Jehovah or Allah

galveston · Jan 1, 2007, 03:35 PM

In this time of "politically correct" it seems that there is a general good feel attitude about religion. "You're OK, I'm OK" pretty well expresses it. Folks say it doesn't matter how you serve God, because we are all His children. I submit for your consideration this: the God of the Bible is not the same as Allah. Discussion anyone?

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 31pumpkin

Morganite-

After the walls of Jericho fell, the Lord commanded Joshua & the Israelites not to covet the plunder. Joshua 7:1-But the Israelites acted unfaithfully in regard to the devoted things. Achan son of Carmi, the son of Zimri, the son of Zerah, of the tribe of Judah, took some of them. So the Lord's anger burned against Israel.
And so the Lord told Joshua to destroy" whatever among you is devoted to destruction."
Agreed? OK. Now do you think in present times someone reading the O.T.(Jew or not) would
stone someone's son to death for grand larceny?
No, because, and even in a RELIGIOUS sense,not to mention the laws of the land today, the Lord doesn't say go"go kill him", it's the devil that does that. You know it. I know it . And Jesus came as the great Intercessor for all. Again, God just doesn't say that anymore. He may say " go fight, I'm with you " but that is a completely different scenario.

Now, do you understand my point? You do not have to agree and that's fine.

"You know it. I know it"

One has to be uttterly conceited and deluded to tell another person what they know or to what they might agree.

I do not agree unless I say I do, and I do not know what you think I know unless I say I do. OK?

talaniman · Jan 14, 2007, 02:37 PM

You sound just like the hard headed fundamentalist who reek terror and ignorance on an unsuspecting population in the name of God but have no clues at all That you both (Islam/Christianity) spew the same stuff that has divided man all along. So I guess you have proved my point that all of you book heads scream and holler at each other, but are not smart enough to know your screaming and hollering about the same thing. So keep pointing fingers and wrap yourself with who's ever blood you need to, but it makes me no difference. Stick your nose back in the book, where you are happy.

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 31pumpkin

You misunderstood my answer. By" laws" I was referring to something like murder, kidnapping, or battery to say the least. Laws against crimes,punishable as in modern times.
Not anything to do with the Bible. It's government.
How do I explain - how many of Exremist Islam followers to moderate Muslims? Perhaps their numbers are the same. Just like all those CHRISTIAN names you gave. What was it, 25?
Don't count the ABORTION CLINIC violence! I'm not talking about 1 or 2 murders either.

25?

Morganite- tell that to Mohanir!

How can anyone tell what you were thinking (in reserve) unless you tell everything and qualify your statements so that they cannot be misunderstood? It is your respionsibility to ensure that you speak plainly, to the point, on the subject, and if you must rebut, then do it with evidence and reasoned argument, and not with a flurry of unsupported opinion.

If you make a statement, you must either support it or else withdraw it, but to make increasingly extravagant claims to justify it by saying you meant something other than what you actually said gives the impression that you are merely quarrelsome.

Do you stand by your statement that the Bible contains no direction to anyone to do violence to anyone? Or do you withdraw it?

magprob · Jan 14, 2007, 03:06 PM

I expected the rehetoric to follow and I will tell you, your having a teaching degree does not impress me in the least. As a matter of a fact, it scares me. First of all, you won't be teaching my children evolution and secondly, I am very carefull about the claims people make as to their education for the simple reason that I have know many eduated idiots in my time. And of course, an empirical wizard such as yourself will know nothing of the matters of the heart, other than heart disease of course.

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 31pumpkin

No, you keep going back to your tired, boring arguments b/c you disagree. We cannot have a debate when you are so inclined to poke fun at the one who you disagree with. You are closed minded b/c of your ego, for what that is worth. You come in on a conversation & spew absolute grade school knowledge that doesn't have any idea of the Bible or Qur'an. You like to get right in the middle & twist the words to suit your own ego. True, I don't know a lot about the Qur'an and I'm taking some Christian leaders word for it.
But the Bible- I know a great deal about. Much more than you know now preppy.

Don't twist the words & don't insult me. I feel sorry for you BTW, b/c it is you who has to worry about "standing before God" I'm covered with the blood of Jesus. Are you?
No, I think you are counting on your own will. Ego is part of the soul. You are out of alignment. Your spirit must be first. You need Jesus first- not yourself.

If you'd be quiet for a while, we might hear more about the Qur'an/Koran. I wonder if you can control it, at least with the superego--maybe we could actually learn something.

According to the Bible, the atonement of Jesus Christ was a universal gift. God is more generous in applying it to humanity than are some of his reputed supporters. Who speaks for God in this debate?

"Believing not" is not the same as not believing. If death was the terminal point of opportunity for men to accept Jesus Christ as Lord and saviour, what happens to all those who lived before the birth of Jesus, and to all those who have lived and do live in parts of the world where the name of Jesus has not been heard? Are they not also the children of a loving God?

Jesus came to be an infinite atonement and, by the shedding of his blood insuring to every creature immortality, because Redemption had to be as universal as the Fall. Further, we must never forget that, whatever we are moved to believe, the ultimate judge of who will and who will not be saved is in the hands of God and Christ alone. No minister has the power to determine otherwise.

It is sobering to consider the fate of those who claim to be followers of Christ but whose example and behavior have turned away many good people from embracing Jesus Christ as their saviour and redeemer. Whether among these is heaven bound?

ordinaryguy · Jan 14, 2007, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morganite

If you make a statement, you must either support it or else withdraw it, but to make increasingly extravagant claims to justify it by saying you meant something other than what you actually said gives the impression that you are merely quarrelsome.

I really do appreciate and admire your attempt to bring a voice of reason and balance to this orgy of Muslim/Allah/Koran bashing, but surely you realize by now that you can't reason with and debate these folks. If you make a point or ask a pointed question that exposes a fallacy in their stream of blather, they will ignore it and go off on yet another unrelated tangent of hyperbole, accusation and innuendo. But in spite of the hopelessnes of making a dent in their self-imprisoning armor, your attempts do serve the admirable purpose of showing that not all Christians are so arrogant and self-deluded that they can't see that others' beliefs, though different from their own, are worthy of respect. For that, I salute and thank you most kindly.

TheSavage · Jan 14, 2007, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magprob

Pilgrims perform last hajj ritual in Mecca - Yahoo! News

Muslim haj pilgrims perform devil-stoning ritual - Yahoo! News

"We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity. We weren't punctilious about locating and punishing only Hitler and his top officers. We carpet-bombed German cities; we killed civilians. That's war. And this is war"...Ann Coulter, Top Leading Christian Worldwide speaker.

"I don’t believe this is a wonderful, peaceful religion. When you read the Koran and you read the verses from the Koran, it instructs the killing of the infidel, for those that are non-Muslim." "The Islamic faith is wicked, violent, and not of the same God. It is a very evil and wicked religion."...Rev. Franklin Graham (son of Billy Graham)

"To see Americans become followers of, quote, Islam, is nothing short of insanity. Terry, you know, I've been in Africa many, many, many, many times, and you see people over here learning Swahili, for example. Swahili was the language of the slave traders. The Islamic people, the Arabs, were the ones who captured Africans, put them in slavery, and sent them to America as slaves. Why would people in America want to embrace the religion of the slavers, and the language of the slavers?"...Pat Robertson Founder and President of The 700 Club

"Islam was founded by Muhammad, a demon-possessed pedophile who had 12
wives - and his last one was a 9-year-old girl. And I will tell you Allah
is not Jehovah either. Jehovah's not going to turn you into a terrorist
that'll try to bomb people and take the lives of thousands and thousands
of people."....Pastor Jerry Vines Pastor of First Baptist Church, Jacksonville, Florida and former President of Southern Baptist Convention.

"Mohammed was a terrorist. I read enough if the history of his life written by both Muslims and non-Muslims (to know) that he was a violent man, a man of war. In my opinion, Jesus set the example for love, as did Moses. And I think that Mohammed set an opposite example."..Pastor Jerry Falwell, President of The Moral Majority, and Old-Time Gospel Hour

There has never been a bigger threat to Christianity, then the cult known as Islam. Yes, Islam is a cult, and a satanic cult at that. September 11, 2001 sounded the alarm and proved to Christian civilization what the true agenda of Islam is, and that is the total destruction of Christianity, as well as Judaism, by killing those who practice these beliefs, whom the Muslims refer to as infidels. We are in a war against terrorism, and this is a fight for survival. Christians and Jews represent Godliness, while Islam represents Satan. Muslims have become agents of Satan, and they will stop at nothing, including suicide to destroy Christians and Jews.

ISLAM

A free Holy Bible for the poor, oppressed and imprisoned

Naik says that he does not know Osama and cannot judge his actions. However, Naik adds that if Osama is "terrorizing the terrorist, America", then he supports Osama bin Laden.

Zakir Naik - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Statements such as above are not a bit different than what Bin laden preaches.
If I was the type that prayed my pray would be --O god protect me from your followers
--Savage

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 03:18 PM

It was either Tweedledum or Tweedledee who said, "When I use a word it means exactly what I want it to say: nothing more, nothing less!"

With that in mind, I offer the following:

Heart Pronunciation (härt) noun

1. Anatomy
a. The chambered muscular organ in vertebrates that pumps blood received from the veins into the arteries, thereby maintaining the flow of blood through the entire circulatory system.
b. A similarly functioning structure in invertebrates.

2. The area that is the approximate location of the heart in the body; the breast.

3.
a. The vital center and source of one's being, emotions, and sensibilities.
b. The repository of one's deepest and sincerest feelings and beliefs: an appeal from the heart; a subject dear to her heart.
c. The seat of the intellect or imagination: the worst atrocities the human heart could devise.

4.
a. Emotional constitution, basic disposition, or character: a man after my own heart.
b. One's prevailing mood or current inclination: We were light of heart.

5.
a. Capacity for sympathy or generosity; compassion: a leader who seems to have no heart.
b. Love; affection: The child won my heart.

6.
a. Courage; resolution; fortitude: The soldiers lost heart and retreated.
b. The firmness of will or the callousness required to carry out an unpleasant task or responsibility: hadn't the heart to send them away without food.

7. A person esteemed or admired as lovable, loyal, or courageous: a dear heart.

8.
a. The central or innermost physical part of a place or region: the heart of the financial district. See Synonyms at center.
b. The core of a plant, fruit, or vegetable: hearts of palm.

9. The most important or essential part: get to the heart of the matter.

10. A conventional two-lobed representation of the heart, usually colored red or pink.

11. Games
a. A red, heart-shaped figure on certain playing cards.
b. A playing card with this figure.
c. hearts (used with a sing. or pl. verb) The suit of cards represented by this figure.
d. A card game in which the object is either to avoid hearts when taking tricks or to take all the hearts.
tr.v. heart·ed, heart·ing, hearts

Archaic: To encourage; hearten.

Idioms:

at heart

In one's deepest feelings; fundamentally.

by heart

Learned by rote; memorized word for word.

do (one's) heart good

To lift one's spirits; make one happy.

from the bottom/depths of (one's) heart

With the deepest appreciation; most sincerely.

have (one's) heart in (one's) mouth

To be extremely frightened or anxious.

have (one's) heart in the right place

To be well-intentioned.

heart and soul

Completely; entirely.

in (one's) heart of hearts

In the seat of one's truest feelings.

lose (one's) heart to

To fall in love with.

near/close to (one's) heart

Loved by or important to one.

steal (someone's) heart

To win one's affection or love.

take to heart

To take seriously and be affected or troubled by: Don't take my criticism to heart.

to (one's) heart's content

To one's entire satisfaction, without limitation.

wear (one's) heart on (one's) sleeve

To show one's feelings clearly and openly by one's behavior.

with all (one's) heart

1. With great willingness or pleasure.
2. With the deepest feeling or devotion.

With half a heart = In a half-hearted manner.

[Middle English hert, from Old English heorte

Glad it is that I am, that none of us is heartless.
(The Barn of Avon)

.

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

It seems like it is easier to separate the differences than looking honestly at the similarities. When you throw the books away, and stand naked and alone before the Creator do you honestly think that their are different lines for different Gods?

It is not really difficult to discover who speaks with which voice.

God and Jesus are the reconcilers, whereas Satan has been called 'the crow-bar' because he pries people apart.

QED

Morganite · Jan 14, 2007, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 31pumpkin

That is the whole point of the question, Tal. We are NOT throwing the books away. We are reading them. The Bible & the Qur'an here. And if you insist on it - yes, there are different "lines" for different gods- exactly why Allah is not the God of the Bible. So, with your non-religious statement we're back to square one-the separating factor.
There is a difference between them(Qur'an & the Bible)
I proposed that some non-Muslim leaders said that there were 17 verses in the Qur'an that were violent(and should be removed) Of course they have similarities, but even one verse promoting violence is too much.

What would you do if all the Books had been destroyed? To what source would you turn for guidance in matters spiritual?

M

RGANITE



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