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Tuscany · Dec 11, 2008, 05:05 AM

I am totally confused how the rights of an unborn child is more important than the rights of a mother. I think that people think that woman go off willy nilly and say hey I got pregnant... crap... guess I need an abortion. When the reality is that for most people it is a hard decision.

I would not judge a woman who had an abortion harshly because I do not know what has lead her to make such a decision.

speechlesstx · Dec 11, 2008, 05:19 AM

Originally Posted by Tuscany

I am totally confused how the rights of an unborn child is more important than the rights of a mother. I think that people think that woman go off willy nilly and say hey I got pregnant...crap...guess I need an abortion. When the reality is that for most people it is a hard decision.

I would not judge a woman who had an abortion harshly because I do not know what has lead her to make such a decision.

Again, projecting views on us not stated. Who has said the rights of an unborn child are more important than the rights of the mother?

tomder55 · Dec 11, 2008, 05:21 AM

Not saying it's not an easy decision . Just saying it is for the most part a wrong decision. Often we have gut wrenching and heart breaking circumstances where the taking of a life is off the table as a remedy . No one is saying the mother's rights are less than the unborn's .We are saying the unborn have an equal right to live.

As has been pointed out before in this ;we are now talking genocide numbers here . 50+ million .

Tuscany · Dec 11, 2008, 05:21 AM

By taking away the woman's right to chose you are stating that the baby is more important then the mother.

Tom- but by not allowing the mother rights... by saying you must have this child... that is not showing equal rights.

sndbay · Dec 11, 2008, 05:22 AM

How does someone put the baby's right second to the mother? Both are individuals with the same equal rights.

Today, approximately 90% of all abortions occur in the first 12 weeks. That means the baby can be 84 days of age.

Cited in American Prospect, the National Abortion Rights Action League (NARAL) asserts that women's reproductive rights are more restricted now than at the time of Roe in 1973. There are two questions at the forefront of the debate: should "partial birth" abortions ("intact dilation and extraction") be legal and should first trimester abortions remain legal?

The most controversial issue is the so-called "partial birth" abortion, a rare procedure. Beginning in the mid-90s, Republicans in the U.S. House of Representative and U.S. Senate introduced legislation to ban "partial birth" abortions. In late 2003, Congress passed and President George W. Bush signed the Partial-Birth Abortion Ban Act (HR 760, S 3).

CP refer: Issue Summary: Abortion

As a christain, I feel we have failed to believe in the power of God, and in the Will of God. But again everyone has free will choice of heart.

tomder55 · Dec 11, 2008, 05:24 AM

Yes I do think the unborn's right to live is greater than the mother's right to choose to kill the baby.

speechlesstx · Dec 11, 2008, 05:30 AM

Originally Posted by NeedKarma

The images you posted are later term and computer generated.

Are they accurate or not? You guys will seemingly go to any length to deny that it IS a child in the womb. Are these accurate and real enough for you?

BBC - In pictures: Watch me grow

Tuscany · Dec 11, 2008, 05:34 AM

As a woman I feel I need to leave this group. Its sad

NeedKarma · Dec 11, 2008, 05:49 AM

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

You guys will seemingly go to any length to deny that it IS a child in the womb.

Yes it is a representation of a child in a womb. No one denied that. I should know, my wife had an ultrasound pretty every month right up until a week before delivering.

speechlesstx · Dec 11, 2008, 05:55 AM

What's sad is so many people seem to think an unborn child has so little value.

Skell · Dec 11, 2008, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

Skell, I never said Synnen's story wasn't relevant and I don't ignore it. In fact I said "I have no doubt that adoption is often traumatic for the birth mother," which I guess you missed.

Gianna's story is MOST relevant regardless of what abortions are illegal, or have you forgotten those "fetuses" become Giannas? And as tom pointed out the youngest surviving infant was born at 21 weeks, along with my 1 lb 8 ounce niece - both being born in the second trimester.

And it's nice to know you think National Geographic's groundbreaking presentation of life in the womb is "imaginary."

No I don't. I think they are 'Amazing photographs'. But irrelevant in this argument in my opinion none the less.

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/photog...aph-44529.html

Skell · Dec 11, 2008, 03:40 PM

Its weird. You guys are quite happy to allow thousands of children to be gunned down whilst they sit quietly at school each year and blame it on "personally responsibility", yet you cause such an uproar about the so called "murder" of unborn children. Now that is SAD!

Maybe you can come up with a new bumper sticker.

"Guns dont kill people, abortions do!!""

speechlesstx · Dec 11, 2008, 04:01 PM

Thousands each year? Where? By my count there have been 96 murders by firearm in US schools since the beginning of 1998. Each a tragedy, but nowhere near the 52 million abortions since Roe v. Wade.

Skell · Dec 11, 2008, 04:06 PM

Oh that's OK then! Sorry!!

I'm getting those bumper stickers printed. They'll be a hit. Right up there with the smiley face and Nike's tick sign. $$$$$

speechlesstx · Dec 11, 2008, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by Skell

Oh that's ok then!! Sorry!!!

I'm getting those bumper stickers printed. They'll be a hit. Right up there with the smiley face and Nike's tick sign. $$$$$

Come on Skell, I said each was a tragedy, but there is a monumental difference between 9.6 per year and thousands per year. But go ahead make your bumper sticker, I'm sure it would be a hit in Madison, WI.

Skell · Dec 11, 2008, 05:32 PM

No, I understand. I'm just saying though that the issues of the death of an unborn child seems more important than the death of a child simply because of religious standpoints! You want policies that reflect your religious view. Yet when it comes to guns you want policies that reflect your constitutional rights. Youse confuse me sometimes. Nothing more!

tomder55 · Dec 12, 2008, 03:17 AM

I'm just saying though that the issues of the death of an unborn child seems more important than the death of a child simply because of religious standpoints

Not true . This posting's subject is abortion not school violence.

You want policies that reflect your religious view. Yet when it comes to guns you want policies that reflect your constitutional rights.

I for one have not in any comment advanced a religious position.Mine is a constitutional argument (opposing the very flawed Roe V Wade Supreme Court Decision);as is my argument in favor of gun ownership . Both defend the right to live.As abortion numbers skyrocket into genocide numbers it is clear that abortion, will never be rare, so long as it is promoted as a constitutional right. Women will never be deterred from killing "unwanted" children unless and until abortion is once again condemned by civil society as a morally reprehensible homicide.

speechlesstx · Dec 12, 2008, 04:16 AM

I don't recall making a religious argument but maybe I did, but I know I have spoken about rights. It really doesn't need to be a religious argument if you ask me.