For school we're having to write a persuasive paper on a topic of our chosing. I recently had to switch mine because, i was having issues finding information on my other topic. The topic i got switchted to is 'Contraception in schools' basically whether or not school nurses should or should be allowed to give out contraceptives, confidetially and at low cost. Just out of curiosity more than anything i was wondering what Other people thought about this topic. Any of your opinions would be apretiated, and/or imformation that could help me with my paper...

speechlesstx

I would hope you can tell by now I don't care for extremists on either side (although I'm sure some here think I'm the extremist, lol). That's part of the problem though, there seems to be no room for rational debate. And I had much more to say but decided to just leave it at that

Synnen

It's all spin-on BOTH sides.

"Pro-choice" is now "murdering babies". Adoption is "better than killing your baby". People getting abortions are always made out to be ignorant murderers who don't give a damn about anyone but themselves, rather than scared young women who made a very hard choice when their birth control failed.

(Just wanted to throw the other side out there)

I don't believe that ANYONE but a parent should decide what sort of medical treatment a minor child should get.

But...at the same time....there are parents out there who are NOT available to their children. Where should THEY go? We've been telling kids for years that if they can't talk to their parents about something, they should go to their teacher, their counselor, their pastor/priest when they need help.

Well, unfortunately, talking about sex with a teen can get those people into trouble, too--all it takes is one person taking the wrong spin on it, and all of a sudden there are child abuse and pedophilia charges--who'd want to take the chance?

IMO--start educating parents. Make THEM take a sex ed course when their kids reach 12-13 years old. If the PARENT doesn't show up for the class, then the kid goes to a comprehensive sex ed class, covering every subject under the sexual sun. Have several dates available--but put it on the PARENT'S shoulders to teach their kids so that we can stop playing the blame game about the whole thing.

charlotte234s

I agree J_9.

And I believe scientific facts over pictures that may or may not even be properly labele,d they could be a fetus much older made to be a 20 week fetus by the anti-abortion fleet.

18-Year-Old Hides Pregnancy, Then Allegedly Throws Newborn Down Trash Chute in Florida While on Vacation - Associated Content

Here's a story about a girl who threw her newborn down a trash chute.

WZTV FOX 17/Nashville

Here's the same basic story except it's a Nashville girl. I could find probably a ton more if you'd like.


And you don't have a right to tell people what to do, no one forces you to have an abortion, why do you want to tell people they can't? It's just not anyone's place to tell other people what they can and can't do with their lives.

And for one, I have an aunt who chose not to have an abortion and her and her son lived in squalor for years afterwards, she did not even have the money to pay for repairing his severely cleft lip, so I know that young, uneducated, scared, poor, single mothers will be more miserable and broke if they are forced to have a child. She lived with her parents who FORCED her to have the baby, after they told her that birth control was for sluts just a year before. She was 17.

ETWolverine

It doesn't do any good in their POCKET.

And wouldn't you prefer it if they didn't need that condom in the first place?

Elliot

NeedKarma

Sure but I'm a realist.

Altenweg

The original question was asking about contraceptives in schools, saying that I'd rather see a condom in their pocket implied that I agree to allowing children access to contraception. Of course they can't leave it in their pocket if it's to work, that's rather obvious (or so I thought). So to make it very clear "I would rather they put a condom on their penis (or their partners penis) before sexual contact and ejaculation." Is that accurate enough?

As to your other question, yes, I would rather they didn't need a condom in the first place, but I'd rather they be prepared than end up with an unwanted pregnancy. It would be a wonderful world indeed if teenagers actually listened to their parents and waited to have sex, but they don't, they never have, I know I didn't, did you?

Sorry if I sound condescending but I feel very strongly about this issue as do all of you. I have a feeling that we're all just going to have to agree to disagree and raise our children according to our beliefs and hope for the best. I'm just trying to be realistic about this issue.

ETWolverine

Here's a twist on things.

For all those who believe that teens are old enough (physically and emotionally) to make decisions about sex, and therefore should be able to get condoms, BC and abortions at will without parental consent... would you guys have a problem with a 14 year old girl having sex with a 35 year old guy?

If you have a problem with it, why? After all, they're old enough to decide for themselves without parental concent. What's the difference between a 14 year old having sex with another teenager and having sex with an adult? If they are old enough to decide, then they are old enough to decide.

And if you don't have a problem with it, why not? Do you feel that teens having sex with adults is okay? Do you feel that there's no such thing as statutory rape?

You see, the issue here is whether these kids have the capacity to make these life-and-death decisions without the consent of a parent. Either they do or they don't. You can't have it both ways. If they are mature enough to make decisions on abortion, BC, condoms and having sex with other teens, then they are mature enough to make those decisions vis-a-vis adults as well. In that case, we need to stop prosecuting adults for statutory rape in cases of consenting sex with a minor.

But if you feel that teens are not mature enough to make those decisions regarding sex with adults, then why do we assume that because they are having sex with other teens its different and they are mature enough for that? To me, there doesn't seem to be any real difference. The decision-making process is the same, and if they are too immature for one, then they should be too immature for the other.

And if they are not mature enough, then PP should not be advocating abortions (a medical procedure) without parental consent, and schools should not be pushing condoms and BC (medication) without parental permission. And schools should not be teaching kids how to have sex... safely or otherwise. They should be teaching kids NOT to have sex.

Seems simple to me.

Elliot

speechlesstx

Did I not mention where those pictures were from? That's right I did, the Texas State Department of Health ... precisely to preempt the improperly labeled photos from "the anti-abortion fleet" argument. Why on earth would the State of Texas use improperly labeled pictures? State of Texas not good enough?

10 weeks courtesy of National Geographic:


14 weeks courtesy The Science Museum in London:


24 weeks courtesy of the University of California, San Francisco:


Will those sources do?

An example from June and one from October is a long way from the claim that I should see it in the news happening "every day."

Haven't we been here before? I said "I have every right to express my opinion just as you do," I don't recall telling anyone they can't have an abortion. I don't recall even asking for a ban on abortions. I'd appreciate it very much if you would point out where I am telling people what they can or can't do, where I'm forcing my will on anyone. If you can find it I'll apologize, otherwise I think it would be appropriate to stop painting that false impression of me. This is only a discussion.

I'm sorry for your aunt and her son's years of squalor, how are they doing now? Does she love her son? Do you love your cousin? Does she regret his life? Should she tell him he should have been aborted, that he didn't deserve a chance to live, laugh, love and be loved?

How does that one example mean you "know that young, uneducated, scared, poor, single mothers will be more miserable and broke if they are forced to have a child?" If my daughter had only come to us and allowed us to help her through her pregnancy I guarantee we would have done everything in our power to make sure they both had anything they needed. I've sat and mourned with friends devastated by the decision to have an abortion 20 years after the fact. I've watched a loving, childless couple struggle, jump through all the hoops and spend a fortune to adopt a child only to be disappointed by the court when it gave him back to his drug addicted mother - and I've been with them through the joy of finally holding an adopted newborn of their own thanks to a courageous teen mother that gave this child a chance.

To condemn a child on the assumption of a miserable and broke life is surrender. It shows an astounding lack of faith in people to rise above circumstances and turn a potentially difficult situation into a triumphant victory. Such cynicism is really sad.

tomder55

great point Elliot. How do most states deal with any male having sex with an underaged girl ?

Altenweg

[quote=speechlesstx]Alt, I watch the news every day, read the paper every day, get glimpses of the news on the internet every day...I cannot recall the last time I heard or read a story about some teenager "tossing it in a trash can or leaving it on the bathroom floor of a public restroom." Can you point those out for me please?


Watch Nancy Grace, at least once a week there are newborns being left for dead by teenage mothers that just weren't ready for motherhood. The last one was a girl that was heavily into sports, she left the baby in a trash can in her school, she was arrested for killing her infant. Before that there was a newborn found in the public bathroom of a hospital, that baby was lucky, it lived. The mother disappeared, she left a note with her infant saying that she fed the baby. I could write a book about the number of teenagers that end up committing this desperate act. Most of them hide their pregnancies from their families and friends by binding their growing bellies. I realize that this is the extreme end of teenage pregnancies, but it happens often enough that it should be a very big concern.

I myself would never get an abortion, it's something that I cannot do because to me it's a baby as soon as I find out I'm pregnant (I have two children). But that doesn't mean that you should take that choice away from someone else. I was 27 years old when I had my first child, married for 3 years, financially stable etc. etc. If I had been 17 years old or even younger it would have been very difficult. Try and put yourself in the shoes of these young girls, maybe you'll see a different side of this issue.