Am I Junior or not?

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 12:26 PM

When I was born I was named after my father as "Jr". Now that he died, am I still "Jr" or just the name without "Jr"?

RubyPitbull · May 11, 2007, 12:33 PM

Convert, please accept my condolensces on the loss of your father.

You are still a "Jr". When or if you have a son, and if you choose to give him your name, he will be "John Smith" III. The passing on of a relative does not change the status of a name.

P.S. You can choose, if you wish to just be known as "John Smith". You don't have to include the "Jr" onto your name if you do not wish to do so. However, legally, you will always be "Jr."

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 12:48 PM

Thank you RubyPitbull. What cute hat! Thanks for condolences. Dad passed 18 years ago at 93 and I've been wondering about this ever since. Procrastinator here. My passport, drivers license and financial documents all say "jr" but for some reason the IRS dropped the Jr so the bank balked at my tax refund check, so decided to get the real answer. Don't mind being Jr at all; dad was a great man. I have no kids, so no "III" issue here.

LadyB · May 11, 2007, 12:56 PM

My condolences as well.

You can choose to drop the Jr. if you wish, or even change it to a II. Judith Martin, AKA Miss Manners, supposedly asserted that families should move everyone up one if there are multiple people with the same name (III, IV, V, etc.)... but changing it is confusing, causes hassles with any legal documents that used the suffix, and all around unnecessary.

RubyPitbull · May 11, 2007, 01:00 PM

Lady B is correct.

Convert, why would the bank balk at the check? Usually with a refund you just deposit it and it goes through. That is rather strange. They usually don't do that. Did they state that they believe this is your father? If so, if you can get a copies of his death certificate and your tax return, as proof this is your money. They should not be stopping you from depositing the check. Trying to get the IRS to correct it is more of a hassle than merely showing the bank your proof.

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 01:01 PM

Thx Lady B. I somehow think the numerical suffixes after a name sound snooty (Lord Pemberhill Fortesque Bumblefahrt The Third). I'll save them for royalty and just keep the Jr which I don't mind at all. Thank you again.

RubyPitbull · May 11, 2007, 01:02 PM

Also, I just wanted to add, doesn't the refund check have your Social security number on it? That should be proof enough.

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 01:08 PM

I deposited the check at the ATM and they (BofA) sent it back stating the name on the check did not exactly correspond to the name on my bank account. (did they think: ah, hah... you're trying to deposit your father's IRS refund into your account! )

You would THINK the IRS would put the SSN on the face of the check, but it does not... then again, it's a federal agency so why would they do the sensible, obvious thing?

Anyway, I had to go down to the branch and show them a copy of my tax return with my SSN on it to prove who I was and that the check was mine. Next time I will make sure my tax return says "Jr".

RubyPitbull · May 11, 2007, 01:14 PM

Yes, convert, good idea to put that on your returns. Avoid problems and confusion. That would annoy me too having to go out of my way to the branch. I am glad you were at least able to resolve the problem.

I haven't seen a tax refund in years so I just don't know what they put on the checks nowadays. I wish I was lucky enough to get one. :(

froggy7 · May 11, 2007, 06:27 PM

As I understand it, the difference between Jr.s and III's, etc. is who they are named after. So, it's Joe Smith, Sr, and his son, Joe Smith, Jr. Now, if Joe Smith, Jr. has a son and names him Joe Smith after himself, he becomes Sr. and the son is Jr. If, however, he names the son after his father, the son is Joe Smith, III. Yeah, it's one of those fascinating tidbits of information that aren't really all that useful.

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 06:31 PM

So, If I am Jr and my father is Sr and I have a kid but name him after ME and not my father then I become Sr and my kid becomes Jr and my dad dies his widow who is not my biological mother still remains my step mother even after his death? Phew. If I have a kid, I'm naming him Egbert.

Fr_Chuck · May 11, 2007, 08:13 PM

No, your legal name is exactly what it is on the birth certificate, it does not change peroid. Unless you go to court and change your name.

So if JR is on the birth certificate you will die a JR, Your dad dying does not change that ( actually the SR part of your dad was not his legal name, that was only a unofficial title for him)

If you are a legal JR, then if you have a child, you would make him a III
(third) if you named him after him.

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 08:43 PM

Well that does it. My birth certificate with my little foot print on it says JR-so be it. Forever junior. Thanks all.

Fr_Chuck · May 11, 2007, 08:46 PM

Yep, my son hates it too. Had I to do it all over again, I would not, all of the "little chuck" Hey JR, and the such, ( of course he is about twice my size now, so he is not little any longer.

And of course if you really want to change it, 200 dollars and 30 minutes in the court house is all it takes.

CONVERT94 · May 11, 2007, 09:21 PM

Oh no, I'm very proud of my wonderful father and glad to have his name, its just when the JR is not on some document and people get picky and turn it into a ordeal.

froggy7 · May 12, 2007, 06:19 AM

Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

No, your legal name is exactly what it is on the birth certificate, it does not change peroid. Unless you go to court and change your name.

So if JR is on the birth certificate you will die a JR, Your dad dying does not change that ( actually the SR part of your dad was not his legal name, that was only a unofficial title for him)

If you are a legal JR, then if you have a child, you would make him a III
(third) if you named him after him.

Actually, this brings up an interesting point (at least to me!). I'm wondering if back when this all started, the Sr. and Jr. and the IIIs were all social conventions, not legal ones. In other words, was it Joe Smith, Joe Smith, and Joe Smith on the birth certificates and legal documents, and then people just referred to them as Senior and Junior to distinguish between them in conversation, much the same way that they would talk about the Portsmouth Smiths versus the Bellwood Smiths? That would make more sense for Junior not being Junior after dad died, because it wouldn't be necessary to distinguish between the two people any more. And it would be different now when we make it part of the legal name. Anyway, thanks for the mental stimulation.

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