Drainline bubbles

speedball1 · Apr 3, 2004, 12:34 PM

Hi Owen, There are bubbles and there are gurgles. A bubbling indicates a partial clog or blockage in the line. A gurgle indicates a venting problem. Bubbles=pressure or blowback. Gurgles= vacuum or suction. I'm presenting both of them because I'm not there to see which is which so I'll take your word that it's pressure blowing back and not air being sucked back into your toilet. The reason it's worse when the washer runs is because there is no other fixture in your house that discharges with more pressure and voluum . You said, "I noticed that the laundry discharge tends to create an "air lock" or vacuum (or whatever the proper term is) in the drain line. " Please explain in more detail what happens at the cleanout when you discharge the washer. If the problem were in the house main or one of the branches you shouldn't see any action at the clean out other then a flow of liquid. I'm a little confused here. At the toilet there are bubbles, (blowback/ partial blockage), however at the cleanout you have vacuum/air lock (blocked vent). Can't be both, got to be one or the other. Does the toilet back up and over flow? When you ran a snake down the cleanout to the septic tank did you also drop the snake down the washer vent and put out enough snake to past the cleanout? If you can still contact the plumber ask if he used 1/4 bends instead of sweeps on the drainage? That would give you back pressure under a high volume discharge such as a washer puts out. I'm still not discounting a vent problem. If there were a partial blockage then the water would back up when it hit forcing air to back uo also but after the bubbles there's usually a overflow. If there's a vent problem the dischage will set up a vacuum and vent through the nearest trap. In this case it could be the trap in your toilet. So, no backups? No liquid gushing out of the tub or shower drain when the washer discharges? Does the cleanout bubble back when the washer discharges? I'll wait on your answer and reply ASAP. Refards, Tom

Owen · Apr 3, 2004, 02:13 PM

Thanks Tom--I'll try to explain exactly what I observe.

When the washer discharges and I observe through the cleanout, I see laundry water rushing by, then slowly backup (because it appears there's so much volume), then slosh back and forth, making an occasional slurping sound. When any other fixture is used (toilet, sink, etc) and I observe through the cleanout, I see the water rushing by with no backing up whatsoever.

I snaked from the cleanout to the septic tank and everything came out clean. I have not snaked the vent.

The toilet does not overflow. What happens in these situations is that when you flush, even if just water, it doesn't go anywhere, just fills to the top of the bowl. A few bubbles come up and the problem clears itself after awhile. As a temporary fix, we try to just use the laundry late at night when no other fixtures will be used for awhile.

I don't know if the plumber used sweeps or 1/4 bends, but given the layout of the piping, and the location of the cleanout relative to the septic tank, I suspect he used 1/4 bend after the cleanout. Thanks--Owen

speedball1 · Apr 3, 2004, 02:45 PM

Have you opened up the septic tank to see if it needs to be pumped?

Owen · Apr 3, 2004, 02:59 PM

Tom--haven't opened the tank, but here's what I did with the septic installer last weekend (because I suspected the septic system to be the culprit):

We dug enough dirt so we could observe about 3' of pipe entering the septic tank, then we opened the cleanout and inserted a garden hose. We ran the garden hose for 30 minutes to see if we could "overfill" the system/drainfield. Everything drained fine and we could hear the water passing through the line into the tank (which was simultaneously satisfying and frustrating.)

To answer your question, when the cleanout is opened, the toilet does not bubble.

My thought about the washer was that it's so much water rushing so fast through the system that when you watch it go past the cleanout it zooms by, then sloshes back and forth making the occasional slurping sound. It seems that this problem is alleviated when I have the cleanout open, but I'm trying not to "overanalyze" this and miss a different problem (for example, others I have asked have blamed it on low-volume toilets, etc.)

speedball1 · Apr 3, 2004, 05:01 PM

A garden hose doesn't have the pressure and volume that a washer pump can put out so that test doesn't tell you much. ? It's not in the vents , you steared me away from there. Congratulations! ;D You have nailed it down to one place. The fact that the toilet doesn't bubble when the cleanout's open tells me that the problem's in the septic system. The air that would normally bubble up the john is now venting through the open clean out. That could only happen if there was a backup downstream of the cleanout. As for the 1.6 gallon lo flush toilets, our problem is a heavy volume of water rushing down the pipe too fast. Any how it gave me a chuckle. You will find your problem somewhere between the cleanout and the end of the drain field. Good luck and I hope I've helped some. Have a great week end! Me? I'm going to the beach and work on my tan. Cheers, Tom 8)

starfaz · Apr 28, 2004, 03:03 PM

:-/
I am having a *similar* problem. My clothes washer overflows in the laundry room and sends water up the vent pipe to the roof. The Roto Rooter (RR) people used their auger thing to clean the drain pipe all the way to the septic tank. He said he felt no obstructions. However, it still flooded the laundry room and sent water to the roof after he "cleaned" the line. RR didn't charge me, since they couldn't find/fix the problem. My neighbor suggested that a tree root may be pushing on the drainline, ever so slightly, to cause it not to have enough "fall" and a bubble is impeding the water flow. So now I am considering a tree surgeon to rip all the trees out by their roots and letting the drainline raise back up. Is there method to this madness?

labman · Apr 28, 2004, 04:41 PM

I seriously doubt a tree root pushing the line out of place would cause the problem. Look at the trap under your sink, and the way the water has to go down, up, and back down again. Did the rotorooter guy start right at the washer drain, or an outside clean out? If so, have him come again and start at the washer.

You can cut down a tree and even have the stump ground away, but most of the tree roots will still be there. I don't think anybody can completely remove all of a tree's roots. I would certainly wait until tanned Tom makes it back from the beach and gives his opinion. It would be one thing to sacrifice the trees if it worked. I am afraid you would be out time, money, the trees, and still have the drain problem. Reread the other posts, and study the problem some more. At least you roof should be water proof.

speedball1 · Apr 29, 2004, 06:42 AM

Hey Star, A sunny hello from Florida. Lab man was right. I played hooky and spent the day at the beach. Sarasota's beautiful this time of year. Most RR men aren't regular plumbers. They just snake out the sewer line from the house to the street or the septic tank to remove roots. If you had tree roots in the sewer line to the septic tank then ALL of your fixtures would be affected. It sounds like you have a blockage in the branch line that drains the washer. This blockage will be located downstream from the vent in the branch line. Did the RR man run a snake down from the roof vent. Because if he didn't then you will still be left with the blockage. Get a man out there to run a snake down the vent and break up the clog and send it on through. Let me know how you make out. Cheers, Tom

starfaz · May 5, 2004, 11:50 AM

Hi Tom,

The RotoRooter (RR) guys came back out. They used a camera to check the drain line and the vent to the roof. The vent was OK, but the drain line was clogged about 50 feet out from the house. Apparently, the drain line didn't connect to the septic tank after all. It was a "graywater" line that ran independently. He said that in our area, it was OK, but in some places that was illegal. He connected the washer to the main septic tank line at the house, capped off the old "graywater" drain line and even pumped the septic tank. He did all of this for $200, which seemed cheap to me, but I didn't question it. Everything seems to be working fine so far and I'm glad I didn't have all the trees ripped out. THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR YOUR ADVICE! Too many times people tell me things just to charge me more and I like having enough knowledge to tell when their lying, or not. Thanks again!

Drainline bubbles

Add your answer here.

Check out some similar questions!