Ask Experts Questions for FREE Help !
Ask
Page 3 of 3 « First < 3
    qn1234's Avatar
    qn1234 Posts: 15, Reputation: 1
    New Member
    		  
    #41

    Feb 21, 2008, 04:23 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by stanfortyman
    To QN. The information I have given you is code correct. I have provided facts to back it up. Whether or not you follow this or other information is up to you.
    Good luck.
    Even if I wanted to the technician and inspector are not going to let it happen. I'm not in a hurry. I rather be late and have it done right the first time.

    Thanks for your suggestion.
    stanfortyman's Avatar
    stanfortyman Posts: 5,598, Reputation: 279
    Electrical & Lighting Expert
    		  
    #42

    Feb 21, 2008, 04:27 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by qn1234
    I rather be late and have it done right the first time.
    Good call. :)
    EPMiller's Avatar
    EPMiller Posts: 624, Reputation: 37
    Senior Member
    		  
    #43

    Feb 21, 2008, 04:45 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by qn1234
    ...Given that have a 12/2 wg, can I use the bare for neutral and share the ground off the oven sitting right below the microwave?....
    No. Period. stanfortyman explained that way back in the post where he gave the only exception to that is SE cable. You have NM. NO again.
    donf's Avatar
    donf Posts: 5,679, Reputation: 582
    Printers & Electronics Expert
    		  
    #44

    Feb 22, 2008, 11:59 AM
    Okay,

    Explain for me, for my own edification, why the same arrangement is allowed to run 10/2 240 VAC using the taped white as L2 to a baseboard heater? Because that's what a licensed electrician did in what is now my office, really it was a shed, but because I make too much noise, it became my office.

    At least according to the last owner, the work was done by a licensed electrician. As a matter of fact, he did a home run from the heater to the SEP for the heat, then installed a home run from a sub panel in the office tied back to a different 240 VAC breaker. That sub panel is wired with two 120 vac -30 amp (thin lines) and one 120 vac 20 amp breaker.

    Is it because the floor baseboard heat does not need a 120 VAC as the does the convection microwave?
    Stratmando's Avatar
    Stratmando Posts: 11,188, Reputation: 508
    Uber Member
    		  
    #45

    Feb 22, 2008, 12:09 PM
    Qn, If you get your 4 conductors from panel to Micro, their can't be any argument.
    If the Oven is in Conduit, you may be able to pull additional wires through there, then fish up to micro. Good Luck
    stanfortyman's Avatar
    stanfortyman Posts: 5,598, Reputation: 279
    Electrical & Lighting Expert
    		  
    #46

    Feb 22, 2008, 12:25 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by donf
    Is it because the floor baseboard heat does not need a 120 VAC as the does the convection microwave?
    Exactly.
    Things like a baseboard heater, water heater, bigger electric motors, A/C condensors, all are straight 240v loads. The circuits they use require NO neutral.
    In these cases the use of "2-wire" type cable (ie: 12/2, 10/2, etc) is acceptable and typical.
    donf's Avatar
    donf Posts: 5,679, Reputation: 582
    Printers & Electronics Expert
    		  
    #47

    Feb 22, 2008, 12:35 PM
    Well, why didn't you write that out in English for me to misread earlier? :)

    Thanks
    KISS's Avatar
    KISS Posts: 12,510, Reputation: 839
    Uber Member
    		  
    #48

    Feb 22, 2008, 02:23 PM
    Those instructions are the worst I've seen. The three wire instructions say to connect 4 wires and the 4 wire instructions say to connect 4 wires. The only thing I see different is the picture. Please confirm that.

    It sounds like it's the range case and the 4 wire range connected to a three wire supply requires that white/bare of the oven be conncted to bare of the feed. Red is connected to L2, Black is connected to L1. L1 and L2 are Line 1, Line 2 or hot1 and hot 2.

    Is that what everybody gets now that it's OK with tk that a 3 wire feed can be used for a 4 wire appliance in this configuration?
    stanfortyman's Avatar
    stanfortyman Posts: 5,598, Reputation: 279
    Electrical & Lighting Expert
    		  
    #49

    Feb 22, 2008, 03:16 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by KeepItSimpleStupid
    Those instructions are the worst I've seen. The three wire instructions say to connect 4 wires and the 4 wire instructions say to connect 4 wires. The only thing I see different is the picture. Please confirm that.

    It sounds like it's the range case and the 4 wire range connected to a three wire supply requires that white/bare of the oven be conncted to bare of the feed. Red is connected to L2, Black is connected to L1. L1 and L2 are Line 1, Line 2 or hot1 and hot 2.

    Is that what everybody gets now that it's OK with tk that a 3 wire feed can be used for a 4 wire appliance in this configuration?
    Yes, I agree that those instructions are terrible.
    For one thing they only say 240v, when it is NOT "240v", it is 120/240v. The stupid "3-wire" and "4-wire" terminology is what is causing this WHOLE mess.

    Also, they are NOT saying "that white/bare of the oven be conncted to bare of the feed."

    Here is the quote from the instructions for the "

    Here is the quote from the instructions for the " hookup:

    "2. Connect the 2 white wires (D) and the green (or bare) ground
    wire (of the microwave oven cable) using a UL listed wire
    connector.    " hookup:

    "the two white wires"

    They say "of the microwave oven cable" is VERY important.
    KISS's Avatar
    KISS Posts: 12,510, Reputation: 839
    Uber Member
    		  
    #50

    Feb 22, 2008, 03:22 PM
    They probably should say; 240 for existing compatible wiring. 120/240 for new wiring.
    stanfortyman's Avatar
    stanfortyman Posts: 5,598, Reputation: 279
    Electrical & Lighting Expert
    		  
    #51

    Feb 22, 2008, 03:31 PM
    Not really. The oven DOES require 120/240v, and even an older circuit still is 120/240v. It just lacks a dedicated ground.
    qn1234's Avatar
    qn1234 Posts: 15, Reputation: 1
    New Member
    		  
    #52

    Feb 22, 2008, 03:52 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Stratmando
    qn, If you get your 4 conductors from panel to Micro, their can't be any argument.
    If the Oven is in Conduit, you may be able to pull additional wires through there, then fish up to micro. Good Luck
    I checked. It's not it a conduit, and it's nailed to the studs. :(
    qn1234's Avatar
    qn1234 Posts: 15, Reputation: 1
    New Member
    		  
    #53

    Feb 22, 2008, 03:57 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by stanfortyman
    Yes, I agree that those instructions are terrible.
    For one thing they only say 240v, when it is NOT "240v", it is 120/240v. The stupid "3-wire" and "4-wire" terminology is what is causing this WHOLE mess.

    Also, they are NOT saying "that white/bare of the oven be conncted to bare of the feed."

    Here is the quote from the instructions for the "3-wire" hookup:

    "2. Connect the 2 white wires (D) and the green (or bare) ground
    wire (of the microwave oven cable) using a UL listed wire
    connector.    "

    They say "the two white wires" when they mean the white from the oven and the white from the feed. The point is that the ground FROM THE OVEN gets bonded to the neutral in the case of an existing legal 3-wire circuit.
    The term "of the microwave oven cable" is VERY important.

    If you guys are confused, a typical guy like me without much of electrical wiring background would be much, much more confused.
    KISS's Avatar
    KISS Posts: 12,510, Reputation: 839
    Uber Member
    		  
    #54

    Feb 22, 2008, 08:34 PM
    But you picked up on it. I mostly follow the motto "If all else fails, read the instructions".
Not your question? Ask your question View similar questions
 
Page 3 of 3 « First < 3

Question Tools Search this Question
Search this Question:

Advanced Search

Add your answer here.


Check out some similar questions!

Bathtub construction: no slab, bare ground [ 3 Answers ]

After Mold Remediation and new construction: still have the mold smell. During remodeling, after mold remediation (done by a national, reputable company) on my daughter's bathroom/vanity area, where there was a leak under the vanity and a lot of mold growing in the vanity and behind the vanity...

Neutral and Ground share the same connection? [ 1 Answers ]

I have a question regarding wiring for my Hot Springs Spa. The spa comes with a subpanel for two GFCI breakers, one 20-amp and one 30-amp. I have 220 wired to an existing subpanel located right next to my spa location. The only difference between my sub panel and the wiring diagram on the spa...

Neutral wire is hot(has voltage potential like the black wire) [ 5 Answers ]

Hi, The problem started at midnight last week. One of my line in the basement is starting to have issue whenever I connect a water pump or appliances to the outlets. Before I plug the appliance in, the neutral is neutral(zero voltage), but when I plug the appliance in, the neutral is now...

Open ground when neutral not touching ground [ 3 Answers ]

Hi, I was moving around a room and noticed my wife wanted her desk elsewhere. I decided to, since she would have her computer on it, check the outlet she would be moving to. It seemed old so I changed it. I noticed before I changed it that with my GFCI tester, all sockets on this circuit were...

Using Neutral as a Ground ? [ 3 Answers ]

In my new apartment there are some wall outlets that are two prong outlets. Also my fear is that the three prong outlets are not “physically” connected to ground. I heard somewhere that in this kind of system the neutral wire can also be used as a ground. Is this correct? Would a separate...

View more questions Search