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Tonya431 · Oct 19, 2006, 03:35 AM

We have 2 cairns that we bought at petstores. The youngest I know was from a puppy mill. She is now 2 yrs old. She pees and poops outside on demand. She rarely has accidents in her crate (usually only a little pee when excited). But, if she needs to pee and she's in the house, she just does. It doesn't matter where or when. She was lying on the top of our leather couch by my head (her fave spot), stood up, squatted and peed. Can dogs be so inbred that they are mentally impaired? She's never been "quite right". We liken her to a child with Down's syndrome. She is very happy and sweet, but doesn't quite get it. I'm sorry if this comment is offensive. I am not being flip. I'm just wondering if we should just "give up" and accept her as she is. Maybe she can't help it. It is so frustrating. Our other dog isn't having any of these problems.

labman · Oct 19, 2006, 04:04 AM

Rather than repeating what was said, Isuggest looking at https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/pets-a...ide-37538.html

Tonya431 · Oct 19, 2006, 04:18 AM

Thanks but I've read it. I don't have an 8 month old puppy I have a dog that will be 3 yrs old in January. We had a tough time training her not to pee in her crate. We've had a tough time training her to do anything. I've learned my lesson about the "doggy in the window". I'll never buy another pet store puppy. We just got lucky with the first one, I guess.

tre_cani · Oct 19, 2006, 07:32 AM

There's a lot of helpful information on potty training in the thread that labman suggested. Not all of it pertains to a puppy.

It sounds as if the dog is being defiant and could use some structure and routine (you didn't mention what their potty routine was like, so I'm just guessing).

Crate training and close supervision, when they are out of the crate, is the best advice I can give.

One of my dogs came to me as a 2 year old rescue, seriously abused in her last home. We sometimes call her 'Rainman' as she does things that seem obsessive (licks the air for 10 minutes solid minutes while nodding her head up and down) and things that seem as though she's a little 'touched'.

She was (and often still is) terrified of any noise and quick movements. She pees when she's startled, pees when she's excited and pees when _____(insert just about any activity). She even pees when you hand her a biscuit and she accidentally drops it on a hard surfaced floor. The noise sends her reeling out of the room and into her crate where she will tremble for an hour or so. It's about the saddest thing in the world to imagine what abuse might have caused this, but she's a million percent better than 4 years ago when she came to me. She was also a 'defiant' pee-er, doing it moments after coming inside and right in the middle of the living room with us sitting mere feet from her.

It took a long time (maybe 4 months) to get her into a routine with the other dogs and she is doing very well now and is a delightful animal (except for the occasional squirt due to biscuit mishandling).:o

My point here is that your dog's origins at a puppy mill are likely not the cause, but you can certainly get a handle on this despite her age and alleged 'mental deficiency'. You really can teach an old dog new tricks!

By the way, I'm very glad you won't be going the puppy mill route again! Adopt or rescue instead, I think they're more appreciative!

Good luck with "Leaky"!

labman · Oct 19, 2006, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by Tonya431

Thanks but I've read it. I don't have an 8 month old puppy I have a dog that will be 3 yrs old in January. We had a tough time training her not to pee in her crate. We've had a tough time training her to do anything. I've learned my lesson about the "doggy in the window". I'll never buy another pet store puppy. We just got lucky with the first one, I guess.

Once a dog has been housebroken and later backslides, the porcedure is largely the same at any age, a vet check, careful supervision, and playing the role of top dog. The older the dog, and the longer it has been doing it, the harder it is, and the longer it may take.

doggie_poopie · Oct 21, 2006, 04:28 PM

Normally puppymill dogs are very difficult to housetrain since they were to go potty in their "kennel" where they slept. So many times kennel training is not an option. However she sounds like she at least gets this part. ANY dog, and I mean ANY dog from a petstore is from a puppymill or backyard breeder. Neither is good. So yes I agree you got lucky on the first one.
Her peeing in front of you or after going out is not being defiant, she does doesn't understand. If she was in her area at the puppymill she would have done the samething. Stood up and peed. Unfortunately, it was your leather couch and not her puppymill home. Be patient, she may always be a little special. Lover her all the more. Yes, while don't have to give up- you do have to accept her for who she is, as she is. Again though that doesn't mean giving up trying to teach her the ways of your pack. Tell her firmly but gently no and take her outside. Tethering is a good technique, I teach/use this for these kind of dogs.
Hope another opinion helps,

Tonya431 · Oct 21, 2006, 04:52 PM

I appreciate everyone's help. She has come a long long way. She used to pee in her crate so we actually did a reverse crating with her. We put her in the garage with an adjustable wire "playpen" and blue pee pads. Every week we made it smaller and smaller until it was about the size of a crate and had only one pee pad. It's been 18 months since she has graduated to her crate and she loves it. She also used to be afraid of people, actually afraid of everything. She would only let us hold her for a minute or two before she would retreat to a safe distance where she would sit and watch us. It's only been the last year that she initiates any loving at all. She's always been at home with our other dog, just not us. She's getting better. She actually has gone up to a few strangers and let them pet her. I guess I just get frustrated. It took a year to housetrain the other one and I thought that was a long time! It's amazing that she has so many problems. We got her when she was 8 weeks old. She's really small for her breed. I think she probably has some yorkie in her. She is cute though. All beauty-no brains!