[peter030205]

Does anyone have any real life feedback regarding these units?


The KVAR Energy Optimizer, also known as a power factor optimizer capacitor will allow you to save 6% to 50% on your energy consumption for your home. Save on energy costs, eliminate energy waste, increase the life of your appliances, and surge protection for your home or establishment.
Depending upon the rate structure of your electric utility, you may be able to save a substantial amount of money on your electric bill. Pay-back period for an equipment purchase including installation cost may be as little as six months. Utility rate structures that account for reactive power consumption, by either a KVA or var demand usage, or a power factor penalty are the ones that can provide the greatest pay-back. Other ancillary benefits to be gained by optimizing power factor are, lower energy losses, better voltage regulation and increased system capacity.

The basic principle is as follows; inductive loads such as electric motors kick back unusable energy into the power system. This unusable energy materializes as heat build-up in appliances, noise on transistor radios and cordless phones, etc.. The KVAR Energy Optimizer contains a capacitor which absorbs this unusable energy and later releases it as usable electricity that can be used by electical appliances, thereby reducing your energy demand from the power company.

Link

[KISS]

Yes, you can optimize power factor. Yes, the utilities often require business too. Yes, there is wasted energy when there is a high power factor.

Is it really useful in the home? Doubt it.

Reason: What contributes mostly to the power factor is motors. How many are there: washer, dryer, refrigerator, air handler, air conditioner.

How often do they run? How often do they run together and for how long?

Probably not enough to matter unless you run your AC 24/7 otherwise I don't see any benefit.

[tkrussell]

Just a few comments in no particular order:

If your electric power meter recorded and billed you for KVAR, and you had a poor Power factor, due to large motors, then you may save some money.

The unit improves lagging Power factor by using capacitors, a simple concept in the electrical industry.

We use large capacitor banks at industrial plants, not to save on the utility bill, but to lower Pf and allow the copper lines and switchgear to run cooler.


Even their website states your utility meter measures watts and time, hence KiloWattHour unit.

Here is a utility website I found at random the explains how they deal with Pf:
Contact Energy - Power Factor Correction

Contact your utility to see what they have to say about PF and how they bill you for usage.

Utility companies do not like low PF also, as they need to upsize their lines to deliver power.


What do you have to lose? Spend almost $500.00 plus installation, and they have a 12 month money back warranty.

You may be interested, if there is more that $50 worth of parts, capacitors, wires, and the junction box, you doing good.

If these things were so good, they would be selling them everywhere, WalMart, Kmart, Sears, etc.

Also, before anyone installs lagging power factor correction, measurements should be taken to be sure there is a PF issue, as simply adding capacitors can cause a leading PF, which is worse to deal with.

Personally, a bunch of hooey, if you ask me. I will not be spending $500.00 for this unit, and I can save installation costs, as I am a licensed electrician.

[peter030205]

Thank you for the feedback. Let me qualify. I'm looking at this for a commercial application. We (2,900 stores) operate a 7.5hp 3 phase mixer up to 20 times per day. That initial electrical spike from the mixer sets our electrical rates by the utility company. Is this unit something that would help in that area, or is it again just a waste of time and money?

[KISS]

No, it's not likely to help. Eliminating peaks with a soft-start controller probably will. Schneider introduces Altistart 01 soft start motor control

Y-Delta is a simple form of motor starting. The electronic varieties are such as those are getting more sophisticated.

The PFC (Power Factor Controller such as KVAR) becomes advantageous when:

1) the utility says you must maintain a pf > XX.
2) Your on the edge of requireing a new service and pf correction will allow you to use the existing service.

The PFC does not respond instantly and therefore it has almost no effect on peaks.

[KISS]

Here is some more info concerning the use of a variable speed drive or soft-start:

Overloaded Dough Mixer

Both will eliminate peaks.

[tkrussell]

The issue you mention is not due to power factor. The inrush starting current is high enough to be affecting the Demand Rate of your utility bill.

Typical you will see two rates on your bill, of course along with all the other fees and charges. They are KWH, which measures watts and time, and Demand KW.

Many times I have found the utility is not familiar with what you have for load, or is using the wrong rate. A 7.5 HP motor is not a big deal, unless your rate is the issue.

Typically, DKW is the max amount of power used, and it checked and recorded each 15 minutes. You get billed for the highest amount. (Trade secret,this is how electricians know what size of new service to install, or add load to an existing system)

Check with your utility as exactly how they do theirs, each utility may have subtle differences.

What Kiss mentions, Soft Start or VFD, same thing, may allow your mixer to start at lower currents.

Another buzz word is "load shedding", that can mean the same thing.

Many times plants will have multiple motors start at once, load shedding causes the motors to start individually, to keep the DKW down low.

Another, but less impacting, is using large lighting contactors to bring up sales floor lighting. Assuming you bring the motor load under control, this would be next to look at. Same effect, bringing up the entire store lighting causes a large one shot load to be recorded in a short period.

Again using the load shedding method, bring up sections over a half hour period, to keep the DKW low for any 15 min period.

The dough machine makes me remember a taco machine I had to troubleshoot. It was drawing 90 amps at startup, when it should have been much lower. This unit made the round flat pieces of dough going around in a circle for some reason. It used the vacuum of an air compressor to keep the round dough in place as it went around. Come to find out the cylinders of the air compressor was clogged with dough and flour, leaving no room for the pistons to move, and all the air passages were clogged.

My point is that other than because of a manufacturing process that needs a motor to start or run slow, most times VFD are not used on a small motor such as yours. My guess is with a 2900 count of locations, this is a small convenience retail,that makes something on site, donuts, sandwich rolls. etc.

I am not saying not do use the VFD, do it for possibly this and other reasons. But be sure to look into the utility issue. This will be a chore, with so many stores spread out. Be sure to understand the billing process, and be sure they now what demand load you do have.

You should have your store design firm look into any and all load shedding and energy savings methods that can be incorporated into new designs, and create specs for retrofitting existing stores. Also, check with each utility and/or state for rebates towards energy savings measures.

Convert lighting from T12 to T8, and other combinations are popular with getting cash back to help defray retrofitting costs.

Changing over any incandescent,and even fluorescent exit signs to LED is a huge savings.

Be sure to have any new ballasts to be high power factor, and low THD, ( this is another issue too lengthy to explain in this forum).

I can go on and on. Perhaps I should be on your design team? I will let you absorb this and stop talking, you have a few utilities to call.

[peter030205]

The issue you mention is not due to power factor. The inrush starting current is high enough to be affecting the Demand Rate of your utility bill.

Typical you will see two rates on your bill, of course along with all the other fees and charges. They are KWH, which measures watts and time, and Demand KW.

Many times I have found the utility is not familiar with what you have for load, or is using the wrong rate. A 7.5 HP motor is not a big deal, unless your rate is the issue.

Typically, DKW is the max amount of power used, and it checked and recorded each 15 minutes. You get billed for the highest amount. (Trade secret,this is how electricians know what size of new service to install, or add load to an existing system)

Check with your utility as exactly how they do theirs, each utility may have subtle differences.

What Kiss mentions, Soft Start or VFD, same thing, may allow your mixer to start at lower currents.

Another buzz word is "load shedding", that can mean the same thing.

Many times plants will have multiple motors start at once, load shedding causes the motors to start individually, to keep the DKW down low.

Another, but less impacting, is using large lighting contactors to bring up sales floor lighting. Assuming you bring the motor load under control, this would be next to look at. Same effect, bringing up the entire store lighting causes a large one shot load to be recorded in a short period of time.

Again using the load shedding method, bring up sections over a half hour period, to keep the DKW low for any 15 min period.

The dough machine makes me remember a taco machine I had to troubleshoot. It was drawing 90 amps at startup, when it should have been much lower. This unit made the round flat pieces of dough going around in a circle for some reason. It used the vacuum of an air compressor to keep the round dough in place as it went around. Come to find out the cylinders of the air compressor was clogged with dough and flour, leaving no room for the pistons to move, and all the air passages were clogged.

My point is that other than because of a manufacturing process that needs a motor to start or run slow, most times VFD are not used on a small motor such as yours. My guess is with a 2900 count of locations, this is a small convenience retail,that makes something on site, donuts, sandwich rolls. etc.

I am not saying not do use the VFD, do it for possibly this and other reasons. but be sure to look into the utility issue. This will be a chore, with so many stores spread out. be sure to understand the billing process, and be sure they now what demand load you do have.

You should have your store design firm look into any and all load shedding and energy savings methods that can be incorporated into new designs, and create specs for retrofitting existing stores. Also, check with each utility and/or state for rebates towards energy savings measures.

Convert lighting from T12 to T8, and other combinations are popular with getting cash back to help defray retrofitting costs.

Changing over any incandescent,and even fluorescent exit signs to LED is a huge savings.

Be sure to have any new ballasts to be high power factor, and low THD, ( this is another issue too lengthy to explain in this forum).

I can go on and on. Perhaps I should be on your design team? I will let you absorb this and stop talking, you have a few utilities to call.

Wow! Okay, I've got some work to do, you pointed me in the right direction... thank you for that! Oh, we make pizza, fresh dough daily.

[Stratmando]

I've never tested these, and have asked in the past about these type money savers? Did find this:
Steve Fish -- KVAR boss fraud conviction | The truth about Steven Bruce Fish, KVAR chief exec
Either they don't work, or perhaps the Government doesn't want you to save Money?
I will stop at a Burger King and see if they are still using these?

[stanfortyman]

Old thread brought to the top by a spammer. Don't 'cha love it. :mad:

[stanfortyman]

BTW, ALL these types of units are scams, plain and simple.

[Stratmando]

Yea, Interesting that the only person I can find satisfied with these is a Sales Person.

[BrandeisHEP]

I work in the Brandeis University High Energy Physics Lab. We did a study on the KVAR Energy Controller. Here are our results:

http://alignment.hep.brandeis.edu/Lab/KVAR/

[area51zc]

Hi, I just wanted to add something here. I was at an auction one day and a display unit with a pump motor, electrical junction boxes and an easy energy saving unit was up for auction, I presume lost in the mail. It is all on an a-frame stand like from a trade show.

I did some research and found that it is being sold through Network Marketing and they try to make you a distributor as well as buy 50 units instead of One to sell to your friends and make your money back.

Don't buy them... its just a sham like all other Network Marketing items... I found three websites selling this thing with three different names on it. Www.ezenergysavings.com as well as http://gottagogreenenergysolutions.com and others all look the same. Good thing I only paid 5.00 Canadian for the whole setup LOL!

Rob G

[fredmcclure]

KVAR CEO Steve Fish is a convicted civil fraudster and thief. Be very careful if you do business with him. It is not advised. Check out his arrest record, mug shots, and the facts at www.stevenbrucefish.com