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First, This is what I mean when speaking about the Trinity. What is it? It is the believe of 3 almighty, God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. All are not separate, but one. All are all knowing and omniscient.. No above the 0ther.
The Catholic encyclopedia says: “The trinity is the central teaching of the Christian religion.”
The Baptist encyclopedia says: “That Jesus is Jehovah or YHWH, and that the Holy spirit is Jehovah or YHWH.
Remember now Christians do not believe the Hindu religion to be the true religion and yet they also believe in Triad God’s as the Egyptians also believed in Triune Gods.
In 1553 they burned people alive for not believing in the Trinity. Was that Christian?
Isaiah 42:38 we read: Isaiah 42:8 (Young's Literal Translation)
8 I [am] Jehovah, this [is] My name, And Mine honour to another I give not, Nor My praise to graven images.
Genesis 17:1 (American Standard Version)
1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, Jehovah appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am God Almighty; walk before me, and be thou perfect. ALSO take a look at
Rev. 16:7 Jehovah the almighty. No where else in the Bible does it refer to anyone else as almighty. Jesus is referred to as mighty but not almighty. Isaiah 43:10 Jehovah says:
Isaiah 43:10 (American Standard Version)
10 Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Does this mean that, because Jesus Christ is prophetically called “Mighty God” at Isaiah 9:6, Jesus must be Jehovah? Again, the context answers, No! None of the idolatrous Gentile nations formed a god before Jehovah, because no one existed before Jehovah.
Nor would they at a future time form any real, live god that was able to prophesy. Isa. 46:9, 10
No where in the scriptures is Jesus referred to as “God the son” but he is referred to as “God’s son”. Take notice:
John 3:16 (New King James Version)
16 For God so loved the world that ‘He gave His only begotten Son,” that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.”
Notice how Jesus himself said he is “the son of God” Not “”God the son.”
John 10:33-36 (New King James Version)
33 The Jews answered Him, saying, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God.”
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your law, ‘I said, “You are gods”’?[a] 35 If He called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), 36 do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’?
In Matthew after Jesus’ baptism, Jehovah was heard to say, “you are my “Son” the beloved. Not “God my Son.” If all are equal then why did Jehovah continue in Matthew to state that he approved of Jesus. Notice:
Matthew 3:17 (New King James Version)
17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.”
Jehovah has not beginning or end. Jesus did. Notice Col 1:15
Colossians 1:15 (King James Version)
15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
The Bible says God can not die. Jesus though was raised from the dead, showing Jesus is not God almighty because he could die and did and was resurrected.
Acts 3:15 (New King James Version)
15 and killed the Prince of life, whom God raised from the dead, of which we are witnesses.
This is just some of the things I find very puzzling when it comes to the teaching of the Trinity. The Trinity doctrine is not compatible with the Bible teachings. If one loves God and believes the Bible to be the truth, how can 0ne believe the Trinity teaching. This information just touches on the lack of compatibility of the Bible and the trinity doctrine
Do you believe in the Trinity? If not, state why you do not believe in it. If you do believe in the doctrine of the trinity then state please why you do and how do you explain the above discrepancies?
Please state your understanding in the matter of the Trinity.
I know you are asking for Christian/Bible proof, but as I am not well versed in either I can only provide a muslim viewpoint!
Here are some verses from the Quran regarding Jesus/Easa alaihi salaam and trinity.
Chapter 004 verse 171
" O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messengers. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs."
Chapter 005 verse 073
" They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One Allah. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them."
That is absolutely correct. TRUE Christianity reflects the teachings of God's Word the Bible, and such teachings of the Bible dispel falsehoods of men including the teaching that God is a trinity. The scriptures make it very clear, upon close scrutiny and examination, that God (commonly referred to as "Jehovah" - see Psalms 83:18) is the Almighty alone. Jesus Christ, is God's Son, a created being as clearly stated in Colossians 1:15 and Revelation 3:14. As someone who has had a beginning, and was created, Jesus cannot be God or a part of a triune God. The holy spirit is not a being at all, it is rather a force that God uses to accomplish his purpose. Certain Bible mis-translations will change various passages to try and lend support to the man-concocted doctrine of the trinity, but the Bible as a whole dispels such an irreverant, blasphemous teaching.
The Trinity is not mentioned directly in the Bible. However, there are verses that refer to the Father, Son and Spirit as being of One Mind, One Will. This is the reason many Christians believe in this.
Luke 10:22
All things have been delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and who the Father is except the Son, and the one to whom the Son wills to reveal Him.”
John 10:30
I and My Father are one.”
John 14:6
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
Ephesians 2:18
For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.
Luke 1:35
And the angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Highest will overshadow you; therefore, also, that Holy One who is to be born will be called the Son of God.
Luke 3:16
John answered, saying to all, “I indeed baptize you with water; but One mightier than I is coming, whose sandal strap I am not worthy to loose. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
Also check out the names of God listed in the Bible. The Names of God
Matthew 2:11 And they came into the house and saw the young child with Mary his mother; and they fell down and worshipped him; and opening their treasures they offered unto him gifts, gold and frankincense and myrrh.
Matthew 8:2 And behold, there came to him a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.
Matthew 14:33 And they that were in the boat worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
Matthew 28:9 And behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and took hold of his feet, and worshipped him.
Luke 24:51-52 And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he parted from them, and was carried up into heaven. And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy.
The worship of Jesus is Biblical is it not? Please explain why it is that Jesus is worshipped with out rebuke. If He is not God manifested in the flesh, then this would have been false worship and these people would have been rebuked for it.
First, This is what I mean when speaking about the Trinity. What is it?
The question should be, "Who is He?" The Trinity is Mighty God. One God in three Divine Persons.
Quote:
....No where in the scriptures is Jesus referred to as “God the son” but he is referred to as “God’s son”. Take notice:
But He is referred to as God:
John 20 28 Thomas answered, and said to him: My Lord, and my God.
2 Peter 1 1 Simon Peter, servant and apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained equal faith with us in the justice of our God and Saviour Jesus Christ.
Hebrews 1 8 But to the Son: Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of justice is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Quote:
Do you believe in the Trinity? If not, state why you do not believe in it. If you do believe in the doctrine of the trinity then state please why you do and how do you explain the above discrepancies?
The apparent discrepancies are simply the writings of a skeptic. Someone who does not believe the evidence. In reality, there are no discrepancies.
As for me, I can look at nature and see that it is trinitarian. The most profound truths in our life are trinitarian.
Let us look at space and time.
Space is trinitarian. There is height, width and length. Yet all are seamlessly one.
Time is trinitarian. There is past, present and future. Yet all is seamlessly one.
Our very being is trinitarian as another person already disclosed.
Therefore, a Trinitarian God would produce a Trinitarian world.
A Unitarian God would produce a one dimensional world. And it is proven scientifically that a one dimensional world exists only in our imaginations.
Quote:
Please state your understanding in the matter of the Trinity.
As this has turned into a big argument I have removed the offending posts
If you are going to discuss religion do so in a civil manner or stern action WILL be taken.
If you have a problem with that PM me.
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