[dcraft49]

Ok, I've been reading a lot of the questions and answers and still am slightly confused. I set the drain(adjustable) after chiseling away concrete and cutting existing drain pipe(from previous fiberglass shower). The lower flange is slightly recessed below floor level(local plumber advised this)to disallow any pooling. Now here is the first question. Did I install this properly(not glued yet-PVC)? Secondly, do I put the shower pan in first and then mud(pitch), or vice a versa? This has been troubling me for about three days now. Help!:confused:

[ballengerb1]

What type of pan are you installing: mud, fiber glass, acrylic, etc...

[dcraft49]

I am installing a tile shower, using a vinyl liner.

[ballengerb1]

We aren't quite getting the detail I am looking for. Tile shower could mean just the walls are tiled but might be the floor/pan too. Vinyl liner could mean a acrylic pan or just something like Shluter Kerdi or their system. Shower Systems - Schluter-Systems Do you have a picture of what you are doing or a brand name or model for the "liner?"

[dcraft49]

Okay. I removed the fiberglass shower stall. I am replacing it with a completely tiled shower, i.e. walls, and floor. The foundation is concrete. There is a10X10 hole in the slsab with a 2" drain close to the left side of the hole(apprx. 3/4" from left side). I have cut the I am installing an adjustable drain(beveled edge) and need to know if the leading edge of the lower section of the drain is to be even with the edge of the slab or slightly below it(advsed to do this by local plumber). I am installing a pitched mortar base and need to know if the vinyl goes below the base(some say yes and others say no)or on top of the pitched base(which seems logical for water shed).
Thanks

[dcraft49]

The liner is a sheet of vinyl used for shower pans

[Bljack]

Hey crafty,

There needs to be two mud layers. The first one goes under the liner and creates a drainage plane for the liner. It's pitched 1/4" per foot from the furthest point from the drain. The mud around the perimeter of the pan is level, so the slope will be greater than 1/4" per foot form all points closer to the drain. You want your wall tile to come down to a nice and level line. Since this layer will be under the liner, once you establish the height you need at the far point, you can use some lattice ripped to the proper size and tacked around the inside of the base as a screed for the perimeter mud height.

For your mud layer, since you installed the drain base flush with the slab, you will need to use a latex admix instead of water for your preslope base. Your mud is bagged sandmix, which is 3 parts sand to 1 part portland cement, mixed with 1 part masons sand, giving you a mixture that is a 4 to 1 ratio. The mixture is by volume, not weight, so measure each in scoops or shovels, 4 shovels of sand mix to one shovel of sand. Mix with just enough latex so that it is packable. It will be a bit trickier as the latex makes it sticky. The minimum thickness of mud mixed with just water is 3/4", which is why you need the latex instead. For your second med layer, which is your setting bed, you will only use water.

Bond the preslope bed to the slab with a thin mix of modifed thinset. Pack it tightly and slope down to the drain.

However, before that, you want to make sure your framing is correct...

The only pressure treated lumber you can use is for the bottom plate of the wall framing. Do not use any anywhere else. For your curb, you want to use bricks, bonding them to the slab with thinset. Unlike the wall framing, the curb cannot be made with pt lumber on the bottom.

Your wall studs should be planed down to allow for the thickness of the liner. Solid blocking gets installed between the studs to support the liner, and the frond of the blocking gets installed in plane with the shaved down stud. The other option is to fur out the studs but you need to prevent both abrasive wear on the liner from the cement board as well as preven the cement board from bowing out at the bottom from the thickness of the liner which will prevent square and plumb corners.

If you are building a bench in this shower, since it's on a slab, remove it if you framed it out of wood. On slabs, you should build benches out of block and build them on top of your setting bed of mud after the walls are installed. That way they are completely within the water management area. Wood framed benches require special attention to detail and use of surface applied waterproofing membranes applied to the cement board before installing the tile.

Now that all the framing stuff and preslope is out of the way,

Install the liner so that it goes about 8" up the walls (at least 2" higher than the finished curb height) and wraps up and over the curb. If you need to make any seams, do the seams so that the overlap is in the direction of the drainage plane to the weep holes. You may need to chisel out a bit more material in the corner studs for the added thickness of the hospital folds in the liner at the corners.

Once the liner is installed, you then install a moisture barrier to the walls, either 4 mil plastic sheeting or 15 lb roofing felt, from at least shower head height, down and overlapping the liner. Install the cement board, keeping it about 1/2" off the bottom of the liner. Do not fasten it through the bottom 8". Use diamond lath, cut to the length of the curb, folded into a box shape and slip it over the curb. Fold the sides in a bit first so it hugs the curb tightly. A couple tapcon screws on the outside only will hold it to the brick.

Install your drain, threading it to a little more than the thickness of the tile, plus 1.25" for the setting bed of mud. Tape over the strainer to keep cr@p out of it. Place some pea gravel around the drain to keep the weepholes protected from clogging.

Install your setting bed of mud, same as the preslope, but mix with water instead of latex. You will not slope it, it will be sloped because it follows the slope below it. It should be uniformly thick 1.25". The setting bed of mud will hold the bottom of the cement board against the framing and will wedge the lath against the inside of the curb.

Form your curb with masons mix. Once it starts to set up, shave down to the proper shape.

Your plumber won't advise you on the preslope because he probably never does it. Unless you slope the liner, water will pool there and stagnate and smell. Unfortunately, even though it's required by code, it's pretty much never enforced, probably because the reason for it is not understood, and all they really care about is that it does not leak. But hey, they don't need to shower on a biological experiment, do they?

Please post back with any other questions you have if there are any parts of these directions you want me to expand upon or if any other issues come up along the way during your tile project.

Happy tiling :)