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    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #1

    Aug 9, 2017, 03:03 PM
    The Ignorance of Trump Rattles the World.
    Not surprisingly, Trump has entirely missed the point of deterrence. Retaliation is promised as a response to prevent the other side from ATTACKING.

    NOT when the other side threatens. With his incredibly stupid "fire and fury" comment, Trump has put this nation in the desperate position of retaliating when the North Koreans THREATEN, which they have been doing for over 50 years. Trump has drawn the red line in the wrong place, and the world trembles at what this madman may do. If he backs down, he encourages North Korea. If he follows through, it's Armegeddon.

    Previous administrations with their so-called "strategic patience" have managed to avoid a resumption of war all those years. Not a bad strategy. Trump, in a single ill-advised moronic comment, has undermined decades of attempted diplomacy - at the precise moment when North Korea has achieved nuclear capacity, however minimal.

    It is time for Trump to go, before it's too late.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #2

    Aug 9, 2017, 03:31 PM
    What do you expect from a moron who has no more intelligence than Kim
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #3

    Aug 9, 2017, 03:33 PM
    yeah it sucks when a President draws a red line you know he won't enforce. History will judge if 'strategic patience' was a better policy than premptive removal of the threat before it reached critical mass . Remember when Bubba told us the crisis was over and the NORKS would never get Nukes ?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TcbU5jAavw


    How did that work out ? If we are not at a tipping point ,we are damn near close to it . You can't blame herr Donald for this crisis . All the diplomatic pablum of Sec States for over 20 years has not done a thing to resolve this .Maybe some tough talk is what lil Kim needs to keep him up at night .
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #4

    Aug 9, 2017, 03:43 PM
    .Maybe some tough talk is what lil Kim needs to keep him up at night .
    Dump just talks tough because he is up at night, if he would just get some sleep maybe we can all get some sleep
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #5

    Aug 9, 2017, 05:07 PM
    hmmmm Trump threatens fire and fury ........the NORKs release a hostage .

    North Korea releases Canadian pastor Hyeon Soo Lim - CNN


    hmmmm Trump threatens fire and fury ........the NORKs release a hostage .

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/09/asia/north-korea-canada-pastor-hyeon-soo-lim/index.html
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #6

    Aug 9, 2017, 09:59 PM
    Well, release of a Canadian hostage means nothing to Trump but it may mean North Koreans think all north americans look alike, or it may mean they think it gives them leverage with the UN. Kim may be confused about the UN, he may think it means him
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #7

    Aug 10, 2017, 03:10 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    hmmmm Trump threatens fire and fury ........the NORKs release a hostage .

    North Korea releases Canadian pastor Hyeon Soo Lim - CNN


    hmmmm Trump threatens fire and fury ........the NORKs release a hostage .

    North Korea releases Canadian pastor Hyeon Soo Lim - CNN

    The process was well underway BEFORE Trump's comment.
    Athos's Avatar
    Athos Posts: 1,108, Reputation: 55
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    #8

    Aug 10, 2017, 03:29 AM
    Trump's comment came in the midst of his much ballyhooed conference on the opioid epidemic.

    His solution to the epidemic? JUST SAY NO!!! Yes, the same as the mid-1980s solution that never worked. Trump completely ignored the PRESENT crisis requiring a solution for those presently addicted.

    Whenever he speaks on an issue of substance, his lack of knowledge betrays him, usually resulting in his spewing out lies. Whether domestic or international, Trump can be trusted to say something really STUPID.

    In the other present crisis, he warned that he gave orders on day one to beef up the US nuclear arsenal. HE DID NOTHING OF THE SORT !!!

    Obama, his self-declared nemesis, gave the order to review the nuclear arsenal which will take several years. Trump is blissfully unaware of that FACT. Or maybe not. He will do everything in his power to take down Obama - whom he hates with a passion - or co-opt Obama's legacy when it's something he likes.

    This presidency is nothing but GET OBAMA. Nothing else matters to Trump.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #9

    Aug 10, 2017, 04:07 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Athos View Post

    This presidency is nothing but GET OBAMA. Nothing else matters to Trump.
    Obama is yesterday, get over it. No one has the right answer to Kim but shouting at him is counterproductive. Maybe the US needs to launch an ICBM in the direction NK unannounced which goes higher and faster and further, landing accurately 200 miles from NK and then say is one of yours missing. Obviously B1 overflights don't send the right message, supercarrier task forces don't send the right message. One thing is sure, midnight rantings on twitter are counterproductive
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #10

    Aug 10, 2017, 10:30 AM
    No one has the right answer ;but are we supposed to ignore that he is threatening a nuke attack on Guam ? Tell me what would happen to the leader of Australian if Kim threatened a launch against one of your territories and the warning was ignored until Kim pulled the trigger ?
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #11

    Aug 10, 2017, 10:47 AM
    Trump completely ignored the PRESENT crisis requiring a solution for those presently addicted.
    And too many of those opiod addicts are patients in pain who appealed to their doctors for relief and were innocently prescribed opioids that were pushed by a greedy Big Pharma.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #12

    Aug 10, 2017, 04:43 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by tomder55 View Post
    No one has the right answer ;but are we supposed to ignore that he is threatening a nuke attack on Guam ? Tell me what would happen to the leader of Australian if Kim threatened a launch against one of your territories and the warning was ignored until Kim pulled the trigger ?
    Tom I know Kim can't be ignored, and he has threatened us too, but the threat against Guam is an escalation, although the intention isn't to hit Guam apparently and he didn't specifically say he would use nuclear warheads, after all if he did that he would deplete his arsenal. You seriously have to wonder if Kim has a death wish. All his bluster is typical terrorist rhetoric but he is half a century too late, we are over it.

    I think the world is going about it the wrong way, sanctions don't work so reverse the flow and flood NK with cheap consumer goods and cheap food. Demonstrate how much better life is outside NK, there are plenty of surpluses, I bet Kim is just hanging out for a big Mac or some KFC and his people certainly are. Set up export industries there like Bangladesh, a little noxious industry or two like tanning, etc
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #13

    Aug 10, 2017, 04:52 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    I think the world is going about it the wrong way, sanctions don't work so reverse the flow and flood NK with cheap consumer goods and cheap food. Demonstrate how much better life is outside NK, there are plenty of surpluses, I bet Kim is just hanging out for a big Mac or some KFC and his people certainly are. Set up export industries there like Bangladesh, a little noxious industry or two like tanning, etc
    That would be my strategy -- like the Bible says, "heap burning coals upon his head." i.e., overwhelm him with kindness.
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,325, Reputation: 10855
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    #14

    Aug 10, 2017, 05:07 PM
    I think Kim has had enough hugs. So have his "friends", and ENABLERS! Let's face it, He couldn't do what he is doing without plenty of help and I hope Dufus knows that and for once does more than just lie, and talk crap.

    It wouldn't surprise me at all if Xi, and Vlad weren't calling the little fat b@stard every night and egging him on.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #15

    Aug 10, 2017, 06:34 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    That would be my strategy -- like the Bible says, "heap burning coals upon his head." i.e., overwhelm him with kindness.
    My thoughts exactly, offer to solve some of his important problems, give him some tractors, seeds. although the people in NK are probably so hungry they would eat them.


    Tal;
    It wouldn't surprise me at all if Xi, and Vlad weren't calling the little fat b@stard every night and egging him on.
    You know, Tal, you are probably right but who is calling that fat b@stard in the White House every night and egging him on?

    I wonder what happened to talk softly and carry a big stick as distinct from shout loudly and throw rocks on your neighbours roof
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #16

    Aug 11, 2017, 09:55 AM
    I think Kim has had enough hugs. So have his "friends", and ENABLERS! Let's face it, He couldn't do what he is doing without plenty of help and I hope Dufus knows that and for once does more than just lie, and talk crap.

    It wouldn't surprise me at all if Xi, and Vlad weren't calling the little fat b@stard every night and egging him on.
    The Iranians are funding the research and they will get the fruit of the NORK's labor . You see ;when Bush mentioned the 'Axis of Evil ' he had a point .The common denominator was that the 3 rogue nations were in pursuit of WMD . 2/3 of the axis is still developing them and are close ;if not beyond, the point of no return. Bush should receive more credit for trying to nip the dangers in the bud before they became harder to solve.The JFKerry type of strategic patience and appeasement diplomacy is what has been the abject failure .
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #17

    Aug 11, 2017, 10:06 AM
    When Democrats threaten 'fire and fury ' ..................

    Bubba Clintoon:
    On his weekend visit to South Korea, President Clinton warned that if North Korea developed and used an atomic weapon, "we would quickly and overwhelmingly retaliate.""It would mean the end of their country as they know it," he said.
    CLINTON'S WARNING IRKS NORTH KOREA - NYTimes.com
    talaniman's Avatar
    talaniman Posts: 54,325, Reputation: 10855
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    #18

    Aug 11, 2017, 12:23 PM
    I don't agree Tom at all, as you keep talking, but appeasement it's not since the only alternative to talking, besides sanctions is too blow Kim away, and that's not good. The gripe I have in this whole mess is not hitting Putin in his friggin' nose, and not choking China for not doing MORE. That's the failure of past policy.
    ,
    Yeah maybe a trade war would have followed, and the money grubbers would be throwing a fit, but so what? If the Chinese won't control their stupid pet, somebody will have too! It's a very complex problem, and it's Trumps problem now, despite his loud mouth condemnation of what's been tried by past presidents.

    e's always trying to pass the buck, and quick to blame others. He DA man now and he better act like one instead of being a whiny BEETCH! I can forgive you for Bush a little, but NOT for the Dufus you guys have elected this time. It's all republican fault for all the crap that happens after Jan. 20th.
    paraclete's Avatar
    paraclete Posts: 2,706, Reputation: 173
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    #19

    Aug 11, 2017, 08:43 PM
    This once again is an american problem. It isn't a Chinese problem, it isn't a Russian problem. Kim is not shouting at China, he is not shouting a Russia, he is shouting at someone half a world away. Trump needs to get this. This is as I have said before a Mouse that Roared situation. Like the Wizard of Oz, Kim is standing behind a curtain and projecting an image, and Trump has been taken in, giving credence to Kim's threats which are probably for home consumption. Trump should understand this posturing, after all he rode the election on it
    tomder55's Avatar
    tomder55 Posts: 1,742, Reputation: 346
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    #20

    Aug 12, 2017, 01:54 AM
    Hitler was the mouse that marched into the Rhineland . sigh ...history ;rinse and repeat .

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