[Clough]

Excellent advice has been going on here!

I want to ask you a question, Erica. Please answer it.

Do you really love this man?

[erlobenauer]

Well if I didn't love him, do you think I'd still be here? At this point, it's the only reason Im still with him. I love him dearly, and other than all of this, he is a really good person to me. ( I know, that doesn't even sound feasible does it? )

[Clough]

People stay together for reasons other than love.

What are some of the things that you love about him and why?

You and I have touched on the subject of perfectionism in another dialogue previously. What is going on with the two of you might also have to do with your tendency to be a perfectionist.

But, please only answer the question that I asked. Thank you!

[Clough]

Now, you know that I like you, am an artist. I am also divorced. I see some things in you that are very much like myself.

[erlobenauer]

He is a good worker, always supported us financially so I could be home with the kids. Hes a great dad. Hes very sweet and loving, always giving compliments. We have a lot of fun together, usually we get along really good, and most of the time, were like two kids together. I love being next to him, I feel comfortable with him. I feel down and upset if he's gone for a while, and when he's here, I love every minute of it. ( when its good of course )

[Clough]

He is a good worker, always supported us financially so i could be home with the kids. Hes a great dad. Hes very sweet and loving, always giving compliments. We have a lot of fun together, usually we get along really good, and most of the time, were like two kids together. I love being next to him, I feel comfortable with him. I feel down and upset if he's gone for a while, and when hes here, I love every minute of it. ( when its good of course )

So, when did this more aggressive side of him start to occur in your marriage?

[erlobenauer]

Haha... when I was pregnant with my first daughter - it was more pinning me down though, nothing more than that. And he's OK for a couple months at a time, then he just snaps over the smallest thing - and after it happens, he doesn't even remember why he did it, or even what all he did.

[Clough]

Has he ever had any psychological testing performed on him? Has he ever had any history of aggression or maybe even depression that you know of?

[erlobenauer]

Not that I know of, but I do know that his two brothers are the same way. They had a really tough childhood with their mother, and she is the first to admit they get their temper from her - He told his SGT's he wanted help, and they took him to his first session yesterday shortly after I had him leave. He has another on Monday, then an appointment for both of us on Wed - is this something I should stick around to help him get through - or should I just stop... and after hearing my daugther say, don't worry momma daddy won't hit you in the face anymore - I'm completely confused again. I was willing to give him the chance, because I KNOW he knows he needs the help - but how can I just block out what my daughter said to me?

[Clough]

You have just written some things about which I can definitely identify.

Now, perhaps would be a good time to tell you something about my marriage and how it ended. Would you like to hear the story?

[erlobenauer]

Yes I would... Please!

[Clough]

Am writing post. Please be patient. Thank you!

[Clough]

When I was about your age that you are now, that is when I got married. Neither of us were ready for marriage. We were pregnant before marriage. We both decided that we should get married. Marriage lasted for 2&1/2 years. The divorce story is another story in itself, but not the point of this post.

Prior to being married, even though I did have some redeeming qualities that might cause another person to become attracted to me, as the case might be. I had a tendency to become violent/aggressive at times. I would hit things, curse, etc. I had learned how to do that from a much older sibling of mine from when I was very young. I was less than seven years old at the time. Not to directly place blame on the sibling, but we do learn by the examples of those who are older, especially if we are very young and observing what would seem to be accepted behavior in the example that has been presented to us. It is much later that we are able to make intelligent, informed choices for ourselves concerning our behaviors. Sometimes, those early behaviors carry over into our adult years in spite of how we know what is a better way to act.

These tendencies and behaviors carried over into our marriage. There were many pressures in our marriage concerning finances and dealing with idiosyncrasies of each other because we hadn't really gotten to know each other as well as we should have before we had gotten married.

My wife decided to go to counseling on her own in order to find out how to solve our marriage problems. After awhile, she wanted me to go with her. Being the macho man that I was, I refused, thinking that I didn't need counseling and that we could work things out on our own.

I finally relented and went with her.

Over the course of our visits with the counselor, I was finding out things about myself that I didn't know about and also was realizing that I truly needed some help outside of what myself or a friend could give to me. I needed a professional.

After awhile, my wife quit going to the counselor. But, I continued because I was starting to enjoy figuring out how I could solve my problems because of techniques that I had learned in the counseling sessions. The main reason that we got divorced was because we had so many differences in our ways of doing things and what our goals were in terms of family. In short, we were both simply two immature to be married. It was also not a good "fit" because we had not gotten to really know each other.

I continued with counseling for a number of years. I switched counselors a number of times because as one problem with me was solved, then another one might be revealed that needed a different type of counselor. I found that group sessions especially helped a lot.

What I'm getting at here is that, through counseling, I was able to overcome my tendencies to be violent and aggressive.

What I am also saying, is that with time and the proper treatment, these things can be overcome and there can be hope for relationships to continue.

You have said some very nice things about why you love your husband. I think that there is hope for your marriage. Of course, don't put up with abuse. But, at least it seems like he is willing to give things a try as far as getting help. He seems to be more willing to do that then when I was his age. I also see the two of you, although it may be difficult at times, working together as a team in this situation.

[go-ask-mom]

Its so easy for us to just say LEAVE and leave NOW! But the majority of abused women grew up in abusive homes where their father beat their mother. This is what they know. This is the type of man they seek out (not necessarily purposefully, either) to be their mate. They think this is normal because this is how they grew up, so they live with it.

And it builds and builds and builds.

There may be "opportunities" to leave. Contacts with the police. Short stints in a women's shelter. You can only stay there so long. Why don't they have any money? They are raising the 3+ children, can't afford a babysitter so they can work, they don't have skills because they didn't graduate high school, they don't have transportation, I could go on all day.
They may love this guy because they don't know what it is like to really be treated with respect, dignity, and love. The man apologizes. And they stay. They stay out of honor of their wedding vows, love, desperation... they are trapped in the situation.

I was not raised like this. It's hard for me to think that any woman would put up with this type of situation. But in my profession, I can comprehend the complexity of the issue. It's not as simple as just sneaking out in the middle of the night with the kids. And I can empathize. It frustrates the hell out of me sometimes when I am trying to give a helping hand to a woman to make that first step. It would be just a step for me looking in from the outside. But for them, it may mean stepping of a cliff into the unknown. All they can see is what they are leaving. Food (hunger/ thirst) and shelter. They are so busy trying to survive their situation, they can't get past the physiological human needs of survival.

Everyone else that is getting what they need in the hierarchy and have passed safety needs, social needs, esteem needs, and have reached self actualization may be willing to take that step at the first sign of abuse. But if you had to struggle daily just to get the most basic needs, do you really think you would have the tools to leave?

It sounds as if you may not be at this desperate of a point yet, but stay with him and you will be. And if you do not have children yet by this man, you are lucky. DON'T. Please try to get help and leave before you have the other issues I addressed above, when children are involved it becomes so much harder to leave an abusive situation!

[erlobenauer]

Thank you Craig - that makes me see things a little differently - that perhaps, maybe people can change.

[Clough]

Yes, people can change. Sometimes it may take some time for the permanent changes to take place. Important word being "can." It's about choices. I really do think that there is hope in your relationship. It's just that sometimes you have to give some "tough love" in order to get things to change for the better.

Each person must work on themselves in order to make the relationship work. With love, all things are possible.

I know that there is love from both you and he towards each other in your relationship. It's just that some old tapes may be playing that need to be found and the content recorded over!

With love, truly all things are possible. But, only if there is love from all points!

:)

[charlotte234s]

It's true that people can change, if you can get him to go and get help for himself, he may still have a chance.

If he will not or the abuse continues, you know what you have to do.

I really hope for your sake that he can get some help, I know divorce and separations are hard, and I would never want you to go through that. I hope that counseling teaches him better ways to vent his frustrations and he learns to better respect you. Best wishes, keep us updated!

[J_9]

I am going to take the side of the children here, okay.

Is he a good role model for your children? Is this the way you want your boys to grow up treating their women and your girls growing up to be hit and abused? Well, that is what happens to children in homes such as this.

While it is possible for people to change, it is necessary that the children not be exposed to this violent behavior any more than they already have been. Either he needs to leave or you take the children while the two of you work this out, if you decide to work this out.

This is a very volatile situation that you are exposing your children to. Remember, you are not the only victim here, they are too. And, many times, the children can be taken away if this continues.

As you can see, I am all about the children here. What you decide to do is your decision, but remember that you are teaching your children that violence against women is acceptable.