Parental rights

speechlesstx · Jun 2, 2009, 06:27 AM

In another thread I complained of groups like PP imposing their agenda on our children without regard to parental values. Don't worry about it I was told, who's saying the parents can't be the parents? Here we go...

Quote:

Calif. District Creates Primary School Gay Curriculum

Monday, June 1, 2009 3:24 PM

By: Rick Pedraza

Elementary school teachers in Alameda, Calif., will introduce lesson plans to their educational curriculum beginning next year that address gay and lesbian issues, KCBS News in San Francisco reports.

Kindergarten through grade 5 students throughout the county will be exposed to same-sex educational material aimed at promoting tolerance and inclusiveness.

The curriculum –– which will include lessons to introduce students to “LGBT” (lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transsexual) issues –– will be designed to discourage bullying and teasing based on gay and lesbian stereotypes. The plan will be implemented despite objections by parents who complain children are too young to be exposed to the material.

Many parents are condemning the lesson plan as sex education in disguise and are angered that they will not be allowed to exempt their children from the lessons. Opponents decry the curriculum plan as an effort to advance the gay, lesbian and transgendered agenda.

Those opposed to sexual orientation lessons for children are so upset they are threatening to sue the school board, ABC News reports. Promoting gay, lesbian and sexual orientation should be a parents' rights issue, parents say, and is not an appropriate topic for school children.

The Alameda school district's legal counsel, however, recommended the plan because the curriculum does not deal with health or sex education, which are topics that do require opt-out provisions.

“It was the opinion of our legal counsel that this curriculum was not health or sex education curriculum,” school board president Mike McMahon told CNS New.

“If a student responds that one family in the book is made up of a mother, a father, and two children and a cat, you may acknowledge that some families look like this, but ask students for other examples of what a family can look like.”

School Board Member Trish Spencer, who voted against the plan, said she worries that its implementation could lead to the harassment of students who have religious objections to homosexuality. She cited that bullying due to religion is a bigger problem for the district than bullying based on homosexuality.

Also adamantly opposed to the plan is Randy Thomasson, president of the Campaign for Children and Families.

“This will be done whether parents like it or not, and it shows the hostility against parental rights and traditional family values,” Thomasson, told CNS New.

Last month, the California Supreme Court upheld Proposition 8, the voter-approved initiative to make same-sex marriage illegal that passed in November.

The Alameda school board said it will review its decision to implement the curriculum at the end of next year’s school session.

Is it the public school's place to instill their values in our children in spite of parental objections - or at all? Or does the public 'benefit' outweigh parental rights?

For all of you who think government should get out of the marriage business, should they get out of the parenting business such as this example, too?

speechlesstx · Jun 10, 2009, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cozyk

I'm just curious speech.

Your main beef is that the mandatory teaching of the existence of this alternative lifestyle is wrong on every level.

cozyk, I've plainly stated numerous times what my "main beef" is, undermining parental rights." And you have once again taking to posting offensive assumptions about me with this pathetic, wrong, idiotic, unjustified bullsh*t claim that my "main beef is that the mandatory teaching of the existence of this alternative lifestyle is wrong on every level."

What's even more pathetic is I don't believe you even get how insulting and offensive that statement is, and on top of that you have the chutzpah to chastise us on insulting each other. Pathetic. No more diversions from the subject or your responses will be treated accordingly.

cozyk · Jun 10, 2009, 07:58 PM

[quote]

Quote:

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

cozyk, I've plainly stated numerous times what my "main beef" is, undermining parental rights."

Yes, I believe that is what I alluded to.

Quote:

And you have once again taking to posting offensive assumptions about me with this pathetic, wrong, idiotic, unjustified bullsh*t claim that my "main beef is that the mandatory teaching of the existence of this alternative lifestyle is wrong on every level."

Woo, touchy aren't you?

What exactly was my offensive assumption?
Am I wrong to conclude that you think teaching it is wrong because it "underminds "your parental rights, that's one level. You feel they are trying to instill values and that's not their place. That's level two. You're okay with anti-bullying teaching in general, just don't go as far as to insinuate that the gay lifestyle is acceptable, that would be level three, and correct me if I'm wrong here (like i need to tell you that) but you do not personally accept gay couples as being just as valid as hetero couples. That would be level number four. Like I said, on many levels.

Quote:

What's even more pathetic is I don't believe you even get how insulting and offensive that statement is, and on top of that you have the chutzpah to chastise us on insulting each other.

Wow, did you ever read me wrong. I was not insulting you. I was trying to understand you, giving you credit for being an involved parent, and trying to appeal to your sense of reason. I was offering a different perspective for you to mull over . I was not insulting you in any way then. But now, I do have an insult or two for you. Your defensiveness is clouding your ability to reason. Your temper is getting the best of you.

Quote:

. No more diversions from the subject or your responses will be treated accordingly.

I don't even know what that means.

Skell · Jun 10, 2009, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by inthebox

Shock Over Chicago Student Gun Deaths - CBS News

Your timeline doesn't have Chicago on the list.

What conclusions can be drawn from this?

Who is from Chicago? Was a senator there during this? Can I say there is a direct causal relationship or just a correlation.

1] The fact that your reference misses Chicago calls into question the validity of the statistics posed.

2] It gives a list but no reference, such as percent of population innvolved or the total sample selected.

The US has a population of about 300 million, if 300 people die from "Y" a year, and
if in country "x" of 30 million people, 60 people die a year, which country is has a higher percentage of people dying from "y?"

G&P

Murders with firearms (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

You're number 8 on the list. Not real good.
Even worse on this list.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ted_death_rate

Number 8 in total crime per capita too.
Total crimes (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

Anyway that is a different debate.

speechlesstx · Jun 10, 2009, 08:30 PM

[quote=cozyk;1789976]

Quote:

Yes, I believe that is what I alluded to.

Do you even remember what you say? You didn't 'allude' to anything, you made an outright offensive, wrong and wrongheaded allegation:

Quote:

Your main beef is that the mandatory teaching of the existence of this alternative lifestyle is wrong on every level.

Quote:

I don't even know what that means.

Now that's what I 'alluded' to.

cozyk · Jun 10, 2009, 08:51 PM

[quote=speechlesstx;1790028]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cozyk

Quote:

Do you even remember what you say? You didn't 'allude' to anything, you made an outright offensive, wrong and wrongheaded allegation:

Now that's what I 'alluded' to.

In the words of the "Lost in Space" robot, That does not compute.

I'm tired of trying to communicate with you. Seems like you just keep going around in circles and resisting any view other than your own, no matter what other perspectives are introduced to you. You can't see the forest for the trees. Then you make assertions and statements that don't make any sense. When I say I don't know what you mean, you just come back with a smart a$$ remark. Way to move the ball forward Speech.

So, good luck with all that hostility towards....well everything. I'm bowing out.

speechlesstx · Jun 11, 2009, 05:09 AM

[quote=cozyk;1790050][quote=speechlesstx;1790028]In the words of the "Lost in Space" robot, That does not compute.[quote]

One last time...

Quote:

Your main beef is that the mandatory teaching of the existence of this alternative lifestyle is wrong on every level.

When you frame it as me believing that teaching the "existence" of homosexuality is "wrong on every level" you've painted me a bigot, a homophone, in serious denial and diverted entirely away from the subject which is and has always been schools undermining parental rights.

Quote:

I'm tired of trying to communicate with you. Seems like you just keep going around in circles and resisting any view other than your own, no matter what other perspectives are introduced to you. You can't see the forest for the trees.

You can't seem to refrain from insulting me or at the least, containing your condescension toward me. I am not some old, white haired, white guy neanderthal yearning for the days when women, blacks and gays knew their place. You act as if you think I've never known a homosexual, a minority or a pregnant woman and have no clue as to the world they live in or the issues they face. Let me tell you, I've seen much, much more than you obviously imagine.

Quote:

Then you make assertions and statements that don't make any sense. When I say I don't know what you mean, you just come back with a smart a$$ remark. Way to move the ball forward Speech.

You act as if you're a smart lady, if you can't figure out how offensive, distracting and utterly useless your statement was then perhaps you could use a little sensitivity training yourself.

Quote:

So, good luck with all that hostility towards....well everything.

Let me be clear - that was another wrong assumption, another insult, another diversion.

Quote:

I'm bowing out.

Now that's moving the ball forward. If you want to discuss parental rights then continue on, but no more diversions and personal digs.

inthebox · Jun 11, 2009, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skell

Murders with firearms (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

You're number 8 on the list. Not real good.
Even worse on this list.

List of countries by firearm-related death rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Number 8 in total crime per capita too.
Total crimes (per capita) by country. Definition, graph and map.

Anyway that is a different debate.

Props to you for referencing data.

Ashame that Chicago has all the homicide despite gun control laws? Again a debate for another threaf.

G&P