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Has Christianity lost it's way?

Asked Jan 3, 2008, 11:54 AM — 18 Answers
Brian McLaren, an evangelical pastor and author of "A New Kind of Christian" writes:
"Sadly, for centuries at a time in too many places to count, the Christian religion has downplayed, misconstrued, or forgotten the secret message of Jesus entirely. Instead of being about the kingdom of God coming to earth, the Christain religion has too often become preoccupied with abandoning or escaping the earth and going to heaven. Too often its members have forgotten the teachings of Jesus about making peace and turning the other cheek and crossing boundaries to serve peopleformerly considered 'outsiders'.
We have, instead, launched or baptized wars, prepetuated racism, and defended an unjust status quo. We have betrayed the message that the kingdom of God is available for all, beginning with the least and the last and the lost----and instead have believed and taught that the kingdom of God is available for the elite, beginning with the correct and the clean and the powerful.
.........our music has too often been discordant, shallow, or played...without feeling and passion.....And whenever that happens, our audiences do exactly as they should: they ignore us and our message, or they turn from us in boredom or disgust."

What say ye.....has the message been distorted by the very ones commissioned with it's dissemination?

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18 Answers
Fr_Chuck's Avatar
Fr_Chuck Posts: 72,624, Reputation: 37031
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#11

Jan 3, 2008, 06:25 PM


But the real issue is is not what each group may think of each other, but what the groups teach, and all groups teach of the love and basically the salvation though Jeuss Christ, all teach of a repentance and a baptism,
They may differ in at what age, and how it is done, but the actual real teachings are basically the same.

In the mid 70's we took the small catechism of the Lutheran church and the Catholic church, they were word for word the exact same ( except for one word) That is how close their actual teachings were at that time.
But the members of each church would have never beleived or accepted it.

But the world has always had preachers who would preach to the popular ideas. It was warned in the bible 2000 years ago, and is still true today.

But in the end, if you throw out the smoke and mirrors, get rid of the dance groups and the 20 piece bands in almsot all of them, you still have the basics of faith, in that there is always a true bond if they want it or not.

** don't forget the Baptist, they had a large group after Katrina also.
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N0help4u's Avatar
N0help4u Posts: 16,954, Reputation: 9423
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#12

Jan 3, 2008, 07:09 PM
I know MANY Christians and Christian churches in my area and heard of some from other areas that helped with Katrina but they went to help Mississippi Katrina victims because they saw that New Orleans was going to end up being a political thing and they wanted to avoid that. Louisana got all the media attention and nobody saw how bad Mississippi had it except for the ones that choose to help there instead.
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labman's Avatar
labman Posts: 10,673, Reputation: 3050
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#13

Jan 3, 2008, 07:46 PM
I feel much of our leadership has utterly lost their way. A PCUSA leader made the statement ''We don't need people hanging on a cross and dripping blood.'' Sorry about that. Christ's atoning work on the cross is the only hope for a sinner like me. The PCUSA and the other mainline denominations are all about various liberal ideas that they see as good works. They have forgotten Christ's death on the cross and the difference between the church and the UN. Due to personal taste and the worship style the PCUSA congregation I was a part of for 30 years has adopted, I am leaving them and going to the Friends. They have their problems, too, but I can enjoy the music, it is close by, and the people are nice. I looked at some more ''evangelic'' churches. They are too hung up on how God choose to create the earth, the time table of the second coming, baptism by immersion, and other things I regard as non essential.
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RickJ's Avatar
RickJ Posts: 10,075, Reputation: 4374
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#14

Jan 4, 2008, 05:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tertullian
Rick:
What do you refer to when you state "Christianity in general"....Protestant Christianity, Roman Catholic Christianity, Orthodox Christianity....Fundamentalist Christianity, non-denominational Christianity? Are you not 'generalizing' Christianity in the same way that you accuse McLaren of doing? And to what purpose?
You generalized in saying simply "the Christian religion has downplayed, misconstrued, or forgotten the secret message of Jesus entirely"

...so I stand by what I initially said.
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Tertullian's Avatar
Tertullian Posts: 33, Reputation: 18
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#15

Jan 4, 2008, 07:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickJ
You generalized in saying simply "the Christian religion has downplayed, misconstrued, or forgotten the secret message of Jesus entirely"

...so I stand by what I initially said.
Sorry to have to disagree, but "I" generalized NOTHING...I merely quoted the summation of a respected author, theologian, and CHRISTIAN pastor whose qualifications to instruct I find impeccable. For you to pass it off as MY generalizing simply begs the question. You will find the same type of 'summation' in a vast number of contemporary theologians from Hans Kung to John Shelby Spong to Matthew Fox and John Dominic Crosson. In my experience...where there is smoke there is fire. Is that not also YOUR experience.
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Tertullian's Avatar
Tertullian Posts: 33, Reputation: 18
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#16

Jan 4, 2008, 07:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck
But the real issue is is not what each group may think of each other, but what the groups teach, and all groups teach of the love and basically the salvation though Jeuss Christ, all teach of a repentance and a baptism,
They may differ in at what age, and how it is done, but the actual real teachings are basically the same.

In the mid 70's we took the small catechism of the Lutheran church and the Catholic church, they were word for word the exact same ( except for one word) That is how close their actual teachings were at that time.
But the members of each church would have never beleived or accepted it.

But the world has always had preachers who would preach to the popular ideas. It was warned in the bible 2000 years ago, and is still true today.

But in the end, if you throw out the smoke and mirrors, get rid of the dance groups and the 20 piece bands in almsot all of them, you still have the basics of faith, in that there is always a true bond if they want it or not.

** don't forget the Baptist, they had a large group after Katrina also.
Authentic faith ALWAYS culminates in action, especially in action toward peace and social justice. It it does not, what matter that two or three or thirty of the 3,000 Christian denominations agree in their teaching? And what can be offered a seeker who tires to fathom the 'mystery' inherrent in either monophysitism, or Jesus as both TRUE GOD AND TRUE MAN? And what of those who simply cannot get their reason around the idea of a Triune God? Do we insist that 'BELIEF' countermands concern? Do we condemn to hell any who wish to find God in today's world and not in some closed Scriptures or archaic rituals? Do we not need to establish a 'common ground' Christianity...one that is NOT elitist, NOT sectarian, NOT denominational...and which avoids the taint of 'contemporary-hail-fellow-well-met' cultism.

A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link. If 'preaching to the popular ideas' can lead men and women to God...who are we to deny them that opportunity by insisting that, in religion, Black is Black, White is White and there is no room for any other color?
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labman's Avatar
labman Posts: 10,673, Reputation: 3050
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#17

Jan 4, 2008, 07:45 AM
''Too often its members have forgotten the teachings of Jesus about making peace and turning the other cheek and crossing boundaries to serve people formerly considered 'outsiders'.'' I am afraid even the writers of the New Testament were unaware this secret. This is exactly where so many of our leaders have gone astray. While nobody with the least acquaintance of the New testament can disagree that the above is expected of Christians, Christianity is about our salvation. Ephesians 2:8-10 is a favorite Bible passage. It leaves no doubt we are saved by faith, but good works are expected of us.
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Fr_Chuck's Avatar
Fr_Chuck Posts: 72,624, Reputation: 37031
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#18

Jan 4, 2008, 07:50 AM


The real issue is that yes, Chrisianity is a common bond, and as long as common trends don't violate what the bible says there is no problem, but if new teachings violate what the Bible is saying then they can not truly be Christian in its full extent.
Irulan (Feb 3, 2008 07:28 PM): The bible is a conglomeration of myths garnered from previous Pagan beleifs .... syncretized to make Christianity more palatable in ancient tines ... and still misleading at present times.   Source:
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Tertullian's Avatar
Tertullian Posts: 33, Reputation: 18
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#19

Jan 4, 2008, 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck
The real issue is that yes, Chrisianity is a common bond, and as long as common trends don't violate what the bible says there is no problem, but if new teachings violate what the Bible is saying then they can not truly be Christian in its full extent.
?Didn't Jesus, himself, violate what the Bible of his day was saying? He deliberately rejected the Mosaic take on divorce....on the stoning of adulterous women... On violating the Sabbath....on associating with pagans, prostitutes and lepers? How often do we read:
"You have heard it said.....but I tell you....."

As to the 'common bond' of Christianity...that is as tenuous as morning mist. Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, are called Satanists by other Christians, even though both religions claim to be followers of Christ. Roman Catholics and Orthodox Christians are called 'heretics' by fundamentalist Christians. Adventists cannot even agree among themselves whether the re-advent of Christ will be premillenial or amillenial....Presbyterians are still divided over the Calvanistic doctrine of predestination. Monophysites deny the dual nature of Christ. Many other denominations deny the Triune God. What common bond is it that has not been questioned on biblical grounds?
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