Ask Experts Questions for FREE Help!
  Advanced
Register  |  Log in  
   Ask    
 Answer  
  Help  

Ask QuestionsprogressAnswer QuestionsprogressBuild ReputationprogressBecome an Expert
 
Free Answers in 3 Easy Steps

Register Now
3 Steps

At Ask Me Help Desk you can ask questions in any topic and have them answered for free by our experts. To ask questions or participate in answering them you must register for a free account. By registering you will be able to:
  • Get free answers from experts in any of our 300+ topics.
  • Accept money for answers that you provide.
  • Communicate privately with other members (PM).
  • See fewer ads.

Home > Home & Garden > Electrical & Lighting   »   neutral wires in an electric panel

 
Question Tools Search this Question Display Modes
Question
 
 
#1  
Old Dec 15, 2007, 06:23 PM
cmhomeinspect
New Member
cmhomeinspect is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 4
cmhomeinspect See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
neutral wires in an electric panel

Why is it considered unsafe to double post neutral wires (two neutral wires to one lug on the neutral bar) in an electric panel?

Reply With Quote
 
     

Answers
 
 
Old Dec 15, 2007, 07:00 PM   #2  
biggsie
Ultra Member
biggsie is offline
 
biggsie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,274
biggsie See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.biggsie See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
This is unsafe due to the need to turn off multiple circuit

breakers to work on any of the circuits using these wires.

If a person is working on one circuit and turns off a breaker

it is possible that the second neutral is carrying current and

is a shock hazzard when removed from neutral buss
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 15, 2007, 07:32 PM   #3  
tkrussell
Electrical & Lighting Expert
tkrussell is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,555
tkrussell See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.tkrussell See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.tkrussell See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.tkrussell See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
Simply because the lug is only rated to handle one wire safely. Any more than rated will result in loose connections.
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 16, 2007, 04:40 AM   #4  
Stratmando
Ultra Member
Stratmando is offline
 
Stratmando's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Florida Keys
Posts: 3,907
Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
Its a code violation also, The code is based on safety, Not necessarily efficiency.
I forget the exact wording in a paragraph at the start of the Electrical Code, that states just that.
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 16, 2007, 05:47 AM   #5  
Cobraguy
Junior Member
Cobraguy is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 140
Cobraguy See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
Quote:
Originally Posted by biggsie
This is unsafe due to the need to turn off multiple circuit

breakers to work on any of the circuits using these wires.

If a person is working on one circuit and turns off a breaker

it is possible that the second neutral is carrying current and

is a shock hazzard when removed from neutral buss


Biggsie...I don't believe this has anything to do with that scenario does it? Since the neutrals are all on the same buss anyway, that problem is always present. The only way to ensure your problem doesn't occur is to have the MWC on tied breakers. Or am I misunderstanding what you're saying?

Comments on this post
biggsie agrees: I don't think you understand what I am saying
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 16, 2007, 05:58 AM   #6  
Stratmando
Ultra Member
Stratmando is offline
 
Stratmando's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Florida Keys
Posts: 3,907
Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
Hey Cobra, I'm thinking he meant 4 breakers would need to be turned off to safely work on a neutral problem, if 2 neutrals under one screw. Provided they were all multi circuit.
Take Care.
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 16, 2007, 04:56 PM   #7  
RustyFairmount
Junior Member
RustyFairmount is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 117
RustyFairmount See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
What biggsie said makes sense to me. Here's the scenario:

Assume every breaker in your panel is on, and all circuits are under load. You turn off one breaker and attempt to remove it's corresponding white from the neutral buss. In the process, the second white pops out and makes contact with you. ZAP!

This is an excellent question. I don't believe in following code just because it says so. It's always wise to question code so that you can learn the reason why it is that way, and then follow it! Understanding why code exists is always a good thing.

Comments on this post
biggsie agrees: Thank You for taking the time to explain my answer
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 17, 2007, 04:44 AM   #8  
Stratmando
Ultra Member
Stratmando is offline
 
Stratmando's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Florida Keys
Posts: 3,907
Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
Another reason is if neutral is removed on a multi circuit while energized, the 120 Volt circuits using that neutral may go to 240 volts if load or breaker(s) are not turned off.
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 17, 2007, 07:01 AM   #9  
labman
Dogs Expert
labman is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern US
Posts: 10,602
labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.labman See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
It may be a bad practice, but come on, who is going to shut off one circuit and loosen 2 wires?

Comments on this post
biggsie agrees: I knew someone who fixed extension cord -- wired hot to handy box case
cmhomeinspect disagrees: Was this a comment on wiring or dogs?
  Reply With Quote
 
     
 
 
Old Dec 18, 2007, 07:58 AM   #10  
Stratmando
Ultra Member
Stratmando is offline
 
Stratmando's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Florida Keys
Posts: 3,907
Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.Stratmando See this member's comment history on his/her Profile page.
If I was redoing a neutral connection that was overheated due to loose connection, I would turn off 2 circuits to repair. If 2 neutrals under same screw. 4 circuits need to be turned off.
  Reply With Quote
 
     


Question Tools Search this Question
Search this Question:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

 
Similar Sponsors

Similar Questions
Question Asker Topic Answers Last Post
Service Panel, Neutral and Ground bars tied? timur Electrical & Lighting 2 Dec 12, 2007 04:34 PM
Grounding/neutral meter box and panel fg017674 Electrical & Lighting 1 Aug 11, 2007 08:17 AM
why is the grounding and neutral bus bar connected in the sub panel? hardcorejonny Electrical & Lighting 1 Jun 21, 2007 04:16 PM
Hot neutral Wires skyhogg Electrical & Lighting 6 Feb 4, 2007 07:12 AM
Open neutral - 3 wires; white as hot? Rldale2 Electrical & Lighting 1 Mar 5, 2006 07:00 AM




Copyright ©2003 - 2007, Ask Me Help Desk.
All times are GMT -8. The time now is 01:44 AM.

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC6 © 2006, Crawlability, Inc.