive war. ie Obama, Hillary, Edwards;;;;Guiliani, Romney, McCain's campaign is failing.

That's what the most powerful country in the history of the world does, n'est pas?
I thought that America being a member of the UBN forbad that?
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 06:53 AM   #4  
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The candidates are certainly saying that pre-emptive is an option that should not be taken off the table.

Of course Obama is talking about pre-emptive war on our allies, while at the same time completely taking our most powerful weapons off the table as an option, but that's a whole other topic.

Is it nationalism that is driving these statements? I don't know. Certainly for a few of them, it's about nationalism. But for at least a few of them, these words are simply what they think the country wants to hear, and they say it in order to get themselves elected.

Now... is nationalism a bad thing? I don't think so. Is a willingness to pre-emptively strike an enemy that is making moves to attack you a bad thing? I don't think so. Is a willingness to fight the enemies of your country with every tool at your disposal a bad thing? I don't think so. And is membership in the UN supposed to be a suicide pact that prevents you from taking actions that can ensure the safety of your citizenty? Again, I don't think so. Is getting international support for such a pre-emptive attack a good thing? Sure. Is it necessary or required? I don't think so.

So, yes, you basically have it right... with the exception of the fact that some of the candidates are simply parroting positions they don't really believe.

Elliot
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 06:58 AM   #5  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_crow
Are all the candidates for President Nationalistic to the point of justifying pre-emptive war?
Hello DC:

Nope. Ron Paul doesn't. Ron Paul for pres!!!!

excon
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 08:14 AM   #6  
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I can't recall a President in the nuclear age who has come into office with the position that they would take preemption off the table. Seems that would be an irresponsible position to take. BTW ;preventive war would be a more accurate description.

Quote:
“The military advantages of landing the first blow become increasingly important with modern weapons, and this is a fact which requires us to be on the alert in order to strike with our full weight as soon as we are attacked, and, if possible, before the Soviet blow is actually delivered.”
NSC-68, Section IX.C



Grenada, Panama, Kosovo are all recent examples of the Presidential use of preemption. The doctrine did not being with Bush nor will it end with him.

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excon agrees: Unless we elect Ron Paul. Ron Paul for pres!!!
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 08:23 AM   #7  
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Excon,

Yeah... Ron Paul for president. That way the enemy can attack us here in the USA before we ever have a chance to stop them elsewhere. Because waiting for the enemy to come here has been so successful for us in the past...

Elliot
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 08:31 AM   #8  
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Hello again, El:

El, El, El.... Tsk, tsk. You assume because he doesn't want to BE the agressor, that he wouldn't defend us. Nope. Wrong. Buzz! You don't understand libertarians. S'ok. Nobody else does either.

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Old Aug 13, 2007, 03:19 PM   #9  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
I can't recall a President in the nuclear age who has come into office with the position that they would take preemption off the table. Seems that would be an irresponsible position to take. BTW ;preventive war would be a more accurate description.

NSC-68, Section IX.C



Grenada, Panama, Kosovo are all recent examples of the Presidential use of preemption. The doctrine did not being with Bush nor will it end with him.
I think we are talking about two different things, Tom. The talk now is with nukes.
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Old Aug 13, 2007, 05:37 PM   #10  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_crow
Are all the candidates for President Nationalistic to the point of justifying pre-emptive war?
What we are seeing is the continuing ripple effect of the Nationalism that swept the country after the attacks of 9/11.

Remember the mass hysteria that fostered that abomination 'The Patriot Act'?

Remember the 'If you're not with us then you must be against us' histrionics?

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Dark_crow agrees: Good point
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