Did Jesus say to himself I'm God

savedsinner7

John 8:19
“Where is your father?” they asked.Jesus answered, “Since you don’t know who I am, you don’t know who my Father is. If you knew me, you would also know my Father.”

John 8:42
Jesus told them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, because I have come to you from God. I am not here on my own, but he sent me.


Jesus said He was from the Father and that they were one (in mind and heart and thought), but they are clearly two persons.

RickJ

John 20:28-29

Thomas said to Jesus, "My Lord and my God!"

Then Jesus told him, "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

So there Jesus affirms that Thomas believes correctly: That He is God.

savedsinner7

Tj3

Jesus called Himself the Almighty:

Rev 1:7-8
8 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."
NKJV

He called Himself Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last, all terms in scripture solely used to describe God.

Rev 22:12-16
12 "And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last." 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie. 16 I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star."
NKJV

He was worshiped (an honour that belongs only to God), and not once did He reject the worship.

Matthew 8:2 And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Matthew 14:33 Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.

Matthew 15:25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

Matthew 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.

Mark 5:6 But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,

Luke 24:52 And they worshipped him, and returned to Jerusalem with great joy:

John 5:23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.

John 9:38 And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

Here is an example where Jesus called Himself God and the Jesus understood it to be so, and tried to stone Him for it.

John 10:28-33
29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father's hand. 30 I and My Father are one."

31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone Him. 32 Jesus answered them, "Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of those works do you stone Me?" 33 The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God."
NKJV

savedsinner7

silentrascal

TIME and again, Jesus showed that he was a creature separate from God and that he, Jesus, had a God above him, a God whom he worshiped, a God whom he called “Father.” In prayer to God, that is, the Father, Jesus said, “You, the only true God.” (John 17:3) At John 20:17 he said to Mary Magdalene: “I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.” (RS, Catholic edition) At 2 Corinthians 1:3 the apostle Paul confirms this relationship: “Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.” Since Jesus had a God, his Father, he could not at the same time be that God.

The apostle Paul had no reservations about speaking of Jesus and God as distinctly separate: “For us there is one God, the Father, . . . and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ.” (1 Corinthians 8:6, JB) The apostle shows the distinction when he mentions “the presence of God and of Christ Jesus and of the elect angels.” (1 Timothy 5:21, RS Common Bible) Just as Paul speaks of Jesus and the angels as being distinct from one another in heaven, so too are Jesus and God.

TIME and again, Jesus made statements such as: “The Son cannot do anything at his own pleasure, he can only do what he sees his Father doing.” (John 5:19, The Holy Bible, by Monsignor R. A. Knox) “I have come down from heaven to do, not my will, but the will of him that sent me.” (John 6:38) “What I teach is not mine, but belongs to him that sent me.” (John 7:16) Is not the sender superior to the one sent?

AT THE very outset of Jesus’ ministry, when he came up out of the baptismal water, God’s voice from heaven said: “This is my Son, the beloved, whom I have approved.” (Matthew 3:16, 17) Was God saying that he was his own son, that he approved himself, that he sent himself? No, God the Creator was saying that he, as the superior, was approving a lesser one, his Son Jesus, for the work ahead.

Jesus made his Father’s superiority clear when the mother of two disciples asked that her sons sit one at the right and one at the left of Jesus when he came into his Kingdom. Jesus answered: “As for seats at my right hand and my left, these are not mine to grant; they belong to those to whom they have been allotted by my Father,” that is, God. (Matthew 20:23, JB) Had Jesus been Almighty God, those positions would have been his to give. But Jesus could not give them, for they were God’s to give, and Jesus was not God.

The difference between what God knows and what Christ knows also existed when Jesus was resurrected to heaven to be with God. Note the first words of the last book of the Bible: “The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him.” (Revelation 1:1, RS, Catholic edition) If Jesus himself were part of a Godhead, would he have to be given a revelation by another part of the Godhead—God? Surely he would have known all about it, for God knew. But Jesus did not know, for he was not God.

The fact is that Jesus is not God and never claimed to be. This is being recognized by an increasing number of scholars. As the Rylands Bulletin states: “The fact has to be faced that New Testament research over, say, the last thirty or forty years has been leading an increasing number of reputable New Testament scholars to the conclusion that Jesus . . . certainly never believed himself to be God.”

The Bulletin also says of first-century Christians: “When, therefore, they assigned [Jesus] such honorific titles as Christ, Son of man, Son of God and Lord, these were ways of saying not that he was God, but that he did God’s work.”

Thus, even some religious scholars admit that the idea of Jesus’ being God opposes the entire testimony of the Bible. There, God is always the superior, and Jesus is the subordinate servant.

Tj3

Did you note that each and every time that Jesus spoke of the father as his God, and being above Him, that He did so when He was in the flesh? That is because Jesus, the second person of the trinity came to each as God in the flesh (1 Tim 3:16), having willingly humbled Himself to become a man (Phil 2:8) so that He could die on the cross for our sins (John 3:16-17).

To be qualified to be our Saviour, He had to be sinless, and as a man, He had to fully submit Himself to God the Father. When He resurrected, He was restored to His full glory as God (John 17:5).

We know that Jesus was God, because scripture says so in many places (John 1:1 and others), and that He, along with God the Father and the Holy Spirit was the same God YHWH (Is 48:16-17), and that there is in fact only one God (Is 44:8).

silentrascal

The fact of the matter is that there is NO trinity. No such teaching is found in or supported by the Bible. What the Bible states clearly, in both Colossians 1:15 and Revelation 3:14 is that Jesus was the beginning, the very first of God's creations. This being the case, Jesus cannot be Almighty God and he never was. He also did not die on a cross, he died on an upright torture stake. The Greek word rendered as the implement of Jesus' death is "stauros", which means nothing more than an upright pole.

What we know is that Jesus never was God, because the Bible says such in many places. Numerous Bible translations incorrectly translate John 1:1 and twist it into saying something that it does not, namely that Jesus is God. The teaching of and belief in the man-made doctrine of a trinity is blasphemous to the highest degree and blatantly dishonors both God and Jesus Christ, who are two completely separate and distinct individuals as the Scriptures clearly attest to.

Tj3

You saying so does not alter what scripture says.


Nowhere does it say that Jesus was created. Let's look at these:

Col 1:15
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
NKJV

The problem with interpreting these in English is that you lose something in the translation. The typical usage of this term in the culture of the time was referring to the pre-eminence. If you read on to see the context, you will see that is the case:

Col 1:16-18
16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
NKJV

He is the creator, not the created. The same is true in Rev 3:14. The terminaology in the original Greek is referring to the first in order (pre-eminence) over creation. This understanding is also consistent with the rest of scripture, for example Micah 5:2:

Mic 5:2
2 "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
Though you are little among the thousands of Judah,
Yet out of you shall come forth to Me
The One to be Ruler in Israel,
Whose goings forth are from of old,
From everlasting."
NKJV



Scripture says that He is:

Rev 1:7-8
8 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."
NKJV

Nothing that you say can change that.


One could refute that simply from history,but we can also refute it from scripture. If it was a torture stake, why does John 20:25 refer to "nails" instead of "nail"?

John 20:25-26
25 The other disciples therefore said to him, "We have seen the Lord." So he said to them, "Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe."
NKJV

If it was a single take, only one nail would have been necessary.


You should get your doctrine from somewhere other than the Watchtower Society.

John 1:1
1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
NKJV

The key portion of this passage that we need to focus on is the part which states "..the Word was God.".

Because of the fact that both Jehovah's Witnesses and Christians acknowledge that the reference to the Word is a reference to Jesus, this is a critical passage. If this does indeed say that Jesus is God, then this is a major blow to one of the most important doctrines of the Watchtower Society.

The original passage in Greek reads:

kai theos en ho logos.

The definite article applies to the subject, which is this case is the Word. The Word is the subject, not God. Second thing to understand about Greek is that the word order may vary, but is important for the purposes of emphasis. In the original Greek, theos is the first person or item mentioned, and though the words may be in any order, the word which is put first is placed in that position for emphasis. The "word" comes later in the sentence. Thus, in Greek, it would read, "What God was, the Word was". In English, we translate this to "The Word was God".

The Jehovah witnesses translate this to read "the Word was a god" based upon a mis-translation of the Greek, making the assumption that "ho" translates to "a" in English as definite article while when "theos" does not have an definite article, it should be assumed to have an indefinite article (Greek does not have an indefinite article). Without trying to get into details of Greek translation, we can demonstrate that this is not correct by simply showing that in Greek, the one true God is referred to elsewhere in the New Testament by the term "theos" without the definite article. Examples:

Matt 1:23
23 "Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel," which is translated, "God with us."
NKJV

Matt 15:4
4 For God commanded, saying, 'Honor your father and your mother'; and, 'He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.'
NKJV

Mark 2:7
7 Why does this Man speak blasphemies like this? Who can forgive sins but God alone?"
NKJV

Luke 20:38
38 "For He is not the God of the dead but of the living, for all live to Him."
NKJV

There are many more examples throughout the New Testament which could be given. In each example given, the Watchtower Society New World Translation translates the word "God" with the exception of Luke 20:38 where they translate it as "a God" (note the capital "G").

The problems with this are numerous. First and foremost, this creates two gods and yet scripture is abundantly clear throughout that there is only one true God (Deut 6:4, Zech 14:9 and many others). Secondly, they are inconsistent in their translation of passages which lack the definite article. Indeed, to claim that there is more than one god mentioned in this passage from John 1:1, then the Greek would have to read as follows:

kai ho logos en theos.

Note how logos now becomes the emphatic and God is demoted? This teaching is a heresy which is known as Arianism, and when you mis-translate the Greek in this manner, you end up with two gods, instead of the one that scripture says exists. Another mistake would have been to word it as:

kai ho logos en ho theos.

Which reads "..and the Word was the God", which in Greek would say that the Word was God the Father, rather than simply God. This is another heresy. But John was quite specific in his wording to be clear that Jesus is God, but not God the Father. Thus John 1:1 says that the Word (Jesus) is God, and though He is God, the one true God, He is not God the Father. John 1:1 is thus presenting the doctrine of the trinity nicely.