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What would you say are the four or five most important questions that must be asked when examining the claims of the Protestant and Catholic positions?

Here are what I believe some of them would...

De Maria,

Okay, let me make sure that I'm understanding what you are saying.

1) Are you arguing then, that it's the children who died during the flood who are being held in the prison...

De Maria,

Thanks for weighing in. Appreciate the input.

By the way, I responded to your post in the discussion re: 1 Peter 3:19 and purgatory:
...

Hello,

I've heard it said that Catholics believe that we are justified by faith and works. What works do they have in mind? I'd like to get a Catholic perspective on this.

Rob

De Maria,

Let's look at that text again:

in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison,
who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the...

If you believe that 1 Peter 3:19 is referring to purgatory, then you believe God destroyed the earth with a flood to kill off those who where actually in God's grace and friendship - not the wicked...

De Maria,

You may have overlooked it as this thread is seeing a lot of activity, but I asked you some questions in post #140 and asked them again in post #600. Have you had a chance to take a...

De Maria,

You may have missed this post. Looks like you've been away for a while, and there has been a lot of traffic since then meaning that this probably got buried:

Thank you Tom. That was the same point that I was trying to make in post #373, but you pointed it out in a more neat and tidy manner. If he is not trying to prove the existence of purgatory by...

Hello Scott,

Yes, I’m well. Thanks for asking.

You wrote:


Do you believe this cleansing spiritual fire to be purgatory? If you do, then you did present this verse as supporting purgatory.

Scott,

That’s not what I asked. I asked:



I did not ask if Bible verses had to be interpreted. Please answer the question above.

I also asked:

Scott,

A) Now are these verses supporting purgatory directly, or do they have to be interpreted "allegorically" to see purgatory in them?

B) Is it fair to say that you are admitting that not...

Scott,

What I'm objecting to is that you say this verse is speaking of purgatory, but to make it say that, you have to rip it from it's historical and literary context and interpret it...

House is pretty much gutted. Need to get smoke smell out of my running watch, book bag, and heart rate monitor. What's the best way to do that?
Thanks!

Rob

Which is one of the reasons Pete, why 1 Corinthians 3:15 is a non-starter regarding purgatory. It's talking about the day of judgment - the great day of the Lord, not the day of our death. Have you...

Not so fast there Scott. :D Obviously you felt it supported purgatory, otherwise you wouldn't have brought up 1 Peter 1:7. Why do you feel that it supports purgatory if what Peter is writing...

Scott RC,

We've already kicked around 1 Corinthians 3:15. Here, you are also appealing to 1 Peter 1:7 as a proof text for purgatory.

Here is the text from 1 Peter (NIV) in context:
...

Fred,

I do appreciate your answer. Part of the reason I asked is that there seems (from what I can tell discussing this topic with my friends) to be an "official debate version" of purgatory and...

Scott, These two quotes appear to be at odds with each other. Did your view change, or is there some way that you can merge these two ideas?

In my opinion, you could modify the Nicene creed, but...

Scott,

That's what I was looking for - a RC perspective. Can you cite some examples of regional councils? Do you feel that the Western church could modify the creed as it wishes for use in the...

ScottRC,

I've seen it go both ways. There is a website (RC) where there is supposedly a code of conduct - acceptable usage policy that states no ad hominems and to keep it polite, yet the...

Nowhere did he ask you to show him what's on it. If I'm understanding him correctly, he was saying that you should have posted the link for those of us who may be checking in from time to time.
...

Where did those quotes come from? I would like to see the context.

I guess I'm mostly asking if it should have been changed without the approval of the Eastern Churches. I'm of the opinion that it shouldn't have been, but I'd like to hear the RC view.

Rob

I love the Hut-Sut song. :D Does anyone know the words? Any background info?

Rob

It seems to me that the Nicene Creed belongs to the entire church and shouldn't be changed unless the entire church agrees to it. Therefore, I'm skeptical about whether the Filoque clause should...

Exactly!

It's tradition as interpreted and defined by Rome, and the scriptures as interpreted by Rome. Essentially, it's a one legged - three legged stool! In the end it's Sola-Roma. ...

A) He's claiming that the rich man went to purgatory (hence in God's grace and friendship), which means he'll go to heaven eventually. I don't see how you can get that from reading the parable of...

Fascinating!

And, as we have seen, to defend his views on purgatory De Maria has had to claim:

A)Those who have it well within their power to help the poor, but don't are in God's grace and...

De Maria,

Yes, I can get wordy. I tried to keep things clear by underlining any questions that I had.

Early on in this thread I pointed out the fact that despite your claim about the rich...

De Maria,
You provided some interesting responses. Regarding my point that the fathers appear to be in agreement that the rich man went to hell in Christ's parable in Luke 16:24 (the parable of the...

Looks like cylinder #4 has bad rings. How did the plug look in that cylinder? What made you decide to do a compression test - oil consumption?

Rob

De Maria,
To attempt to find scriptural support for purgatory you have appealed to Luke 16:24, 1 Peter 3:19, and 1 Corinthians 3:15. I checked out each verse carefully. Here is what I found:
...

Well friend, looking at your question again, then I would say that the purpose of the law was fulfilled. The purpose of the law was to bring us to Christ (Galatians 3:24) was it not? And now, being...

There is a low pressure side and a high pressure side on your air conditioning system. If you were to hook your can of R-134 to the high pressure side it would destroy your can of refrigerant and...

Hello sndby,

That's a question that I've also thought about from time to time. There might be something to it. The people were not to eat the fat on the organs or the blood of the animals that...

NOhelp4u,

Thanks for the insight. It would seem that you would argue that the RCC shouldn't teach such things as "3 yrs off purgatory for reading your Bible" , etc.

Rob

I've seen where it's claimed that this or that good work will get so many years taken off your stay in purgatory. Just what exactly does the RCC teach regarding the length of one's stay there? Is...

Hello sndbay,

I understand what you are saying above.
Thanks!

Rob

sndbay,

I was under the impression that the newer versions (NKJV, NASB, NIV) are based on a more accurate Hebrew text, closer to the original than what was available when the KJV was written. Are...

sndbay,

Seems that the new translations have both of the above verses that tell what Ham did. I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

I decided to go with the NKJV this time around. ...

Thanks Crevendovidis and FR_Chuck. Let me rephrase that slightly as I'm not likely going to have the time to actually check a Hebrew Bible. If you were to choose between the NKJV or NASB for...

Hello,

From the reading that I've done it seems that the NKJV uses newer OT sources/findings for its text than the NASB. Supposedly, the NKJV uses the 1967/1977 Stuttgart edition of the Biblia...

Dear Lixue-Sebille 3,

Catholics are a subgroup of true Christians. Some Catholics are genuine, believing, disciples of Christ. Some Baptists are genuine, believing disciples of Christ. Same is...

There are three main branches of Christianity. They are Orthodox, Catholic, and Protestant.

Rob