[Robert Gift]

Need circuit schematic:
One button, or switched right, would turn on the siren for five minutes (steady tone) "ALERT", then off.
Other button, or switched left, would cycle siren 3-seconds ON, 3-seconds OFF for five minutes: "ATTACK".
Federal Signal 2t22A airaid siren accelerates from 0 to 3,450 rpm in 3 seconds!

I will build the contoller.
Will send 120 VAC to a three-phase motor relay (switch) which closes 240 VAC to the siren's 10-hp motor.
Thank you.

[KISS]

I don't quite have the time to do the design, but a good place to start is here: ABB SSAC Timers & Controls Fast Facts (800) 377-SSAC(7722)

SSAC makes a nice selection of timer modules although I'd look at the problem another way:

1. In both cases, it's on for 5 minutes, thus in both positions one timer runs for 5 minutes. Thus a delay on make timer would work here.

2. In one position the output is steady and in the other case it runs in an interval mode. This in one of the cases it, just shorts the output of the interval timer.

Part of the design is what voltage to use. 24 vac, 24 VDC, 120 VAC etc.

What switch to use. You could use a heavy duty toggle like a 3PDT switch. Sager Electronics - Electronic Component Distributor should have one. Bought them there for a hoist.

You can also get 4pdt sun-mineature switches. They are not the most robust in the world, but they work.

You also need to decide whether you want the switches to be used in a momentary mode or on/off mode. (ON)-OFF-(ON) may allow the ability to turn things off easily. The () means momentary.

Another switch option is to use industrial type switches that are used in control panels. They mount in a standard hole and are very robust. They get long when you try to add contact blocks.
Usually they might be called 1 NC/1NO contact block. The blocks themselves don't have a common connection like a switch.

So initially, I see a 3pdt momentary switch. One pole provides power in either position.

Another pole just shorts the interval timer output in one position.

The other pole provides the signal for the Delay-on-Make for the timer. Sometimes they need to be separate.

This is just off the top of my head.

The 555 timer was/is a popular timer, but I never liked it. It's problematic with starting a timing interval on power up.

Something like the "Smart relay" from Idec would be an application of what you want. Idec Programmable Smart Relay Search Results idec Programmable Smart Relay - Davis Instruments Catalog Problem is, you need a development system and it might not be feasible for one.

Making a timer from a PIC IC adds another dimension, but could be workable. PICs are tiny microprocessors programmable in BASIC. They are made my Microchip Technology Inc. is a Leading Provider of Microcontroller and Analog Semiconductors, providing low-risk product development, lower total system cost and faster time to market for thousands of diverse customer applications worldwide.

This company Comfile Technology Inc. has intriqed me as well. Seems like a relatively simple and more integrated than a PIC.

So, you have lots of options with lots of "learning curves" from traditional timing modules and wiring to mini PLC's (Pogrammable Logic Controller) with a display of sorts to something that could be "real cheap" if you needed 100K of them.

I don't recommend the 555 approach. The Cubloc approach is probably the most cost-effective if you have a little time to spend. The smart-relay could do it in a hurry.

Check out The best way to buy industrial controls--low prices, fast shipping and superior service. for other parts.

[KISS]

Here is the smart relay brochure. http://www.idec.com/language/english...chure%2006.pdf

And the main page: http://www.idec.com/usen/products/Ca...martRelay.html

[Robert Gift]

Thank you very much, KISS.

I may use a simple 5-minute thermal switch. (Looks like a vacuum tube. I had a 60-second tube.)
Once on, it takes 5 minutes to heat up and turn itself off. (If they make any which span 5 minutes.)

[KISS]

Thermal relays might be tough to find. I manufacturer used to be Amperite (spelling). 5 minutes might be too long.

It's difficult making RC delays over 1 second since RC of a 1 megohm resistor and a 1 uf cap is about a sec with 5-6% tolerences. Anything longer usually be counting pulses.

[Stratmando]

Wonder if this could work for 3 seconds on, 3 seconds off:
http://www.altronix.com/p_pdf//DTMR1.pdf
Cut J1

[KISS]

Nope. Equal times in flasher mode.

SSAC, I know has timers. I just didn't try to select two.

[Stratmando]

I thought he wanted 3 seconds on, and 3 seconds off, for this to go on for 5 minutes, he would also need a 5 minute timer.

[KISS]

Your right, It was equal intervals, so it could work.

I still think the smart relay is the way to go, especially with all the other FEATURES he wants to add like the warning mode.

I do like the telephone gizmo, but it needs some smarts on the receiving end.

[KISS]

This weekend, I downloaded the DEMO software for the Idec Smart Relay here: Software Demos : Download Center : IDEC

Some of the logic blocks your looking for like the warning mode is an actual logic element. The language seems to be easy to learn. I managed to write and simulate a program pretty easily for something I might want to do. My issue is sensing 24 VAC

The USB programming cable is pricey, but I already own a couple of USB to serial converters. The starter kits don't seem that bad.

Seriously, take a good look at it.

Eaton an Omron make similar products, but I like the Idec Smart relay,

[Robert Gift]

Thank you, KISS.
I shallook.
Robert

[KISS]

BTW, Allied stocks them: Allied Electronics - Catalog

From what I can tell, the programming cable has a std 9 in at the PC end for about $70 and for $150 has a USB to serial converter.

The memory/battery modules appear to be optional. It seems to have an internal battery as well.

The starter kits seem inexpensive when you use a standard serial port.

The relay outputs are easy.

The inputs is where things get weird. They are non isolated.

Industry practice is to use I/O modules with a backplane. These provide isolation. Typical logic supplies are 5, 15 or 24 VDC. Pricey though. Crydom - Product Catalog