Original Sin

Not sure why this is under Paranormal but original sin and not sure why you believe there is a lot of speculation over it, In religion you either believe it exists as in the teachings of the Roman Catholic, the Independent Catholics, the various Orthodox Churches, the Anglican, most Lutherans churches.

It is where because sin entered the world though Adam ( Adam and Eve) and were put out of the garden, and all mankind was cursed ( man to work hard and women to suffer in child birth) This curse and thus their sin continues in the line of all men. So man at birth contains this original sin.
This is why all of the above churches baptise the infant, to cleanse them from the original sin.

More current churches Baptist, Penticostal, Univeralists and so on don't accept this idea. They do not believe in original sin, thus they do not baptise until a child reaches their teens. Or adults.

It was an accepted Chrsitian fact for almost 1500 years it is only in the more recent few hundred years that some wish not to accept this fact.

I feel it has an importanant place on this forum due to the fact we were discussing the evil and good in the world as it pertains to the spirits that people are encountering and if in fact they are good or evil. Does GOD have both attributes or do just we, the creation of GOD, have those attributes of good and evil and everything in between? Chuck, there has been great controversy through out the ages, even within the Catholic church, concerning this subject. It is the Church's way to not say that GOD is the origin of, or creator of, the evil we experience but that man, the creation is. It is to say GOD "does not have an evil bone in his body". Where did Evil originate Chuck? Because we are less than GOD, is it just a natural attribute of us? Then when we pass on and our spirits are earth bound, does that somehow trigger the evil to be the predominate nature? Or, are there other evil spirits with evil that did not originate from Adam and Eve, and were in existance before them, that are loose on this earth and have the ability to "play with us?

Since there are areas that deal with religion this would have best been placed there I still think, An area that deals with UFO's or Ghosts or fortune telling is not really a area for a religous discussion.

Sin is a matter of free will, since God created all things, he would have created the ability to sin, but not the sin itself. Sin of course as bibical study tells us, started out though pride. Where one of God's creations, a angel wished to become or be god. How it all happened we do not know and will perhaps never know.

But sin while not created has been allowed to exist by God. Had God not allowed Adam and Eve to exist. He could have just wiped them out and started over if he wished.

But I believe that sin exists today as a burden or testing of some level for mankind. Will we keep the moral course or will we take to the fancy of the day and follow our personal desires over that of God.

The only real debate over it, is when man wishes to try and understand it on his terms, by using mans reasoning and mans teachings. If one merely accepts it as it is told to us in the bible, then one has the answer.

God did create everything, A angel now called Satan turned against God and has tempted various men directly as we are told in the bible.
Because of this man has adapted the sinful nature. Man will live forever on earth with his sin nature that he has to deal with daily.

Do you think that maybe Satan is still "tempting men on earth today? Could these Aliens possibly be evil spirits trying to convince the population that the bible is not true, ie: "new age movement." Channeling of spirit voices telling every one there is nothing to worry about because it is all good so if it feels good do it. Why, that sounds just like Satan to me Chuck! "Go ahead, who's going to know?" How many times have you heard that one Chuck? If the issues of the paranormal today have nothing to do with religon as you say Chuck, then none of the issues of today have anything to do with the church so I guess you should turn in your nice robe there and we will all just sleep in on sunday morning! Wait!?! We can't do that, who will pass around the collection plate, worse yet, who will donate thiths if we all are no longer prisoners of fear and compelled to pave our way to heaven with dollor bills? Hmmmmm, Ok, OK, I got it....This will really scare them...Ready? THE END IS NEAR! THE END IS NEAR! Ah yes I am a dramatic son of a gun and sometime too passionate but I hope you get my point FR Chuck. Satan is alive and well working to his end on this planet now. That is the reason so many thousands of people are having paranormal experiances now. That is the reason for so many UFO sitings. Come on Chuck, you should know that better than I being a man of the cloth. And you should be the first to admit that the Ghost Busting for Dummies book is actually Bible.

Of course as Chrsitians we should know ( while many don't though) that if heaven is real, then so is the devil, satan, or what ever name you want to give to him, we know from the bible that he and a large portion of his followers were taken from heaven. We also know that Satan is free to travel back and forth across the earth.

We also know that he is only a powerful angel,not god, so he can only be in one place at one time, But his followers ( the evil angels now called demons or evil spirits) are here on earth. Most of them don't have to do much anymore. They merely get rid of restrictiions on man and man will do most of his own harm. And of course it is a combination of our own evil will and the tempting that is those little voices that tell us to do what we want.

The one area in the bible I find intersting is where Jesus was walking on the water and his followers thought he was a Ghost. Not a devil, not a angel but a ghost. Now this can be perhaps merely their own minds and Christ did not correct them and say Ghosts are not real.

We also go to the witch that brought Samuel back to speak to the king. We are not told it was an evil spirit, but that it was actually Samuel that came to speak to the king. So even the bible has some mention of the occult and also includes witchcraft and other things.

So perhaps there is an some level of ghosts and spirits that don't fall into the evil spirit area that we just can't explain. It does not take away from anything in the bible, the bible deals with those things needed for worship and salvation, and a guilde to everyday living. It tells us not to call up spirits or ghosts, it tells us not to go after witchcraft and so on.
If they did not exist we would not be warned about them.

As for as UFO, who knows and cares, If a entire fleet came in tomorrow it again would not take away or add tothe bible, God never said he created any other worlds with living things, but he never said he did not either.

As for as ghosts or spirits, the church as a whole accepts the existance of evil spirits and possessions and the spirit being "in" a place. It is not done often and then only with the greatest care but spirits have been sent away both in the bible and in today's society,

But I am also the first to say that we can't merely blame the devil on what we do, he is only their to temp us, not to force us, we are in the end the ones who chose to do evil or wrong doing.

The Bible describes God as good. In fact, he is said to be the personification of love.
His works are described as perfect. The reason they seem botched up on earth now is because of the independence mankind demanded via rebellion and was temporarily granted. With that granting came a removal of God's blessing of the earth for human habitation.


Evil? It originated in the mind of Satan and spread from there. However, potential misuse of free was there and with it the possibility of sin. Being less than God doesn't necessarily make a creature evil. The angels are less and the majority have kept their holiness intact despite the temptations. There are even humans who have lived exemplary Christian lives despite their inherited sinful tendencies.

The only earthbound spirits mentioned in the Bible are Satan and the rebel angels who are now limited to this region. These feign to be dear departed in order to spread the original lie of you will not die.

Soul immortal?
Body


BTW
I agree that the subject is pertinent to the occult which is being discussed here because it does pertain to the spirits which people here say they are encountering.

Original sin I believe to be when Eve ate of the forbidden fruit. This had to be done for our sake. We are here and being tested and tried. God gives us the freedom to choose good or bad and the way in which we want to live our lives. I think this is why sin had to be introduced. Without sin we would live in a perfect world and I think that would defeat the purpose of us being here on earth.

I agree with Starman, only good can come from God. He is perfect. Satan is the cause of all evil. We are less than God and are tested on a daily basis. We are tested constantly. I don't know about aliens or anything but I do believe that if a person has God on their side, anything is possible. I also believe the same with Satan except in a purely evil way.

As far as the entire baptism thing. I don't believe that God would send any child away because they haven't been baptised. I don't think you need to be baptised until you are aware of your actions and whether they are right or wrong. Knowledge is everything.

So the Devil and God were in cahoots to get Adam and Eve to sin for our sake?
What scriptural basis is there for this concept?

So the Devil and God were in cahoots to get Adam and Eve to sin for our sake? What scriptural basis is there for this concept?